War On Liberal America

[Carrera]

This is a bit like trying to prove a bigger wrong makes a lesser wrong O.K. In Thailand you face up to 30 years for smuggling dope and Thai jails use chains, beat prisoners e.t.c. One American in Signapore faced a public flogging for joyriding. Doesn't mean to say that worse examples abroad justify the abandonment of civilized standards in Europe or the U.S.
All countries that don't respect human rights should be pressured. Look at Russia. Russia is a long way from being perfect but Russia now has better human rights than China and has gone some way to accepting European standards. Yet Russia used to lock dissenters up in mental institutions if they expressed the view you might be able to own private property or vote for multiple parties. Under Stalin, thousands of Estonians, Latvians and Lithuanians were deported to Siberian gulags.
If Bush has a genuine interest in freedom, democracy and human rights, he should be setting his own house in order and pressuring other countries to follow by example, in my view.

Who is Rocky "Balbao"? Is he Chachi's brother?

I attached a few pics for you...Now tell me do you prefer the "blue dress" or the Pick shorts?

 

[Carrera]

I don't think blame is either here nor there. The common interest we all have is to prevent criminal behaviour.
You have 2 possibilities to tackle crime:
(1) Put people in chains and have them break rocks in a quarry.
(2) Try and reform the individual, encourage sports activities, find them a job and get them to understand why criminal behavious is unacceptable and how it hurts the victims of crime.
I think you have an idea I'm defending mass murders and serial killers but I'm really talking about a different type of crime than that. Less serious crimes are usually linked to family breakdown or other social factors.
Crime in the part of Spain I lived was incredibly low - safe fro women to walk the streets at night. The reason: family ties were very strong, family discipline was evident and parents wanted to know where their kids were and genuinely cared for their welfare. But in the bigger cities, family ties were weaker and crime higher.

So blame everyone else but the criminal?

 

[zapper]

This is a bit like trying to prove a bigger wrong makes a lesser wrong O.K. In Thailand you face up to 30 years for smuggling dope and Thai jails use chains, beat prisoners e.t.c. One American in Signapore faced a public flogging for joyriding. Doesn't mean to say that worse examples abroad justify the abandonment of civilized standards in Europe or the U.S.
All countries that don't respect human rights should be pressured. Look at Russia. Russia is a long way from being perfect but Russia now has better human rights than China and has gone some way to accepting European standards. Yet Russia used to lock dissenters up in mental institutions if they expressed the view you might be able to own private property or vote for multiple parties. Under Stalin, thousands of Estonians, Latvians and Lithuanians were deported to Siberian gulags.
If Bush has a genuine interest in freedom, democracy and human rights, he should be setting his own house in order and pressuring other countries to follow by example, in my view.

Here's a "net tip" for you...When quoting a post and responding at least respond to the quote...I mean what was the purpose? I'm still curious about the pick short..is it going to be a new fad? Oh, it also helps to know the facts when laying blame...

I see the script from you guys...Hurricane devastates Florida "Bush did it" Tsunami kills a hundred thousand people..."bush did it"

However, under President Bill Clinton, the number of prisoners under federal jurisdiction doubled, more than the previous 12-years of Republican rule, combined. As of December 31, 1999, a year prior to the completion of his term in office, the Clinton Administration already was ahead of the Reagan and Bush Administrations with a federal incarceration rate of rate of 42 per 100,000. This was more than double the federal incarceration rate at the end of President Reagan's term (17 per 100,000), and 61% higher than at the end of President George Bush's term (25 per 100,000).

See the trend??? I doubt if it has anything to do with the President, do you?

 

[Colorado Ryder]

I don't think blame is either here nor there. The common interest we all have is to prevent criminal behaviour.
You have 2 possibilities to tackle crime:
(1) Put people in chains and have them break rocks in a quarry.
(2) Try and reform the individual, encourage sports activities, find them a job and get them to understand why criminal behavious is unacceptable and how it hurts the victims of crime.
I think you have an idea I'm defending mass murders and serial killers but I'm really talking about a different type of crime than that. Less serious crimes are usually linked to family breakdown or other social factors.
Crime in the part of Spain I lived was incredibly low - safe fro women to walk the streets at night. The reason: family ties were very strong, family discipline was evident and parents wanted to know where their kids were and genuinely cared for their welfare. But in the bigger cities, family ties were weaker and crime higher.

Try telling the family whose house was burglarized that the criminal had a bad childhood or was poor. I don't think they really care. Once a person reaches the age of majority they have no excuse. They know right from wrong, regardless of their upbringing or economic situation.

 

[lokstah]

This is a petty and pathetic brush off and I am a bit surprised, Lokstah, that a debator such as yourself would have made such a dismissive comment and done so as if I was a 12 year old boy aggrevating you to go outside and play basketball.

I didn't mean to be a jerk about it, so if I came across as one, I apologize. That said, I felt really strongly that the issue at hand was a terrible tangent for the discussion to proceed along. Next time I feel that way I'll say so more tactfully.

 

[zapper]

I didn't mean to be a jerk about it, so if I came across as one, I apologize. That said, I felt really strongly that the issue at hand was a terrible tangent for the discussion to proceed along. Next time I feel that way I'll say so more tactfully.

Although I agree with you LOK, the fact remains that is utter personal and political suicide to discuss such matters without being branded a racist but if one were to discuss the same matters in relation to lets' say the hebrews the Irish, the American Indian etc..then that does't make anyone blush... Sad...very sad...

 

[lokstah]

...the fact remains that is utter personal and political suicide to discuss such matters without being branded a racist but if one were to discuss the same matters in relation to lets' say the hebrews the Irish, the American Indian etc..then that does't make anyone blush... Sad...very sad...

