The sweet spot in biking



"amh" <[email protected]> wrote
>
> Running is different in that it doesn't react with the body. If you
> take measures to reduce injury (stretch, wear proper shoes, don't over
> do it, eat properly, etc) the body will adapt to the running just
> fine.


Not for me. I tried regular running in my 20's, had knee problems. Went to
a sports doc, he told me I was just too big to run (6'10", 230), said I'd
just trash my body. I quit, and have had no knee problems since (30 yrs).
My brother, who is a couple of years younger, kept running, and is now
looking at double knee replacement. Our cycling club is full of ex-runners
who had to give it up because of chronic injuries. One guy I knew gave up
marathoning because of trashed knees, to up bike riding to rehab, wound up
winning a US national masters time trial. He couldn't run, but biked 1,000
mi/wk for training.
 
Badger_South wrote:


||
|| Now some might say 'if you're not sore, you haven't ridden hard or
|| long enough', and no argument from that. I really expected to be a
|| little sore from my epic ride up Monticello, but, nope. Nada. (BTW I

Anytime I do about 60+ miles, my quads are sore for a couple of days
afterwards. I wish that problem would go away.
 
On Sun, 24 Oct 2004 17:24:02 -0400, "Roger Zoul" <[email protected]>
wrote:

>Badger_South wrote:
>
>
>||
>|| Now some might say 'if you're not sore, you haven't ridden hard or
>|| long enough', and no argument from that. I really expected to be a
>|| little sore from my epic ride up Monticello, but, nope. Nada. (BTW I
>
>Anytime I do about 60+ miles, my quads are sore for a couple of days
>afterwards. I wish that problem would go away.


You are nearly in the 'freak 0' nature' Cat, Rog. doing these 85 mile rides
in your first year on the bike! Someday I'll be trying that kind of
distance. Nov. hopefully. (metric century).

IOW, I don't get DOMS in the quads anymore. I have ridden a 60 mile day
recently, but it was two ~30 milers 1 am and 1 (non-scheduled) late
afternoon ride...nothing.

Btw, today I watched my first OLN network Bike race at home. I only had
basic cable and was not aware OLN was available, thus why I traveled to Va
beach to wach it as my brother's cable company had it as basic service.

Anyway today's were two triathlons, but with ample bike leg coverage. I was
whooping it up...er enjoying myself quite a bit.

Incidently, I was not aware that short course Triathlons in the series
allowed drafting and peloton type riding, just like a bike race. The long
course (Ironman distances) do not allow drafting and the passing rider has
12 seconds to get past and must maintain some distance (10 feet, 15 feet, I
forget) between any two riders. It ws a neat race with incredible tactics.
Catch it if you can (Germany Tri). I posted in another thread.

(A Postal team member participated in it, but they flash the names times so
freakin' fast on those, I couldn't get his name...rider #100, shaved head
all-white skinsuit. Made up huge time in the bike leg...couldn't get his
final.) The short course race (in Korea was Awesome. Incredible coverage,
and everything about it was super exciting (60 minute shows). Best of the
series so far)

-B
 
"Roger Zoul" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
> Anytime I do about 60+ miles, my quads are sore for a couple of days
> afterwards. I wish that problem would go away.


In my experience, it will go away if you do adequate preparation ahead
of time. I'm still learning a lot about how the body responds to
training, but I've noticed that the body definitely improves its
ability to go for longer periods if you train it right: lots of long,
easy (meaning EASY) miles for the first few months of the season
(known as "base" to the racing types) followed by more intense
training and even longer rides later on.

A normal week for me during the main riding season includes 3-4 rides
of 20-30 miles (varying intensity) on weekday evenings, plus a long
ride (40-70 miles) on the weekend.

At the end of the summer I did a 50-mile charity ride. I just went
out and had fun -- hammered up some hills, sat back and chatted in a
group, hammered up some steeper hills, then went balls-to-the-wall for
the last ~15 miles. It was great fun, and I never had a thought about
my leg muscles (Ok, maybe on that one long, steep hill with the high
winds - yikes). They were a little sore at the end of the day, but
the next day I was fine.

BTW, I should mention that I don't race (too slow for that) -- I'm
just a medium-to-old fart who loves to ride.

As always, YMMV...

JR
 
On 25 Oct 2004 08:22:24 -0700, [email protected] (SlowRider) wrote:

>"Roger Zoul" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
>> Anytime I do about 60+ miles, my quads are sore for a couple of days
>> afterwards. I wish that problem would go away.

