The One Hour Record



gntlmn

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gntlmn said:
It appears that we may get an idea whether Lance will make an attempt at the World Hour Record within about 6 weeks. At that time, it may be clearer as to what date it will be attempted and at what locale. It sounds like it may be almost 2 years away.

http://www.usoc.org/11796_30046.htm

I hate to say this, but I hope he does it at sea level. If that 7-Eleven velodrome they are talking about is in Colorado Springs, it may be at elevation 6,000 ft+. A record set at that elevation won't be comparable to Boardman's. Even if he beat it by a fair margin at high elevation, the result will be called into question. Unlike Merckx' day, we all know the top athletes use hypoxic tents and are conditioned for riding at high elevation. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think UCI is silent about elevation for the Hour Record.
 

gntlmn

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I like the way Chris Boardman describes the record and what he thinks about keeping it pure and historically comparable in this article. He said it well. He also mentions that he suggested to race officials when he set the record in October of 2000 that they should take and preserve samples from the athlete. While that is a nice gesture, we've already seen that method fail with Hamilton in the Olympics. Anyway, read this article for his thoughts on Armstrong's attempt at the One Hour Record http://www.manchesteronline.co.uk/sport/s/144/144430_lance_gears_up.html
 

taras0000

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gntlmn said:
I like the way Chris Boardman describes the record and what he thinks about keeping it pure and historically comparable in this article. He said it well. He also mentions that he suggested to race officials when he set the record in October of 2000 that they should take and preserve samples from the athlete. While that is a nice gesture, we've already seen that method fail with Hamilton in the Olympics. Anyway, read this article for his thoughts on Armstrong's attempt at the One Hour Record http://www.manchesteronline.co.uk/sport/s/144/144430_lance_gears_up.html
I would love to see Lance do it at sea level as well, even Manchester, but I think that it will be done in the US for the same reason that Chris did it in Manchester, home town crowd. As far as the altitude thing goes and keeping it pure and comparable, you have to remember that Eddy did his at altitude as well. So if there is going to be a standard, what's it going to be? the Chris standard, or the Eddy standard?
 

gntlmn

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taras0000 said:
I would love to see Lance do it at sea level as well, even Manchester, but I think that it will be done in the US for the same reason that Chris did it in Manchester, home town crowd. As far as the altitude thing goes and keeping it pure and comparable, you have to remember that Eddy did his at altitude as well. So if there is going to be a standard, what's it going to be? the Chris standard, or the Eddy standard?

I was thinking along the same lines myself, that each athlete doesn't want this to be a cut and dried comparison. I bet each one has a hunch which altitude he will (or would) fare best at compared to the competition. So they choose to do it at the altitude that suits them best, not what their competition chooses. The result becomes fodder for discussion after discussion, and that's what they want, to be kept alive in the minds of us cycling fans.

Eddy's record at altitude was done without the help of acclimatization to the thin air. That's not the case nowadays with hypoxic tents very popular. I think any athlete nowadays will have an advantage in the hour at elevation compared to sea level if he uses a tent. Such was probably not the case in Merckx' day. I'm not sure he gained anything riding high in the mountains. But I am pretty sure that he would have done better, probably quite a bit better, if he would have been sleeping in a hypoxic tent to acclimatize his blood to the thin air.

If Lance does his attempt in Colorado at 6,000 ft elevation, even on the classic bike he will smash the record. Maybe he'll do it again at sea level for comparison purposes, but I have a feeling he won't. This event is not at all easy when it's an attempt on the world record. It's probably about as agonizing an athletic event as can be. So I think he'll probably do it in Colorado Springs to bring some attention and welcome upgrades to the Olympic Training Center there.
 

gntlmn

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It appears that Boardman remembers the pain very well when he set the athlete's one hour record in 2000. It appears that Armstrong is leaving it in the air as to which record he will attempt: the one hour performance, which is the one allowing aerodynamic improvements, and the athlete's one hour record, which uses the Merckx bike. Maybe he'll do both.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,4-1485906,00.html
 

El Loto

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I was reading an article on a website about the history of the World Hour Record and it mentioned at the bottom that Abraham Olano was going to go for the record either in Bilbao or Bordeaux. I'm not sure when it was published. I'll find the link and post it.
 

gntlmn

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El Loto said:
http://www.speed101.com/now/fastest_0717_4.htm
It was July 2001.

