Warburton Trail ??

Discussion in 'Australia and New Zealand' started by Louis Naturani, May 4, 2003.

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  1. Hi All, Had a go at the Lilydale to Warburton trail today only to embarrasingly get stuck at the
    college. Due to a lack of signage it was not clear how to continue. Back at home I can now see on
    the online Melways that you are meant to ride through the college sports fields although the red
    dashed lines indicating a cycle path don't continue through the college.??

    Any guidance appreciated, because we are going to have another go at it next weekend.

    Lou Melbourne.
     
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  2. Alan Erskine

    Alan Erskine Guest

    "Louis Naturani" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
    > Hi All, Had a go at the Lilydale to Warburton trail today only to embarrasingly
    get
    > stuck at the college. Due to a lack of signage it was not clear how to continue. Back at home I
    > can now see on the online Melways that you are meant to
    ride
    > through the college sports fields although the red dashed lines indicating
    a
    > cycle path don't continue through the college.??
    >
    > Any guidance appreciated, because we are going to have another go at it
    next
    > weekend.
    >
    > Lou Melbourne.
    >
    >

    Best thing to do is ask a local - even the train station staff might be able to help. You have to
    cross the highway. The school 'owns' the land and they won't allow cyclists through. Bicycle
    Victoria has some interesting information on that particular neck of the woods, by the way.

    --
    Alan Erskine alanerskine(at)optusnet.com.au GWB the Ghengis Khan of the 21st Century
     
  3. "Louis Naturani" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
    > Hi All, Had a go at the Lilydale to Warburton trail today only to embarrasingly
    get
    > stuck at the college. Due to a lack of signage it was not clear how to continue. Back at home I
    > can now see on the online Melways that you are meant to
    ride
    > through the college sports fields although the red dashed lines indicating
    a
    > cycle path don't continue through the college.??

    No, stay away from the college. This was a controversial issue last year when the State government
    signed a lease with this crummy college to give them a twenty year lease on land which was a rail
    easement and intended for development as a rail trail. Mt Lilydale College, a bunch of crummy
    Pope-pleasers, claimed that the rail-trail would attract lots of drug dealers and paedophiles. I
    think the ALP government was pandering to pressure from the Catholic side of their constituency.
    <end political rant>

    Sorry about all that, these decisions just make me mad.

    If you are planning to ride the Warburton Trail you will need to access it from the Maroondah Hwy
    just over the hill crest east of Anderson St. The access is fairly poor (BV is working to get a
    bridge built to give access from the LH side of the eastbound carriageway) but you can do a U-turn
    through a median break to go up the gravel path behind Le Pine funeral parlour. This leads you
    straight onto the trail. You can also get onto the trail at Old Gippsland Rd. Melways map 118 G5 has
    all the details.

    It's a great ride out to Warburton - 38 km one way. Return the same way or organise a lift. If you
    want to do a tour of the Warburton end of the trail and return a different way MBTC (standing for
    Melbourne Bicycle Touring Club) has a tour on Sunday 11th May, commencing from Launching Place.
    About 50 kms almost all on tracks off the busy roads. Give Viv our Touring Secretary a ring to get
    contact details. Interested non-members are always welcome on our rides.

    Enough of the advertorial. Have a great ride wherever you go.

    Cheers Peter See www.mbtc.org.au for details.
     
  4. Louis Naturani wrote:

    > Hi All, Had a go at the Lilydale to Warburton trail today only to embarrasingly get stuck at the
    > college. Due to a lack of signage it was not clear how to continue. Back at home I can now see on
    > the online Melways that you are meant to ride through the college sports fields although the red
    > dashed lines indicating a cycle path don't continue through the college.??
    >
    > Any guidance appreciated, because we are going to have another go at it next weekend.

