Underwater filming, Cheap!



M

MJuric

Guest
Anyone know of a cheap way to do underwater filming?

The idea I've come up with are.

1) Periscope, two mirror in PVC pipe going to camcorder. Drawbacks, Limited field of view,
possibly bulky.

I'd like to put some sort of "Web cam" in a tube, however I can't seem to find any "web cam" type of
lenses that will hook directly to a camcorder. Most only hook to a PC or similar. Of course I gues I
could go out and buy a laptop....

Anyone else have some sort of cheap setup?

~Matt
 
MJuric left this mess on Thu, 18 Dec 2003 19:00:22 GMT for The Way to clean up:
>
>Anyone know of a cheap way to do underwater filming?
>
>The idea I've come up with are.
>
>1) Periscope, two mirror in PVC pipe going to camcorder. Drawbacks, Limited field of view, possibly
> bulky.
>
>I'd like to put some sort of "Web cam" in a tube, however I can't seem to find any "web cam" type
>of lenses that will hook directly to a camcorder. Most only hook to a PC or similar. Of course I
>gues I could go out and buy a laptop....
>
> Anyone else have some sort of cheap setup?
>

Matt, there really aren't many. You might try a Baggie around a camcorder with easy to use controls,
but that's about the best you're going to do and it is risky.

Tao te Carl "It takes a village to have an idiot." - Carl (c) 2003

(Kudos to Cap'n Jim Wyatt for this link) BEFORE you ask a dumb-ass question
here...http://www.speakeasy.org/~neilco/bart.gif
 
<MJuric> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
> Anyone know of a cheap way to do underwater filming?
>
> The idea I've come up with are.
>
> 1) Periscope, two mirror in PVC pipe going to camcorder. Drawbacks, Limited field of view,
> possibly bulky.
>
> I'd like to put some sort of "Web cam" in a tube, however I can't seem to find any "web cam" type
> of lenses that will hook directly to a camcorder. Most only hook to a PC or similar. Of course I
> gues I could go out and buy a laptop....

Many of the new DVI camcorders have a firewire port. You might check to see if the firewire port can
be used for input as well as output. If so, then you would just need to find a webcam with a
firewire connector (although most webcams leave a lot to be desired in the resolution department).
Plus, those DVI camcorders are still a little spendy...

If you go the plastic bag route, consider using two bags for extra protection. Maybe even put the
camcorder in one of those Seal-N-Save or FoodSaver bags....

Or build a HUGE periscope out of some large-diameter PVC pipe (stove pipe might be cheaper) and big
mirrors....

They also sell a camera setup called AquaVue designed for anglers to look at underwater structure
while fishing. That setup may be cheaper than many dive cameras for the same quality.
 
Can't say that this is "cheap" but is much cheaper than some, but by viewing
their site it might give you some ideas.
http://www.federationpeak.com.au/layout/1-4-12.htm

