the term "islamo-fascism", valid?

[Wurm]

Here are some inconvenient details on the recently "discovered" WMD's in Iraq:

[size=+1] Olbermann: Santorum WMD's false Story [/size]



Good Evening from New York.

We have found Weapons of Mass Destruction in Iraq.

15-year old Weapons of Mass Destruction that could give you the equivalent of a serious rug burn.

Our fifth story on the Countdown: Independent experts and the level-headed, staggering in amazement today, that deteriorated mustard gas canisters -- at least fifteen years old and as much as **eighteen** years old -- could be **palmed off** by desperate politicians as some kind of rationale for the deaths of 2500 American servicemen in Iraq.

Republican Senator, Rick Santorum, down 18 percent in the polls in his own re-election bid... **joined** by the chairman of the House Intelligence Committee, Representative Pete Hoekstra of Michigan... in pimping part of a two-month old military intelligence report describing the existence of old munitions shells with chemical weapons that are degraded, unusable, and non-threatening. "We have found weapons of mass destruction in Iraq, **chemical** weapons," Santorum told a news conference.Gullible news organizations treated the story with slightly less fervor than they might, the Second Coming...

"Since 2003," Santorum said, reading from the report, "coalition forces have recovered approximately 500 weapons munitions which contain degraded mustard or sarin nerve agent... pre-Gulf War chemical munitions are assessed to still exist. ... While agents degrade over time, chemical warfare agents remain hazardous and potentially lethal."

Santorum adding, "This is an incredibly -- in my mind -- significant finding."

Congressman Hoekstra was not quite as restrained. "This says weapons have been discovered, more weapons exist and they state that Iraq was not a WMD-free zone," he foamed...

That there are continuing threats from the materials that are or may still be in Iraq."

But a Pentagon official contradicted the Republican leaders, telling NBC News: "This does not reflect a capacity that was built up after 1991."

The weapons are the same kind of ordnance the US military has been gathering up in Iraq for the past several years...

And these munitions --quote -- "are not the WMDs this country and the rest of the world believed Iraq had, and not the WMDs for which this country went to war."

A distinction that clearly eluded the official's Pentagon boss.

Pentagon briefing// Rumsfeld: ...we've found hundreds of them... they are dangerous... They are weapons of mass destruction. They are harmful to human beings.)

...we've found hundreds of them... they are dangerous... They are weapons of mass destruction. They are harmful to human beings.

So was any exposure to the **sun** endured by whoever went searching for them. Moreover, the Washington Post reports that the munitions shells which Santorum and Hoekstra have clutched to their bosoms... were found buried near the Iranian border -- forgotten by Iraqi troops in their war with Iran which ended in 1988.

And the former chief U-N Weapons Inspector and President Bush's Iraq Survey Group Chief -- David Kay -- telling Countdown that Senator Santorum's comments are -- quote -- wrong as to the facts and exaggerated beyond all reason as to the interpretation of the 'facts'." He continued, "There is no surprise that very small numbers of chemical canisters from the Iran-Iraq War have been found. "The ISG found them and in my testimony in 2004 I said that I expected that we would continue to find them for a very long time. "These are in very small numbers and are scattered. The nerve agents have long since degraded to the point that they no long pose any substantial threat.

"In most cases the mustard agent has substantially degraded, but will burn you if skin comes in contact with it."

Joining me now, the Senior Vice President for National Security at the Center for American Progress in Washington, Joseph Cirincione...

He's co-author of "Deadly Arsenals: Tracking Weapons of Mass Destruction". Thank you for your time, sir.

To make the statement, "We have found weapons of mass destruction in Iraq" -- does the person making it **have** to be either exaggerating to the point of dishonesty, or simply not capable of understanding what Weapons of Mass Destruction really are?


www.crooksandliars.com/stories/2006/06/23/olbermannSantorumWmdsFalseStory.html


So, when will we see wolfux and the other fascist supporters on this site admit that they're nothing but slavish robo-pawns for their thuggish, filthy masters?

 

[darkboong]

You need to point out where I called Muslims "genocidal maniacs." And you also need to point out where I declared .........."have insisted that you can't communicate or coexist with Muslims. "

I claimed that you "implied".

And yes, there have been Muslims convicted in this country of terrorism.

Name em.

It wasn't Catholic altar boys flying those planes on 9/11.