    The only successful way I've ever found it is to ride straight up the Warbutton highway from the
    station, then turn right onto the trail just after the top of the hill. The school refused to allow
    the trail to be built because in their opinion, bike trails attract druggies and paedophiles --- as
    well as pedal-files :)

    If you really want to find the route, try following the various signs and rutted dirt tracks *back*
    from the highway crossing down towards the school and back to the station. There's a few patches of
    swamp and blackberries, but it can be done.

    If you're driving out there, I'd be wary of leaving a car in the station carpark anyway, there were
    *many* piles of window glass there when I last rode through. I'd be more inclined to drive to one of
    the places where the trail cross the path and has a park. Ignore this if you're arriving by train!

    Oh yeah, it's not a bad trail once you can find it!

    > Lou Melbourne.

    Adrian

    ---------------------------------------------------------------
    Adrian Tritschler mailto:[email protected] Latitude 38°S, Longitude 145°E,
    Altitude 50m, Shoe size 44
    ---------------------------------------------------------------
     
  5. "Adrian Tritschler" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    >
    > The only successful way I've ever found it is to ride straight up the Warbutton highway from the
    > station, then turn right onto the trail just
    after
    > the top of the hill. The school refused to allow the trail to be built because in their opinion,
    > bike trails attract druggies and paedophiles ---
    as
    > well as pedal-files :)
    >
    Maroondah Hwy can be unpleasant when carrying a lot of traffic. My wife and I have crossed at the
    lights by the railway station, then used Hardy St., Cobden Cr and Norris Dr to get to the kink in
    Burton Rd that is right beside the track A glance at a street directory should make this clear. This
    seemed to us a fairly direct and pleasant route.

    John Retchford
     
  6. Chickasmith

    Chickasmith Guest

    > Sorry about all that, these decisions just make me mad.

    > Cheers Peter

    Graduated from the college in 1997 and still live in the area. I am not too sure if you know much
    about Lilydale and the area, but where do some of the unsavoury types hang out in the area? At the
    Lilydale station ... where does the Warbuton trail start? ... same spot

    Considering the school has been there for the best part of a few decades (dont actually know) and in
    one instance, it is asked that you give back some property that cyclists and other 'unsavoury' types
    just to have a 'trail' go through because of 'history', I think the right decision has been made.

    Would you let a 'trail' go through your backyard, where not only cyclists would come through, but
    anyone else? I'd think not ...
     
  7. Alan Erskine

    Alan Erskine Guest

    "chickasmith" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    >
    > > Sorry about all that, these decisions just make me mad.
    >
    > > Cheers Peter
    >
    > Graduated from the college in 1997 and still live in the area. I am not
    too
    > sure if you know much about Lilydale and the area, but where do some of
    the
    > unsavoury types hang out in the area? At the Lilydale station ... where does the Warbuton trail
    > start? ... same spot
    >
    > Considering the school has been there for the best part of a few decades (dont actually know) and
    > in one instance, it is asked that you give back some property that cyclists and other 'unsavoury'
    > types just to have a 'trail' go through because of 'history', I think the right decision has
    been
    > made.

    If that's the case, then it's not the trail causing the problems but the station - GET RID OF THE
    TRAIN STATION I say.
    --
    Alan Erskine alanerskine(at)optusnet.com.au GWB the Ghengis Khan of the 21st Century
     
  8. "chickasmith" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...

    > Considering the school has been there for the best part of a few decades (dont actually know) and
    > in one instance, it is asked that you give back some property that cyclists and other 'unsavoury'
    > types just to have a 'trail' go through because of 'history', I think the right decision has
    been
    > made.

    Don't think I said anything about giving it back. The land never belonged to the school, and still
    doesn't - just leased for 20 years, roll on 2022. As fro the unsavoury types, the farmers out at
    Woori Yallock used that argument, now there's a trail. Haven't heard of any rash of burgs or
    drug-dealing.

    > Would you let a 'trail' go through your backyard, where not only cyclists would come through, but
    > anyone else? I'd think not ...

    If there was a public right-of-way through my backyard I'd just have to wear
    it. Like the residents in Port Phillip who are going to have their rear lanes reclaimed by
    the council.

