On Mar 24, 11:10 pm, Andre Jute <
[email protected]> wrote:
> What's described here looks like a protection racket (techincally,
> legally, "unfair trading practices", "restraint of trade", "attempted
> monopoly practice" and suchlike depending on where you are), and in
> Canada would very likely be illegal and in the States it would depend
> on in which State it happens whether you can get the law enforced.
> However, you have another much more effective tool than the law to
> hand: publicity, naming and shaming transgressors.
>
> First of all, let's look at this:
It is an attempted monopoly practice and I was responding specifically
to the fact that someone here is NOT buying Shimano because of
Shimano's attempts to restrict gray market. My LBS is doing their
best to restrict ALL gray market anythings, with a special focus on
counterfeit goods, goods that fell off the back of a factory, and
Shimano products whose serial numbers indicate that they should be OEM
rather than aftermarket. The third part of it is almost certainly
because the local shop is a shop-in-shop partner (do you guys have
shop-in-shop in NorAm and Europe?)
> > My local bike shop // cycling association will no longer allow people
> > to participate in races or group events if they are using equipment
> > that was purchased through unauthorized channels.
>
> If it's the local bike shop running races for their customers, they
> are entirely within their rights to say "this is a privarte club,
> members only -- and if you don't want to follow the rules, bugger
> off".
>
> If it is the local cycling association, which is open to the public,
> but taken over by the cycle shop interests, or unduly influenced by
> them ("It is in the interest of all cyclists to ensure a strong LBSs,"
> or similar circumlocutions will be a dead giveaway), the remedy is to
> make a public ruction in front of invited media, who you will have
> briefed up front. You can also get review by the courts of the actions
The local cycling association is technically a separate body from the
bike shop but the headquarters are on the third floor of the bike shop
and the secretary general is the owner of the bike shop. It's
certainly possible to be involved with the local cycling association
and NOT be an employee of the bike shop and it's even possible to be
involved with the local cycling association and not be a cyclist but
it doesn't happen much.
A number of the provincial level coms weren't riders until after they
got involved in the rules and regs side of it and some of them still
aren't. Almost none of the organizers of the Tour have anything at
all to do with cycling except for making a really classy professional
event.
I would never make a fuss about anything the LBS did. Even if the
bike shop owner's attempts to set me up with the bike shop manager
have (at least so far) failed, I'm practically family.
> of such public bodies but generally the best bet is tp get the local
> trading standards officers, whatever they may be called in your
> region, to act against the shop for colluding with the public body of
> the cycling association to restrain trade. If you present this as a
> form of corruption, the battle is won.
You assume that I want to.
> > > <[email protected]> wrote in message
>
> > > The second problem is how to get the Alfine hub. Here in Canuckland, buying
> > > through an official Shimano distribution channel (the dreaded LBS and our
> > > even more dreaded wholesale cartel) is simply not an option. Hideously
> > > expensive - not even worth asking for a price quote. And Shimano has been
> > > very naughty in squealching grey-market and mail-order sales, a key reason
> > > why I have not bought Shimano for 5 years.
>
> ... to be read with this from Marian:
>
> > This means that the guy who was wearing counterfeit Discovery kit was
> > told he had to wear other clothing to race on Saturday (a t-shirt
> > instead), and the guy whose 105 drivetrain was bought in Hong Kong had
> > to borrow someone else's bike because the regional Shimano rep
> > didn't recognize it as being either the correct drivetrain for that
> > frame or correct aftermarket serial numbers.
>
> I doubt it is Shimano, the Japanese firm, or their North American
> headquarters breaking anti-monopolies law and trade restraint law.
Definitely not their North American headquarters having anything to do
with that.
> They are far too fly to commit dangerous and expensive (fines can run
> into tens of millions) stupidities like that. But they may close their
> eyes to what a regional distributor who is otherwise independent does.
> So the first thing is to write Shimano a letter explaining the
> situation and to get a reply denying that they support such abuses.
But I want Shimano to continue liking me. I'm still trying to
convince them that they should hire me (without either making me move
to Shanghai or learn Japanese).
Writing letters would be very counterproductive.
> If it is the local Shimano importer and LBS operating a protection
> racket through undue influence in a local cycling association, as I
The LBS definitely has undue influence on the local Shimano rep. Back
before he was responsible for two provinces and one special economic
zone he used to be their head mechanic. If he's in town and they are
over-busy he still does wrenching for them.