>
>In my experience, it will go away if you do adequate preparation ahead
>of time. I'm still learning a lot about how the body responds to
>training, but I've noticed that the body definitely improves its
>ability to go for longer periods if you train it right: lots of long,
>easy (meaning EASY) miles for the first few months of the season
>(known as "base" to the racing types) followed by more intense
>training and even longer rides later on.
>
>A normal week for me during the main riding season includes 3-4 rides
>of 20-30 miles (varying intensity) on weekday evenings, plus a long
>ride (40-70 miles) on the weekend.
>
>At the end of the summer I did a 50-mile charity ride. I just went
>out and had fun -- hammered up some hills, sat back and chatted in a
>group, hammered up some steeper hills, then went balls-to-the-wall for
>the last ~15 miles. It was great fun, and I never had a thought about
>my leg muscles (Ok, maybe on that one long, steep hill with the high
>winds - yikes). They were a little sore at the end of the day, but
>the next day I was fine.
>
>BTW, I should mention that I don't race (too slow for that) -- I'm
>just a medium-to-old fart who loves to ride.
>
>As always, YMMV...
>
>JR


I love you, man! uh, in a totally butch way, that is...er.

-B
You give good 'read'.
 
Badger_South wrote:
> On 25 Oct 2004 08:22:24 -0700, [email protected] (SlowRider) wrote:
>
>
>>"Roger Zoul" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
>>
>>>Anytime I do about 60+ miles, my quads are sore for a couple of days
>>>afterwards. I wish that problem would go away.

>>

--snippity--
>>BTW, I should mention that I don't race (too slow for that) -- I'm
>>just a medium-to-old fart who loves to ride.
>>
>>As always, YMMV...
>>
>>JR

>
>
> I love you, man! uh, in a totally butch way, that is...er.
>
> -B
> You give good 'read'.


*groan* Badge, that was a low blow.

*innocent look*

-km

--
Only cowards fight kids -- unidentified Moscow protester

http://community.webshots.com/user/blackrosequilts
proud to be owned by a yorkie
 
On Mon, 25 Oct 2004 17:48:51 GMT, the black rose
<[email protected]> wrote:

>> I love you, man! uh, in a totally butch way, that is...er.
>>
>> -B
>> You give good 'read'.

>
>*groan* Badge, that was a low blow.
>
>*innocent look*
>
>-km


Huh? I don't know what you mean. I was trying to say in a humorous way that
the post was just 'right', neat, and cool and got me off, since my thoughts
are so there....orgasmic riding / bike talk, iow.

Same as when a hot chick walks in with a totally state of the art
laptop...I sidle up and say, 'can I have a look...at your laptop'...and she
brightens and we talk shop!

-B
 
SlowRider wrote:
:: "Roger Zoul" <[email protected]> wrote in message
:: news:<[email protected]>...
::: Anytime I do about 60+ miles, my quads are sore for a couple of days
::: afterwards. I wish that problem would go away.
::
:: In my experience, it will go away if you do adequate preparation
:: ahead
:: of time. I'm still learning a lot about how the body responds to
:: training, but I've noticed that the body definitely improves its
:: ability to go for longer periods if you train it right: lots of long,
:: easy (meaning EASY) miles for the first few months of the season
:: (known as "base" to the racing types) followed by more intense
:: training and even longer rides later on.

Yeah, that makes sense to me.

::
:: A normal week for me during the main riding season includes 3-4 rides
:: of 20-30 miles (varying intensity) on weekday evenings, plus a long
:: ride (40-70 miles) on the weekend.

My problem is I can't really count on riding 30 miles during the week. I
did managed to do that back in June, but only because my work schedule
happened to permit that. I'm not sure if I'll be able to count on that next
summer.
::
:: At the end of the summer I did a 50-mile charity ride. I just went
:: out and had fun -- hammered up some hills, sat back and chatted in a
:: group, hammered up some steeper hills, then went balls-to-the-wall
:: for
:: the last ~15 miles. It was great fun, and I never had a thought
:: about
:: my leg muscles (Ok, maybe on that one long, steep hill with the high
:: winds - yikes). They were a little sore at the end of the day, but
:: the next day I was fine.
::
:: BTW, I should mention that I don't race (too slow for that) -- I'm
:: just a medium-to-old fart who loves to ride.

Yeah, me too. Way too slow to race, and too heavy too. That's what leads
to such a workout for my quads, actually.

