turning professional and mileage..

[Columbia]

im a 19 year old rider who has been racing on and off for about 4 years. i have always been self-trained as i feel i have a good grasp of how my body reacts to different training stimuli.

recently I have been thinking about trying to join the professional ranks, so i invested in a copy of 'the lance armstrong performance program' as i have heard people recommend it. i did the field test in slightly over 6 minutes (6:04), which is way below the given "advanced" level of under 8 minutes. nevertheless, i turned to the advanced training program and it just seems INCREDIBLY light compared to the training i have been doing for years.

now here are my questions..
can there be any benefit from reducing my mileage so much? i mean an actual training benefit, not a recovery benefit.
since my training load already seems so much higher (about 5-10 hours a week higher) than this book recommends, am i in danger of over-training if i increase it much more?
is it simply a case that the LAPP is too conservative, and i would be better off with some other guide?

finally, and somewhat related to the last point, i have an option to pay 40 euros a month to be coached by a soon-to-be ex professional with one year's experience in training, is this something i should grab with both hands or be wary about?

 

[BullGod]

im a 19 year old rider who has been racing on and off for about 4 years. i have always been self-trained as i feel i have a good grasp of how my body reacts to different training stimuli.

recently I have been thinking about trying to join the professional ranks, so i invested in a copy of 'the lance armstrong performance program' as i have heard people recommend it. i did the field test in slightly over 6 minutes (6:04), which is way below the given "advanced" level of under 8 minutes. nevertheless, i turned to the advanced training program and it just seems INCREDIBLY light compared to the training i have been doing for years.

now here are my questions..
can there be any benefit from reducing my mileage so much? i mean an actual training benefit, not a recovery benefit.
since my training load already seems so much higher (about 5-10 hours a week higher) than this book recommends, am i in danger of over-training if i increase it much more?
is it simply a case that the LAPP is too conservative, and i would be better off with some other guide?

finally, and somewhat related to the last point, i have an option to pay 40 euros a month to be coached by a soon-to-be ex professional with one year's experience in training, is this something i should grab with both hands or be wary about?

what level are you racing at right now?
what results have you had?
Do you have any power data?
what is your current weekly training look like?
How much of that is racing?

 

[Columbia]

im a 3rd cat right now. although i could have been a 2, when i transitioned from junior i knew i could only do a couple of races this year so i stayed a 3.
ive been averaging about 3 wins a season, out of about 20-25 races per season. ive been in the top 20 of a few international junior stage races.
no, i havent had the money to invest in a power meter as of yet, i train by heart-rate.
my current weekly schedule is completely unstructured. i basically train according to however i feel in the morning, and none of this is racing.
however, my more normal schedule (that is, last year) would be about 15-16 hours of training a week, usually with 2-3 of those being racing.

 

[Spunout]

Get a coach, get involved in some national team projects. At this time of the year, try to get into some bigger races as a stagiare with more advance team.s

 

[limerickman]

im a 3rd cat right now. although i could have been a 2, when i transitioned from junior i knew i could only do a couple of races this year so i stayed a 3.
ive been averaging about 3 wins a season, out of about 20-25 races per season. ive been in the top 20 of a few international junior stage races.
no, i havent had the money to invest in a power meter as of yet, i train by heart-rate.
my current weekly schedule is completely unstructured. i basically train according to however i feel in the morning, and none of this is racing.
however, my more normal schedule (that is, last year) would be about 15-16 hours of training a week, usually with 2-3 of those being racing.

As a junior, we were training 12 hours during the week (Monday-Friday).

At weekends we would be racing (in summer) or doing training spins (in winter) - on both Saturdays and Sundays :
This totals approximately 18 hours per week.
Our team had guys on the verge of the national squad for Moscow and LA Olympics.

Comparing my total time on the bike (as a junior) to yours, I would suggest that you need to get more hours in either racing and/or training.

The old system - which I have tried to re-introduce to my local club when training juniors - was to exceed total mileage per week/month through either racing and/or training.
The yearly (racing/training) mileage was 12,000.

