Vinokourov- Dr Ferrari response



DiabloScott

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May 15, 2003
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plectrum said:
The strange thing is that their is a clear scientific and statistical reason to perform the B test at the same lab under the same conditions with the same technique. Dr Ferrari knows this as he is scientifically trained, his response was strange.

That's true for reproducibility of results - but the reasons for testing at different labs have to do with fraud and sabotage of samples. There are pinch points in the current sample collection and handling procedures that provide greater risk for tampering. Who knows how much of this goes on but separate labs, separate courriers, and separate chains of custody would reduce the opportunity for such things to occur.
 

Doctor.House

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Jun 14, 2007
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Conspiracy? Drug test sabotage?

It has to be French corruption at the LNDD lab otherwsie:

Lance Phamrstrong was a drug cheat.
Roid Landis a fraud
Tyler was a liar
Cow blood and insulin were USPO drug gear in 2001
USPO Benoit Joachim was not framed in 2000
Michele Ferrari was truthful
Frankie Andreu was not an isolated case
Mike Anderson was not confused
Emma O'Reilly was not jealous

Those awful labs, so jealous.


DiabloScott said:
That's true for reproducibility of results - but the reasons for testing at different labs have to do with fraud and sabotage of samples. There are pinch points in the current sample collection and handling procedures that provide greater risk for tampering. Who knows how much of this goes on but separate labs, separate courriers, and separate chains of custody would reduce the opportunity for such things to occur.
 

plectrum

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Jul 26, 2007
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my fiancee made an amusing soundbyte for Dr Ferrari's site

his catchphrase for 53x12 is 'Train like a pro'

to which my fiancee added .... 'Train like a pro, shoot EPO'

I think it rocks!
 

ilpirata

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Aug 19, 2004
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I don't believe in the years prior to Armstrong, that in the USA there was complete coverage of the entire race, available to cable customers. Satellite began to grow during the Armstrong years. So I am sure viewership has increased, but I am not sure you can draw a conclusion that it is thanks to Lance.

plectrum said:
The strange thing is that their is a clear scientific and statistical reason to perform the B test at the same lab under the same conditions with the same technique. Dr Ferrari knows this as he is scientifically trained, his response was strange.


I do agree tho with the McQuaid / Lance part as the French hated it. Virenque was the golden boy in France and still is loved regardless on doping. France were hypocritical to the extreme over Lance Armstrong.

Lance Armstrong must have thought many times why? .... he dedicated himself only to 'their' race, he brought in millions of fans worldwide into TdF rather than just cycling in general, he cycled better both stronger and tactically than any other TdF rider .... and they hated him!

Does anyone have any overall viewing figures from 1990 - 2005, I bet you their is a surge during the Armstrong years!
 

Gregers

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whiteboytrash said:
Shiesse ! Didn't know that..... I think thats the end of the world as we know it.....
Unbelievably, or maybe not, brother Hein is actually head honcho for......ethics.
Yup, that must be the end of the space/time continuum as we know it. Heeeelp!
 

limerickman

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Jan 5, 2004
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Gregers said:
Unbelievably, or maybe not, brother Hein is actually head honcho for......ethics.
Yup, that must be the end of the space/time continuum as we know it. Heeeelp!

Good God.

The lunatics have actually taken over the asylum.
Verbruggen and ethics!
Give me a break.
 

Wayne666

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Jun 4, 2007
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DiabloScott said:
That's true for reproducibility of results - but the reasons for testing at different labs have to do with fraud and sabotage of samples.
Has there even been a single time that we know this has happened or even a serious reason to suspect it happened?
 

DiabloScott

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May 15, 2003
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Wayne666 said:
Has there even been a single time that we know this has happened or even a serious reason to suspect it happened?

Don't really know - if it were to happen and be exposed internally, the test would be negative and we likely would never hear about it. But if there were enough money at stake (or some other motivation) it could surely happen.

The point is, busted riders will use sabotage and contamination as a defense and if separate labs were used for A and B then it would be a much harder case to make because it would be much harder to accomplish.
 

Doctor.House

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Jun 14, 2007
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DiabloScott said:
Don't really know - if it were to happen and be exposed internally, the test would be negative and we likely would never hear about it. But if there were enough money at stake (or some other motivation) it could surely happen.

The point is, busted riders will use sabotage and contamination as a defense and if separate labs were used for A and B then it would be a much harder case to make because it would be much harder to accomplish.
Mass Media friends can fix any test result--either way.

No need to abuse the lab workers.
 

ilpirata

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Aug 19, 2004
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This is a very good point.

As far as the reproducibility of results, this type of testing should be part of a certification for that lab, that ought to be checked at random by outside agencies. As is done for instance with ISO quality certifications. A high level of quality should be required. All this of course in a perfect world.

DiabloScott said:
That's true for reproducibility of results - but the reasons for testing at different labs have to do with fraud and sabotage of samples. There are pinch points in the current sample collection and handling procedures that provide greater risk for tampering. Who knows how much of this goes on but separate labs, separate courriers, and separate chains of custody would reduce the opportunity for such things to occur.
 

nns1400

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Jul 27, 2006
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Gregers said:
Unbelievably, or maybe not, brother Hein is actually head honcho for......ethics.
Yup, that must be the end of the space/time continuum as we know it. Heeeelp!
Well, the U.N. put Libya in charge of.....human rights. So I don't see the international community really doing a much more serious jub with sports.
 

nns1400

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DiabloScott said:
That's true for reproducibility of results - but the reasons for testing at different labs have to do with fraud and sabotage of samples. There are pinch points in the current sample collection and handling procedures that provide greater risk for tampering. Who knows how much of this goes on but separate labs, separate courriers, and separate chains of custody would reduce the opportunity for such things to occur.
It would, however, increase the opportunity for conspiracy theories....;)
 

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