Anybody know if Olano went for it?

It's interesting that in that article, it mentions that Boardman actually believed that he wouldn't have to set a new distance record when the aerodynamically advantaged one hour performance was no longer recognized as the world hour record. Goes to show you he actually believed the hype that the record was indisputably his, that the aerodynamics didn't make such a huge difference from 50- km to 56+ km in an hour. He was in for a rude awakening.

Boardman may not like it much if Armstrong tries for the record at elevation, but actually, it will keep Chris' memorable performance alive for years to come if Armstrong breaks the record. The debate will then focus on the advantage of elevation.

I have a feeling that Armstrong may want to make a statement about his ability at elevation. After all, that's where he would open his biggest gaps in the Tour de France--in the mountains. It's been reported in the media that he sleeps in hypoxic tents to acclimatize to elevation. I don't think there's much doubt that if a rider is acclimatized to elevation (sleep high, train low), he will ride farther in an hour at 6,000 ft elevation than he would at sea level. Furthermore, if the athletes horsepower doesn't degrade as much, relative to other riders, in the hills, this will give him an additional advantage.

I'm rather surprised that the UCI didn't address the elevation question in setting the One Hour Record back to the classic bike. Other things would make a difference too, such as floor surface and aerodynamics of the clothing. But I think these are lesser factors than elevation, which is I suspect a big factor for a prepared athlete.
 

closesupport

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gntlmn said:
It's interesting that in that article, it mentions that Boardman actually believed that he wouldn't have to set a new distance record when the aerodynamically advantaged one hour performance was no longer recognized as the world hour record. Goes to show you he actually believed the hype that the record was indisputably his, that the aerodynamics didn't make such a huge difference from 50- km to 56+ km in an hour. He was in for a rude awakening.

Boardman may not like it much if Armstrong tries for the record at elevation, but actually, it will keep Chris' memorable performance alive for years to come if Armstrong breaks the record. The debate will then focus on the advantage of elevation.

I have a feeling that Armstrong may want to make a statement about his ability at elevation. After all, that's where he would open his biggest gaps in the Tour de France--in the mountains. It's been reported in the media that he sleeps in hypoxic tents to acclimatize to elevation. I don't think there's much doubt that if a rider is acclimatized to elevation (sleep high, train low), he will ride farther in an hour at 6,000 ft elevation than he would at sea level. Furthermore, if the athletes horsepower doesn't degrade as much, relative to other riders, in the hills, this will give him an additional advantage.

I'm rather surprised that the UCI didn't address the elevation question in setting the One Hour Record back to the classic bike. Other things would make a difference too, such as floor surface and aerodynamics of the clothing. But I think these are lesser factors than elevation, which is I suspect a big factor for a prepared athlete.
i think that they should ride the same bike, on the same track at the same altitude, then if he doesn't break it or if he does break it, i'm sure you'll all suggest maybe he did through doping preperation.
 

gntlmn

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closesupport said:
i think that they should ride the same bike, on the same track at the same altitude, then if he doesn't break it or if he does break it, i'm sure you'll all suggest maybe he did through doping preperation.

Well, we basically have 3 different athletes we are comparing now: Merckx, Boardman and the new challenger, Armstrong (if he follows through, which I think he will). Merckx and Boardman did it at different altitudes, and Boardman had more technological advantage than Merckx did. I'm not talking about the bike. Of course the bike was UCI regulation on his athlete's record. I'm talking about for training. Boardman had the use of heart rate monitors, power meters, hypoxic tents, more nutrition advances garnered over the 28 year period, and he also probably had more track experience than Merckx, although Merckx was not strictly a roadie either. He, like Boardman, had great successes on the track too.

Since Boardman only beat the record by 10 meters or so, Merckx' record at elevation is going to be in the discussion because of all the differences mentioned above. This is why it is difficult to decide exactly what elevation the standard should be set at, not to mention that each athlete has his own idea of what elevation would bring out his greatest strengths.