It wasn't a Muslim who who detonated the van full of blammo in Oklahoma either. What's your point ?

[I know they were not convicted]

Mainly because there was no trial and the evidence collected was circumstantial, however convincing or otherwise you may feel it to be.

And we only have to look to Canada a few weeks ago to see what is going on.

The authorities stated that they didn't pose any threat whatsoever... We need to wait and see the evidence really, getting taken into custody and being accused of doing stuff by the folks arresting them doesn't prove anything. See Forest Gate here in the UK for an example of that, or for that matter how about the 5000 plus guys suspected of being Muslim who were arrested under the Patriot act... How many have been charged or faced trial ? Nil.

So yeah, we all know what's going on here. Folks who appear to be Muslim are being hauled off the streets and imprisoned without charge, and you endorse it.

And common sense tells me that this is not all Muslims, nor even a large porportion of them.

So why do you ignore the non-muslim terrorists, and assume Muslims to be terrorists by default then ?

And yes, it is hard to tella "Jihad" muslim from a man who wants to enter this country for a legitimate reason.

Same goes for an Irishman, right ?

Same goes for an Ex-Army guy in Oklahoma, right ?

Terrorists are difficult to catch before the act at the best of times without dissipating your resources and revealing your techniques with crude racial profiling techniques.

Because if I felt that all Muslims or their religion preached hatred , I would not have a small business relationship with 2 Muslims.
I had a relationship with a women several years ago that had 2 children that were Muslim. [I dumped her, but it wasn't for that reason. She had "jihad" for me when I wouldn't commit to her. Now, I will go on record and say she wa a "genocidal maniac." }

ROTFL.

And if the Muslims in this country have a problem with profiling, they need to look at their brothers that have brought the attention to them.

Just like the Blacks in South Africa, right ?

Or the Orangemen in Ireland ?

Or the Minutemen in the USA.

... and so on.

And when Americans usually refer to " genocidal maniacs" they are not refering to the Muslims that work and live in their neighborhoods, but the Muslims that are on TV decaring it's hate for America and the desire to kill Americans. Even as I write this the TV is reporting on this situation right now as a Muslim leader is declaring just this.

Maybe you should be taking a look at the Jewish Defense League and the Christian Fundamentalists that attract millions of viewers in the US that endorse and incite violence against Muslims. I do not see any discernable difference asdie from the fact that they are endorsed and indeed openly supported by US citizens.

 

[darkboong]

And if the Muslims in this country have a problem with profiling, they need to look at their brothers that have brought the attention to them.

For the record, I HAVE A PROBLEM WITH RACIAL PROFILING, as do a number of very experience and well respected Police officers. Racial profiling is fundamentally incompatible with Justice.

And when Americans usually refer to " genocidal maniacs" they are not refering to the Muslims that work and live in their neighborhoods, but the Muslims that are on TV decaring it's hate for America and the desire to kill Americans.

When they fail to make a distinction in what they say and they are endorsing fundamentally racist policies you can't honestly intepret that any other way. They are racists endorsing and promoting racism.

Even as I write this the TV is reporting on this situation right now as a Muslim leader is declaring just this.

Bush on Boykin declared war on Islam themselves. Go figure what the Muslims think about that, seeing as the US, UK and Israel are in fact actually killing Muslims by the score every day all around the world, and as you should well know the Kill-Ratio is very much against the Muslims of all shapes, nations, colours and beliefs.

I can't see anything constructive or useful coming out of making it a war of faiths, the goal should be to nail terrorists, regardless of what their creed is. How many more McVeighs or McGuinnesses' do you need understand that ?

 

[Carrera]

"I notice the liberals on the left coast are not speaking out against Bush and Rice talking strong with the N.Koreans. Especially since the missle will reach them and more then likely they would be the target. Things change when you are in the sights."

I don't myself see North Korea as a threat. The U.S. line may have something to do with concerns in Japan over North Korea. North Korea is a little bit crazy but I don't think they're unstable. I believe diplomacy is the way to get North Korea on board.

After the news tonight about the Sears Tower and last weeks Canadian news I feel an effort must be stepped up to deal with the Islam fraction in this country. Even if they are citizens.

I notice the liberals on the left coast are not speaking out against Bush and Rice talking strong with the N.Koreans. Especially since the missle will reach them and more then likely they would be the target. Things change when you are in the sights.

