Training Week Ending December 18, 2005

Discussion in 'General Fitness' started by SwStudio, Dec 18, 2005.

  1. SwStudio

    SwStudio Guest

    "Teresa Bippert-Plymate" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > Sun: Winterhaven Run Through the Lights 5K. Non-competitive.
    > And great fun. Stopped twice to sing carols. Afterward was the
    > Grand Prix awards at the Racquet Club (with food of course), and
    > I did get 1st for women 40-49. That got me a nice certificate,
    > a NB running hat, 3 pr NB running socks, a NB water bottle, and
    > a NB FM radio. Yahooee! And I do need the socks and hat!



    Holy crap, I've never won that much stuff at one race.
    Sweet deal!


    cheers,
    --
    David Hirsh, director
    www.absolutelyaccurate.com
    Southern Ontario's Summer Race Series!
     


  2. Dot

    Dot Guest

    Anthony wrote:
    > Goals: Marathon on January 5.
    >
    > Just when things are looking good, and the taper
    > is kicking in, and I'm feeling fine....
    >
    > A fleeting moment, a stupid decision, and wham.
    >


    Ouch! Anthony, so sorry. Real bummer. I can't add anything to what
    others have already said. Maybe some good will come out of enforced taper?

    Dot

    --
    "You’ll never hear me say I beat the Peak. I’ve run up there pretty
    fast, and that mountain doesn’t care. I’ll never conquer the Peak." -
    Matt Carpenter
     
  3. Anthony

    Anthony Guest

    "SwStudio" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]

    > Horrible luck, Anthony.
    >
    > Keep doing everything you are doing, and I believe you will
    > make it in time. Don't worry about getting in anything quality
    > (or even much running of any kind) between now and the
    > race. You *have* to keep reminding yourself that the changes
    > you've made to your aerobic capacity are in the bank at this
    > point. The marathon is that close.
    >
    > I sprained my ankle badly, and found as I reached the point
    > where I wanted to try some test running that wrapping it fairly
    > tightly to limit that ankle's range of motion, as well as support
    > it worked well.


    Thanks David. I hadn't planned to tape it, but may try it out if it
    feels weak. I'm not planning to do any running on uneven surfaces though.

    Anthony.
     
  4. Anthony

    Anthony Guest

    "Teresa Bippert-Plymate" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]
    >
    > OWWW! So sorry to hear about your ankle!! I'm glad the
    > xray is clear. Best of luck to you, I'll cross my fingers
    > it's one of those quick ones. But sounds like you're doing all
    > the right things. Keep us posted...


    Thanks Teresa!
     
  5. Anthony

    Anthony Guest

    "Phil M." <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]

    > I think you'll be surprised. As others have said, this is a great time
    > to get injured. Have you heard of the "Zatopek effect?" I know it's a
    > little tough to take right now. Before Boston I had a forced 1 month
    > layoff. I ran a total of 7 miles for the month before the marathon. I
    > didn't even expect to finish the race, but I did, and in a pretty
    > decent time.

    What was the story with Zatopek? Got injured, missed training and
    then ran some great races? I've heard of that effect with several
    elite runners.

    Yeah - I remember that. Fitness wise I think I'll be OK. With all the
    preparation, and now I'm getting in a pool running session every day.
    Just a question of whether the ankle/foot is ready...
    >
    > BTW, what's the story with the guy trying to take your clothes? Did he
    > explain what he was doing?


    He claimed that it looked like they were thrown out, and he was collecting
    for the needy.
    Actually they were neatly folded, with a few water bottles on top...

    Anthony.
     
  6. Anthony

    Anthony Guest

    "Dot" <[email protected]#duh?att.net> wrote in message
    news:%[email protected]

    > Ouch! Anthony, so sorry. Real bummer. I can't add anything to what others
    > have already said. Maybe some good will come out of enforced taper?


    Thanks Dot. I would prefer my regular "running" taper, but at least
    I'm not missing too many serious workouts or long runs.

    Anthony.
     
  7. anders

    anders Guest

    Anthony wrote:

    > What was the story with Zatopek? Got injured, missed training and
    > then ran some great races? I've heard of that effect with several
    > elite runners.


    The story with the famous "Zatopek phenomenon" (i.e. forced taper) is
    that the "Human Locomotive" got ill two weeks before the 1950 European
    Championships in Brussels and ended up in hospital from which he was
    released two days before the 10,000m race: he won it as he did the
    5,000m race a few days later.

