Ultegra 9sp Vs Durace 9sp

[Rick H]

Hi all can somebody help me, I am looking for a new road bike and am wondering what the difference
is between the Ultegra 9sp & Durace 9sp groupsets. I have seen the price differences & i know the 04
durace is 10sp but what are the other differences & is it worth the money???? Any advice would be
greatly appreciated.

Thanks

 

[Sheldon Brown]

Rick H wrote:

> can somebody help me, I am looking for a new road bike and am wondering what the difference is
> between the Ultegra 9sp & Durace 9sp groupsets. I have seen the price differences & i know the 04
> durace is 10sp but what are the other differences & is it worth the money???? Any advice would be
> greatly appreciated.

Dura-Ace is a teeeensy bit lighter and a lot more expensive.

The Dura-Ace triple crank uses oddball, non-interchangeable chainrings, and should be avoided.

The Dura-Ace bottom bracket is also known to be more troublesome than the Ultegra unit, so the
Ultegra BB is often substituted even in otherwise Dura-Ace bikes.

If you're wealthy enough that the price difference doesn't matter, might as well indulge yourself
with Dura-Ace.

If you object to throwing money away, go with Ultegra, if you're set on Shimano.

Sheldon "Prefers Mix 'n' Match" Brown +----------------------------------------------+
| Every person who has mastered a profession | is a skeptic concerning it. | --George
| Bernard Shaw |
+----------------------------------------------+ Harris Cyclery, West Newton, Massachusetts Phone
617-244-9772 FAX 617-244-1041 http://harriscyclery.com Hard-to-find parts shipped Worldwide
http://captainbike.com http://sheldonbrown.com

 

[A Muzi]

Rick H wrote:
> can somebody help me, I am looking for a new road bike and am wondering what the difference is
> between the Ultegra 9sp & Durace 9sp groupsets. I have seen the price differences & i know the 04
> durace is 10sp but what are the other differences & is it worth the money???? Any advice would be
> greatly appreciated.

Not much difference because they both share an overly complex non-serviceable shifter design. Worth
it? No, they are both overpriced compared to Centaur and Chorus respectively.

That's my opinion. YMMV.

--
Andrew Muzi www.yellowjersey.org Open every day since 1 April, 1971

 

[Bruce Lange]

The 10s Dura Ace hubs have 15mm axles, which I would say is a good thing. You could say that's bad
for interchangeability but I think it wold be a step forward if freehubs moved in that direction.

-Bruce-

>I have seen the price differences & i know the 04 durace is 10sp but what are the other differences
>& is it worth the money???? Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
>
> Thanks

 

[Tom]

One of the best bikes I ever owned had all Dura Ace except the Bottom Bracket and the 'hubs' which
were Ultegra; best coasting bike I ever owned.

Tom

-----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =----- http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1
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[Bfd]

"Sheldon Brown" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Rick H wrote:
>
> > can somebody help me, I am looking for a new road bike and am wondering
what
> > the difference is between the Ultegra 9sp & Durace 9sp groupsets. I have seen the price
> > differences & i know the 04 durace is 10sp but what are
the
> > other differences & is it worth the money???? Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
>
> Dura-Ace is a teeeensy bit lighter and a lot more expensive.
>
> The Dura-Ace triple crank uses oddball, non-interchangeable chainrings, and should be avoided.
>
> The Dura-Ace bottom bracket is also known to be more troublesome than the Ultegra unit, so the
> Ultegra BB is often substituted even in otherwise Dura-Ace bikes.
>
> If you're wealthy enough that the price difference doesn't matter, might as well indulge yourself
> with Dura-Ace.
>
> If you object to throwing money away, go with Ultegra, if you're set on Shimano.
>
This is generally true as even low end shimano stuff just works and well! However, I would recommend
getting the DA STI shifters over the ultegra, or any other Shimano STI shifter, for one reason
-Warranty Its my understanding that DA parts have a 3 year warranty; all other shimano groups are
only 2 years. Since STI shifters cannot be rebuild/fixed if it breaks, a 3 year warranty becomes
important.

 

[Baird Webel]

On 12/07/2003 22:41, in article 9qSAb.329898$9E1.1625624@attbi_s52, "Bruce Lange"
<[email protected]> wrote:

> The 10s Dura Ace hubs have 15mm axles, which I would say is a good thing. You could say that's bad
> for interchangeability but I think it wold be a step forward if freehubs moved in that direction.
>
> -Bruce-

Why? What is the gain from doing so?

