tranquilizers were found in the hotel room

Discussion in 'Road Cycling' started by Hold My Beer An, Feb 15, 2004.

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  1. ~99 to 1 its a suicide.
     
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  2. On Sun, 15 Feb 2004 06:10:11 -0500, "hold my beer and watch this..."
    <[email protected]> wrote:

    >~99 to 1 its a suicide.
    >
    He was being treated for depression so it's pretty likely he was on tranquilisers.

    Regards! Stephen
     
  3. leif_ericson

    leif_ericson New Member

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    >He was being treated for depression so it's pretty likely he was on tranquilisers.

    Tranquilizers for depression? I understand anxiety problems but depression?
     
  4. On Sun, 15 Feb 2004 14:04:31 GMT, leif_ericson
    <[email protected]> wrote:

    >>He was being treated for depression so it's pretty likely he was on tranquilisers.
    >
    >Tranquilizers for depression? I understand anxiety problems but depression?

    Anxiety and depression very often go hand in hand.

    Regards! Stephen
     
  5. Steve McGinty <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
    > On Sun, 15 Feb 2004 06:10:11 -0500, "hold my beer and watch this..." <[email protected]> wrote:
    >
    > >~99 to 1 its a suicide.
    > >
    > He was being treated for depression so it's pretty likely he was on tranquilisers.
    >
    > Regards! Stephen

    Sources are not unanimous on whether drugs were involved.

    Tranquilizers should not used to treat depression, although they may be called for to treat anxiety.
    Depression and anxiety are often comorbid.

    In any case, it would be highly foolish and unethical to prescribe potentially fatal drugs to
    someone who is (suicidally) depressed. One of the most important criteria today for antidepressants
    is that they not be very toxic, so that patients will not be able to commit suicide with them.

    -RJ
     
  6. Nick Burns

    Nick Burns Guest

    "Steve McGinty" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > On Sun, 15 Feb 2004 14:04:31 GMT, leif_ericson <[email protected]> wrote:
    >
    > >>He was being treated for depression so it's pretty likely he was on tranquilisers.
    > >
    > >Tranquilizers for depression? I understand anxiety problems but depression?
    >
    > Anxiety and depression very often go hand in hand.

    They do, but the risk of prescribing them to suicidal patients often contra-indicates them. They
    would only be used (properly) if the drug clearly solved the underlying symptoms including the
    depression. If not, there is no way the guy would ever get anything but anti-depressant drugs if the
    MD was qualified to treat him.

    IOW, possible but definitely *not* likely.

    > Regards! Stephen
     
  7. On Sun, 15 Feb 2004 11:08:40 -0800, "Nick Burns"
    <[email protected]> wrote:

    >
    >"Steve McGinty" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    >news:[email protected]...
    >> On Sun, 15 Feb 2004 14:04:31 GMT, leif_ericson <[email protected]> wrote:
    >>
    >> >>He was being treated for depression so it's pretty likely he was on tranquilisers.
    >> >
    >> >Tranquilizers for depression? I understand anxiety problems but depression?
    >>
    >> Anxiety and depression very often go hand in hand.
    >
    >They do, but the risk of prescribing them to suicidal patients often contra-indicates them. They
    >would only be used (properly) if the drug clearly solved the underlying symptoms including the
    >depression. If not, there is no way the guy would ever get anything but anti-depressant drugs if
    >the MD was qualified to treat him.
    >
    >IOW, possible but definitely *not* likely.
    >
    I don't know if it's a question of translation but according to

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/other_sports/cycling/3490761.stm

    Pantani death 'not suicide'

    Pantani has had a troubled time over the last few years Cyclist Marco Pantani, who has been found
    dead in a hotel room in Italy, did not commit suicide, according to the local magistrate Paolo
    Gengarelli. "Nobody has spoken about suicide and I exclude it," Gengarelli said.

    Pantani, whose career has been blighted by doping allegations, was found alone, with 10 packets of
    prescription sedatives in the room.

    The cause of death is to be established at an autopsy on Monday morning, but investigators ruled
    out violence.

    Gengarelli said he was awaiting the results of the autopsy to help him reconstruct the last hours
    before Pantani's death.

    "There are no other elements before the autopsy," he said on Sunday.

    Pantani's manager, Manuela Ronchi, said the magistrate had interviewed several people during
    Sunday morning.

    Police told a news conference on Sunday that some of the packets of tranquilisers were empty and
    some started.

    Gengarelli added that Pantani had effectively secluded himself in the room for five days and left it
    only for breakfast.