    (OTOH he had been in great racing shape and run a new 10,000m WR in
    Turku about a week before got ill.)

    Abebe Bikila is often mentioned in this context, too: he was
    hospitalized for an appendix operation shortly before his marathon
    victory in Tokyo 1964.



    > Yeah - I remember that. Fitness wise I think I'll be OK. With all the
    > preparation, and now I'm getting in a pool running session every day.
    > Just a question of whether the ankle/foot is ready...


    I would be slightly optimistic about the ankle if there wasn't any
    bruising. If the swelling has completely subsided and you can already
    tolerate exercising it (with 15-20min of conscientous icing
    afterwards), the chances are - read: there is some anecdotal evidence
    - that it will be the least of your worries during the marathon. It
    would still IMHO be a good idea to have a professional tape it for the
    race.

    What I see as the darkest cloud on the horizon could be called the
    "Lance phenomenon": if you cannot get a certain amount of running done,
    your leg muscles (usually calves or quads) may become utterly
    unprepared to cope with the repeated impacts for the entire distance.
    OTOH a surprisingly small amount can be quite sufficient: for instance
    a 3-5x 400-500m with long rests a couple of times could be enough to
    prevent a rebellion.

    FWIW if I were in your shoes, I'd even be willing to take a small risk
    and substitute that 10km run with a session on a stationary bike; if
    the ankle can stand the above interval sessions, there's no need to
    test it any further (and 10km would be too short anyway). OTOH I would
    be quite prepared to quit - while you may prefer to deny yourself that
    option.






    Anders
     
  8. Anthony

    Anthony Guest

    "anders" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]
    > Anthony wrote:
    >
    > The story with the famous "Zatopek phenomenon" (i.e. forced taper) is
    > that the "Human Locomotive" got ill two weeks before the 1950 European
    > Championships in Brussels and ended up in hospital from which he was
    > released two days before the 10,000m race: he won it as he did the
    > 5,000m race a few days later.


    Thanks. I'll settle for less than a win ;-)
    >
    > I would be slightly optimistic about the ankle if there wasn't any
    > bruising. If the swelling has completely subsided and you can already
    > tolerate exercising it (with 15-20min of conscientous icing
    > afterwards), the chances are - read: there is some anecdotal evidence
    > - that it will be the least of your worries during the marathon. It
    > would still IMHO be a good idea to have a professional tape it for the
    > race.


    I'll look into the taping options if I decide to run. There is still some
    swelling
    but no bruising. I can tolerate all the dosiflexion/ flexion and rotations
    of
    the foot. Walking is normal but can feel a little pain. I have run a few
    steps
    without any worse pain, but don't want to return to running properly
    until the swelling has gone and the pain has eased.
    >
    > What I see as the darkest cloud on the horizon could be called the
    > "Lance phenomenon": if you cannot get a certain amount of running done,
    > your leg muscles (usually calves or quads) may become utterly
    > unprepared to cope with the repeated impacts for the entire distance.
    > OTOH a surprisingly small amount can be quite sufficient: for instance
    > a 3-5x 400-500m with long rests a couple of times could be enough to
    > prevent a rebellion.


    Interesting...
    >
    > FWIW if I were in your shoes, I'd even be willing to take a small risk
    > and substitute that 10km run with a session on a stationary bike; if
    > the ankle can stand the above interval sessions, there's no need to
    > test it any further (and 10km would be too short anyway). OTOH I would
    > be quite prepared to quit - while you may prefer to deny yourself that
    > option.


    Not sure what you mean here - quit the 10km run or the race?

    Thanks for all the input.

    Anthony.
     
  9. anders

    anders Guest

    Anthony wrote:

    > > FWIW if I were in your shoes, I'd even be willing to take a small risk
    > > and substitute that 10km run with a session on a stationary bike; if
    > > the ankle can stand the above interval sessions, there's no need to
    > > test it any further (and 10km would be too short anyway). OTOH I would
    > > be quite prepared to quit - while you may prefer to deny yourself that
    > > option.


    > Not sure what you mean here - quit the 10km run or the race?


    The marathon: I know that for some people it is a point of honour or a
    matter of principle or whatever that they will finish a marathon if
    they've started it. (To me it would be sheer folly or smack of a kind
    of vanity to continue beyond a point of no point in continuing, but
    hey, human diversity is a wonderful thing.)