    Cheers Peter
     
  9. Chickasmith

    Chickasmith Guest

    GET RID OF THE TRAIN STATION I say.
    > --
    > Alan Erskine alanerskine(at)optusnet.com.au GWB the Ghengis Khan of the 21st Century
    >
    Not sure if that comment was tongue in cheek or not, but shutting down a few cyclists such as
    ourselves where the population is small versus public transport users would create a lot more
    trouble that re opening the warbuton trail.
     
  10. "chickasmith" <[email protected]> writes:

    <snip>

    >Considering the school has been there for the best part of a few decades (dont actually know)
    >and in one instance, it is asked that you give back some property that cyclists and other
    >'unsavoury' types just to have a 'trail' go through because of 'history', I think the right
    >decision has been made.

    I strongly disagree with your statements here. For one, the land does NOT belong to the school (it
    is public land), so being asked to 'give it back' is not quite the reality that you are
    (mis)representing.

    Bicycle Victoria has looked extensively at the issues involved. Below, I paraphrase some of
    their concerns.

    Despite the irresponsible claims by school Principal Bernard Dobson (that you are simply parroting
    off here), that the trail would bring "paedophiles and drug dealers" into Mt Lilydale College, an
    article in "The Age" newspaper has revealed that police from Lilydale and Warburton believe that the
    area around the school is safe.

    Evidence from cyclists and other trail users is that the trail is very safe, especially as there are
    many users and no motor vehicles. My personal experience of riding the trail strongly supports this
    view. Regardless, plans for the trail around Lilydale included a proposal for double fencing to
    separate the trail from the school grounds.

    International experience, especially from the US where the Rails to Trails Conservancy keeps
    statistics on more than 1,000 trails, shows they are usually safer than the areas through which
    they pass.

    More than 100 schools around Melbourne enjoy the benefits of having public trail access. Why is Mt
    Lilydale College so different?

    >Would you let a 'trail' go through your backyard, where not only cyclists would come through, but
    >anyone else? I'd think not ...

    Absolutely. I'm a strong advocate of public trails. If I were lucky enough to have a railtrail pass
    through my backyard, I would be grateful for having such easy access to it.

    Andrew
     
  11. Alan Erskine

    Alan Erskine Guest

    "Andrew Lampert" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > "chickasmith" <[email protected]> writes:
    >
    >
    > <snip>
    >
    > >Considering the school has been there for the best part of a few decades (dont actually know) and
    > >in one instance, it is asked that you give back some property that cyclists and other 'unsavoury'
    > >types just to have a 'trail' go through because of 'history', I think the right decision has
    been
    > >made.
    >
    > I strongly disagree with your statements here. For one, the land does NOT belong to the school (it
    > is public land), so being asked to 'give it back'
    is
    > not quite the reality that you are (mis)representing.
    >
    > Bicycle Victoria has looked extensively at the issues involved. Below, I paraphrase some of their
    > concerns.
    >
    > Despite the irresponsible claims by school Principal Bernard Dobson (that
    you
    > are simply parroting off here), that the trail would bring "paedophiles
    and
    > drug dealers" into Mt Lilydale College, an article in "The Age" newspaper has revealed that police
    > from Lilydale and Warburton believe that the area around the school is safe.
    >
    > Evidence from cyclists and other trail users is that the trail is very
    safe,
    > especially as there are many users and no motor vehicles. My personal experience of riding the
    > trail strongly supports this view. Regardless,
    plans
    > for the trail around Lilydale included a proposal for double fencing to separate the trail from
    > the school grounds.
    >
    > International experience, especially from the US where the Rails to Trails Conservancy keeps
    > statistics on more than 1,000 trails, shows they are usually safer than the areas through which
    > they pass.
    >
    > More than 100 schools around Melbourne enjoy the benefits of having public trail access. Why is Mt
    > Lilydale College so different?
    >
    > >Would you let a 'trail' go through your backyard, where not only cyclists would come through, but
    > >anyone else? I'd think not ...
    >
    > Absolutely. I'm a strong advocate of public trails. If I were lucky enough
    to
    > have a railtrail pass through my backyard, I would be grateful for having
    such
    > easy access to it.
    >
    > Andrew
    >

    In full agreeance with Andrew.

