Ultegra crankset ceramic bearings

[scottdurand]

I would like to know if anyone hear has changed out their bearings in an Ultegra crankset to a ceramic bearing set. I am interested in upgrading mine and wondering if anyone here has made the switch and which brand/model bearings you used. Also where did you find the best pricing?

 

[Tech72]

Which vintage of Ultegra crankset/BB do you have?

If you have the new 10sp Ultegra setup with the external BB and want to go ceramic, you don't need to buy the over-priced FSA ceramic bearing exo BB or any of the expensive aftermarket ceramic bearing retrofitted Shimano exo BB's.

There's a cheaper way to get as good or better quality ceramic bearings for your exo BB. If you are mechanically inclined and have access to the equipment/tools - press, bearing puller, etc. or make friends with someone who works in a machine shop. Source the bearing through a local specialized industrial supply place or even eBay. The cartridge bearing used in all FSA MegaExo and Shimano external BB's is bearing size 6805 (dimension is 25mm ID x 37mm OD x 7mm W).

I bought a set of ABEC-5 rated ceramic bearings for my Dura-Ace 7800 BB and installed it myself at a friend's machine shop. There IS a difference compared to the original bearings. The new ceramic bearings are noticeably smoother and spin much longer when I had the chain off. That can only translate to good things on the road.....Although I bought ABEC-5 rated bearings, there are higher rated ones (more precision = less friction) if you want to spend more. Also, if you have extra cash weighing you down, I believe Enduro and Phil Wood sells a fancy home bearing puller/press tool that's specifically designed for swapping out external BB and hub bearings (approx. $100 US for the tool).

By the way, as with all cartridge bearings (including ceramic ones), there are differences in bearing grades/materials/construction/retainers/seals/etc. so be careful when selecting the bearing. I just gave you the bearing size, you have to decide what your bearing budget or needs are to select the right bearing for your application.

Cheers.

 

[scottdurand]

Sorry I didn't mention it in the first post. I have an Ultegra setup from 2001 9 speed.
Cheers,
Scott

Which vintage of Ultegra crankset/BB do you have?

If you have the new 10sp Ultegra setup with the external BB and want to go ceramic, you don't need to buy the over-priced FSA ceramic bearing exo BB or any of the expensive aftermarket ceramic bearing retrofitted Shimano exo BB's.

There's a cheaper way to get as good or better quality ceramic bearings for your exo BB. If you are mechanically inclined and have access to the equipment/tools - press, bearing puller, etc. or make friends with someone who works in a machine shop. Source the bearing through a local specialized industrial supply place or even eBay. The cartridge bearing used in all FSA MegaExo and Shimano external BB's is bearing size 6805 (dimension is 25mm ID x 37mm OD x 7mm W).

I bought a set of ABEC-5 rated ceramic bearings for my Dura-Ace 7800 BB and installed it myself at a friend's machine shop. There IS a difference compared to the original bearings. The new ceramic bearings are noticeably smoother and spin much longer when I had the chain off. That can only translate to good things on the road.....Although I bought ABEC-5 rated bearings, there are higher rated ones (more precision = less friction) if you want to spend more. Also, if you have extra cash weighing you down, I believe Enduro and Phil Wood sells a fancy home bearing puller/press tool that's specifically designed for swapping out external BB and hub bearings (approx. $100 US).

By the way, as with all cartridge bearings (including ceramic ones), there are differences in bearing grades/materials/construction/retainers/seals/etc. so be careful when selecting the bearing. I just gave you the bearing size, you have to decide what your bearing budget or needs are to select the right bearing for your application.

Cheers.

 

[Tech72]

Your 2001 9sp Ultegra Octalink BB uses loose ball bearings held in a retainer. I don't think you can get ceramic bearings (or if it's really worth it to) for this particular BB. The ceramic bearings for this BB (if you can even find them) will cost much more than what the entire set-up is worth. If the bearings in your current Ultegra BB are bad, I would recommend buying a new Ultegra BB-6500 bottom bracket to replace instead of looking for ceramic bearings. Current market price for a brand new Shimano Ultegra BB-6500 is about $35-40 US.

 

[scottdurand]

Thanks for the great info. I may just go ahead and make the switch to the 700 model compact Shimano crankset that does not come with a BB. The shimano matching BB for the 700 compact isn't cermaic. Would it be worthwhile to get a cermaic setup instead of the Shimano?

 

[alienator]

Thanks for the great info. I may just go ahead and make the switch to the 700 model compact Shimano crankset that does not come with a BB. The shimano matching BB for the 700 compact isn't cermaic. Would it be worthwhile to get a cermaic setup instead of the Shimano?

Not as worth while as you might think. Cheap ceramic bearings--of which most being advertised are (including the vaunted FSA ceramics in their BB)--aren't an improvement over top quality stainless steel bearings. The affordable ceramics are hybrids and more often than not one of the lower grades.

Full ceramic, ABEC 5 bearings are very nice, but they are also ungodly expensive....like around $125+ per sealed bearing unit, depending on size.

 

[Tech72]

Not as worth while as you might think. Cheap ceramic bearings--of which most being advertised are (including the vaunted FSA ceramics in their BB)--aren't an improvement over top quality stainless steel bearings. The affordable ceramics are hybrids and more often than not one of the lower grades.