    If you are one of them, I can understand that you will want a continous
    test run before you commit yourself by putting a bib on. The problem,
    as I see it, is that your ankle may hold beautifully (and the rest of
    your legs will not mutiny) for that10km run and yet not be up to the
    task of the 42.195km race (in which case you are in for an hour and a
    half that will seem longer than any you've ever spent shopping with
    your wife).

    But if you aren't, you are free to quit without too much soul-searching
    if the ankle refuses to co-operate. Therefore you do not really need
    that sense of somewhat greater (but still possibly false) certainty and
    IMHO you can perfectly well spare the ankle from that 10km run: one
    continous run won't make it any stronger and cycling (and aquarunning)
    is close enough for maintenance (and a pre-carboiloading workout, if
    one uses it as such).

    OTOH one continous 10km run at that point shouldn't aggravate the
    injury, either, and you can stick to your plan of a test run - and use
    the remaining days to decide which group of marathoners you belong to,
    if you aren't sure of it:)


    Anders
     
  10. Daniel

    Daniel Guest

    Mon 7.2 miles 10:49/mile HR=140±5 (hills)
    Tue 3.5 miles 10:57/mile HR=140±5 (flat)
    Wed 3.5 miles 10:54/mile HR=140±5 (flat)
    Thu 0
    Fri 5 miles 10:32/mile HR=140±5 (hills)
    Sat 0
    Sun 6.2 miles 9:54/mile overall, first 3 miles
    at HR=140±5, mile 4 at 9:04 (flat)

    Total: 25.4 miles.

    Coming off being sick last week. Tried an experiment in
    "forced recovery" using strict attention to the heartrate
    monitor to keep it easy. Maffetone (180-age) would give me
    132 heartbeats per minute on the slow end. More sophisticated
    formula somebody here used was (if I recall correctly)

    Resting_HR + n% (Max_HR - Resting_HR) = Target_HR

    My minimum & maximum observed lately are 55 and 188.

    55 + 60% (188 - 55) = 134.8
    55 + 70% (188 - 55) = 148.1

    Decided to set the ancient Polar HRM range at 135, 145.

    This felt really really slow. At least it kept me from
    having to quit due to coughing. 60 to 70 percent of HRR
    was "aerobically" relaxing, but a faster (to me) pace
    around 75 to 80 percent (HR 150 to 155 bpm and more like
    9:30/mile) actually seems more relaxing to the legs. On
    some uphills 140bpm is such a slow jog that walking gait
    is more efficient. I can't believe Dr. Maffetone thinks
    I should stay at this pace for months.
    --
    Daniel
    [email protected]
     
  11. Well, it was a 9-race series that got all that. They never say
    what the prizes are so I was happy they were useful ones!

    Teresa in AZ

    SwStudio wrote:

    > "Teresa Bippert-Plymate" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    >
    >>Sun: Winterhaven Run Through the Lights 5K. Non-competitive.
    >>And great fun. Stopped twice to sing carols. Afterward was the
    >>Grand Prix awards at the Racquet Club (with food of course), and
    >>I did get 1st for women 40-49. That got me a nice certificate,
    >>a NB running hat, 3 pr NB running socks, a NB water bottle, and
    >>a NB FM radio. Yahooee! And I do need the socks and hat!

    >
    >
    >
    > Holy crap, I've never won that much stuff at one race.
    > Sweet deal!
    >
    >
    > cheers,
     
  12. steve common

    steve common Guest

    "Anthony" <[email protected]> wrote:

    > With 1 km to go
    >I saw that my clothes had been taken. Looking around
    >I saw a man not too far away with a plastic bag. I
    >tried scrambling down some rocks to get to him faster,
    >lost my footing, and twisted my ankle badly.


    At least you got the clothes back without getting stabbed or anything but
    what shitty bad luck.

    It's annoying enough to get injured just before a long-term target when
    it's you're own fault, but when it's caused by a third-party, it's enough
    to make you sign up with the pro-hanging, drawing and quartering lobby...
     
  13. anders

    anders Guest

    steve common wrote:

    > It's annoying enough to get injured just before a long-term target when
    > it's you're own fault, but when it's caused by a third-party, it's enough
    > to make you sign up with the pro-hanging, drawing and quartering lobby...


    Well, count me in as a bleeding heart liberal when it comes to these
    kind of "free game"-collectors (who, unlike us, inhabitate the margins
    of society and whose mental processes often differ slightly from ours)
    - I'd reserve capital punishment for certain dog- and horse-owners.

    Anders (who has discovered that dog leashes and piles of horse manure
    can be practically invisible in semi-darkness)
     
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