Track Disc Wheel Question

[Rob]

I have a question about track Disk Wheels...or any track wheels really..can
one use a quick release on the track or must in be bolt and nut type of axel
? are they hard to change ?

Thanks
Rob Wille

 

[Davey Crockett]

"Rob" <[email protected]> writes:

> I have a question about track Disk Wheels...or any track wheels really..can
> one use a quick release on the track or must in be bolt and nut type of axel
> ? are they hard to change ?
>
> Thanks
> Rob Wille
>
>
You need track-bolted hub lockers/retainers rather than a quick-release system.

But it isn't hard to do. Simply get yourself a couple of 15mm wrenches and eat your porridge.

--
le Vent a Dos
Davey Crockett
Six-Day site: http://members.rogers.com/sixday/sixday.html

 

[Andy Coggan]

"Rob" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:cqNdc.61719$Pk3.47585@pd7tw1no...
> I have a question about track Disk Wheels...or any track wheels
really..can
> one use a quick release on the track or must in be bolt and nut type of
axel
> ? are they hard to change ?

If you'd rather not (or can't )change the axle, you can also use a road
wheel by replacing the skewer with one of the Allen head non-quick-release
types. However, even if you've got a road wheel than can be used with a
fixed cog (e.g., older Specialized Ultralight), I'd be hesistant about doing
this on the rear, as you might easily pull the wheel to the side with a
strong jump. It works just fine with a front wheel, however.

Andy Coggan

 

[warren]

In article <[email protected]>, Andy
Coggan <[email protected]> wrote:

> "Rob" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:cqNdc.61719$Pk3.47585@pd7tw1no...
> > I have a question about track Disk Wheels...or any track wheels
> really..can
> > one use a quick release on the track or must in be bolt and nut type of
> axel
> > ? are they hard to change ?
>
> If you'd rather not (or can't )change the axle, you can also use a road
> wheel by replacing the skewer with one of the Allen head non-quick-release
> types. However, even if you've got a road wheel than can be used with a
> fixed cog (e.g., older Specialized Ultralight), I'd be hesistant about doing
> this on the rear, as you might easily pull the wheel to the side with a
> strong jump. It works just fine with a front wheel, however.

Andy,
your concerns are unfounded. ZIPP disk rear wheels are one of the most
popular track rear wheels and they use an allen screw with washer that
is almost identical to the allen bolt method used on the replacement
skewers with allen screw ends sold at Excel Sports and elsewhere for
this purpose.

For the original poster, best to ask the officials at your local track
about their policy on skewers. Some will allow skewers on the front
wheel if the lever is taped to the fork.

-WG

 

[Carl Sundquist]

"warren" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>
> Andy,
> your concerns are unfounded. ZIPP disk rear wheels are one of the most
> popular track rear wheels and they use an allen screw with washer that
> is almost identical to the allen bolt method used on the replacement
> skewers with allen screw ends sold at Excel Sports and elsewhere for
> this purpose.
>

I'll believe that if you can show me some data where the clamping pressure
of the skewers is similar to that of the ZIPP method or the traditional axle
bolts.

 

[erik saunders]

dude... dont jack around... get an axle with 15mm bolts on it that way you are
covered no matter what... for mass start at a local level you may not ever have
a problem with a skewer, but if you get to a high level you wouldnt want to
chance it... and for sure if you EVER think you might do sprints in races or
training or a standing start event like pursuit or kilo, or chariot races like
at t-town you NEED a rear wheel with bolts...

 

[Bob Schwartz]

As others have mentioned, use allen head skewers for front wheels.

I've used the allen head skewers for rea wheels also. I grease the
threads to get extra clamping force. But a much better way to go
is to use a cassette converter if it is a Shimano hub:
http://www.sheldonbrown.com/harris/fixed-hubs.html

Its at the top of the page. Switching back and forth is not instant
but not too bad.

Bob Schwartz
[email protected]

 

[John Dacey]

On Sat, 10 Apr 2004 15:35:55 GMT, warren <[email protected]>
wrote:

>In article <[email protected]>, Andy
>Coggan <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> "Rob" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>> news:cqNdc.61719$Pk3.47585@pd7tw1no...
>> > I have a question about track Disk Wheels...or any track wheels
>> really..can
>> > one use a quick release on the track or must in be bolt and nut type of
>> axel
>> > ? are they hard to change ?
>>
>> If you'd rather not (or can't )change the axle, you can also use a road
>> wheel by replacing the skewer with one of the Allen head non-quick-release
>> types. However, even if you've got a road wheel than can be used with a
>> fixed cog (e.g., older Specialized Ultralight), I'd be hesistant about doing
>> this on the rear, as you might easily pull the wheel to the side with a
>> strong jump. It works just fine with a front wheel, however.
>
>Andy,
>your concerns are unfounded. ZIPP disk rear wheels are one of the most
>popular track rear wheels and they use an allen screw with washer that
>is almost identical to the allen bolt method used on the replacement
>skewers with allen screw ends sold at Excel Sports and elsewhere for
>this purpose.

It's worth noting that the newest generation of Zipp's track hubs and
disc wheel have abandoned the Allen-head bolts in favor of
traditionally nutted axles. The old system was pretty marginal
(particularly at the rear), but it worked as well and as often as it
did largely because there was only a gap of a few mm between the head
of the bolt and the axle end into which it was threaded.