 

[Columbia]

i average about 31 km/hr in training, so 15 hours of that per week for 48 weeks of the year = 22,320k's, or close to 14,000 miles.

 

[Bailsibub]

Columbia,

If you want to race pro, then I think you should start looking at how the pros race and train(and basically live). Now I'm not saying that you should train like one right now, but what I'm saying is they do pretty much every thing they can in their lives to ride at their maximum potential. That generally means coaching, lots of races(traveling to who knows where), periodization, power meters (these days), dialed-in nutrition, and probably other stuff us pack fodder haven't even heard about yet! It's a 24-hour-a-day job.

It's good you got the book. Keep reading training books and any research you can find. Educate yourself on the sport. And get help from people who know what they are doing. I know that coaches are expensive. I've never had one. And a friend of mine, a strong Cat 1, hasn't either(makes me wonder "what if"). But it might be something worth working a part-time job for at your age....

Making the decision to turn pro is a BIG commitment. I encourage you to go for it. Good luck and stick with it.

 

[Roadie_scum]

im a 19 year old rider who has been racing on and off for about 4 years. i have always been self-trained as i feel i have a good grasp of how my body reacts to different training stimuli.

recently I have been thinking about trying to join the professional ranks, so i invested in a copy of 'the lance armstrong performance program' as i have heard people recommend it. i did the field test in slightly over 6 minutes (6:04), which is way below the given "advanced" level of under 8 minutes. nevertheless, i turned to the advanced training program and it just seems INCREDIBLY light compared to the training i have been doing for years.

now here are my questions..
can there be any benefit from reducing my mileage so much? i mean an actual training benefit, not a recovery benefit.
since my training load already seems so much higher (about 5-10 hours a week higher) than this book recommends, am i in danger of over-training if i increase it much more?
is it simply a case that the LAPP is too conservative, and i would be better off with some other guide?

finally, and somewhat related to the last point, i have an option to pay 40 euros a month to be coached by a soon-to-be ex professional with one year's experience in training, is this something i should grab with both hands or be wary about?

To get where you want to be you definitely need a coach. The Lance Armstrong book is for schmucks and beginners.

 

[dm69]

That book isn't for someone of your ability. You need a coach, and you need to race a lot more.

 

[Columbia]

Columbia,

If you want to race pro, then I think you should start looking at how the pros race and train(and basically live). Now I'm not saying that you should train like one right now, but what I'm saying is they do pretty much every thing they can in their lives to ride at their maximum potential. That generally means coaching, lots of races(traveling to who knows where), periodization, power meters (these days), dialed-in nutrition, and probably other stuff us pack fodder haven't even heard about yet! It's a 24-hour-a-day job.

It's good you got the book. Keep reading training books and any research you can find. Educate yourself on the sport. And get help from people who know what they are doing. I know that coaches are expensive. I've never had one. And a friend of mine, a strong Cat 1, hasn't either(makes me wonder "what if"). But it might be something worth working a part-time job for at your age....

Making the decision to turn pro is a BIG commitment. I encourage you to go for it. Good luck and stick with it.

thank you, this was great advice..not that i dont appreciate everyones comments here
recently i have been living like the university student i am, instead of the pro cyclist i want to be.

 

[Ade Merckx]

im a 19 year old rider who has been racing on and off for about 4 years. i have always been self-trained as i feel i have a good grasp of how my body reacts to different training stimuli.

recently I have been thinking about trying to join the professional ranks, so i invested in a copy of 'the lance armstrong performance program' as i have heard people recommend it. i did the field test in slightly over 6 minutes (6:04), which is way below the given "advanced" level of under 8 minutes. nevertheless, i turned to the advanced training program and it just seems INCREDIBLY light compared to the training i have been doing for years.

now here are my questions..
can there be any benefit from reducing my mileage so much? i mean an actual training benefit, not a recovery benefit.
since my training load already seems so much higher (about 5-10 hours a week higher) than this book recommends, am i in danger of over-training if i increase it much more?
is it simply a case that the LAPP is too conservative, and i would be better off with some other guide?

finally, and somewhat related to the last point, i have an option to pay 40 euros a month to be coached by a soon-to-be ex professional with one year's experience in training, is this something i should grab with both hands or be wary about?