And I notice no one in this forum has brought up the report that was released several days ago about Saddam's program he had going previous to the war concerning WMD.

And where are the civil rights people speaking out against the insurgents torturing the 2 soldiers? Not a word.

Liberals expose themselves for what they are.

And the book "Inside the Third Riech" by Speer does not show a comparision of Hitlers agenda and the US/Britain's agenda. ******'s armies had intentions of staying. The big talk now in Congress, actually 2 votes today in Congress, show that the US/Allies have intentions of a general pullout, with the Iraqi's in charge of their own country. Go back and read that book again. Look at the difference.

The mass imprisionment of males ? Tell me how the US/Allies have implemented a plan of mass imprisonment.

You're argument that the police are practicing "Kristalnacht" against the Muslims does not tell the truth. In the US , Muslims are a very high percentage of the terrorists arrested and convicted today. They are a very small percentage of the population, but are the majority of terrorists. Only a fool would not look at them with a more suspicious eye then say a "hispanic immigrant."

 

[Carrera]

Do you believe there is no racial difference between human beings or racial characteristics that make people different?
Do you not believe black people are essentially better runners than white people due to genetic traits. Or that Russian men are genetically stronger than, say, Japanese?
Amazingly, this is what people believe in this country today - that there is no such thing as race and that all people are the same.
In my house we have a border collie and I can tell you, he's smarter than most other dogs. It's a fact collies are probably the most intelligent of dogs. However, we have reached a stage where it's apparently racist to state border collies are smarter than, say, poodles or terriers. Or that greyhounds are faster runners than German shepherds.
I did see all the programs on TV and documentaries that claimed race doesn't exist but it denies genuine research and it somehow reminds me of the Middle Ages when people believed the world was flat.
I think it's time we did accept human beings are different on account of ethnic origen but also culture. Therefore, surely if pizza is stolen from a fridge in a house shared by Japanese and Italians, surely you're going to suspect an Italian above a Japanese?

For the record, I HAVE A PROBLEM WITH RACIAL PROFILING, as do a number of very experience and well respected Police officers. Racial profiling is fundamentally incompatible with Justice.



When they fail to make a distinction in what they say and they are endorsing fundamentally racist policies you can't honestly intepret that any other way. They are racists endorsing and promoting racism.



Bush on Boykin declared war on Islam themselves. Go figure what the Muslims think about that, seeing as the US, UK and Israel are in fact actually killing Muslims by the score every day all around the world, and as you should well know the Kill-Ratio is very much against the Muslims of all shapes, nations, colours and beliefs.

I can't see anything constructive or useful coming out of making it a war of faiths, the goal should be to nail terrorists, regardless of what their creed is. How many more McVeighs or McGuinnesses' do you need understand that ?

 

[Carrera]

"I can't see anything constructive or useful coming out of making it a war of faiths, the goal should be to nail terrorists, regardless of what their creed is. How many more McVeighs or McGuinnesses' do you need understand that ?"

What about the Romans and Christians? The majority of classical historians now agree the rise of Christianity destabilised the Roman World and played a huge part in its fall. For a start, Christians refused to serve in the Roman army and claimed you couldn't be a true Christian and be involved in state affairs - you had to abstain.
This led to difficulties recruiting troops to fill the legions which, in turn, led to more successful invasions by Germanic tribes. By 400 A.D. there were hardly any Roman troops in the army - most were foreign conscripts. The problem was huge at the time.
In restrospect, had the Romans known the future that lay in store (the suppression of paganism, book-burning, banning of science e.t.c.) they would possibly have found ways to counter the radical theocratic clergy which went on to create a theocratic Roman state.
Since Christianity was too openly tolerated later on, this allowed more radical Christianity to prosper and become grounded within society. It's the same with all religions which is why China is possibly so intolerant of organized religion as a whole.
Everywhere religion is allowed to take root, you find division and strife.

For the record, I HAVE A PROBLEM WITH RACIAL PROFILING, as do a number of very experience and well respected Police officers. Racial profiling is fundamentally incompatible with Justice.



When they fail to make a distinction in what they say and they are endorsing fundamentally racist policies you can't honestly intepret that any other way. They are racists endorsing and promoting racism.



Bush on Boykin declared war on Islam themselves. Go figure what the Muslims think about that, seeing as the US, UK and Israel are in fact actually killing Muslims by the score every day all around the world, and as you should well know the Kill-Ratio is very much against the Muslims of all shapes, nations, colours and beliefs.