Baird

 

[David L. Johnso]

On Mon, 08 Dec 2003 01:56:13 +0000, bfd wrote:

> This is generally true as even low end shimano stuff just works and well! However, I would
> recommend getting the DA STI shifters over the ultegra, or any other Shimano STI shifter, for one
> reason -Warranty Its my understanding that DA parts have a 3 year warranty; all other shimano
> groups are only 2 years. Since STI shifters cannot be rebuild/fixed if it breaks, a 3 year
> warranty becomes important.

Unless you ride a lot of miles per year, this probably is not worth that much. Though "Mike
Yankee"'s experience of 20+k miles exceeds what most people get out of a set of STI levers, most can
expect maybe 15, which, depending on who you are and how many bikes you have, is quite likely to be
past 3 years. It's like car battery warrantees. You know the darn thing will last 1 month past the
warrantee and then die when you need it. How much more do you have to pay for a marginal increase in
warrantee protection?

If you really want to protect yourself against this particular problem, buy components that can
be repaired.

--

David L. Johnson

__o | "Business!" cried the Ghost. "Mankind was my business. The _`\(,_ | common welfare was my
business; charity, mercy, forbearance, (_)/ (_) | and benevolence, were, all, my business. The
dealings of my trade were but a drop of water in the comprehensive ocean of my business!"
--Dickens, "A Christmas Carol"

 

[Bfd]

"MikeYankee" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> >Since STI shifters cannot be rebuild/fixed...
>
> The Ultegra STI shifters on one of my bikes are still going strong after
22,000
> miles in 7 years, knock wood. I keep 'em clean and avoid riding that
bike in
> messy conditions. Occasional light lube. A few crashes haven't hurt 'em, except cosmetically.
>
> Shimano's non-repairable philosophy pisses me off, though. I kept
thinking of
> that while overhauling the Campy Ergo levers on one of my other bikes last fall. Yet I think the
> resentment is based on emotional factors rather
than
> practicality. I simply cannot fault the Ultegra stuff for working and
holding
> up VERY well.
>
>
Agree, ultegra and the other *lower* shimano groups all work fine. However, if you do have a problem
with your STI lever, they're toast. That's why I recommend a person consider getting DA STI levers
and everything ultegra (or *lower*) if they want to save money....

 

[Qui si parla Ca]

rickh-<< can somebody help me, I am looking for a new road bike and am wondering what the difference
is between the Ultegra 9sp & Durace 9sp groupsets. >><BR><BR>

Be advised that DA 9s parts are a gonna get scarce. You can use most of the 10s stuff with DA 9s,
like ders and such but the left lever, for instance, is gone as is the BB.

For the $, I would get ultegra or look at Centaur or Chorus , a better idea all around, IMHO-

Peter Chisholm Vecchio's Bicicletteria 1833 Pearl St. Boulder, CO, 80302
(303)440-3535 http://www.vecchios.com "Ruote convenzionali costruite eccezionalmente bene"

 

[Qui si parla Ca]

Bruce-<< The 10s Dura Ace hubs have 15mm axles, which I would say is a good thing. >><BR><BR>

Except ya can't put a 9s shimano cogset onto them.

Peter Chisholm Vecchio's Bicicletteria 1833 Pearl St. Boulder, CO, 80302
(303)440-3535 http://www.vecchios.com "Ruote convenzionali costruite eccezionalmente bene"

 

[Richard Chan]

"David L. Johnson" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:<[email protected]>...
>
> Unless you ride a lot of miles per year, this probably is not worth that much. Though "Mike
> Yankee"'s experience of 20+k miles exceeds what most people get out of a set of STI levers, most
> can expect maybe 15, which, depending on who you are and how many bikes you have, is quite likely
> to be past 3 years. It's like car battery warrantees. You know the darn thing will last 1 month
> past the warrantee and then die when you need it. How much more do you have to pay for a marginal
> increase in warrantee protection?
>
> If you really want to protect yourself against this particular problem, buy components that can be
> repaired.