> suspect, publicity and the local fair trading enforcement officers
> (who are not cops -- they don't need warrants; they're like the
> customs and excuse, a law onto themselves) will shut down their racket
> in very short order. It would help to catch the "local Shimano rep" on
> camera and tape telling people that they cannot ride if they didn't
> buy their components from him and his LBS accessories in his crimes.
You don't need to buy your components from him. You need to buy
authorized components. There is a difference.
One of my friends has Hong Kong purchased XTR which has the correct
aftermarket serial numbers. The shop will fix that bike for him and
the cycling association will allow him to use it in races even though
he didn't get the parts from them.
This guy's Hong Kong purchased 105 had serial numbers which indicated
it was gray market (don't ask me how, they just did) so the shop won't
fix his bike and the cycling association won't let him use it in
races.
If I bought my Chris King in China I'd be getting it from someone who
paid sales tax when they got it from a distributor that paid import
tax and it would cost almost twice as much. I'm currently waiting for
the dollar/renminbi exchange rate to hit 7 to 1 because while Y4050 is
practically the same as Y4150, Y3999 is vastly cheaper than Y4001. If
I weren't me I'd have to pay a nominal installation fee and wheel
lacing fee on goods purchased elsewhere but because I am me they'll
probably waive the charge and I'll take the mechanic out to dinner
instead.
> And you needn't be too delicate about explaining his precise
> relationship to Shimano: if he or the LBS who benefits from his
> shenannigans call him "the Shimano rep", that's a handle: call him
> that to the media and wait for Shimano indignantly to denounce him and
> his practices: more good publicity.
I prefer the handle "arrrgghh nononononono don't tickle me" since
that's usually what I say whenever he sneaks up behind me. I've also
been known to call him "hey stupid" but that's generally reserved for
his boss.
> > The unofficial policy remains that you can't use anything bought from
> > the rival bike shop but this is part of the official policy since
> > everything at the rival bike shop is grey market.
>
> Once more, if it is private club belonging to this LBS, you haven't
> got a foot to stand on. Start your own rival independent club.
The enemy camp tried to do that and in terms of independent cycling
clubs in China they're doing a pretty good job. It's just that the
public cycling association here is kind of sort of the most serious
amateur cycling association in the country so competing with them is a
pointless venture destined for failure.
> However, if this is a public cycling association unduly influenced by
> this one LBS, aided and abetted by "the Shimano rep", you have all the
> tools to hand already to put a stop to an abuse in a very short order.
> If you handle this right, Shimano will have no option but to help you
> put these guys down; just don't expect them to thank you for it (LOL).
The one LBS, their network of partner shops in five other cities,
their branch shop in another city, their repair shop out by where we
have training rides, and their two mini shops inside of malls.
The LBS has temporarily put a stop to opening new bike shops but only
because they ran out of trained employees to run them.
> I should say that I have no problem with local bike shops; I know
> which are incompeent, which crooks, which greedy, which merely
> unpleasant; I just give those a miss and import whatever I want from
> the Continent; I give such business as they want and can handle to the
> nice LBS and don't mind paying their prices to keep them in business
> in case I ever need them.
I'd give the mall shops a miss since I'm not doing folders or city
bikes and I'd also avoid the guys in Wenchang, Qionghai, Changjiang,
and Danzhou cities but I'd say somewhere around 75% of my stuff comes
from the main shop and all of my repair work is done by them. If I
import something from overseas it's usually because it is otherwise
unavailable in this country. As for the rest of my stuff, people are
just in the habit of giving me things for free ...
> I see absolutely no reason
> you shouldn't apply the same principles against your local LBS/Shimano
> distributor/cycling association cartel -- except that you don't
> threaten destructive publicity as I did in the case of the crooked
> computer merchant, you start with outraged publicity at this abuse of
> the public trust.
Well, I suppose it's
a) because I don't think ruining people is an especially productive
use of my time
b) think that their efforts are reasonable when it comes to running a
high quality business in China
Then, of course, I'm also friendly with them and owe it to them for my
ever deepening involvement in the Chinese professional sporting
world. If it weren't for the LBS/Shimano distributor/cycling
association in question I might be doing some kind of boring desk job
in Shanghai or New York instead of helping organize an international
triathalon right now.
-M