I can't see anything constructive or useful coming out of making it a war of faiths, the goal should be to nail terrorists, regardless of what their creed is. How many more McVeighs or McGuinnesses' do you need understand that ?

 

[NYYTEX22]

if there is such a thing as islamo-facism. then the nazis were raging homosexuals

 

[darkboong]

Do you believe there is no racial difference between human beings or racial characteristics that make people different?

Nope.

Do you not believe black people are essentially better runners than white people due to genetic traits. Or that Russian men are genetically stronger than, say, Japanese?

Tell that to a Sumo.

Amazingly, this is what people believe in this country today - that there is no such thing as race and that all people are the same.

Bollocks.

Genetic makeup is orthogonal to the religious beliefs and whether a particular person is a terrorist. There have been terrorists of all skin colours and religious beliefs, that was true before DNA was even discovered and it remains true to this very day. That is why racial profiling is incompatable with justice as far as determining if an individual is a terrorist or not.

In my house we have a border collie and I can tell you, he's smarter than most other dogs. It's a fact collies are probably the most intelligent of dogs.

Right, so when you discover some dog **** on a lamp-post do you automatically assume that a Border Collie did it ... ?

However, we have reached a stage where it's apparently racist to state border collies are smarter than, say, poodles or terriers. Or that greyhounds are faster runners than German shepherds.

If you've got evidence to support those assertions they will stand, accusations of racism or not. Again, I have yet to see any objective evidence presented by you or your pals that race and religion are reliable indicators of terrorist activity.

I did see all the programs on TV and documentaries that claimed race doesn't exist but it denies genuine research and it somehow reminds me of the Middle Ages when people believed the world was flat.

You deny genetic research when it suits you too Crappy. You refuse to accept that the indigenous Jews in Israel are in anyway connected with the indigenous Gentiles in Israel for example, despite the peer reviewed studies that say the contrary.

I think it's time we did accept human beings are different on account of ethnic origen but also culture. Therefore, surely if pizza is stolen from a fridge in a house shared by Japanese and Italians, surely you're going to suspect an Italian above a Japanese?

I do not consider sanctioning someone on a mere suspicion to be compatable Justice, evidence is required. If you've got evidence present it, if you haven't shut the **** up.

 

[Carrera]

The idea that terrorism is related to race is a ridiculous argument - one I never put forward.
What I have stated is that the whole idea there is no such thing as race is totally unscientific and amounts to a load of twaddle. I was talking about physical attributes and mental attributes being distinguished by race. The sumo wrestler argument you put forward is demonstrably wrong as sumo wrestlers aren't strong and, besides that, their average life expectancy is 42.
Next time you watch the Olympics try and find a top Japanese weight-lifting contender as it's pretty hard to do. It's a known fact the Slavic peoples are naturally stronger just as black runners are better than white runners - generally speaking. This is basic genetics. Races are not the same but different. Goldfish and and silver dollars are both freshwater fish but genetically distinct the same as people are.
Why does the U.S. always do so well in the Olympics? Simple answer. They put forward athletes from various ethnic backgrounds, sprinters from Africa, gymnasts from Russia e.t.c.
"That is why racial profiling is incompatable with justice as far as determining if an individual is a terrorist or not."
Naturally. Whoever argued we should try and pick out terrorists by determining their race? That's not what we mean by racial profiling. What people are saying is something like if a bottle of vodka is stolen in a house shared by Russians and American Mormons, you can bet your bottom dollar the Russians are the most likely suspects for having stolen the vodka.
Or would you start your investigations by searching the American Mormons?
Therefore, if there's a terrorist attack and police find a copy of the Koran nearby, it's not rocket science to deduce that maybe your suspects hail from the Middle East.
"You deny genetic research when it suits you too Crappy. You refuse to accept that the indigenous Jews in Israel are in anyway connected with the indigenous Gentiles in Israel for example, despite the peer reviewed studies that say the contrary."
I studied genetics at university some years ago. However, I don't plan to reopen this debate over Israel on account of people getting upset. Nuff said.
"Again, I have yet to see any objective evidence presented by you or your pals that race and religion are reliable indicators of terrorist activity."
You're straying from the point a bit as that wasn't my argument. The source of terrorism isn't racial but it is religious - motivated by religion. People are saying that suicide bombings are typical of Middle Eastern tactics and that Italians, Germans or your average American tourist doesn't blow himself up in a public area.