KF

~~~~~~~~~^o~~~~~~~~~~

<MJuric> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
> Anyone know of a cheap way to do underwater filming?
>
> The idea I've come up with are.
>
> 1) Periscope, two mirror in PVC pipe going to camcorder. Drawbacks, Limited field of view,
> possibly bulky.
>
> I'd like to put some sort of "Web cam" in a tube, however I can't seem to find any "web cam" type
> of lenses that will hook directly to a camcorder. Most only hook to a PC or similar. Of course I
> gues I could go out and buy a laptop....
>
> Anyone else have some sort of cheap setup?
>
> ~Matt
 
On 18 Dec 2003 12:48:08 -0800, de Valois <[email protected]>
wrote:

>MJuric left this mess on Thu, 18 Dec 2003 19:00:22 GMT for The Way to clean up:
>>
>>Anyone know of a cheap way to do underwater filming?
>>
>>The idea I've come up with are.
>>
>>1) Periscope, two mirror in PVC pipe going to camcorder. Drawbacks, Limited field of view,
>> possibly bulky.
>>
>>I'd like to put some sort of "Web cam" in a tube, however I can't seem to find any "web cam" type
>>of lenses that will hook directly to a camcorder. Most only hook to a PC or similar. Of course I
>>gues I could go out and buy a laptop....
>>
>> Anyone else have some sort of cheap setup?
>>
>
>Matt, there really aren't many. You might try a Baggie around a camcorder with easy to use
>controls, but that's about the best you're going to do and it is risky.

I had someone reccommend this approach. The draw backs are large.
1) risk to camera
2) The filmer must get in the water adn more than likely cant move as fast as the swimmer so
probably bad shots.

Of course I guess you could rig up a camcorder on a pole, cover it and stick it in
the water.

~Matt

>
>Tao te Carl "It takes a village to have an idiot." - Carl (c) 2003
>
>(Kudos to Cap'n Jim Wyatt for this link) BEFORE you ask a dumb-ass question
>here...http://www.speakeasy.org/~neilco/bart.gif
 
Have you called the local dive shops to ask if they have film equipment for rent?

martin

MJuric wrote:

> On 18 Dec 2003 12:48:08 -0800, de Valois <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> >MJuric left this mess on Thu, 18 Dec 2003 19:00:22 GMT for The Way to clean up:
> >>
> >>Anyone know of a cheap way to do underwater filming?
> >>
> >>The idea I've come up with are.
> >>
> >>1) Periscope, two mirror in PVC pipe going to camcorder. Drawbacks, Limited field of view,
> >> possibly bulky.
> >>
> >>I'd like to put some sort of "Web cam" in a tube, however I can't seem to find any "web cam"
> >>type of lenses that will hook directly to a camcorder. Most only hook to a PC or similar. Of
> >>course I gues I could go out and buy a laptop....
> >>
> >> Anyone else have some sort of cheap setup?
> >>
> >
> >Matt, there really aren't many. You might try a Baggie around a camcorder with easy to use
> >controls, but that's about the best you're going to do and it is risky.
>
> I had someone reccommend this approach. The draw backs are large.
> 1) risk to camera
> 2) The filmer must get in the water adn more than likely cant move as fast as the swimmer
> so probably bad shots.
>
> Of course I guess you could rig up a camcorder on a pole, cover it and stick it in the
> water.
>
> ~Matt
>
>
> >
> >Tao te Carl "It takes a village to have an idiot." - Carl (c) 2003
> >
> >(Kudos to Cap'n Jim Wyatt for this link) BEFORE you ask a dumb-ass question
> >here...http://www.speakeasy.org/~neilco/bart.gif
 
A camcorder is far too expensive to risk on a ziploc bag or even two. Check out the EWA Marine Bag.
You can get them for most camcorders for around $200. At TI workshops we use the Coach Cam from
ucca.biz. It's the best we've found and quit reasonably priced at under $500 too. Terry
 
how cheap? You're in for 200-300 bucks no matter what, even if you already have a camcorder.

I just organized getting the underwater cam for our coach.

<MJuric> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
> Anyone know of a cheap way to do underwater filming?
>
> The idea I've come up with are.
>
> 1) Periscope, two mirror in PVC pipe going to camcorder. Drawbacks, Limited field of view,
> possibly bulky.
>
> I'd like to put some sort of "Web cam" in a tube, however I can't seem to find any "web cam" type
> of lenses that will hook directly to a camcorder. Most only hook to a PC or similar. Of course I
> gues I could go out and buy a laptop....
>
> Anyone else have some sort of cheap setup?
>
> ~Matt
 
our club just spent about $1800 on a system for underwater filming...

the cart with a periscope a digital video camera Dartswim big ol' tv tivo

all that combined with the underwater windows makes for a nifty set up.

i bet we use it once a month. waste of money as far as i'm concerned.

