U.S. Constitutional crisis?



davidmc

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In an unprecedented move, Justice dept barges into congressional members office circumventing capitol police who are charged with protecting house members person and effects. Violation of Article I, Section 6 of Constitution. Rogue executive power :confused: as the Justice Dept. is an arm (Executive agency staffed by executive appointee's-Attorney's General) of the Executive Branch. It has never happened in 219 years (not long by european standards, neverthe less) of our history as each of the three branches of government are co-equal. Attorney General offers to resign. Stay tuned.

Bipartisan group condemns search of lawmaker's office

Tuesday, May 30, 2006; Posted: 1:12 p.m. EDT (17:12 GMT)

Rep. James Sensenbrenner has called the FBI raid a violation of constitutional separations of powers.


Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI)
White House
Justice Department

WASHINGTON (AP) -- House Judiciary Committee Chairman James Sensenbrenner said Tuesday he will summon Attorney General Alberto Gonzales and FBI Director Robert Mueller before his panel to explain their decision to raid a lawmaker's office for the first time in history.

"I want to have Attorney General Gonzales and FBI Director Mueller up here to tell us how they reached the conclusion they did," said Sensenbrenner, one of President Bush's most loyal House allies. Sensenbrenner's hearings, which began Tuesday, are examining whether the May 20 raid violated the Constitution.

Calling the decision to authorize the raid "profoundly disturbing," Sensenbrenner signaled that he would not be among the lawmakers backing off their criticism of the Bush administration. Any progress in talks between House and Justice Department lawyers in crafting guidelines for future criminal investigations of Congress would not deter Sensenbrenner from calling the administration to account for weekend search of Rep. William Jefferson's offices.
"They didn't get it right this time," Sensenbrenner said.
 
Interesting how Repig's like Sensenbrenner and Hastert start getting nervous when it's their (Congressional) offices being Gestapo'ed.

Where were they on the "Patriot" Act, and most recently - domestic spying/wiretapping? Apparently the Bu$hCo tactics are OK for everyone else but them.
 
"Apparently the Bu$hCo tactics are OK for everyone else but them."

He's the reason I hit a rut in the road the other day - Bush and his cohorts have a lot to answer for. You ask yourself why these ruts in the road are a danger to cyclists and the only answer is it's a conspiracy - planned by no other than Bush. :D



Wurm said:
Interesting how Repig's like Sensenbrenner and Hastert start getting nervous when it's their (Congressional) offices being Gestapo'ed.

Where were they on the "Patriot" Act, and most recently - domestic spying/wiretapping? Apparently the Bu$hCo tactics are OK for everyone else but them.
 
davidmc said:
In an unprecedented move, Justice dept barges into congressional members office circumventing capitol police who are charged with protecting house members person and effects. Violation of Article I, Section 6 of Constitution. Rogue executive power :confused: as the Justice Dept. is an arm (Executive agency staffed by executive appointee's-Attorney's General) of the Executive Branch. It has never happened in 219 years (not long by european standards, neverthe less) of our history as each of the three branches of government are co-equal. Attorney General offers to resign. Stay tuned.

Assuming that the report is correct - I think that what you say is a constitutional matter.

At the very least, there ought to be an enquiry to establish the basis for the raid.
In addition, i would have thought that a raid would require a judicial warrant??
 
limerickman said:
Assuming that the report is correct - I think that what you say is a constitutional matter.

At the very least, there ought to be an enquiry to establish the basis for the raid.
In addition, i would have thought that a raid would require a judicial warrant??
I don't think it is a matter of being illegal, I think it more of a matter of never being done.......And warrants were issued I believe.

But if you have followed the story, it is the Republicans that are screaming foul..... This while the Dems are distancing themselves from the Congressman in question.
 
limerickman said:
Assuming that the report is correct - I think that what you say is a constitutional matter.

At the very least, there ought to be an enquiry to establish the basis for the raid.
In addition, i would have thought that a raid would require a judicial warrant??
Here is "Section 6", from the U.S. Constitution, for any interested parties:
Section. 6. The Senators and Representatives shall receive a Compensation for their Services, to be ascertained by Law, and paid out of the Treasury of the United States. They shall in all Cases, except Treason, Felony and Breach of the Peace, be privileged from Arrest during their Attendance at the Session of their respective Houses, and in going to and returning from the same; and for any Speech or Debate in either House, they shall not be questioned in any other Place.
http://www.constitution.org/constit_.htm
 
wolfix said:
Exactly.....The congressnman in question was committing felony actions. So it is legal in the constitution.....
It would appear that you are not aware of proper procedure. Kicking in doors is a "last resort" tactic. No wonder the Leadership wants the AG & FBI director up there to testify as to why they used "last resort" tactics :confused: The executive branch is a co-equal branch. Justice falls under the executive branch. The AG is selected by the executive. Etc...
There are two remedies the justice dept & fbi "overlooked", as it were. One was to contact the clerk who would notify the house leadership of the dept's intent's then the leadership would make a decision. Another remedy would have been to contact the congressional counsel (woman) who would have initiated a more "coordinated & valid" search. Searching w/o an attorney present weakens the justice dept's discoveries, if there were any. They trampled proper procedure under foot. They over-ruled the capital police whose duty is to protect the capital & its contents.
 
davidmc said:
It would appear that you are not aware of proper procedure. Kicking in doors is a "last resort" tactic. No wonder the Leadership wants the AG & FBI director up there to testify as to why they used "last resort" tactics :confused: The executive branch is a co-equal branch. Justice falls under the executive branch. The AG is selected by the executive. Etc...
There are two remedies the justice dept & fbi "overlooked", as it were. One was to contact the clerk who would notify the house leadership of the dept's intent's then the leadership would make a decision. Another remedy would have been to contact the congressional counsel (woman) who would have initiated a more "coordinated & valid" search. Searching w/o an attorney present weakens the justice dept's discoveries, if there were any. They trampled proper procedure under foot. They over-ruled the capital police whose duty is to protect the capital & its contents.
This was a federal issue concerning international issues..... The investigation was by the US Justice Department. The case is not weakened because of the lack a attorney. Search warrants are conducted when they are served. The evidence in this case comes from the video tape of the congressman himself taking the bribes......