Nope.



Tell that to a Sumo.



Bollocks.

Genetic makeup is orthogonal to the religious beliefs and whether a particular person is a terrorist. There have been terrorists of all skin colours and religious beliefs, that was true before DNA was even discovered and it remains true to this very day. That is why racial profiling is incompatable with justice as far as determining if an individual is a terrorist or not.



Right, so when you discover some dog **** on a lamp-post do you automatically assume that a Border Collie did it ... ?



If you've got evidence to support those assertions they will stand, accusations of racism or not. Again, I have yet to see any objective evidence presented by you or your pals that race and religion are reliable indicators of terrorist activity.



You deny genetic research when it suits you too Crappy. You refuse to accept that the indigenous Jews in Israel are in anyway connected with the indigenous Gentiles in Israel for example, despite the peer reviewed studies that say the contrary.



I do not consider sanctioning someone on a mere suspicion to be compatable Justice, evidence is required. If you've got evidence present it, if you haven't shut the **** up.

 

[darkboong]

The idea that terrorism is related to race is a ridiculous argument - one I never put forward.

In which case why post your ideas about Genetics in reply to a post that discusses racial profiling ?

 

[Carrera]

Because I was pointing out there has been a lot of psuedo-science promoted of late, namely that there is no such thing as race. My argument is that there is such a thing as race.
As for racial profiling, yes I agree, terrorism cannot be related to race and I don't think anyone argued that case. Besides if you study my former posts, you will see I pointed out many times Christianity has had terrorists throughout ancient times - Christians burned Rome down apparently in the first century A.D.
Religion was the source of it all not race.
I agree that racial profiling is a strong term and may be subject to abuse. I don't propose locking up all people who hail from the Middle East.
I think people are simply saying if there's a suicide bombing and copies of the Koran nearby, then it makes sense to start your investigations at that point but you have to keep an open mind.
The problem in this country is they've been knocking doors down without sufficient evidence and panicking whole sections of immigrant society which I agree isn't fair or the right way to proceed.

In which case why post your ideas about Genetics in reply to a post that discusses racial profiling ?

 

[darkboong]

Therefore, if there's a terrorist attack and police find a copy of the Koran nearby, it's not rocket science to deduce that maybe your suspects hail from the Middle East.

It's not science at all. If anything it rates as circumstantial evidence. The Koran could have belonged to one of the victims, it could have been planted there, or it could even belong to Cat Stevens (who is not from the Middle East).

 

[Hypnospin]

"ooh, baby, baby, it's a wild world"

It's not science at all. If anything it rates as circumstantial evidence. The Koran could have belonged to one of the victims, it could have been planted there, or it could even belong to Cat Stevens (who is not from the Middle East).

 

[Carrera]

I seem to recall we had this discussion before after the Madrid bombings when some people on the Soapbox suggested ETA was involved, (together with Jose Maria Aznar).
However, the sheer scale of the attack and the fact they found several copies of the Koran made it pretty obvious is was an Al Quaida style operation.
However, that's not to say I condone the police storming into Moslem areas, knocking down doors and accusing innocent people without any actual evidence. By the same token, I think it would be crazy to have started looking in the ranks of ETA after the Madrid bombings when ETA has never carried out an attack on such a scale.
Seems like a question of balance, common sense and good intelligence so you know you've got the right people before you move in.

It's not science at all. If anything it rates as circumstantial evidence. The Koran could have belonged to one of the victims, it could have been planted there, or it could even belong to Cat Stevens (who is not from the Middle East).

 

[darkboong]

However, the sheer scale of the attack and the fact they found several copies of the Koran made it pretty obvious is was an Al Quaida style operation.

You clearly don't understand what Circumstantial Evidence actually means. As I recall you insisted it was Al Quaida, yet in practice the accused ended up being North Africans who had no links whatsoever. The so-called Koran evidence would simply have driven you to accuse some folks who never had anything to do with it, just as it did with the July 7th bombings.

Seems like a question of balance, common sense and good intelligence so you know you've got the right people before you move in.

You can only have suspicions, it's up to the Judge + Jury to decide guilt. In order to secure a prosecution the Police should ensure they have considerably more evidence than a Koran found within 50m of the bomb site. A lot of perfectly decent folks carry Korans with them.