"DaKitty" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:tStEb.29815$m83.4202@fed1read01...
> how cheap? You're in for 200-300 bucks no matter what, even if you already have a camcorder.
>
> I just organized getting the underwater cam for our coach.
>
> <MJuric> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
> > Anyone know of a cheap way to do underwater filming?
> >
> > The idea I've come up with are.
> >
> > 1) Periscope, two mirror in PVC pipe going to camcorder. Drawbacks, Limited field of view,
> > possibly bulky.
> >
> > I'd like to put some sort of "Web cam" in a tube, however I can't seem to find any "web cam"
> > type of lenses that will hook directly to a camcorder. Most only hook to a PC or similar. Of
> > course I gues I could go out and buy a laptop....
> >
> > Anyone else have some sort of cheap setup?
> >
> > ~Matt
> >
 
I just got our coach an underwater camera and a small (easy to carry around) digital camcorder that
will read the mini underwater camera feed, and download video to the computer (firewire). Camcorder
was $499, the underwater camera was $230 (color, very small 1"x2" original waterproof casing, with a
60 foot waterproof cable). Better quality camera than what I've seen on "coaches cam" and similar
products. It's an underwater surveylance camera. We're yet to mount it on a pole... haven't had the
time yet. Camera comes with a mounting kit.

Our coach took the camcorder to the regional meet this weekend (3 days), and filmed just about
everyone's swim. Till the batteries ran out each day. We had 19 swimmers swimming 140 events total
and 25 relays. I think he filmed them all :) So far he's having a ball wioth it, and showing us all
how we swam. He also wants dartswim, but we weren't able to raise enough money to buy it. The
masters team members pulled together and raised money to get him that stuff as a christmas gift. We
jsut presented it to him at our christmas party. He waas speachless. It was very cute. I don't think
the overall team (not just masters) is willing to invest in it. Now, he has one of his own, so he
can do things more independently.

He already has a portable TV that he brings to the clinics, and used to borrow my camcorder to film
us all at the clinics. He's definately making use of the stuff, and we are all benefiting. For a
number of us on the team it makes a difference to see yourself swim.

"diablo" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
>
> our club just spent about $1800 on a system for underwater filming...
>
> the cart with a periscope a digital video camera Dartswim big ol' tv tivo
>
> all that combined with the underwater windows makes for a nifty set up.
>
> i bet we use it once a month. waste of money as far as i'm concerned.
>
>
> "DaKitty" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:tStEb.29815$m83.4202@fed1read01...
> > how cheap? You're in for 200-300 bucks no matter what, even if you already have a camcorder.
> >
> > I just organized getting the underwater cam for our coach.
> >
> > <MJuric> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
> > > Anyone know of a cheap way to do underwater filming?
> > >
> > > The idea I've come up with are.
> > >
> > > 1) Periscope, two mirror in PVC pipe going to camcorder. Drawbacks, Limited field of view,
> > > possibly bulky.
> > >
> > > I'd like to put some sort of "Web cam" in a tube, however I can't seem to find any "web cam"
> > > type of lenses that will hook directly to a camcorder. Most only hook to a PC or similar. Of
> > > course I gues I could go out and buy a laptop....
> > >
> > > Anyone else have some sort of cheap setup?
> > >
> > > ~Matt
> > >
> >
> >
>
 
In article <[email protected]>, <MJuric> wrote:
>Anyone know of a cheap way to do underwater filming?
>
>The idea I've come up with are.

With what intent? Most of the Canon and Olympus digital cameras have a short video mode - mine
will do 3 minutes at a shot. This is not DV resolution however, but it does ok. UW camera housings
run 150-200.

Otherwise, the Ewa bags seem the best route for a camcorder. Depends on what you need, and what
hardware you have to start with. I already had both of my components.

--
Jason O'Rourke www.jor.com
 
Check out the "Snooper"-Marty Hull's package at <www.zoomers.net>:$850 compact system with the bugs
seemingly worked out: miniature camera in a housing on a pole. I think USA Masters' Swimming has
some sort of loaner program for these??
 
MJuric left this mess on Thu, 18 Dec 2003 23:14:28 GMT for The Way to clean up:
>
>On 18 Dec 2003 12:48:08 -0800, de Valois <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>MJuric left this mess on Thu, 18 Dec 2003 19:00:22 GMT for The Way to clean up:
>>>
>>>Anyone know of a cheap way to do underwater filming?