Yes, sad indeed, and a deep subject with many facets. Some night, when we have a whole night to spare, we can all agree to arrive here drunk and chew the fat on African American race relations in the 20th century until sunrise.

 

[davidmc]

Here's a "net tip" for you...When quoting a post and responding at least respond to the quote...I mean what was the purpose? I'm still curious about the pick short..is it going to be a new fad? Oh, it also helps to know the facts when laying blame...

I see the script from you guys...Hurricane devastates Florida "Bush did it" Tsunami kills a hundred thousand people..."bush did it"

However, under President Bill Clinton, the number of prisoners under federal jurisdiction doubled, more than the previous 12-years of Republican rule, combined. As of December 31, 1999, a year prior to the completion of his term in office, the Clinton Administration already was ahead of the Reagan and Bush Administrations with a federal incarceration rate of rate of 42 per 100,000. This was more than double the federal incarceration rate at the end of President Reagan's term (17 per 100,000), and 61% higher than at the end of President George Bush's term (25 per 100,000).

See the trend??? I doubt if it has anything to do with the President, do you?

Remeber the "cops" legislation, spearheaded by Clinton which put additional cops on the street. More cops=higher incarceration rate. Incidentally, the Republican held congress did not fund that program this year, at the previous level's or at all, can't remember which. It's hard to keep up w/ all of their shenanigan's

 

[davidmc]

I don't think blame is either here nor there. The common interest we all have is to prevent criminal behaviour.
You have 2 possibilities to tackle crime:
(1) Put people in chains and have them break rocks in a quarry.
(2) Try and reform the individual, encourage sports activities, find them a job and get them to understand why criminal behavious is unacceptable and how it hurts the victims of crime.
I think you have an idea I'm defending mass murders and serial killers but I'm really talking about a different type of crime than that. Less serious crimes are usually linked to family breakdown or other social factors.
Crime in the part of Spain I lived was incredibly low - safe fro women to walk the streets at night. The reason: family ties were very strong, family discipline was evident and parents wanted to know where their kids were and genuinely cared for their welfare. But in the bigger cities, family ties were weaker and crime higher.

You missed the primary deterrent. Give all Americans equal access to education/jobs to prevent crime. Don't wait until the person ends up in prison to reform them carerra. With the American CEO's now making over 300x the amt of the avg. salary of a "line employee", as opposed to 42x in 1980, not to mention the CEO's shifting factories "out of country"; one begins to wonder which crime is worse-blue collar or white collar. I submit that white collar is worse, in it's own devious way. Case in point: Kenny-boy", (& his white-collar, criminal, cronies) as Bush referred to him, sent countless 1000's to the poor-house who were close to retirement. Someone please defend Kenneth Lay. I eagerly await response's from the right/conservative side

 

[Colorado Ryder]

You missed the primary deterrent. Give all Americans equal access to education/jobs to prevent crime. Don't wait until the person ends up in prison to reform them carerra. With the American CEO's now making over 300x the amt of the avg. salary of a "line employee", as opposed to 42x in 1980, not to mention the CEO's shifting factories "out of country"; one begins to wonder which crime is worse-blue collar or white collar. I submit that white collar is worse, in it's own devious way. Case in point: Kenny-boy", (& his white-collar, criminal, cronies) as Bush referred to him, sent countless 1000's to the poor-house who were close to retirement. Someone please defend Kenneth Lay. I eagerly await response's from the right/conservative side

And this is political because?

 

[davidmc]

And this is political because?

I resent your & Zapper's (& Bush's, for that matter) "hang em' high" attitude w/o any referrence to the root causation. Shame on you both

 

[jaguar75]

I didn't mean to be a jerk about it, so if I came across as one, I apologize. That said, I felt really strongly that the issue at hand was a terrible tangent for the discussion to proceed along. Next time I feel that way I'll say so more tactfully.

Thank you Lok...And I agree with your latter post about staying up all night with our drinks of preference discussing the impact the issus of race has had on the American Population for the last 100 years.


What are all of these posts about a protest that I am seeing spread throughout the Forum?

 

[lokstah]

What are all of these posts about a protest that I am seeing spread throughout the Forum?

I don't know about you, but I feel out the loop and slightly annoyed.

 

[jaguar75]

I don't know about you, but I feel out the loop and slightly annoyed.

I agree...the spammers are invading...

 

[davidmc]

I agree...the spammers are invading...

Looks to be from England or Australia-"Victoria Square". Steve (the moderator) must know about it because its at the header of the soapbox.
Seems as if a cyclist was hit & the accused motorist set free.

 

[lokstah]

Looks to be from England or Australia-"Victoria Square". Steve (the moderator) must know about it because its at the header of the soapbox.
Seems as if a cyclist was hit & the accused motorist set free.

I figured as much; I just expected a little more background information so that the 95% of forum users who didn't live near Victoria Square wouldn't be quite so perplexed. No worries. Best of luck to the effort.

 

[FredC]

I figured as much; I just expected a little more background information so that the 95% of forum users who didn't live near Victoria Square wouldn't be quite so perplexed. No worries. Best of luck to the effort.

Looks like Oz to me, I sent one into the Website, and asked them to bleach them all out.

 

[Colorado Ryder]

I resent your & Zapper's (& Bush's, for that matter) "hang em' high" attitude w/o any referrence to the root causes. Shame on you both

You obviously resent the concept of personal responsibility.

 

[Colorado Ryder]

I resent your & Zapper's (& Bush's, for that matter) "hang em' high" attitude w/o any referrence to the root causes. Shame on you both

I resent yours and Lokstahs insinuations that conservatives are racist.

 

[lokstah]

I resent yours and Lokstahs insinuations that conservatives are racist.

Care to identify where and how I did so?