On the other hand, the Allen-head replacement skewers to which you
refer must pass through the entire over-locknut axle width plus the
left and right dropout before engaging the nut at the other end. On
the front, that's a distance of 110 mm or so, the rear must span
around 130 mm. Consider that you're winding up a slender fastener (~4
mm in diameter) that's twenty times (or more) as long as it is wide to
a recommended torque value that's second only to the torque normally
applied to secure your bike's cranks. Think you can get it tight
enough for consistent security without wringing the head off?

-------------------------------
John Dacey
Business Cycles, Miami, Florida
http://www.businesscycles.com
Now in our twenty-first year.
Our catalog of track equipment: eighth year online
-------------------------------

 

[warren]

In article <[email protected]>, John Dacey
<[email protected]> wrote:

> On Sat, 10 Apr 2004 15:35:55 GMT, warren <[email protected]>
> wrote:
>
> >In article <[email protected]>, Andy
> >Coggan <[email protected]> wrote:
> >
> >> "Rob" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> >> news:cqNdc.61719$Pk3.47585@pd7tw1no...
> >> > I have a question about track Disk Wheels...or any track wheels
> >> really..can
> >> > one use a quick release on the track or must in be bolt and nut type of
> >> axel
> >> > ? are they hard to change ?
> >>
> >> If you'd rather not (or can't )change the axle, you can also use a road
> >> wheel by replacing the skewer with one of the Allen head non-quick-release
> >> types. However, even if you've got a road wheel than can be used with a
> >> fixed cog (e.g., older Specialized Ultralight), I'd be hesistant about
> >> doing
> >> this on the rear, as you might easily pull the wheel to the side with a
> >> strong jump. It works just fine with a front wheel, however.
> >
> >Andy,
> >your concerns are unfounded. ZIPP disk rear wheels are one of the most
> >popular track rear wheels and they use an allen screw with washer that
> >is almost identical to the allen bolt method used on the replacement
> >skewers with allen screw ends sold at Excel Sports and elsewhere for
> >this purpose.
>
> It's worth noting that the newest generation of Zipp's track hubs and
> disc wheel have abandoned the Allen-head bolts in favor of
> traditionally nutted axles. The old system was pretty marginal
> (particularly at the rear), but it worked as well and as often as it
> did largely because there was only a gap of a few mm between the head
> of the bolt and the axle end into which it was threaded.
>
> On the other hand, the Allen-head replacement skewers to which you
> refer must pass through the entire over-locknut axle width plus the
> left and right dropout before engaging the nut at the other end. On
> the front, that's a distance of 110 mm or so, the rear must span
> around 130 mm. Consider that you're winding up a slender fastener (~4
> mm in diameter) that's twenty times (or more) as long as it is wide to
> a recommended torque value that's second only to the torque normally
> applied to secure your bike's cranks. Think you can get it tight
> enough for consistent security without wringing the head off?

Hasn't happened yet.

-WG

 

[warren]

In article <[email protected]>, Carl Sundquist
<[email protected]> wrote:

> "warren" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> >
> > Andy,
> > your concerns are unfounded. ZIPP disk rear wheels are one of the most
> > popular track rear wheels and they use an allen screw with washer that
> > is almost identical to the allen bolt method used on the replacement
> > skewers with allen screw ends sold at Excel Sports and elsewhere for
> > this purpose.
> >
>
> I'll believe that if you can show me some data where the clamping pressure
> of the skewers is similar to that of the ZIPP method or the traditional axle
> bolts.

It just has to work, and it does. If you're really worried about
pulling the wheel you can also use those adjustable clips that go
around the axle and droput.

The problem that I see with the ZIPP allen bolts is that some people
don't have the correct amount of axle exposed in the dropout. I find
these two allen screw methods easier than the traditional 15mm bolts
because the 15mm bolts and their washers are easier to move around
(change chain tightness) while you're tightening them.

-WG

 

[Howard Kveck]

In article <120420040907251001%[email protected]>,
warren <[email protected]> wrote:

> The problem that I see with the ZIPP allen bolts is that some people
> don't have the correct amount of axle exposed in the dropout. I find
> these two allen screw methods easier than the traditional 15mm bolts
> because the 15mm bolts and their washers are easier to move around
> (change chain tightness) while you're tightening them.
>
> -WG

I haven't seen the Zipp bolt setup, but it sounds a lot like the
arrangement on the Phil Wood hubs, with one difference. The Phils don't
have any axle that goes into the dropout, as the sockethead cap screws have
a washer that has a sleeve section that is the diameter of the axle. You
are correct that those are pretty easy to work when adjusting chain
tension. The bolt/washer setup doesn't seem to move the wheel around when
you're tightening them.

You can definitely put far more tension on those bolts (I believe
they're 8mm) than you can put on a bolt-style skewer that goes all the way
across a hub. Those are only a 5mm bolt, and will stretch like mad because
of all the unsupported length. I had Control Tech skewers like that for a
while on my road bike, and I could pull a wheel crooked in angled dropouts
when taking off from a light while seated.

--
tanx,
Howard

Q: Can we call it a quagmire yet?

remove YOUR SHOES to reply, ok?