    --
    Alan Erskine alanerskine(at)optusnet.com.au GWB the Ghengis Khan of the 21st Century
     
  12. Ray Peace

    Ray Peace Guest

    Greetings, I have read all this and am putting my two penneth in too. As for the school blocking the
    trail and being `right' to do so, garbage. The obstrepperous attitude of the school in question is
    blocking the completion of a linear route at one of its worst points, forcing cyclists onto the
    appalling Maroondah Highway instead of providing the smooth, car free access the former rail
    reservation would provide. The complaints about drug dealers and other undesirables are crap.
    Camberwell Grammar School and Camberwell High School both sit dead on the Outer Circle rail trail,
    to name two of many, and there have been no such complaints, ever. Lilydale station does not have
    any significant problems with drug use or other abberant behaviour, I have been there dozens of
    times and found it no better and no worse than any other suburban station. If we had a decent rail
    system, which we don't, there would be sufficient patronage to justify improving it, but while our
    trains average 37 k/mh (your racing bicycle can do better) and run on 1878 timetables this is not
    likely to happen, is it ? I presume you drive a car. See me riding past in the next gridlock, such
    as on Maroondah Hwy (speak of the devil) between Box Hill and Ringwood yesterday arvo. Rail trail
    development has enough problems with absymal sign-posting, lack of facilities and preferential
    treatment generally for the Great God Car, without twaddle like this being introduced. Genghis Khan
    in the 13th century was a bloody murderer and torturer anyway. Regards, Ray (not happy either)

    chickasmith wrote:

    >>Sorry about all that, these decisions just make me mad.
    >>
    >
    >>Cheers Peter
    >>
    >
    >Graduated from the college in 1997 and still live in the area. I am not too sure if you know much
    >about Lilydale and the area, but where do some of the unsavoury types hang out in the area? At the
    >Lilydale station ... where does the Warbuton trail start? ... same spot
    >
    >Considering the school has been there for the best part of a few decades (dont actually know)
    >and in one instance, it is asked that you give back some property that cyclists and other
    >'unsavoury' types just to have a 'trail' go through because of 'history', I think the right
    >decision has been made.
    >
    >Would you let a 'trail' go through your backyard, where not only cyclists would come through, but
    >anyone else? I'd think not ...
     
  13. Keith

    Keith Guest

    "Peter Signorini" wrote

    > "Louis Naturani" wrote

    > > Had a go at the Lilydale to Warburton trail today only to embarrasingly get stuck at the
    > > college.

    > No, stay away from the college. This was a controversial issue last year when the State government
    > signed a lease with this crummy college to give them a twenty year lease on land which was a rail
    > easement and intended for development as a rail trail. Mt Lilydale College, claimed the rail-trail
    > would attract lots of drug dealers and paedophiles.

    There is another (peripheral) issue, too. A generation ago, all day-pupils traveled to school by
    public tansport, bike or walking. More recently, they have taken to arriving in mum-driven SUVs.
    This change reinforces class differences and has huge environmental implications, directly
    contributing to the reduction in safety for cyclists on our overcrowded roads.

    Schools should be encouraging cycling in all its manifestations, not locking themselves away from
    the rest of us in their comfortable cocoons.
     
  14. Shabby

    Shabby New Member

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    For the record, Port Philip council has a "walking bus". A simple concept, some parents walk to school and the kids meet them on the way. I believe they are starting work on a cycling bus, although the logistics of 50 kids on bikes could be much more difficult.

    In any case, you achieve a lot by riding to work or school, and every person you get out of a car and onto a bike for one day a week cuts down their commuting emissions by 20% and starts reducing their public health system burden.
     
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