This is a serious case of Fuzzy Math/Fuzzy Logic and facts. When you add the consumable costs of
parts/time every 6 months/year, Campy ERGO Cost of Ownership is higher than STI. Campy ERGO can be
rebuilt because they HAD to. Shimano encourages you ride hard and break their parts because their
warranty (often no questions asked) is real. It is like "my Fiat runs great but I have to rebuild
the engine every 6000 miles. Hey trust me, it is really easy". Buy the Toyota.

At the current price point, DA9 is the BEST bargain. The price is almost obscene for proven, pro
level equipment. You will never look back and wonder. I also think DA9 is the best looking Shimano
group. Lastly, Shimano parts are widely available and costs less.

 

[Robert Strickla]

> >
> > If you really want to protect yourself against this particular problem, buy components that can
> > be repaired.
>
> This is a serious case of Fuzzy Math/Fuzzy Logic and facts. When you add the consumable costs of
> parts/time every 6 months/year, Campy ERGO Cost of Ownership is higher than STI. Campy ERGO can be
> rebuilt because they HAD to. Shimano encourages you ride hard and break their parts because their
> warranty (often no questions asked) is real. It is like "my Fiat runs great but I have to rebuild
> the engine every 6000 miles. Hey trust me, it is really easy". Buy the Toyota.

Except, of course, that you don't have to rebuild/repair Campy ERGO every 6 months or even every
year so your further claim is erroneous. When I (maybe) have to rebuild my Campy ERGO shifters after
two years of use, whereas many Shimano owners have to fork out for new shifters after two years of
use (or buy DA for a whopping extra year of warranty) who's using fuzzy logic?

> At the current price point, DA9 is the BEST bargain. The price is almost obscene for proven, pro
> level equipment. You will never look back and wonder. I also think DA9 is the best looking Shimano
> group. Lastly, Shimano parts are widely available and costs less.

What necessary improvement does DA9 give me that Ultegra 9 or Chorus 9 (or for that matter Centaur
9) doesn't? As I see it, Centaur 9 has all of the functionality and beauty of DA9 for much less. Not
to mention better front shifting. Or exposed cables. That sounds like a bargain.

Rob Strickland

 

[David]

> This is a serious case of Fuzzy Math/Fuzzy Logic and facts. When you add the consumable costs of
> parts/time every 6 months/year, Campy ERGO Cost of Ownership is higher than STI. Campy ERGO can be
> rebuilt because they HAD to. Shimano encourages you ride hard and break their parts because their
> warranty (often no questions asked) is real. It is like "my Fiat runs great but I have to rebuild
> the engine every 6000 miles. Hey trust me, it is really easy". Buy the Toyota.
>
> At the current price point, DA9 is the BEST bargain. The price is almost obscene for proven, pro
> level equipment. You will never look back and wonder. I also think DA9 is the best looking Shimano
> group. Lastly, Shimano parts are widely available and costs less.

If you have a lot of money to burn, DA 9 is definitely nice. But I beg to question why you should
get DA 9 groupset if you are not racing professionally. Most people are happy with Tiagra, 105 and
Ultegra. The weight to price difference between Ultegra and Dura-Ace is really not worthed in my
opinion. The realibility issue on STI shifters are pretty much overblown. You should usually get
good life out them within 15 to 16000 miles. Some people who do yearly maintenance of the shifters
can have them working pass 20k. So unless you are a hardcore commuter who regularly clocks in 20,000
miles a year, you are not going to kill any STI shifters anytime soon. I think people try to
anticipate future problems before they even happened like trying to buy the best and obscenely
expensive parts on the assumption that they will never break. Guess what, most of the mechanical
problems come from people who own bikes with expensive components. The problems don't show up right
away. It usually takes awhile for them to creep up and the weeks, months and years of neglect cause
them to fail. When asked why they didn't check these parts for wear on a yearly basis, they said,
because my bike shop told me that I shouldn't do anything to them -- they are built to last!

Yeah right.. If parts are built to last forever, ever wonder why Chris King and American Classic are
still in business today?