::
:: As always, YMMV...
::
:: JR
 
Badger_South wrote:
:: On Sun, 24 Oct 2004 17:24:02 -0400, "Roger Zoul"
:: <[email protected]> wrote:
::
::: Badger_South wrote:
:::
:::
:::::
::::: Now some might say 'if you're not sore, you haven't ridden hard or
::::: long enough', and no argument from that. I really expected to be a
::::: little sore from my epic ride up Monticello, but, nope. Nada.
::::: (BTW I
:::
::: Anytime I do about 60+ miles, my quads are sore for a couple of days
::: afterwards. I wish that problem would go away.
::
:: You are nearly in the 'freak 0' nature' Cat, Rog. doing these 85
:: mile rides in your first year on the bike! Someday I'll be trying
:: that kind of distance. Nov. hopefully. (metric century).

Hmm....I don't really think that's true, Badge. I'm certain you could do it
too if you set your mind to it.

::
:: IOW, I don't get DOMS in the quads anymore. I have ridden a 60 mile
:: day recently, but it was two ~30 milers 1 am and 1 (non-scheduled)
:: late afternoon ride...nothing.

Hills. Hills. Hills.

::
:: Btw, today I watched my first OLN network Bike race at home. I only
:: had basic cable and was not aware OLN was available, thus why I
:: traveled to Va beach to wach it as my brother's cable company had it
:: as basic service.
::
:: Anyway today's were two triathlons, but with ample bike leg
:: coverage. I was whooping it up...er enjoying myself quite a bit.

Yeah, I've got my Tivo on the job getting those bike races for me. I love
tivo.
::
:: Incidently, I was not aware that short course Triathlons in the
:: series allowed drafting and peloton type riding, just like a bike
:: race. The long course (Ironman distances) do not allow drafting and
:: the passing rider has 12 seconds to get past and must maintain some
:: distance (10 feet, 15 feet, I forget) between any two riders. It ws
:: a neat race with incredible tactics. Catch it if you can (Germany
:: Tri). I posted in another thread.

I saw that and I have my buddy on the job :)

Seems kinda hard to be forced to pass in 12 seconds....depends on what the
other guy is doing.

::
:: (A Postal team member participated in it, but they flash the names
:: times so freakin' fast on those, I couldn't get his name...rider
:: #100, shaved head all-white skinsuit. Made up huge time in the bike
:: leg...couldn't get his final.) The short course race (in Korea was
:: Awesome. Incredible coverage, and everything about it was super
:: exciting (60 minute shows). Best of the series so far)

Did I mention that I saw Hincappie race right here in Greenville SC a few
weeks ago? It was in some pro-level bike race in the Fall For Greenville
Festival. Hincappie won the race and I was standing ride in line with the
finish line when he crossed and put those arms up. That was fun. Every
time the peloton flew by I tried to imagine how I would do in relation to
them. It was sad. :)
 
Badger_South wrote:
> On Mon, 25 Oct 2004 17:48:51 GMT, the black rose
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>
>>>I love you, man! uh, in a totally butch way, that is...er.
>>>
>>>-B
>>>You give good 'read'.

>>
>>*groan* Badge, that was a low blow.
>>
>>*innocent look*
>>
>>-km

>
>
> Huh? I don't know what you mean. I was trying to say in a humorous way that
> the post was just 'right', neat, and cool and got me off, since my thoughts
> are so there....orgasmic riding / bike talk, iow.


I think I saw a pun where none was intended (hence the groan).

My husband is an inveterate punster. He had a friend in
college that was as bad as he was; when those two got
together, people moved to more distant tables. Seriously.

Our sons showed signs of punster-ness at early ages.

I'm doomed. :-D

-km

--
Only cowards fight kids -- unidentified Moscow protester

http://community.webshots.com/user/blackrosequilts
proud to be owned by a yorkie
 
Roger Zoul wrote:
> SlowRider wrote:
> :: A normal week for me during the main riding season includes 3-4 rides
> :: of 20-30 miles (varying intensity) on weekday evenings, plus a long
> :: ride (40-70 miles) on the weekend.
>
> My problem is I can't really count on riding 30 miles during the week. I
> did managed to do that back in June, but only because my work schedule
> happened to permit that. I'm not sure if I'll be able to count on that next
> summer.


Ah ha-a. Did you just identify why your quads get so sore?

> :: At the end of the summer I did a 50-mile charity ride. I just went
> :: out and had fun -- hammered up some hills, sat back and chatted in a
> :: group, hammered up some steeper hills, then went balls-to-the-wall
> :: for
> :: the last ~15 miles. It was great fun, and I never had a thought
> :: about
> :: my leg muscles (Ok, maybe on that one long, steep hill with the high
> :: winds - yikes). They were a little sore at the end of the day, but
> :: the next day I was fine.
> ::
> :: BTW, I should mention that I don't race (too slow for that) -- I'm
> :: just a medium-to-old fart who loves to ride.
>
> Yeah, me too. Way too slow to race, and too heavy too. That's what leads
> to such a workout for my quads, actually.