Hi Columbia, first off I wish you all the luck in the world with your dream of being a pro. Just off the top of my head head I think there are a number of things you should be doing;

1. Get in touch with your National Cycling Federation and find out what
programs or club(s) in particular you should be involved with.

2. Don't just get any old coach get someone who's well connected, scientifically knowledgeble and experienced enough to get you where you need to be so you don't end up wasting time.

3. Don't lose focus on your studies coz there's no guarantees you'll make.

4. Like the other fellas have said keep training and loose the Armstrong book its really for weekend warriors and time constrained oldies who aren't seriously competitive.

5. Learn how to win more races and people will start to notice you. Plus it will look good on your Palmares

6. Do your research, find out what good amateur DS's and pro DS's are looking for. Is it just race results, impressive wattage outputs etc etc

Good luck dude

 

[Roadie_scum]

Hi Columbia, first off I wish you all the luck in the world with your dream of being a pro. Just off the top of my head head I think there are a number of things you should be doing;

1. Get in touch with your National Cycling Federation and find out what
programs or club(s) in particular you should be involved with.

2. Don't just get any old coach get someone who's well connected, scientifically knowledgeble and experienced enough to get you where you need to be so you don't end up wasting time.

3. Don't lose focus on your studies coz there's no guarantees you'll make.

4. Like the other fellas have said keep training and loose the Armstrong book its really for weekend warriors and time constrained oldies who aren't seriously competitive.

5. Learn how to win more races and people will start to notice you. Plus it will look good on your Palmares

6. Do your research, find out what good amateur DS's and pro DS's are looking for. Is it just race results, impressive wattage outputs etc etc

Good luck dude

+1 Well said, especially 2 and 3.

 

[BullGod]

Columbia,

Making the decision to turn pro is a BIG commitment. I encourage you to go for it. Good luck and stick with it.

very few people decide to go pro. Pro teams decide to offer you a contract. To be noticed by pro teams you have to win lots of amateur races at top level. To get on a european team that means coming over here and riding as many elite level races as possible.

here in Holland there are hundreds of elite amateurs, and (with the exception of the Rabobank development squad who have been earmarked as future pros since the juniors) each year only 2/3 get a pro contract. Of those 2/3 probably only 1 gets a second contract.

There are amateurs here who rack up 20+ victories a season, and place ahead of many good pros when theire teams are "wildcarded" in pro races. They still don't get a pro contract though.

basically it's a lot harder than "deciding" to go pro and training 20 hrs a week, or having a VO2 max of 85, or an FT of 395w....

 

[dhk2]

Bullgod, your response should be printed out and hung on the wall of everyone who dreams of "turning pro", particularly students who are trying to decide what to do with the next 10 years of their life.

And what is so great about a career in pro cycling anyway? The average pro rider in Europe makes what, $30K euros/year? Considering the risk of injury, pain and career longevity, and just plain beating yourself up all the time, it's not much of a way to make a living....even for the 1/1000 elite who get there.

 

[Roadie_scum]

Bullgod, your response should be printed out and hung on the wall of everyone who dreams of "turning pro", particularly students who are trying to decide what to do with the next 10 years of their life.

And what is so great about a career in pro cycling anyway? The average pro rider in Europe makes what, $30K euros/year? Considering the risk of injury, pain and career longevity, and just plain beating yourself up all the time, it's not much of a way to make a living....even for the 1/1000 elite who get there.

When you win a race at the highest level of the sport... I wish I could even imagine what that is like. It's not often a lifestyle choice or a financial decision. For the people that make it... who cares what you get paid?

Bullgod: If you have a VO2max of 85 and an FT of 395 and you are under 23 (or not TOO much older), you are extremely likely be offered a contract unless you are a ********, have no passion for racing or have the worst bike handling skills known to man. And even then... a good director would get you under control and turn you into a great rider. The problem isn't so much that it isn't about the numbers (although they aren't the only thing). The problem is that for many people it can take a lifetime of work and they still won't get those numbers.