What is being questioned here is that Congress and politicians have always had this "old boys club" mentality. And I agree with Wurm ..... and god does that hurt, but yes it is time that something that they have used against the people since the writing of the Constitution is ued against them .... Even though this goes back to the beginning and is not a Bushco only act.
 
By Dana Milbank
Wednesday, May 31, 2006; Page A02

When asked to hold hearings on the rendition and torture of terrorism suspects, House Judiciary Committee Chairman James Sensenbrenner Jr. (R-Wis.) respectfully declined.

Invited repeatedly to probe the Bush administration's leaking of a CIA operative's identity, the chairman sent his regrets.

"Documents having nothing whatsoever to do with any crime" were "seized by the executive branch without constitutional authority," House Judiciary Chairman James Sensenbrenner said at the first hearing on the raid.

Urged to have hearings dedicated to the administration's warrantless eavesdropping, Sensenbrenner demurred once more.

But when FBI agents searched a congressional office 11 days ago, Sensenbrenner went up to the attic and found his gavel.

Yesterday, he held the first of at least four hearings into the raid -- the debut was dispassionately titled "Reckless Justice" -- and announced that he will haul the attorney general and FBI director before his committee. He also vowed that he will "promptly" write legislation to prevent a recurrence.

Even before the expert witnesses were sworn in yesterday, Sensenbrenner said his mind was made up. "Documents having nothing whatsoever to do with any crime," he lectured absent administration officials, were "seized by the executive branch without constitutional authority."

The four witnesses performed in the perfect harmony of an amen chorus.

"A wholesale constitutional violation," said former House lawyer Charles Tiefer.

"Unconstitutional," judged constitutional lawyer Bruce Fein.

"Abandonment of fundamental law," said former congressman Bob Walker (R-Pa.). "A recipe for constitutional crisis."

"A profound and almost gratuitous insult," contributed George Washington University law professor Jonathan Turley. "Raw arrogance."

Democrats needled the majority about the fresh discovery of the committee's oversight authority. Rep. Chris Van Hollen (Md.) reminded his colleagues of a "number of examples of overreaching by the executive branch where there's been a total lack of oversight by this Congress: the torture memorandum, detainees, enemy combatants, signing statements, domestic surveillance, data-mining operations."
Sensenbrenner took off his glasses and rubbed his eyes.

But, consistent or not, the lawmakers acted as though they were 17th-century English parliamentarians protecting democracy from King Charles. "For the first time in 219 years, the Department of Justice entered a Capitol Hill office and removed documents and materials without the involvement of a single legal representative of Congress," Sensenbrenner intoned.

Ranking Democrat John Conyers Jr. (Mich.) also recalled "219 years in which, in this history of the United States, [we] have been able to avoid the spectacle of the Federal Bureau of Investigation swooping down into the Capitol."

Rep. Bobby Scott (D-Va.) preferred round numbers. "Over 200 years, it hasn't happened," he said.

And the chorus sang. "The Justice Department has sought to redefine a relationship 219 years in the making" (Walker). "Over 200 years, this hasn't occurred" (Turley).

"Professor Tiefer," asked Conyers, "what do you think was behind the fact that we haven't ever had this happen before in 219 years?"

The professor said that this time "they were simply in a hurry."

Sensenbrenner sought to summarize the findings. "It's worked for 219 years," he concluded. "There's no reason to ignore the 219 years of success of separation of powers."

A couple of the witnesses tried to suggest, gently, that Congress was arriving a bit late to the party. Fein called the office raid "simply an additional instrument of the Bush administration to cow Congress," including "a claim of inherent presidential authority to flout any statute that he thinks impedes his ability to gather foreign intelligence, whether opening mail, conducting electronic surveillance, breaking and entering, or committing torture."

This all seemed to wake up freshman Rep. Louie Gohmert (R-Tex.). "I've been so much more concerned about the judiciary overreaching in power, and I really had not looked at the executive," he confessed. But after the "phone logs and things," he added, "I've become more concerned."

Issa became dramatic. "We have the power to impeach the attorney general," he reminded his peers, before quickly adding: "I think we're a couple of shakes short of a quorum for that purpose."

"Not yet," Sensenbrenner agreed.
 
Carrera said:
"Apparently the Bu$hCo tactics are OK for everyone else but them."

He's the reason I hit a rut in the road the other day - Bush and his cohorts have a lot to answer for. You ask yourself why these ruts in the road are a danger to cyclists and the only answer is it's a conspiracy - planned by no other than Bush. :D
So is it your contention that once again, this FBI raid "didn't really happen", or that it was not engineered by Bu$hCo?
 
Wurm said:
So is it your contention that once again, this FBI raid "didn't really happen", or that it was not engineered by Bu$hCo?
Poor, poor Bu$hCo :rolleyes: :p
I wonder when they are going to declare martial law :confused:
 

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