>>>
>>>The idea I've come up with are.
>>>
>>>1) Periscope, two mirror in PVC pipe going to camcorder. Drawbacks, Limited field of view,
>>> possibly bulky.
>>>
>>>I'd like to put some sort of "Web cam" in a tube, however I can't seem to find any "web cam" type
>>>of lenses that will hook directly to a camcorder. Most only hook to a PC or similar. Of course I
>>>gues I could go out and buy a laptop....
>>>
>>> Anyone else have some sort of cheap setup?
>>>
>>
>>Matt, there really aren't many. You might try a Baggie around a camcorder with easy to use
>>controls, but that's about the best you're going to do and it is risky.
>
> I had someone reccommend this approach. The draw backs are large.
> 1) risk to camera
> 2) The filmer must get in the water adn more than likely cant move as fast as the swimmer so
> probably bad shots.
>
> Of course I guess you could rig up a camcorder on a pole, cover it and stick it in the
> water.
>

Hey, you said "cheap" not good :)

Tao te Carl "It takes a village to have an idiot." - Carl (c) 2003

(Kudos to Cap'n Jim Wyatt for this link) BEFORE you ask a dumb-ass question
here...http://www.speakeasy.org/~neilco/bart.gif
 
"DaKitty" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:lpvEb.29832$m83.7417@fed1read01...

Better quality camera than what
> I've seen on "coaches cam" and similar products. It's an underwater surveylance camera.

i wish our club had thougt it through a little better before selecting the camera/cart that they
did. we did consider the coaches cam, however, if i was going to get any use out of it, i needed a
stable moveable platform from which i could use continuous footage and enough stability to be able
to use markers for biomex analysis. from the price you quoted, we could have found a cheap trolley
and mounted a cheaper camera on it.

> He's definately making use of the stuff, and we are all benefiting. For a number of us on the team
> it makes a difference to see yourself swim.

i'm sure its useful, but there are better ways to spend $2000 as far as i was concerned. sounds like
you have a comparable system for less than 50% of the price. however we used money from USA
Swimming, so what they claimed is what they have to spend.

as a side however, i'd encourage your coach to download the evaluation version of Dart Trainer once
he has some footage. they give you a 30 day trial, and access to some of their stock footage. some
of the features are superb (multi clip, side-by-side analysis, as well as on clip instant angle
measurement, syncing etc). probably the best biomechanical analysis software i've seen. paired with
our power analysis equipment, it'll be interesting.

steve
 
Where did you get the underwater camera? What's the resolution?

"DaKitty" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<lpvEb.29832$m83.7417@fed1read01>...
> I just got our coach an underwater camera and a small (easy to carry around) digital camcorder
> that will read the mini underwater camera feed, and download video to the computer (firewire).
> Camcorder was $499, the underwater camera was $230 (color, very small 1"x2" original waterproof
> casing, with a 60 foot waterproof cable). Better quality camera than what I've seen on "coaches
> cam" and similar products. It's an underwater surveylance camera. We're yet to mount it on a
> pole... haven't had the time yet. Camera comes with a mounting kit.
>
> Our coach took the camcorder to the regional meet this weekend (3 days), and filmed just about
> everyone's swim. Till the batteries ran out each day. We had 19 swimmers swimming 140 events total
> and 25 relays. I think he filmed them all :) So far he's having a ball wioth it, and showing us
> all how we swam. He also wants dartswim, but we weren't able to raise enough money to buy it. The
> masters team members pulled together and raised money to get him that stuff as a christmas gift.
> We jsut presented it to him at our christmas party. He waas speachless. It was very cute. I don't
> think the overall team (not just masters) is willing to invest in it. Now, he has one of his own,
> so he can do things more independently.
>
> He already has a portable TV that he brings to the clinics, and used to borrow my camcorder to
> film us all at the clinics. He's definately making use of the stuff, and we are all benefiting.
> For a number of us on the team it makes a difference to see yourself swim.
>
>
> "diablo" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
> >
> > our club just spent about $1800 on a system for underwater filming...
> >
> > the cart with a periscope a digital video camera Dartswim big ol' tv tivo
> >
> > all that combined with the underwater windows makes for a nifty set up.
> >