 

[stevebaby]

The idea that terrorism is related to race is a ridiculous argument - one I never put forward.
What I have stated is that the whole idea there is no such thing as race is totally unscientific and amounts to a load of twaddle. I was talking about physical attributes and mental attributes being distinguished by race. The sumo wrestler argument you put forward is demonstrably wrong as sumo wrestlers aren't strong and, besides that, their average life expectancy is 42.
Next time you watch the Olympics try and find a top Japanese weight-lifting contender as it's pretty hard to do. It's a known fact the Slavic peoples are naturally stronger just as black runners are better than white runners - generally speaking. This is basic genetics. Races are not the same but different. Goldfish and and silver dollars are both freshwater fish but genetically distinct the same as people are.
Why does the U.S. always do so well in the Olympics? Simple answer. They put forward athletes from various ethnic backgrounds, sprinters from Africa, gymnasts from Russia e.t.c.
"That is why racial profiling is incompatable with justice as far as determining if an individual is a terrorist or not."
Naturally. Whoever argued we should try and pick out terrorists by determining their race? That's not what we mean by racial profiling. What people are saying is something like if a bottle of vodka is stolen in a house shared by Russians and American Mormons, you can bet your bottom dollar the Russians are the most likely suspects for having stolen the vodka.
Or would you start your investigations by searching the American Mormons?
Therefore, if there's a terrorist attack and police find a copy of the Koran nearby, it's not rocket science to deduce that maybe your suspects hail from the Middle East.
"You deny genetic research when it suits you too Crappy. You refuse to accept that the indigenous Jews in Israel are in anyway connected with the indigenous Gentiles in Israel for example, despite the peer reviewed studies that say the contrary."
I studied genetics at university some years ago. However, I don't plan to reopen this debate over Israel on account of people getting upset. Nuff said.
"Again, I have yet to see any objective evidence presented by you or your pals that race and religion are reliable indicators of terrorist activity."
You're straying from the point a bit as that wasn't my argument. The source of terrorism isn't racial but it is religious - motivated by religion. People are saying that suicide bombings are typical of Middle Eastern tactics and that Italians, Germans or your average American tourist doesn't blow himself up in a public area.

http://www.olympic.org/uk/athletes/profiles/bio_uk.asp?par_i_id=23485
INTERNATIONAL OLYMPIC COMMITTEE - ATHLETES

 

[gavin11756]

here in the us this term has been used in the media of late, a recent spate of white house press releases and official talking heads have used this term in the media, and it is now being given commonplace use in the media/political arena.

fact is, a cursory "google" for this gets no hits for dictionary definition references, and i would think, in any regard, the commonly understood definition of "fascist" would be of dubious validity when combined with a religious generalization...funny how we do not hear of "judeo-christian fascism", for example.

i wonder, one, what people think about the use of this term, it's acceptibility, validity, and implications,
and two, if it is being used in the mainstream media in the UK.

Well for a start, there is really no such thing as "Judeo-Christian"! That's just the zionists seeking a kind of shelter under Christians! Christianity has more in common with Islam than Judaism, mainly via traditional religious non usurious banking!

You will never here of jews described as fascists as they are traditionally hostile to it and usually to the extent they occupy leadership in the communist party, as in pre Stalinist Soviet Union and eastern Europe and Germany prior to the war.

BTW. Fascism was popular before WW2 and it only became unpopular via the media after the communists effectively won WW2

Now! Back to cycling!

 

[Carrera]

Christians persecuted Jews before Moslems and both Christians and Moslems tend to persecute Jews. There was very strong anti-semitism amongst the Greek communities of the Roman Empire around the 2nd century A.D.
Clearly anti-semitism arose due to the idea Jews crucified Jesus Christ and rejected the overall Christian doctrine. Both Jews and Moslems reject the concept Jesus was the son of God. Now we are finding ancient gnostic texts that would seem to indicate Jesus never specifically taught what we now accept as Christian orthodoxy so who's to say Jews and Moslems have got their interpretations wrong?
Whichever way you look at it though, religion is at the centre of it all.
I'm not religious myself but the thing that gets up my amazes me is that Christians and Moslems base their entire religion on Judaism - a monotheistic authoritarian set of beliefs. They (Christians and Moslems) have their religion, Moses, the prophets and the Old Testament on account of Judaism. Christians took the O.T. as official creed so they believe in Adam and Eve and the flood, just as Jews do. Christians believe Adam and Eve over the alternative theory of evolution and, in the U.S., evolution teaching is being squeezed out of schools in favour of the 6 day creation creed.
However, if the Jewish clerics themselves disagree over creed and interpretation, they are ridiculed.
I feel O.K. over Buddhists having a go at Jews, perhaps, since the Buddhists have their own texts based on their own history and culture. The Buddhists don't have a saviour who's ancestry and ethnic line is believed to go all the way back to King David of Israel and, therefore, they have no particular axe to grind.
I think we'd all be better off without religion to be honest as it caused nothing but problems and wrangles for millenia.