Squats. Lunges. Leg presses. They help. Even wusses like
me, so surely they'll help you.

I'm way too slow to race too. I'll be happy if I can keep
with the C-riders. Plenty of folks to ride with in that range.

-km

--
Only cowards fight kids -- unidentified Moscow protester

http://community.webshots.com/user/blackrosequilts
proud to be owned by a yorkie
 
the black rose wrote:
|| Roger Zoul wrote:
||| SlowRider wrote:
||||| A normal week for me during the main riding season includes 3-4
||||| rides
||||| of 20-30 miles (varying intensity) on weekday evenings, plus a
||||| long
||||| ride (40-70 miles) on the weekend.
|||
||| My problem is I can't really count on riding 30 miles during the
||| week. I did managed to do that back in June, but only because my
||| work schedule happened to permit that. I'm not sure if I'll be
||| able to count on that next summer.
||
|| Ah ha-a. Did you just identify why your quads get so sore?

Sure.

||
||||| At the end of the summer I did a 50-mile charity ride. I just
||||| went
||||| out and had fun -- hammered up some hills, sat back and chatted
||||| in a group, hammered up some steeper hills, then went
||||| balls-to-the-wall
||||| for
||||| the last ~15 miles. It was great fun, and I never had a thought
||||| about
||||| my leg muscles (Ok, maybe on that one long, steep hill with the
||||| high winds - yikes). They were a little sore at the end of the
||||| day, but
||||| the next day I was fine.
|||||
||||| BTW, I should mention that I don't race (too slow for that) -- I'm
||||| just a medium-to-old fart who loves to ride.
|||
||| Yeah, me too. Way too slow to race, and too heavy too. That's
||| what leads to such a workout for my quads, actually.
||
|| Squats. Lunges. Leg presses. They help. Even wusses like
|| me, so surely they'll help you.

I already do all of that!!! I have been for two years straight.

||
|| I'm way too slow to race too. I'll be happy if I can keep
|| with the C-riders. Plenty of folks to ride with in that range.

I basically ride alone.

||
|| -km
||
|| --
|| Only cowards fight kids -- unidentified Moscow protester
||
|| http://community.webshots.com/user/blackrosequilts
|| proud to be owned by a yorkie
 
On Mon, 25 Oct 2004 16:39:57 -0400, "Roger Zoul" <[email protected]>
wrote:

> a neat race with incredible tactics. Catch it if you can (Germany
>:: Tri). I posted in another thread.
>
>I saw that and I have my buddy on the job :)
>
>Seems kinda hard to be forced to pass in 12 seconds....depends on what the
>other guy is doing.


I was not of the specific. This functionally seems only applied to the
leaders...the pack, (50th and back?? is riding like struggling
guppies...can't blame 'em. You'll see it..

>:: (A Postal team member participated in it, but they flash the names
>:: times so freakin' fast on those, I couldn't get his name...rider
>:: #100, shaved head all-white skinsuit. Made up huge time in the bike
>:: leg...couldn't get his final.) The short course race (in Korea was
>:: Awesome. Incredible coverage, and everything about it was super
>:: exciting (60 minute shows). Best of the series so far)
>
>Did I mention that I saw Hincappie race right here in Greenville SC a few
>weeks ago? It was in some pro-level bike race in the Fall For Greenville
>Festival. Hincappie won the race and I was standing ride in line with the
>finish line when he crossed and put those arms up. That was fun. Every
>time the peloton flew by I tried to imagine how I would do in relation to
>them. It was sad. :)


Ppl dont' realize how 'fast' those guys, -and- how fast pro track runners
go. Indoors down by the boards, holy shite, hold on to your hat fast.

-B
So you're comparing yourself to Hincapie, now, heh.heh.
 
On Mon, 25 Oct 2004 21:06:44 GMT, the black rose
<[email protected]> wrote:

>I'm way too slow to race too. I'll be happy if I can keep
>with the C-riders. Plenty of folks to ride with in that range.
>
>-km


(aside to Roger: "you -know- she's killin' them C-riders")

Sure, sure. ;-p

-B
 
On 26 Oct 2004 00:17:57 GMT, David Reuteler <[email protected]> wrote:

> Badger_South <[email protected]> wrote:
>> On Mon, 25 Oct 2004 18:33:20 -0400, "Roger Zoul"
>> <[email protected]>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> I basically ride alone.

>>
>> The, um, Johnny Cash of cycling?

>
> bah. perhaps, but it's true for 99% of my rides, as well. i'd bet there
> are a lot of us out there.