> > i bet we use it once a month. waste of money as far as i'm concerned.
> >
> >
> > "DaKitty" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:tStEb.29815$m83.4202@fed1read01...
> > > how cheap? You're in for 200-300 bucks no matter what, even if you already have a camcorder.
> > >
> > > I just organized getting the underwater cam for our coach.
> > >
> > > <MJuric> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
> > > > Anyone know of a cheap way to do underwater filming?
> > > >
> > > > The idea I've come up with are.
> > > >
> > > > 1) Periscope, two mirror in PVC pipe going to camcorder. Drawbacks, Limited field of view,
> > > > possibly bulky.
> > > >
> > > > I'd like to put some sort of "Web cam" in a tube, however I can't seem to find any "web cam"
> > > > type of lenses that will hook directly to a camcorder. Most only hook to a PC or similar. Of
> > > > course I gues I could go out and buy a laptop....
> > > >
> > > > Anyone else have some sort of cheap setup?
> > > >
> > > > ~Matt
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
 
"diablo" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> "DaKitty" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:lpvEb.29832$m83.7417@fed1read01...
>
> Better quality camera than what
> > I've seen on "coaches cam" and similar products. It's an underwater surveylance camera.
>
> i wish our club had thougt it through a little better before selecting the camera/cart that they
> did. we did consider the coaches cam, however, if i was going to get any use out of it, i needed a
> stable moveable platform
from
> which i could use continuous footage and enough stability to be able to
use
> markers for biomex analysis. from the price you quoted, we could have
found
> a cheap trolley and mounted a cheaper camera on it.
>
> > He's definately making use of the stuff, and we are all benefiting. For
a
> > number of us on the team it makes a difference to see yourself swim.
>
> i'm sure its useful, but there are better ways to spend $2000 as far as i was concerned. sounds
> like you have a comparable system for less than 50%
of
> the price. however we used money from USA Swimming, so what they claimed
is
> what they have to spend.
>
> as a side however, i'd encourage your coach to download the evaluation version of Dart Trainer
> once he has some footage. they give you a 30 day trial, and access to some of their stock footage.
> some of the features are superb (multi clip, side-by-side analysis, as well as on clip instant
angle
> measurement, syncing etc). probably the best biomechanical analysis
software
> i've seen. paired with our power analysis equipment, it'll be interesting.

Yea, my coach keeps talking about the Dart Swim. I'm ikind of assisting him with a lot of the
computer and AV stuff. It's crossed my mind to download the demo version. We'll probably do it very
soon. There's a whole laundry list of things to do before we have time for that one. I did look over
their website and got a little bit familiar with what they offer. Looks very interesting, and
promissing.

Have you used Dart Swim (or dart trainer, whichever one you guys have) much yet?

There are couple of books and some other literature that I picked up on biometrics and similar
stuff, I also need a bit more time toi digest all the materials before I can help him out more. It;s
interesting stuff, and keeps my engineering side of the brain interestred. Makes me wanna get in
grad school too ;)
 
"DaKitty" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:8G5Fb.35723$m83.31198@fed1read01...

i've been playing with it this week. they have available a lot of stock footage. you can run four
video clips on the same project. using two at the same time is really nice. there are two functions
i find incredibly useful. the first is the ability to flip the video image, so you can compare right
and left side in the same bodily oreintation. if this is paired with a power out put read out, you
can use the length and joint angle functions to highlight small changes you might want to make.

we have two real objectives with the video set up. the first is to do personal evaluations (pretty
much for the top end swimmers, as well as private clinics). also, we mounted a bigg as tv on the
pool wall, hooked up the camera system to a Tivo. then, when coaching larger groups for correction,
you just have it run on a delayed loop. swimmers A is filmed...as swimmer B is completing their
filming, swimmer A's footage is being played on the tv...while swimmer C is being filmed, swimmer B
is watching himself. it works as a pretty slick system.

however, back to dart swim...i've used two or three biomechanical software packages, and find this