Well for a start, there is really no such thing as "Judeo-Christian"! That's just the zionists seeking a kind of shelter under Christians! Christianity has more in common with Islam than Judaism, mainly via traditional religious non usurious banking!

You will never here of jews described as fascists as they are traditionally hostile to it and usually to the extent they occupy leadership in the communist party, as in pre Stalinist Soviet Union and eastern Europe and Germany prior to the war.

BTW. Fascism was popular before WW2 and it only became unpopular via the media after the communists effectively won WW2

Now! Back to cycling!

 

[Carrera]

Well for a start, there is really no such thing as "Judeo-Christian"! That's just the zionists seeking a kind of shelter under Christians."

It was the reverse. Christians took the old Hebrew scripts as canon. The entire Bible is comprised of ancient Hebrew and Greek texts. Christians believe in the flood, Noah, Jonah and Job as gospel. Christianity goes back as far as Adam and Eve as a point of canon.

Well for a start, there is really no such thing as "Judeo-Christian"! That's just the zionists seeking a kind of shelter under Christians! Christianity has more in common with Islam than Judaism, mainly via traditional religious non usurious banking!

You will never here of jews described as fascists as they are traditionally hostile to it and usually to the extent they occupy leadership in the communist party, as in pre Stalinist Soviet Union and eastern Europe and Germany prior to the war.

BTW. Fascism was popular before WW2 and it only became unpopular via the media after the communists effectively won WW2

Now! Back to cycling!

 

[gavin11756]

Christians persecuted Jews before Moslems and both Christians and Moslems tend to persecute Jews. There was very strong anti-semitism amongst the Greek communities of the Roman Empire around the 2nd century A.D.
Clearly anti-semitism arose due to the idea Jews crucified Jesus Christ and rejected the overall Christian doctrine. Both Jews and Moslems reject the concept Jesus was the son of God. Now we are finding ancient gnostic texts that would seem to indicate Jesus never specifically taught what we now accept as Christian orthodoxy so who's to say Jews and Moslems have got their interpretations wrong?
Whichever way you look at it though, religion is at the centre of it all.
I'm not religious myself but the thing that gets up my amazes me is that Christians and Moslems base their entire religion on Judaism - a monotheistic authoritarian set of beliefs. They (Christians and Moslems) have their religion, Moses, the prophets and the Old Testament on account of Judaism. Christians took the O.T. as official creed so they believe in Adam and Eve and the flood, just as Jews do. Christians believe Adam and Eve over the alternative theory of evolution and, in the U.S., evolution teaching is being squeezed out of schools in favour of the 6 day creation creed.
However, if the Jewish clerics themselves disagree over creed and interpretation, they are ridiculed.
I feel O.K. over Buddhists having a go at Jews, perhaps, since the Buddhists have their own texts based on their own history and culture. The Buddhists don't have a saviour who's ancestry and ethnic line is believed to go all the way back to King David of Israel and, therefore, they have no particular axe to grind.
I think we'd all be better off without religion to be honest as it caused nothing but problems and wrangles for millenia.

Jews have for some reason never wanted to fit in to host cultures. This is why they have been persecuted. A mob of Christians led by Christ were persecuted long before Christians persecuted jews. Jews have always been allowed to make a living and become wealthy. The host culture has never persecuted jews until they, jews got out of hand with either usury or ancient barbaric practices.

Judaism is, after all, an ancient barbaric cult!


Christians do not accept the O.T! That is the Torah! And King David is not for those of Northwest European blood! To take up Jesus as a saviour due to his fine example does not mean you support jewish interpretations