By my calculations, that VO2 and FT would put you at 70.5kg, about 5.6W/kg. If you are reasonably young, that is a very good foundation to build off. Typical numbers for a good young pro. Maybe not protour, but strong enough to ride pro, and definitely with a shot at making it protour. The thing is, there might be hundreds or thousands of amateurs trying to make it around the world. Only a handful of them get those numbers.

 

[Columbia]

Bullgod: If you have a VO2max of 85 and an FT of 395 and you are under 23 (or not TOO much older), you are extremely likely be offered a contract unless you are a ********

heh, i dunno about my power data but my VO2 was 81 the time i had it measured (when i was 17)...i dunno what this says about my personality

 

[Roadie_scum]

heh, i dunno about my power data but my VO2 was 81 the time i had it measured (when i was 17)...i dunno what this says about my personality

That's pretty good man. You have to take the measurements with a grain of salt sometimes - different labs have different protocols and levels of accuracy. The other thing is, when you are young (but not too young) you can sometimes pull higher numbers due to lower mass - your body hasn't filled out yet. A VO2 of 85 is worth more when you are older. But if you keep training... good luck... you never know. Functional threshold and the metabolic adaptions that flow therefrom are the major determinants of cycling performance. With a high VO2, that should give you extra motivation and confidence that if you do good, structured work, it might pay off. It doesn't guarantee success, but it makes it more likely.

Seriously, who organised the VO2 test for you? How were the results used to restructure your training? Maybe you should be speaking to either the people who organised it or the people who did the test about training.

I would be wary of 'ex-pro' coaches. Some of them are very good, others less so. A good knowledge of exercise physiology and plenty of experience are good indicators. One interesting thing: I don't know too many ex-pro's who coach pro's. Many pro's coaches are professionally qualified exercise physiologists or medical doctors - or at the very least have been full time coaches for a long time and have a good knowledge of 'training science' as it were.

At 19, I wouldn't impute anything about your personality from the fact you haven't been offered a contract... what are your race results like, where have you been racing, how long have you been in the sport, have you been knocking on doors?

(If you are getting good results and feel like doing some racing/riding in Australia and NZ, maybe we could work something out... we get quite a few northerners coming down to stay fit in our summer/your winter).

 

[Alex Simmons]

Functional threshold and the metabolic adaptions that flow therefrom are the major determinants of cycling performance.

+1
I would say "major physiological determinants".

 

[BullGod]

When you win a race at the highest level of the sport... I wish I could even imagine what that is like. It's not often a lifestyle choice or a financial decision. For the people that make it... who cares what you get paid?

Bullgod: If you have a VO2max of 85 and an FT of 395 and you are under 23 (or not TOO much older), you are extremely likely be offered a contract unless you are a ********, have no passion for racing or have the worst bike handling skills known to man. And even then... a good director would get you under control and turn you into a great rider. The problem isn't so much that it isn't about the numbers (although they aren't the only thing). The problem is that for many people it can take a lifetime of work and they still won't get those numbers.

By my calculations, that VO2 and FT would put you at 70.5kg, about 5.6W/kg. If you are reasonably young, that is a very good foundation to build off. Typical numbers for a good young pro. Maybe not protour, but strong enough to ride pro, and definitely with a shot at making it protour. The thing is, there might be hundreds or thousands of amateurs trying to make it around the world. Only a handful of them get those numbers.

I agree to a certain extent, but there are more guys than you think capable of putting out those kind of numbers. Here in NL there are plenty of guys who know they're good enough to "go pro" but won't get the chance because there are quite a few guys just as good as they are, and only a couple of squads recruiting Dutch amateurs. Also big sponsors want big names, and they'd much rather spend the money on a reputation than an unknown.

 

[youhaditcoming]

Hi

No one says you can't finish University and pursuing a career in cycling at the same time. Tony Rominger was an Accountant for example, he became pro rather late and won 4 grand tours among other races !

One thing you definitively can't do is hung out with your College pals who like to party when you need to be resting...

AHH... and stay clean and away of Doping of course !