The most frequently confused words I see in bicycling forums

  • Thread starter Colorado Bicycler
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Marz wrote:
> Colorado Bicycler wrote:
>
>>"you are a very sad (miserable) individual. "
>>
>>Yes! I no. Pleeze safe mi sole!
>
>
> You have one worth saving?
>
Can't you see that his sole is floundering, do it if not for the halibut.
 
Yup. After all, we live in a culture where to be concerned with
accurate expression is considered snobbish, effete, even "gay." So
using "hopefully" instead of "I hope", "momentarily" instead of "in a
moment" (the one that drives me nuts), etc. somehow marks the speaker
as unaffected and sincere.

When I was teaching, and would point out spelling, punctuation and
useage errors in my students' essays, many would complain that what
really mattered was the point they were making. They just didn't get
it that their point was incomprehensible because of the way they'd
expressed it.

I blame Marshall McCluhan.
 
"Roger Houston" wrote: No, but they are doomed to repeat it.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Or change majors.
 
"Zoot Katz" wrote: Hope's, Faith's and Charity's sister, Shirley?
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
"Shirley?" You jest!
 
Bern Mart writes:

> Yup. After all, we live in a culture where to be concerned with
> accurate expression is considered snobbish, effete, even "gay." So
> using "hopefully" instead of "I hope", "momentarily" instead of "in
> a moment" (the one that drives me nuts), etc. somehow marks the
> speaker as unaffected and sincere.

Oh yes!

"He'll be here momentarily." Oh that's too bad he can't stay awhile.

As in "Just press the button momentarily, don't hold it down."

> When I was teaching, and would point out spelling, punctuation and
> usage errors in my students' essays, many would complain that what
> really mattered was the point they were making. They just didn't
> get it that their point was incomprehensible because of the way
> they'd expressed it.

These same folks discount what Black English and Mexican American
speakers say because it isn't grammatically correct. What a bunch of
hubris.

> I blame Marshall McCluhan.

Not at all! But I think you mean McLuhan:

http://www.marshallmcluhan.com/

Jobst Brandt
 
>>Can't you see that his sole is floundering, do it if not for the halibut.

ROTFLMAO!!

Best one yet.
 
[email protected] wrote:
> Bern Mart writes:
>
> > Yup. After all, we live in a culture where to be concerned with
> > accurate expression is considered snobbish, effete, even "gay." So
> > using "hopefully" instead of "I hope", "momentarily" instead of "in
> > a moment" (the one that drives me nuts), etc. somehow marks the
> > speaker as unaffected and sincere.
>
> Oh yes!
>
> "He'll be here momentarily." Oh that's too bad he can't stay awhile.
>
> As in "Just press the button momentarily, don't hold it down."
>
> > When I was teaching, and would point out spelling, punctuation and
> > usage errors in my students' essays, many would complain that what
> > really mattered was the point they were making. They just didn't
> > get it that their point was incomprehensible because of the way
> > they'd expressed it.
>
> These same folks discount what Black English and Mexican American
> speakers say because it isn't grammatically correct. What a bunch of
> hubris.

Does hubrus come in bunches?

Bern Mart's point is quite valid. It is possible to produce a
sentence that because of structure, punctation or spelling that is
either incomprehensible or subject to serious misinterpretation. Our
last Prime Minister, concluding a visit to a farm is reported to have
said "I'd like to thank Mr Smith for the use of his farm and his
wife". I would suggest that either this is not good English or else
Jean was carry on a bit.

And I am sure that you have seen the "Eats, shoots, and leaves" book.
 
Thanks, Jobst, for the correction about McLuhan's name. I really do
think he's partly to blame for celebrating fuzzy language and imagery
as evidence of creativity. And during the 60's, it became cool to be
vague in one's language--you know, like war sucks, you know? I mean,
it does, you know? Leftie that I was, and am, that aspect of the
sixties drove me nuts, and it has stuck in our culture while what was
best about that era sloughed off.

As I once said to an SDS member, "if you can't express yourself
clearly, shut the f..ck up!!"

But, like, that's me, y'know?
 
willarch wrote:
> Roger Houston Wrote:
> > [email protected] wrote in message
> > news:[email protected]...
> >
> > [email protected] wrote:
> >
> > And I am sure that you have seen the "Eats, shoots, and leaves" book.
> >
> > Send a box of our candy, and nuts to your girlfriend.
>
> Surely the most misused word relating to cycling is the use of "bike"
> to mean "motor bike"?

Which leads to another peeve - folks calling me a 'biker'.
 
