typical low-carb meals - what us wrong with this



T

Tcomeau

Guest
Here are a couple of typical low-carb meals. I challenge any
anti-atkins people to explain what is wrong and so dangerous
about this.

1) 4 ounces of chicken, beef, fish, pork or lamb side of
veggies - carrots and peas all the salad and vinaigrette
dressing you want

2) 4 ounces of bbq steak, ribs, or chicken mushroom and
veggie stuffed green pepper all the summer salad and
vinaigrette dressing you want

Sounds downright dangerous doesn't it.

The only thing being restricted is refined sugars and grains
and high-starch tubers. Scary, eh?

TC
 
Why not a side of grain or tubers? Why not a side of
multigrain bread with butter? Why not any other carb source
with an gi/gl = < the carrets and peas, both high btw? Why
not a moderate carb diet which falls within one's energy
requirements?

>Here are a couple of typical low-carb meals. I challenge
>any anti-atkins people to explain what is wrong and so
>dangerous about this.
>
>1) 4 ounces of chicken, beef, fish, pork or lamb side of
> veggies - carrots and peas all the salad and vinaigrette
> dressing you want
>
>2) 4 ounces of bbq steak, ribs, or chicken mushroom and
> veggie stuffed green pepper all the summer salad and
> vinaigrette dressing you want
>
>Sounds downright dangerous doesn't it.
>
>The only thing being restricted is refined sugars and
>grains and high-starch tubers. Scary, eh?
>
>TC
 
What's wrong? There's no carbs!

--
Frank W. Marrs III Georgia Institute of Technology
[email protected] <omit "spamguard" to
email> "tcomeau" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Here are a couple of typical low-carb meals. I challenge
> any anti-atkins people to explain what is wrong and so
> dangerous about this.
>
> 1) 4 ounces of chicken, beef, fish, pork or lamb side of
> veggies - carrots and peas all the salad and
> vinaigrette dressing you want
>
> 2) 4 ounces of bbq steak, ribs, or chicken mushroom and
> veggie stuffed green pepper all the summer salad and
> vinaigrette dressing you want
>
> Sounds downright dangerous doesn't it.
>
> The only thing being restricted is refined sugars and
> grains and high-starch tubers. Scary, eh?
>
> TC
 
> Why not a side of grain or tubers? Why not a side of
> multigrain bread with butter? Why not any other carb
> source with an gi/gl = < the
carrets
> and peas, both high btw? Why not a moderate carb diet
> which falls
within
> one's energy requirements?

Let me think... hm.... hm.... what about calories? :)

Mirek
 
x-no-archive: yes

>Why not a side of grain or tubers? Why not a side of
>multigrain bread with butter? Why not any other carb source
>with an gi/gl = < the carrets and peas, both high btw? Why
>not a moderate carb diet which falls within one's energy
>requirements?
>

Why add grains in place of much more nutrient dense
plant foods?

I don't get you extremists.

Susan
 
The first principle in weight control is to get the energy
balance in hand, source of the calories doesn't matter. One
could take any item in the original low carb example and
reduce it by x calories and add the same x from carb sources
and the energy balance is intact. Grains are plant foods
too. The energy concentration of the peas and corn in the
low carb example are quite similar in energy concentration,
as measured by gi/gl, to multigraim bread and brown rice.
Extreme with regard to what?

>>Why not a side of grain or tubers? Why not a side of
>>multigrain bread with butter? Why not any other carb
>>source with an gi/gl = < the carrets and peas, both high
>>btw? Why not a moderate carb diet which falls within one's
>>energy requirements?
>>
>
>Why add grains in place of much more nutrient dense
>plant foods?
>
>I don't get you extremists.
>
>Susan
 
The other carb sources were to be in place of the peas and
corn, as mentioned, energy requirements are not to be
exceeded; thus calories are considered.

>> Why not a side of grain or tubers? Why not a side of
>> multigrain bread with butter? Why not any other carb
>> source with an gi/gl = < the
>carrets
>> and peas, both high btw? Why not a moderate carb diet
>> which falls
>within
>> one's energy requirements?
>
>Let me think... hm.... hm.... what about calories? :)
>
>Mirek
 
x-no-archive: yes

>The energy concentration of the peas and corn in the low
>carb example are quite similar in energy concentration, as
>measured by gi/gl, to multigraim bread and brown rice.
>Extreme with regard to what?

Extreme in the belief that it's important to include grains,
that the meal was deficient without them.

I'd dump peas and corn for colorful leafies, myself. More
nutritional bang for the buck, which matters more the
less one eats.

Susan
 
Of course nothing of the kind was said; nothing about
important or deficient. The original provided a menu with
peas and corn as a side, the multigrain bread and brown rice
are comperable in every way, including nutrition. So again,
extreme with regard to what? With regard to weight control,
the concern of the original post menu example, caleries from
a carb source is just fine as long as the energy balance is
met and no more. Now you mention nutrition as an additional
point, we can add it to the energy balance, both easily
achieved while including a substantual part of food intake
from carb sources, including those in the leafy greens whose
color is appealing.