Along comes Armstrong. What elevation does he choose: the sea level one or the 8,000+ ft. one of Mexico City elevation? Apparently, he will choose neither. Instead he will choose 6,000+ ft. This is because there is no clear elevation standard yet. Merckx record was only beaten by a hair, and he will still be in the discussion until his record is beaten by a great amount. I think Armstrong can beat it by a pretty wide margin at 6,000 ft because of all the advantages he has, mentioned above, that Merckx didn't have when he was riding. For this reason, I think people will be talking about Merckx for a long, long time.
 

trackmaster

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You can't compare Lance to Merckx because of all the technological advantages there are for him. I'm sure Lance will
woop merckx's record because he has the best of everything; trainers, equipment, nutritionist and apparently he's going to get a world class velodrome built just to break the one hour record. Geesh.
What Lance doesn't have yet is a shirt from www.kingzoftheroad.com

peace.
 

gntlmn

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trackmaster said:
You can't compare Lance to Merckx because of all the technological advantages there are for him. I'm sure Lance will
woop merckx's record because he has the best of everything; trainers, equipment, nutritionist and apparently he's going to get a world class velodrome built just to break the one hour record. Geesh.
What Lance doesn't have yet is a shirt from www.kingzoftheroad.com

peace.

Very well said. For the same reason, we cannot compare what Boardman did to what Merckx did, even though he did best the distance, albeit by only a few meters.
 

trackmaster

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ric_stern/RST said:
It isn't Merckx's record to "woop". It's Boardmans.

I know it's Boardman's record now.
My point is Merckx set the bar pretty damn high with what he had back in the day which is pretty remarkable. Merckx is the Man!
;)
 

trackmaster

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ric_stern/RST said:
in other words you agree with me, and your previous comment was incorrect

ric

No my previous comment isn't incorrect Ricky.
Why don't you go back and read it first.
The comment wasn't about who Lance is going to "beat" but how you can't "compare" the two. :eek:
I think we can all agree that Lance will break the record no matter whos it
because of the advantages he has in 2005.
The fact that you posted a thread just to try and get me to say I was wrong and agree with you makes me laugh!
Have a nice day Ricky :D
 

gntlmn

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trackmaster said:
I know it's Boardman's record now.
My point is Merckx set the bar pretty damn high with what he had back in the day which is pretty remarkable. Merckx is the Man!
;)

I agree with you about Merckx, that his record is still the standard against which current rides, with the current advantages, are compared. Clearly, there have been many improvements in training since then. On the other hand, I don't think a significant change has occurred since Boardman set the record in 2000. Lance will still need to use the bicycle approved by UCI, which will be the same as the one Merckx and Boardman used. So that won't change. The difference will be in any training advantages Armstrong has that Boardman didn't. I don't think there are any at the moment, not to preclude the possibility that there might be significant improvements between now and the end of 2006.

Do you figure Lance has a disadvantage against Boardman and Merckx due to lack of much track experience? Boardman had the most track experience of the 3.
 

gntlmn

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An exercise physiologist, Dan Heil at the University of Montana, has submitted a paper to the European Journal of Applied Physiology in which he contends, based on a sophisticated mathematical and physics based model, that Lance Armstrong may smash both hour records by a margin that will put them out of reach of any other athletes for decades to come. He predicts that Armstrong may add as much as 2 km to each record.

http://www.dailypeloton.com/displayarticle.asp?pk=7500

I don't want to discredit what this scientist is proposing, but out of fairness to the other athletes who were also analyzed in various ways by physiologists, it will be interesting to see what really happens when Armstrong makes his attempt. That will be the ultimate test.

Maybe Lance really is going to try for both records: the One Hour performance, and the Athlete's One Hour Record.
 

gntlmn

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This series of articles makes it sound like Lance is only now getting on a track bike for the first time. Even Ekimov entered a wind tunnel for the first time now after his long and fabulous career.

http://www.cyclingnews.com/tech.php?id=tech/2005/features/lance_tunnel

I guess it might make it tough for others to beat the record if they build the velodrome at altitude and then tear it down after Lance sets the record. Heh heh. I don't know if they'll do that, but they mention it.
 

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