    Regards! Stephen
     
  8. Nick Burns

    Nick Burns Guest

    "Steve McGinty" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > On Sun, 15 Feb 2004 11:08:40 -0800, "Nick Burns" <[email protected]> wrote:
    >
    > >
    > >"Steve McGinty" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > >news:[email protected]...
    > >> On Sun, 15 Feb 2004 14:04:31 GMT, leif_ericson <[email protected]> wrote:
    > >>
    > >> >>He was being treated for depression so it's pretty likely he was on tranquilisers.
    > >> >
    > >> >Tranquilizers for depression? I understand anxiety problems but depression?
    > >>
    > >> Anxiety and depression very often go hand in hand.
    > >
    > >They do, but the risk of prescribing them to suicidal patients often contra-indicates them. They
    > >would only be used (properly) if the drug clearly solved the underlying symptoms including the
    > >depression. If not, there is no way the guy would ever get anything but anti-depressant drugs
    if
    > >the MD was qualified to treat him.
    > >
    > >IOW, possible but definitely *not* likely.
    > >
    > I don't know if it's a question of translation but according to
    >
    > http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/other_sports/cycling/3490761.stm
    >
    > Pantani death 'not suicide'

    There is plenty of contradictory information about this incident. They can only rule out suicide if
    they can show it was from natural causes. Until I see that, I am assuming it is suicide and that
    they are being diplomatic about the investigation. Also, take a look at what little facts we have
    and there are obviously indications of a complete lack of will to live and the most that can be said
    at this point was that he killed himself by accident as a result of that lack of motivation to live.
    He was not at a resort for 5 days, it looks like it was more like motel *hell*o (a film reference).

    Joking aside, what do you think was going through his head during that time? I do not think he was
    making any comeback plans and he had been made in to a complete joke for years now. The press is
    being blamed partly for this but then who were they marketing to? That would be *us*. In some part,
    even the fans have to share accountability. Only a complete hypocrite would turn on Pantani the way
    so many of his (fair weather) "fans" did.

    >
    > Pantani has had a troubled time over the last few years Cyclist Marco Pantani, who has been found
    > dead in a hotel room in Italy, did not commit suicide, according to the local magistrate Paolo
    > Gengarelli. "Nobody has spoken about suicide and I exclude it," Gengarelli said.
    >
    > Pantani, whose career has been blighted by doping allegations, was found alone, with 10 packets of
    > prescription sedatives in the room.
    >
    > The cause of death is to be established at an autopsy on Monday morning, but investigators ruled
    > out violence.
    >
    > Gengarelli said he was awaiting the results of the autopsy to help him reconstruct the last hours
    > before Pantani's death.
    >
    > "There are no other elements before the autopsy," he said on Sunday.
    >
    > Pantani's manager, Manuela Ronchi, said the magistrate had interviewed several people during
    > Sunday morning.
    >
    > Police told a news conference on Sunday that some of the packets of tranquilisers were empty and
    > some started.
    >
    > Gengarelli added that Pantani had effectively secluded himself in the room for five days and left
    > it only for breakfast.
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    > Regards! Stephen
     
  9. On Sun, 15 Feb 2004 11:34:56 -0800, Nick Burns wrote:
    > I do not think he was making any comeback plans and he had been made in to a complete joke for
    > years now.

    He finished 14th in the Giro last year.
     
  10. Ewoud Dronkert <[email protected]> wrote:

    > On Sun, 15 Feb 2004 11:34:56 -0800, Nick Burns wrote:

    >> I do not think he was making any comeback plans and he had been made in to a complete joke for
    >> years now.

    > He finished 14th in the Giro last year.

    He was also looking good for a top ten finish until he crashed just three days from the finish and
    lost fifteen minutes. The fact is that less than a year ago he was riding very close to the absolute
    highest level. Hardly a joke.

    -as
     
  11. B. Lafferty

    B. Lafferty Guest

    "Ewoud Dronkert" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > On Sun, 15 Feb 2004 11:34:56 -0800, Nick Burns wrote:
    > > I do not think he was making any comeback plans and he had been made in to a complete joke for
    > > years now.
    >
    > He finished 14th in the Giro last year.

    And in the top 20 which is still pretty good. Suicide is a real possibility. If you've read
    Obree's book you realize how close to the line people can go and how some are just lucky, as with
    Obree, to be saved.
     
  12. In article <[email protected]>, "Nick Burns"
    <[email protected]> wrote:

    > "Steve McGinty" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > news:[email protected]...
    > > On Sun, 15 Feb 2004 14:04:31 GMT, leif_ericson <[email protected]> wrote:
    > >
    > > >>He was being treated for depression so it's pretty likely he was on tranquilisers.
    > > >
    > > >Tranquilizers for depression? I understand anxiety problems but depression?
    > >
    > > Anxiety and depression very often go hand in hand.
    >
    > They do, but the risk of prescribing them to suicidal patients often contra-indicates them. They
    > would only be used (properly) if the drug clearly solved the underlying symptoms including the
    > depression. If not, there is no way the guy would ever get anything but anti-depressant drugs if
    > the MD was qualified to treat him.
    >
    > IOW, possible but definitely *not* likely.
    >
    > > Regards! Stephen

    The thing is you can't be totally sure. It's like someone buying a gun- they can say it's for
    protection, but suppose they are intending to kill themselves? no one says, "oh, by the way, it's
    for suicide." Someone could say they're fine and it's just for anxiety and then decide to off
    themselves. Or they could hoard their pills. Someone who is intent on killing themselves will find a
    way. However, it's still ambiguous with pantani, I think we'll all have to wait and find out. It
    sounds more like an accidental overdose- he may have wanted to take a lot of pills but didn't know
    how much would be lethal.
     