 

[Bfd]

Baird Webel <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<BBF96154.3691B%[email protected]>...
> On 12/07/2003 22:41, in article 9qSAb.329898$9E1.1625624@attbi_s52, "Bruce Lange"
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> > The 10s Dura Ace hubs have 15mm axles, which I would say is a good thing. You could say that's
> > bad for interchangeability but I think it wold be a step forward if freehubs moved in that
> > direction.
> >
> > -Bruce-
>
>
> Why? What is the gain from doing so?
>
The *advantage* of the DA 10 hubs, model 7800, is the oversized axles are lighter and increases
rigidity; very similar to Campy Record/Chorus/Centaur hubs. In fact, pics of the new DA 10 rear hub
looks very much like a Chorus hub:

DA 10 rear hub (scroll down to rear hub):
http://www.dura-ace.com/publish/content/duraace/en/home/the_product0/wheels.html

Campy Chorus rear hub: http://www.campagnolo.com/pics/03_CHmozpost.jpg

Haven't seen the new DA 10 rear hub yet, but if its as quite as the DA 9 (model 7700) version, it
looks like they have a winner.

Then again, the DA 10 rear hub has a going price of approximately $164 makes it more expensive than
Campy Record hub, which can be found in the $125-140 range....

 

[Paul Kopit]

On 8 Dec 2003 08:16:41 -0800, [email protected] (Richard Chan) wrote:

>
>This is a serious case of Fuzzy Math/Fuzzy Logic and facts. When you add the consumable costs of
>parts/time every 6 months/year, Campy ERGO Cost of Ownership is higher than STI. Campy ERGO can be
>rebuilt because they HAD to.

"Rebuilding" is putting in 2 springs and you need do it 8-10,000 miles depending on your usage. The
springs cost ~$10.

I don't mean to imply or want to start another thread on which system is better only to get the
facts accurate.

 

[Mike S.]

<snip>
> > If you object to throwing money away, go with Ultegra, if you're set on Shimano.
> >
> This is generally true as even low end shimano stuff just works and well! However, I would
> recommend getting the DA STI shifters over the ultegra,
or
> any other Shimano STI shifter, for one reason -Warranty Its my
understanding
> that DA parts have a 3 year warranty; all other shimano groups are only 2 years. Since STI
> shifters cannot be rebuild/fixed if it breaks, a 3 year warranty becomes important.
>
The warranty wouldn't be the reason I'd recommend the D/A STI shifters over the Ultegra.
Its the feel.

D/A has a much more solid feeling shift. I like it better, but YMMV as always.

As for the rest... Save your money or buy slightly used. I've managed to piece together several D/A
bikes for less than Ultegra would've cost new.

Mike

 

[Richard Chan]

Paul Kopit <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:<[email protected]>...
> On 8 Dec 2003 08:16:41 -0800, [email protected] (Richard Chan) wrote:
>
> >
> >This is a serious case of Fuzzy Math/Fuzzy Logic and facts. When you add the consumable costs of
> >parts/time every 6 months/year, Campy ERGO Cost of Ownership is higher than STI. Campy ERGO can
> >be rebuilt because they HAD to.
>
> "Rebuilding" is putting in 2 springs and you need do it 8-10,000 miles depending on your usage.
> The springs cost ~$10.
>
> I don't mean to imply or want to start another thread on which system is better only to get the
> facts accurate.

You are assuming the enduser doing the repairs? I am suggesting the scenerio of having a shop to do
it: labor/parts/shipping both ways. Are we missing a broken post now and then?

 

[Mike S.]

<snip> I also think DA9 is the best looking Shimano group.

Current group maybe. The first generation of XTR is probably my favorite Shimano group
appearance-wise. Sante was pretty cool if you like paint.

> Lastly, Shimano parts are widely available and costs less.

That's been the reason I haven't been running Campy for the last several years. Now with Gore's
invention: the internet, I can overnight things to my heart's content! Excel can afford to stock all
the Campy stuff, whereas your LBS may not.

Mike

 

[Paul Kopit]

On 8 Dec 2003 21:10:36 -0800, [email protected] (Richard Chan) wrote:

>You are assuming the enduser doing the repairs? I am suggesting the scenerio of having a shop to do
>it: labor/parts/shipping both ways. Are we missing a broken post now and then?

Yes, I'm assuming that you do the repairs yourself. All it takes is a 3 and 5 mm hex wrench and a
wide blade screw driver. Having a mechanic do the job would cost $25 more. I have not done that many
but, if you hand me the lever, it takes <15 minutes. The newer posts don't go frequently and, when
they do, add $10.