"Roger Houston" <[email protected]> wrote:

>"Marz" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>news:[email protected]...
>>
>> Do you consider people unable to fathom calculus funny too?
>
>No, but they are doomed to repeat it.

It's most important during the winter riding season to NOT mix up
"your" and "you're"... for example, it's a compliment to suggest that
someone rides to work in the snow that "you ride to work to show your
co-workers you're nuts".

Mark Hickey
Habanero Cycles
http://www.habcycles.com
Home of the $795 ti frame
 
"Leo Lichtman" <[email protected]> wrote:

>"Zoot Katz" wrote: Hope's, Faith's and Charity's sister, Shirley?
>^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>"Shirley?" You jest!

I'm jest what? And don't call me Surely.

Mark Hickey
Habanero Cycles
http://www.habcycles.com
Home of the $795 ti frame
 
Peter Cole writes:

> From m-w.com:

> Main Entry: hope.ful.ly
> Pronunciation:
> Function: adverb
> 1 : in a hopeful manner
> 2 : it is hoped : I hope : we hope

> Usage In the early 1960s the second sense of hopefully, which had
> been in sporadic use since around 1932, underwent a surge of popular
> use. A surge of popular criticism followed in reaction, but the
> criticism took no account of the grammar of adverbs. Hopefully in
> its second sense is a member of a class of adverbs known as
> disjuncts. Disjuncts serve as a means by which the author or
> speaker can comment directly to the reader or hearer usually on the
> content of the sentence to which they are attached. Many other
> adverbs (as interestingly, frankly, clearly, luckily, unfortunately)
> are similarly used; most are so ordinary as to excite no comment or
> interest whatsoever. The second sense of hopefully is entirely
> standard.

Whether the use of hopefully has been taken up by the dictionary you
cite or not has little bearing on its effective use. I disagree on
the definition of it being an adverb. The dangling hopefully is none
of the above and that is why its use is inappropriate. Appending a
"hopefully" to the beginning or end of a sentence gives it a doubtful
ring and most likely not what the author intended. Because being
opinionated is a great faux pas in our society, "hopefully" is invoked
to avoid that criticism. The speaker wants to underwrite a concept
but is afraid to do so. For instance take a moment to compare: "This
will work, hopefully." and "I hope this will work."

In that vein, many writers on this forum slide into the subjunctive to
avoid actually voicing their opinion. "If I were to believe that, I
would probably say it wasn't contrived.".. (aka, but I wont say that).

As you may have noticed in this forum, when looking for a harsh
criticism in response to something I wrote, "opinionated" is what
comes out of people civil enough to not use four letter words in their
response.

Jobst Brandt
 
<[email protected]>: (clip) As you may have noticed in this
forum, when looking for a harsh criticism in response to something I wrote,
"opinionated" is what comes out of people civil enough to not use four
letter words in their response.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
You consider "opinionated" a harsh criticism? Hopefully, you will come to
recognize it as an apt description.

BTW, since we are discussing language and its correct use, I must take
exception to your writing: "when looking for a harsh criticism in response
to something I wrote, 'opinionated' is what comes out" (clip). This
contains two errors. "Something I wrote," should read, "something I have
written." I will leave it to you to search for the other.

Some people would also object to "to not use," on the ground that it is a
split infinitive. I regard Fowler's Modern English Usage as the ultimate
authority, and he does not object to them. I believe that "not to use" is
preferable, however--it flows more smoothly.
 
"Mark Hickey" wrote: I'm jest what? And don't call me Surely.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
I didn't call you surly. But, if you'll give me your number, I'll surely
call you.
 
On Sun, 11 Dec 2005 22:04:21 -0700, Mark Hickey <[email protected]>
wrote:

>>No, but they are doomed to repeat it.
>
>It's most important during the winter riding season to NOT mix up
>"your" and "you're"... for example, it's a compliment to suggest that
>someone rides to work in the snow that "you ride to work to show your
>co-workers you're nuts".

You'd get fired and arrested for misspelling that one.
--
zk
 

> The dangling hopefully is none
> of the above and that is why its use is inappropriate. Appending a
> "hopefully" to the beginning or end of a sentence gives it a doubtful
> ring

It's intended to give it a hopeful ring, sort of like Paul McCartney's
facial expression, particularly the eyebrows.
 
FWIW, although I still find it useful, Fowler's may be somewhat out-of
-date, despite subsequent editions, and Anglo-centric. I've been
meaning to get a copy of this, more current and based on US usage:
Garner's Modern American Usage (see, e.g.,
http://www.worldwidewords.org/reviews/re-gar1.htm). Regards, Roy Zipris
 
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