>Extreme in the belief that it's important to include
>grains, that the meal was deficient without them.
>
>I'd dump peas and corn for colorful leafies, myself. More
>nutritional bang for the buck, which matters more the less
>one eats.
>
>Susan
 
There are as many carbs as one may need unless of course you
plan to run a marathon. Lots of carbs. You do realize that
there really is no *essential* carbohydrate, don't you?

TC

"Frank W. Marrs III" <[email protected]> wrote in
message news:<[email protected]>...
> What's wrong? There's no carbs!
>
> --
> Frank W. Marrs III Georgia Institute of Technology
> [email protected] <omit "spamguard" to
> email> "tcomeau" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> > Here are a couple of typical low-carb meals. I challenge
> > any anti-atkins people to explain what is wrong and so
> > dangerous about this.
> >
> > 1) 4 ounces of chicken, beef, fish, pork or lamb side of
> > veggies - carrots and peas all the salad and
> > vinaigrette dressing you want
> >
> > 2) 4 ounces of bbq steak, ribs, or chicken mushroom and
> > veggie stuffed green pepper all the summer salad and
> > vinaigrette dressing you want
> >
> > Sounds downright dangerous doesn't it.
> >
> > The only thing being restricted is refined sugars and
> > grains and high-starch tubers. Scary, eh?
> >
> > TC
 
Why a side of grain or tubers? Why multi-grain bread? They
are unnecessary to a healthy diet.

I would have a pat of butter on the veggies or some olive
oil on the stuffed green pepper though. Soooo good and
satiating, and healthy.

These meals are moderate carbs and they fall within one's
energy requirements. Especially if one is not a world class
athlete like the majority of americans.

The point is that grains, tubers and sugars are too much for
our lifestyles.

TC

[email protected] wrote in message news:<[email protected]
net.com>...
> Why not a side of grain or tubers? Why not a side of
> multigrain bread with butter? Why not any other carb
> source with an gi/gl = < the carrets and peas, both high
> btw? Why not a moderate carb diet which falls within one's
> energy requirements?
>
>
> >Here are a couple of typical low-carb meals. I challenge
> >any anti-atkins people to explain what is wrong and so
> >dangerous about this.
> >
> >1) 4 ounces of chicken, beef, fish, pork or lamb side of
> > veggies - carrots and peas all the salad and
> > vinaigrette dressing you want
> >
> >2) 4 ounces of bbq steak, ribs, or chicken mushroom and
> > veggie stuffed green pepper all the summer salad and
> > vinaigrette dressing you want
> >
> >Sounds downright dangerous doesn't it.
> >
> >The only thing being restricted is refined sugars and
> >grains and high-starch tubers. Scary, eh?
> >
> >TC
 
> There are as many carbs as one may need unless of course
> you plan to run a marathon. Lots of carbs. You do realize
> that there really is no

Actually, I believe that for running marathon, fat (dietary
and then body) is the energy source anyway:)

Mirek
 
> The first principle in weight control is to get the energy
> balance in hand, source of the calories doesn't matter.
> One could take any item
in

So you do think that by replacing mentioned menu with
refined sugar with same calories count would be ok ?

Mirek
 
> Of course nothing of the kind was said; nothing about
> important or deficient. The original provided a menu with
> peas and corn as a side,
the
> multigrain bread and brown rice are comperable in every
> way, including nutrition. So again, extreme with regard to
> what? With regard to
weight

Well, thinking about it, we somewhat missed OP point...

So again, do you think that the menu presented is dangerous
to the health?

What is so important about bread? And BTW, bread is either
too high-GI (above 40), or it tastes really bad. I do not
like low-GI bread and I do not want to eat high-GI one.

Mirek
 
Can you give us an example of your idea of the ideally
balanced meal?

TC

"Frank W. Marrs III" <[email protected]> wrote in
message news:<[email protected]>...
> What's wrong? There's no carbs!
>
> --
> Frank W. Marrs III Georgia Institute of Technology
> [email protected] <omit "spamguard" to
> email> "tcomeau" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> > Here are a couple of typical low-carb meals. I challenge
> > any anti-atkins people to explain what is wrong and so
> > dangerous about this.
> >
> > 1) 4 ounces of chicken, beef, fish, pork or lamb side of
> > veggies - carrots and peas all the salad and
> > vinaigrette dressing you want
> >
> > 2) 4 ounces of bbq steak, ribs, or chicken mushroom and
> > veggie stuffed green pepper all the summer salad and
> > vinaigrette dressing you want
> >
> > Sounds downright dangerous doesn't it.
> >
> > The only thing being restricted is refined sugars and
> > grains and high-starch tubers. Scary, eh?
> >
> > TC
 
"So again, do you think that the menu presented is dangerous
to the health?"

No, and the things mentioned that could be substituted were
equally so. Do you think a diet that meets energy balance
and nutrition goals and draws upon moderate use of all food
sources is a threat to health? If one wants to include bread
in one's diet, do it within those same goals, regardless of
the gi of bread chosen. However, by definition the nutrition
goal is better met with breads using whole grains and a
concern for moderation naturally speaks to quantity of any
single food. .
 