  13. In article <[email protected]>, Ewoud Dronkert
    <[email protected]> wrote:

    > On Sun, 15 Feb 2004 11:34:56 -0800, Nick Burns wrote:
    > > I do not think he was making any comeback plans and he had been made in to a complete joke for
    > > years now.
    >
    > He finished 14th in the Giro last year.

    He actually did pretty well in the giro until he crashed and lost all that time. That stage on the
    Zoncolan was one of the best mountain stages I'd ever seen, rivalling anything in the tour. The fans
    were going crazy over pantani, screaming and cheering him on and pounding him on the back, and he
    surprised everyone by finishing 5th. So sad, that was his last race, but at least it'll be
    remembered for some great moments. The giro is going to be so sad this year, I can imagine fans
    standing on the mountain top finishes and crying.
     
  14. Kyle Legate

    Kyle Legate Guest

    Steve McGinty wrote:
    > On Sun, 15 Feb 2004 11:08:40 -0800, "Nick Burns" <[email protected]> wrote:
    >
    >>
    >> "Steve McGinty" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    >> news:[email protected]...
    >>> On Sun, 15 Feb 2004 14:04:31 GMT, leif_ericson <[email protected]> wrote:
    >>>
    >>>>> He was being treated for depression so it's pretty likely he was on tranquilisers.
    >>>>
    >>>> Tranquilizers for depression? I understand anxiety problems but depression?
    >>>
    >>> Anxiety and depression very often go hand in hand.
    >>
    >> They do, but the risk of prescribing them to suicidal patients often contra-indicates them. They
    >> would only be used (properly) if the drug clearly solved the underlying symptoms including the
    >> depression. If not, there is no way the guy would ever get anything but anti-depressant drugs if
    >> the MD was qualified to treat him.
    >>
    >> IOW, possible but definitely *not* likely.
    >>
    > I don't know if it's a question of translation but according to
    >
    > http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/other_sports/cycling/3490761.stm
    >
    > Pantani death 'not suicide'
    >
    According to a yahoo report I read they're calling the initial cause of death cardiac failure, which
    would be strange enough in itself considering the latest rash of mysterious deaths, but I rather
    think it was suicide.
     
  15. On Sun, 15 Feb 2004 20:54:41 GMT, Marlene Blanshay wrote:
    >> He finished 14th in the Giro last year.
    >
    > He actually did pretty well in the giro until he crashed

    Don't get me wrong, that was what I meant, that he did (more than) pretty well.
     
  16. Tom Kunich

    Tom Kunich Guest

    "hold my beer and watch this..." <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:p[email protected]...
    > ~99 to 1 its a suicide.

    99 to 1 it ain't. No note. Dopers tend to be careless with the crap they aren't afraid of and after
    all the stuff he had probably consumed he was unafraid of too many tranqs.
     
  17. Howard Kveck

    Howard Kveck Guest

    In article <[email protected]>,
    [email protected] (Marlene Blanshay) wrote:

    > The thing is you can't be totally sure. It's like someone buying a gun- they can say it's for
    > protection, but suppose they are intending to kill themselves? no one says, "oh, by the way, it's
    > for suicide." Someone could say they're fine and it's just for anxiety and then decide to off
    > themselves. Or they could hoard their pills. Someone who is intent on killing themselves will find
    > a way. However, it's still ambiguous with pantani, I think we'll all have to wait and find out. It
    > sounds more like an accidental overdose- he may have wanted to take a lot of pills but didn't know
    > how much would be lethal.

    It is also not hard to get pretty much any pill (anti-depressants, trancs, etc.) without a
    prescription. Plenty of people willing to sell thing slike that no questions asked.

    --
    tanx, Howard

    "We're not laughing -at- you, we're laughing -with- you..) "But... I'm not
    laughing???" Happiness

    remove YOUR SHOES to reply, ok?
     
  18. "hold my beer and watch this..." <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:p[email protected]...
    > ~99 to 1 its a suicide.

    Dumbass -

    What do you know about tranquilizers, depression and suicide? Next thing you know, Kunich will be
    posting about how to attract women.

    thank you very much and have a nice day.
     
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