one extremely user friendly. you can practice playing with it right now i guess..just go download
the evaluation software, get a couple of MPEGS from a swimming site and play with it. you'll be
pretty impressed i think.

steve

> Yea, my coach keeps talking about the Dart Swim. I'm ikind of assisting him with a lot of the
> computer and AV stuff. It's crossed my mind to download the demo version. We'll probably do it
> very soon. There's a whole laundry list of things to
do
> before we have time for that one. I did look over their website and got a little bit familiar with
> what they offer. Looks very interesting, and promissing.
>
> Have you used Dart Swim (or dart trainer, whichever one you guys have)
much
> yet?
>
> There are couple of books and some other literature that I picked up on biometrics and similar
> stuff, I also need a bit more time toi digest all
the
> materials before I can help him out more. It;s interesting stuff, and
keeps
> my engineering side of the brain interestred. Makes me wanna get in grad school too ;)
 
Cool! Thanks for the feedback. Sounds promissing. Next time coach and I are playing with this stuff,
I think we'll definately do it.

"diablo" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
>
> "DaKitty" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:8G5Fb.35723$m83.31198@fed1read01...
>
> i've been playing with it this week. they have available a lot of stock footage. you can run four
> video clips on the same project. using two at
the
> same time is really nice. there are two functions i find incredibly
useful.
> the first is the ability to flip the video image, so you can compare right and left side in the
> same bodily oreintation. if this is paired with a
power
> out put read out, you can use the length and joint angle functions to highlight small changes you
> might want to make.
>
> we have two real objectives with the video set up. the first is to do personal evaluations (pretty
> much for the top end swimmers, as well as private clinics). also, we mounted a bigg as tv on the
> pool wall, hooked
up
> the camera system to a Tivo. then, when coaching larger groups for correction, you just have it
> run on a delayed loop. swimmers A is filmed...as swimmer B is completing their filming, swimmer
> A's footage is being played on the tv...while swimmer C is being filmed, swimmer B is watching
> himself. it works as a pretty slick system.
>
> however, back to dart swim...i've used two or three biomechanical software packages, and find this
> one extremely user friendly. you can practice playing with it right now i guess..just go download
> the evaluation
software,
> get a couple of MPEGS from a swimming site and play with it. you'll be pretty impressed i think.
>
> steve
>
> > Yea, my coach keeps talking about the Dart Swim. I'm ikind of assisting him with a lot of the
> > computer and AV stuff. It's crossed my mind to download the demo version. We'll probably do it
> > very soon. There's a whole laundry list of things
to
> do
> > before we have time for that one. I did look over their website and got a little bit familiar
> > with what
they
> > offer. Looks very interesting, and promissing.
> >
> > Have you used Dart Swim (or dart trainer, whichever one you guys have)
> much
> > yet?
> >
> > There are couple of books and some other literature that I picked up on biometrics and similar
> > stuff, I also need a bit more time toi digest all
> the
> > materials before I can help him out more. It;s interesting stuff, and
> keeps
> > my engineering side of the brain interestred. Makes me wanna get in grad school too ;)
> >
> >
>
 
"DaKitty" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:lpvEb.29832$m83.7417@fed1read01...
> I just got our coach an underwater camera and a small (easy to carry
around)
> digital camcorder that will read the mini underwater camera feed, and download video to the
> computer (firewire). Camcorder was $499, the underwater camera was $230 (color, very small 1"x2"
> original waterproof casing, with a 60 foot waterproof cable). Better quality camera than what I've
> seen on "coaches cam" and similar products. It's an underwater surveylance camera. We're yet to
> mount it on a pole... haven't had the time yet. Camera comes with a mounting kit.

I build the Pipecam for just this purpose. Colour webcam in a pipe, holder on top for your
camcorder. 4 AA batteries to power the webcam.

Works great and is cheap.

Complete, ready to use, you supply the camcorder and the AA batteries (NiMh's last about 10 hours).

Your camcorder must have a tripod socket, an LCD display, an analog video in; and I need some
dimensions.

$300 plus shipping.

email me as evans<underscore>the<underscore>swim<at>tesco<dot>net
 
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