Full ceramic, ABEC 5 bearings are very nice, but they are also ungodly expensive....like around $125+ per sealed bearing unit, depending on size.

I agree, unless you really have lots of cash weighing you down, ceramic bearings are expensive and not significantly better than a top quality stainless steel bearing (unless used for specific application in industry). For the weekend warrior, it's just bling. I bought my 6805 ABEC-5 ceramics through work and saved some change in the process - I wouldn't have gotten them otherwise. Better to spend on a top quality SS bearing than a low rent hybrid ceramic bearing.

 

[Phill P]

I'd be interested to hear what size and number balls are used in older bottom brackets. As many on this site would know I sell grade 5 ceramic balls in a number of sizes for campy and shimano hubs, and now have the 3/32" size for shimano pedals.

I have been looking at a way to get sealed bearings for shimano/FSA/truvative external bottom brackets, but sell them for less than the un godly prices quoted above. It all comes down to performance to price and what you're willing to pay for what you get. Currently high price, not much demand. I'm trying to lower the price for the ABEC 5 sealed bearings so more people can afford them. However buying a minimum of 500 from my supplier it making it hard for me to afford to get any stock in!!!

When looking at bearings go by the ABEC rating. A full steel bearing at ABEC 7 will perform as well as a ceramic hybrid at ABEC 7, but it will cost less, but the hybrid will likely last longer (how many out there worn out a bottom bracket lately?)
ABEC 5 and ABEC 3 is harder to achieve and maintain in use for steel balls, but ceramics can be refined to this point and can maintain it longer. I tihnk zipp use ABEC3 in thier wheels and double the price for the privledge. But then I've seen other places quoting ABEC7. Watch what you are getting as you may be throwing money at something that doesn't gain you ANY speed.

As a side note you can get a factory ceramic kit for record class hubs. I wonder how long til either DA or record come standard with ceramic bearings (DA is due for a face lift next year maybe.....)

 

[hjulcompaniet]

Phil Wood make a neat tool for extracting and and installing bearings from the HTII BB Cups.

 

[dhk2]

I'd be interested to hear what size and number balls are used in older bottom brackets. As many on this site would know I sell grade 5 ceramic balls in a number of sizes for campy and shimano hubs, and now have the 3/32" size for shimano pedals.

I have been looking at a way to get sealed bearings for shimano/FSA/truvative external bottom brackets, but sell them for less than the un godly prices quoted above. It all comes down to performance to price and what you're willing to pay for what you get. Currently high price, not much demand. I'm trying to lower the price for the ABEC 5 sealed bearings so more people can afford them. However buying a minimum of 500 from my supplier it making it hard for me to afford to get any stock in!!!

When looking at bearings go by the ABEC rating. A full steel bearing at ABEC 7 will perform as well as a ceramic hybrid at ABEC 7, but it will cost less, but the hybrid will likely last longer (how many out there worn out a bottom bracket lately?)
ABEC 5 and ABEC 3 is harder to achieve and maintain in use for steel balls, but ceramics can be refined to this point and can maintain it longer. I tihnk zipp use ABEC3 in thier wheels and double the price for the privledge. But then I've seen other places quoting ABEC7. Watch what you are getting as you may be throwing money at something that doesn't gain you ANY speed.

As a side note you can get a factory ceramic kit for record class hubs. I wonder how long til either DA or record come standard with ceramic bearings (DA is due for a face lift next year maybe.....)

I may be showing my ignorance here, but I'm really skeptical that a difference in ABEC class or a switch from steel to ceramic BB bearings would have any practical value in terms of bearing life. Aren't the speeds and loads low enough to make these differences unimportant? Seems to me good seals to keep out water and grit are the key thing to long bearing life.

Also, can hi-precision ceramic bearings really save energy? Are we talking anything significant, ie, more than 0.1 watts? Doesn't most drag in BBs come from preload and seals anyway?

 

[ScienceIsCool]

I may be showing my ignorance here, but I'm really skeptical that a difference in ABEC class or a switch from steel to ceramic BB bearings would have any practical value in terms of bearing life. Aren't the speeds and loads low enough to make these differences unimportant? Seems to me good seals to keep out water and grit are the key thing to long bearing life.

Also, can hi-precision ceramic bearings really save energy? Are we talking anything significant, ie, more than 0.1 watts? Doesn't most drag in BBs come from preload and seals anyway?

Agreed. My understanding is the same as yours and I've concluded that the differences between steel and ceramic bearings are negligible. The loads, speeds and temperatures are just not high enough. And other sources of friction (seals, grease, misalignment, preload, etc) obscure the differences even further.

John Swanson
www.bikephysics.com

 

[alienator]

Agreed. My understanding is the same as yours and I've concluded that the differences between steel and ceramic bearings are negligible. The loads, speeds and temperatures are just not high enough. And other sources of friction (seals, grease, misalignment, preload, etc) obscure the differences even further.

John Swanson
www.bikephysics.com

Now that just can't be, because FSA claims otherwise in its ads.....

I will admit, though, that if I do come into a sizeable excess of money and if the new LEW wheels end up being all that they claim.....well, I'd buy a set, and I'd spend the extra $1000 to get the full ceramic bearings. Why not? Iffin' a guy's gonna spring for $5500 wheels, another $1000 is a veritable drop in the bucket. Besides, like the man said, iffin' you gonna get the hot wheels, you just gotta spring for the velvet seats, too.