Heh. I'm with you. I do crazy stuff when I am riding by myself and just
take
off on the bike at random. When I leave the house I never know if it will
be
around the block or around 3 counties. Planning? What planning? Sometimes
I will go from the road and take a trail that turns into a wild downhill
cyclocross, other times who knows. Around here I have 13 year old boys
that won't try some of the things I do, so yeah, alone and out of control.
If your heart is beating then you should be having fun.
I don't "Walk the line". Tribute to Johnny. I liked "A boy named Sue", Cash
was great.
Bill Baka


--
Using M2, Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/m2/
 
Badger_South wrote:
|| On Mon, 25 Oct 2004 16:39:57 -0400, "Roger Zoul"
|| <[email protected]> wrote:
||
||| a neat race with incredible tactics. Catch it if you can (Germany
||||| Tri). I posted in another thread.
|||
||| I saw that and I have my buddy on the job :)
|||
||| Seems kinda hard to be forced to pass in 12 seconds....depends on
||| what the other guy is doing.
||
|| I was not of the specific. This functionally seems only applied to
|| the leaders...the pack, (50th and back?? is riding like struggling
|| guppies...can't blame 'em. You'll see it..
||
||||| (A Postal team member participated in it, but they flash the names
||||| times so freakin' fast on those, I couldn't get his name...rider
||||| #100, shaved head all-white skinsuit. Made up huge time in the
||||| bike leg...couldn't get his final.) The short course race (in
||||| Korea was Awesome. Incredible coverage, and everything about it
||||| was super exciting (60 minute shows). Best of the series so far)
|||
||| Did I mention that I saw Hincappie race right here in Greenville SC
||| a few weeks ago? It was in some pro-level bike race in the Fall
||| For Greenville Festival. Hincappie won the race and I was standing
||| ride in line with the finish line when he crossed and put those
||| arms up. That was fun. Every time the peloton flew by I tried to
||| imagine how I would do in relation to them. It was sad. :)
||
|| Ppl dont' realize how 'fast' those guys, -and- how fast pro track
|| runners go. Indoors down by the boards, holy shite, hold on to your
|| hat fast.
||
|| -B
|| So you're comparing yourself to Hincapie, now, heh.heh.

Yeah, it's sad, huh. :)
 
Badger_South wrote:
> On Mon, 25 Oct 2004 21:06:44 GMT, the black rose
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>
>>I'm way too slow to race too. I'll be happy if I can keep
>>with the C-riders. Plenty of folks to ride with in that range.
>>
>>-km

>
>
> (aside to Roger: "you -know- she's killin' them C-riders")
>
> Sure, sure. ;-p


Heh. Heh. Heh.

If you buy a CycleOps trainer right now, you get a free CTS
training video in the box. Which one you get appears to be
random (there are 5 -- climbing, MTB, sprinting, criterium,
and time trialing), but I got the one on time trialing.

Heh. Heh. Heh.

Come spring, I'm gonna blow the C-riders outta the water.

Serious aside: it's a GREAT workout. You're too busy
feeling the pain to get bored.

-km

--
Only cowards fight kids -- unidentified Moscow protester

http://community.webshots.com/user/blackrosequilts
proud to be owned by a yorkie
 
On Tue, 26 Oct 2004 13:44:45 GMT, the black rose
<[email protected]> wrote:

>Badger_South wrote:
>> On Mon, 25 Oct 2004 21:06:44 GMT, the black rose
>> <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>>
>>>I'm way too slow to race too. I'll be happy if I can keep
>>>with the C-riders. Plenty of folks to ride with in that range.
>>>
>>>-km

>>
>>
>> (aside to Roger: "you -know- she's killin' them C-riders")
>>
>> Sure, sure. ;-p

>
>Heh. Heh. Heh.
>
>If you buy a CycleOps trainer right now, you get a free CTS
>training video in the box. Which one you get appears to be
>random (there are 5 -- climbing, MTB, sprinting, criterium,
>and time trialing), but I got the one on time trialing.
>
>Heh. Heh. Heh.
>
>Come spring, I'm gonna blow the C-riders outta the water.


Though you come across as gentle and supportive, with great humor. I'm
intuiting that you also have this shark-like intensity, and obvious
bulldog-like persistence and dedication. Plus, brainy! (Linux)

>Serious aside: it's a GREAT workout. You're too busy
>feeling the pain to get bored.


Pain? What is this 'pain' of which you speak?

Kidding. The feeling, in a group ride, is like this deep intensity, and
strain to concentrate, as you shuttle the tension from system to system,
trying to hold on, looking for places to relax, and then trying to push in
surges.

>-km


-B