"Ok" is always with regard to some measure/goal. Where
weight status alone is the hypothetical point with regard to
energy balance, there is no problem. When nutrition and
range of food sources is a goal, it would probably not be
wise on a constant basis. One instance of replacing the
carbs from peas and corn with sugar is no big deal in and of
itself, a glass of lemonaid might be such a thing.

> The first principle in weight control is to get the energy
> balance in hand, source of the calories doesn't matter.
> One could take any item
in

So you do think that by replacing mentioned menu with
refined sugar with same calories count would be ok ?
 
Just to make the simple point that substutions can easily
be made with those things you said should be excluded,
because they are equivalent in carb status. Don't exceed
calorie requirements, regardless of food sources and you
will not gain weight, lower energy intake below that needed
to maintain metabolism and you will lose weight.
"necessary" to health is based on what? Any food you care
to mention can easily be excluded without health problems,
so that statement helps us not one bit. Eating many carb
source foods increases the probability that the nutrition
required for health will be there, including those in
grains and tubers.

>Why a side of grain or tubers? Why multi-grain bread? They
>are unnecessary to a healthy diet.
>
>I would have a pat of butter on the veggies or some olive
>oil on the stuffed green pepper though. Soooo good and
>satiating, and healthy.
>
>These meals are moderate carbs and they fall within one's
>energy requirements. Especially if one is not a world class
>athlete like the majority of americans.
>
>The point is that grains, tubers and sugars are too much
>for our lifestyles.
>
>TC
>
>[email protected] wrote in message news:<[email protected]
>n et.com>...
>> Why not a side of grain or tubers? Why not a side of
>> multigrain bread with butter? Why not any other carb
>> source with an gi/gl = < the carrets and peas, both high
>> btw? Why not a moderate carb diet which falls within
>> one's energy requirements?
>>
>>
>> >Here are a couple of typical low-carb meals. I challenge
>> >any anti-atkins people to explain what is wrong and so
>> >dangerous about this.
>> >
>> >1) 4 ounces of chicken, beef, fish, pork or lamb side of
>> > veggies - carrots and peas all the salad and
>> > vinaigrette dressing you want
>> >
>> >2) 4 ounces of bbq steak, ribs, or chicken mushroom and
>> > veggie stuffed green pepper all the summer salad and
>> > vinaigrette dressing you want
>> >
>> >Sounds downright dangerous doesn't it.
>> >
>> >The only thing being restricted is refined sugars and
>> >grains and high-starch tubers. Scary, eh?
>> >
>> >TC
 
[email protected] wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
> Why not a side of grain or tubers? Why not a side of
> multigrain bread with butter? Why not any other carb
> source with an gi/gl = < the carrets and peas, both
> high btw?

Actually, the carrot deal appears to be a mistake- go ahead
and crunch'em!

A recent issue of the newsletter Harvard Women's Health
Watch ranked some foods by both GI and GL. For a baked
potato, the calculation went like this: 37 (grams of
carbohydrate in a serving) multiplied by 1.21 (GI) equals
45. That's still high in a ranking of foods by glycemic
load. Air-popped popcorn, though, went from a high GI of
79 to a low GL of 4. Corn chips fell from 105 to a
moderate GL of 16. Carrots dropped from Harvard's oddly
high GI of 131 to a GL of 10. Remember, serving size
counts: That's a cup of popcorn, an ounce of corn chips
and a half cup of cooked carrots.

And carrots' stock goes up even further. The widely used
glycemic indexing of carrots at 92 (not to mention that
131) was faulty, according to Australian researcher Dr.
Jennie Brand-Miller, a leader in the field and author of
"The Glucose Revolution." She told me by e-mail that a
later, less publicized test put carrots' GI at 49, and very
recent tests under her watch found boiled carrots to have a
GI of 32 and carrot juice 43. That would give carrots a GL
between 3 and 4.

"I think the glycemic load is shaping up to be a valuable
concept," said Brand-Miller. "A diet with a very high GL
should be avoided. This means that the higher the
carbohydrate content of your diet, the more important it is
that the carbohydrate comes from low-GI sources."

Though a proponent of GI and GL awareness — she's working to
develop a program that would allow low-glycemic-index foods
to be labeled as such — Brand-Miller cautions against taking
it to extremes.

"I don't think we should be necessarily aiming for a diet
with the lowest GL," she said. "While the worst choice is a
high-cholesterol, high-GI diet, the best choice is still
being sorted out."

Molly Martin is assistant editor of Pacific Northwest
magazine. She can be reached by calling 206-464-8243, e-
mailing [email protected] or writing her at Pacific
Northwest magazine, The Seattle Times, P.O. Box 70,
Seattle, WA 98111.
 
On 17 Mar 2004 07:08:27 -0800, [email protected] (tcomeau) posted:

>Can you give us an example of your idea of the ideally
>balanced meal?

A varied, wholefood, eucaloric diet and you won't go far
wrong. No point excluding any wholefoods unless they affect
you badly (allergies etc). So long as you get essential
micronutrients, and about 50g of balanced amino acids, then
the rest is meant to be enjoyed.
 
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