value to 1975 mercier?



On 16 Jun 2006 00:02:31 -0700, "41" <[email protected]> wrote:


> As to the production bicycles, as I said before, the PX10 was
>not the best of them- that would arguably have been the Motobecane or
>Gitane. But Thevenet won the Tour in 1975 (and again in 1977) on a
>Peugeot (not a PX10), and when that happened even the cycling mags
>admitted that the bicycle was as fine as anything available anywhere.


But Thevenet's bike _looked_ like a PX10, so it was notoriety by
association.

<snip>
> but I would have rather had a Motobecane Grand Record, which
>had a more useful design, with nice long chainstays.


You still can, they come up on Ebay at very reasonable prices because
the unwashed masses don't realize what the early 70's models are.

> I'd have rather
>had a Raleigh International than a Professional,


Both fetch more serious prices than the PX10 these days but probably
both better bikes.

>but I'd probably still rather have
>the Grand Record than the International.


A fellow non-conformist! My congratulations.

>Then there was also Gitane,
>ridden by Anquetil, Van Impe, and others,


Bad head badge and decals though - always looked cheap.

>as well as other famous makes
>like Mercier, ridden by Poulidor, or Helyett, ridden by Anquetil for
>many years, and still others.


Few examples of the better ones around these days. There were a lot of
nice Merciers - not sure where they all went.

>I think you are forgetting that the Simplex Prestige was not the best
>derailleur from Simplex, that Simplex was not the only French
>derailleur maker,


I think the Super LJ was the best of the French. There was the Huret
Jubilee but it's a rather sloppy shifter. Between the Super LJ and the
Campy NR I'd have to lean to the LJ but it's a close call.

>and the same for Normandy with the hubs. I never
>examined the expensive Normandy hubs, so I can't confirm or refute your
>claim, but I do know that more expensive hubs were available from
>Pelissier and Maxicar, and these command quite a premium today.


The Normandy Luxe is a serious hub. Precision cones, comparable to
Campy. There was also the Maillard 700 line, another fine hub.
 
- Bob - wrote:
> On 16 Jun 2006 00:02:31 -0700, "41" <[email protected]> wrote:
>>As to the production bicycles, as I said before, the PX10 was
>>not the best of them- that would arguably have been the Motobecane or
>>Gitane. But Thevenet won the Tour in 1975 (and again in 1977) on a
>>Peugeot (not a PX10), and when that happened even the cycling mags
>>admitted that the bicycle was as fine as anything available anywhere.

>
> But Thevenet's bike _looked_ like a PX10, so it was notoriety by
> association.


While we're talking Peugeots, does anybody know if the letters in their
model names (PX10, PY-something, UO8, etc.) stood for anything?

Mark
 
Donald Gillies wrote:
> "john" <[email protected]> writes:
>
> >Around 1970 a PX10 was $195 @ the good bike shop in Menlo Park, Ca.
> >Calif. may have raised the price little. I would consider that a mid
> >range bike. Perhaps a little above mid, but not top line Campy.

>
> PX-10 was the best that money could buy from france. It was by no
> means a mid-range bicycle. And, it was lighter than a full campy bike
> by 2 lbs - no lie.
>
>


Where did that 2lb difference come from?
 
[email protected] wrote:
> Donald Gillies wrote:
> > "john" <[email protected]> writes:
> >
> > >Around 1970 a PX10 was $195 @ the good bike shop in Menlo Park, Ca.
> > >Calif. may have raised the price little. I would consider that a mid
> > > range bike. Perhaps a little above mid, but not top line Campy.

> >
> > PX-10 was the best that money could buy from france. It was by no
> > means a mid-range bicycle. And, it was lighter than a full campy bike
> > by 2 lbs - no lie.
> >
> >

>
> Where did that 2lb difference come from?


I see only three possible sources:

(1) French tube diameters, frame and handlebar and stem, are slightly
smaller than standard British/Italian. How much that accounts for, I
don't know, but I don't believe anywhere near 2 lbs.

(2) They used lighter gauge tubing, or lighter tires and rims. I
believe the rims were basically the same but the tires might have been
a little lighter.

(3) They measured on a smaller size frame.
#
 
- Bob - wrote:

> The Normandy Luxe is a serious hub. Precision cones, comparable to
> Campy. There was also the Maillard 700 line, another fine hub.


But did they have replaceable forged races, like the Campagnolo and
Dura-Ace? I've only seen the outsides.

I have a later (sealed bearing) Maillard 700 front hub, yet to be
laced. Very smooth and seemingly very well sealed, quite spectacular
looking, with its brilliant mirror-finish polishing.
u
 
On 16 Jun 2006 23:53:42 -0700, "41" <[email protected]> wrote:

>
>- Bob - wrote:
>
>> The Normandy Luxe is a serious hub. Precision cones, comparable to
>> Campy. There was also the Maillard 700 line, another fine hub.

>
>But did they have replaceable forged races, like the Campagnolo and
>Dura-Ace? I've only seen the outsides.


No.... although properly lubed, they didn't seem to wear.

>I have a later (sealed bearing) Maillard 700 front hub, yet to be
>laced. Very smooth and seemingly very well sealed, quite spectacular
>looking, with its brilliant mirror-finish polishing.
>u
 
41 wrote:
> [email protected] wrote:
> > Donald Gillies wrote:
> > > "john" <[email protected]> writes:
> > >
> > > >Around 1970 a PX10 was $195 @ the good bike shop in Menlo Park, Ca.
> > > >Calif. may have raised the price little. I would consider that a mid
> > > > range bike. Perhaps a little above mid, but not top line Campy.
> > >
> > > PX-10 was the best that money could buy from france. It was by no
> > > means a mid-range bicycle. And, it was lighter than a full campy bike
> > > by 2 lbs - no lie.
> > >
> > >

> >
> > Where did that 2lb difference come from?

>
> I see only three possible sources:
>
> (1) French tube diameters, frame and handlebar and stem, are slightly
> smaller than standard British/Italian. How much that accounts for, I
> don't know, but I don't believe anywhere near 2 lbs.
>


More like 1/4 lb, apples to apples.Maybe less.....


> (2) They used lighter gauge tubing, or lighter tires and rims. I
> believe the rims were basically the same but the tires might have been
> a little lighter.
>


Another 1/4lb??


> (3) They measured on a smaller size frame.
> #


That plus a little "creativity"! ;-)