I think they're close... but not the same. I think perhaps Rocky mountain (Is that a maple leaf... Canada??) ripped off the BH shape. It would be pretty easy to copy a mould (just stick a real BH frame into the mould) and perhaps make minor changes... the carbon fibre material design may be of different quality though.531Aussie said:in further developments........the BH frames come out of the same mold as something called a Rocky Mountain!! That's the exact same farkin frame! Do they just stamp out millions of them with different stickers?
The two bikes you showed are different frame sizes obviously (head tube differences)... The design difference I noticed was minor... the shape of the curved section joining the seat tube to the underside of the top tube. It was a bigger radius curve in the smaller (RM) frame. Perhaps this is also because it is a different frame size though.
The forks also look different (the RM is more curved) though this isn't part of the frame mould.
"It would be pretty easy to copy a mould (just stick a real BH frame into the mould) and perhaps make minor changes..."
Reverse engineering a carbon frame would be a waste of time, unless you had a 6 axis 3D scanner, which is unlikely.
In a production environment the moulds are probably CNC'd from Aluminium and hand finished, which as you can imagine is very expensive.
Unless companies have major dollars to throw at design and mould making, the very vast majority just point to a catalogue and say "I'll have that one". All the SE Asian carbon suppliers just self reference or copy other companies, which is why very few carbon frames either look completely unique or make any sense whatsoever.
Nev, if you think 4500 is a lot, I only have one word for you. TIME.
Reverse engineering a carbon frame would be a waste of time, unless you had a 6 axis 3D scanner, which is unlikely.
In a production environment the moulds are probably CNC'd from Aluminium and hand finished, which as you can imagine is very expensive.
Unless companies have major dollars to throw at design and mould making, the very vast majority just point to a catalogue and say "I'll have that one". All the SE Asian carbon suppliers just self reference or copy other companies, which is why very few carbon frames either look completely unique or make any sense whatsoever.
Nev, if you think 4500 is a lot, I only have one word for you. TIME.
531Aussie said:in further developments
Yes --- happens all the time...
Check it out...
Plenty more where that come from too...
I asked thunder in the FID if he could give a rundown of Australia's medal prospects in Beijing. He PM'd me a detailed reply and mentioned that classic might want to add some comments. There was some informative analysis (though I am an ignorant ass) from both and a short tennis rally of "ghey *******" comments...
I posted their replies and comments (sans ghey ******* references) in a new thread in the GT forum if anyone's interested:
http://www.cyclingforums.com/t464548.html
I posted their replies and comments (sans ghey ******* references) in a new thread in the GT forum if anyone's interested:
http://www.cyclingforums.com/t464548.html
Thanks for that thylo. I mentioned that they may be able to copy the shape... but not the structure so easy... but I never knew that they were ordering off catalogues.Thylacine said:
Thanks for the description of how the business works for most manufacturers.
And I guess the small shape differences I noticed were probably only because of the different frame size.
I didn't know it was so blatant with carbon.parawolf said:
Because the shape of carbon frames vary so much (even subtly), it's too easy to spot a duplicate. So, the big question is, why would someone pay $4,500 for a frame which is, unquestionably, exactly the same as a $2,000 frame, apart from the paint job?
At least with aluminium 'duplicates', the price differences between one with 'Ciocc' stamped on it and one with 'Azzurri' on it wouldn't be as much, and ya could at least pretend that: "well, the tubing might be the same, but the Italian one has better welds, better bog, and the making of it was overseen by a 90-yr-old 'Tuscanite' who's been making frames for 87 years."
classic1 said:
Nev said:
Are we in good company???
I was reading an old mag in which Davis Phinney said he watched Eddy Merckx in A Sunday in Hell stop to adjust his seat height "about 50 times during the Paris-Roubaix". Phinney was writing about a 'training' ride he did with Merckx around 1994, and he reckons Eddy always carried a spare seat bolt and an allen key, even during pro races!
yeah, wanted to have a good run. A crawl to Ringwood. Got a pretty good run back to Wellington Rd. Quite frustrating. Me thinks poorly orgainsed or way over expectations for the event. Wanted to whallop old farts/mountain bike zen masters who hog the right hand lane. Saw a few bingles on the way. I thought both sides were going to be open, instead 1.5 poorly marked lanes=pandemonium.matagi said:
matagi said:
Narp - ITT two blocks from home, so that was my morning. Lots of first hand accounts of madness on the Eastlink though.
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