Was Jesus Compassionate



W

Wholey_smoke

Guest
Was Jesus Peaceable And Compassionate? The birth of Jesus was heralded with "Peace on Earth," yet
Jesus said, "Think not that I am come to send peace: I came not to send peace but a sword." (Matthew
10:34) "He that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one." (Luke 22:36) "But those mine
enemies, which would not that I should reign over them, bring hither, and slay them before me."
(Luke 19:27. In a parable, but spoken of favorably.)

The burning of unbelievers during the Inquisition was based on the words of Jesus: "If a man abide
not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into
the fire, and they are burned." (John 15:6)

Jesus looked at his critics "with anger" (Mark 3:5), and attacked merchants with a whip (John 2:15).
He showed his respect for life by drowning innocent animals (Matthew 8:32). He refused to heal a
sick child until he was pressured by the mother (Matthew 15:22-28).

The most revealing aspect of his character was his promotion of eternal torment. "The Son of man
[Jesus himself] shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things
that offend, and them which do iniquity; And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be
wailing and gnashing of teeth." (Matthew 13:41-42) "And if thy hand offend thee, cut it off: it is
better for thee to enter into life maimed, than having two hands to go into hell, into the fire that
never shall be quenched." (Mark 9:43)

Is this nice? Is it exemplary to make your point with threats of violence? Is hell a kind,
peaceful idea?

Did Jesus Promote "Family Values"? "If any man come to me, and hate not his father, and mother, and
wife, and children, and brethren, and sisters, yea, and his own life also, he cannot be my
disciple." (Luke 14:26)

"I am come to set a man at variance against his father, and the daughter against her mother, and the
daughter in law against her mother in law. And a man's foes shall be they of his own household."
(Matthew 10:35-36)

When one of his disciples requested time off for his father's funeral, Jesus rebuked him: "Let the
dead bury their dead." (Matthew 8:22)

Jesus never used the word "family." He never married or fathered children. To his own mother, he
said, "Woman, what have I to do with thee?" (John 2:4)

What Were His Views On Equality And Social Justice? Jesus encouraged the beating of slaves: "And
that servant [slave], which knew his lord's will, and prepared not himself, neither did according to
his will, shall be beaten with many stripes." (Luke 12:47) He never denounced servitude,
incorporating the master-slave relationship into many of his parables.

He did nothing to alleviate poverty. Rather than sell some expensive ointment to help the poor,
Jesus wasted it on himself, saying, "Ye have the poor with you always." (Mark 14:3-7)

No women were chosen as disciples or invited to the Last Supper.

What Moral Advice Did Jesus Give? "There be eunuchs which have made themselves eunuchs for the
kingdom of heaven's sake. He that is able to receive it, let him receive it." (Matthew
19:12) Some believers, including church father Origen, took this verse literally and castrated
themselves. Even metaphorically, this advice is in poor taste.

a.. If you do something wrong with your eye or hand, cut/pluck it off

b.. Marrying a divorced woman is adultery. (Matthew 5:32)
c.. Don't plan for the future. (Matthew 6:34)
d.. Don't save money. (Matthew 6:19-20)
e.. Don't become wealthy. (Mark 10:21-25)
f.. Sell everything and give it to the poor. (Luke 12:33)
g.. Don't work to obtain food. (John 6:27)

h.. Make people want to persecute you. (Matthew 5:11)
i.. Let everyone know you are better than the rest. (Matthew 5:13-16)
j.. Take money from those who have no savings and give it to rich investors. (Luke 19:23-26)
k.. If someone steals from you, don't try to get it back. (Luke 6:30)
l.. If someone hits you, invite them to do it again. (Matthew 5:39)
m.. If you lose a lawsuit, give more than the judgment. (Matthew 5:40)
n.. If someone forces you to walk a mile, walk two miles. (Matthew 5:41)
o.. If anyone asks you for anything, give it to them without question. (Matthew 5:42) Is this
wise? Is this what you would teach your children?

Was Jesus Reliable? Jesus told his disciples that they would not die before his second coming:
"There be some standing here, which shall not taste of death, till they see the Son of man coming in
his kingdom" (Matthew 16:28). "Behold, I come quickly." (Revelation 3:11) It's been 2,000 years, and
believers are still waiting for his "quick" return.

He mistakenly claimed that the mustard seed is "the least of all seeds" (Matt. 13:32), and that salt
could "lose its savour" (Matthew 5:13).

Jesus said that whoever calls somebody a "fool" shall be in danger of hell fire (Matthew 5:22), yet
he called people "fools" himself (Matthew 23:17).

Regarding his own truthfulness, Jesus gave two conflicting opinions: "If I bear witness of myself,
my witness is not true" (John 5:31), and "Though I bear record of myself, yet my record is true"
(John 8:14).

Was Jesus A Good Example? He irrationally cursed a fig tree for being fruitless out of
season (Matthew
21:18-19, and Mark 11:13-14). He broke the law by stealing corn on the Sabbath (Mark 2:23), and he
encouraged his disciples to take a horse without asking permission (Matthew 21).

The "humble" Jesus said that he was "greater than the temple" (Matt 12:6), "greater than Jonah"
(Matthew 12:41), and "greater than Solomon" (Matthew
21:1). He appeared to suffer from a dictator's "paranoia" when he said, "He that is not with me is
against me" (Matthew 12:30).

Why Jesus? Although other verses can be cited that portray Jesus in a different light, they do not
erase the disturbing side of his character. The conflicting passages, however, prove that the New
Testament is contradictory.

The "Golden Rule" had been said many times by earlier religious leaders. (Confucius: "Do not unto
others that you would not have them do unto you.") "Turn the other cheek" encourages victims to
invite further violence. "Love thy neighbor" applied only to fellow believers. (Neither the Jews nor
Jesus showed much love to foreign religions). A few of the Beatitudes ("Blessed are the
peacemakers") are acceptable, but they are all conditions of future reward, not based on respect for
human life or values.

On the whole, Jesus said little that was worthwhile. He introduced nothing new to ethics (except
hell). He instituted no social programs. Being "omniscient," he could have shared some useful
science or medicine, but he appeared ignorant of such things (as if his character were merely the
invention of writers stuck in the first century).

Many scholars are doubtful of the historical existence of Jesus. Albert Schweitzer said, "The
historical Jesus will be to our time a stranger and an enigma." No first-century writer confirms
the Jesus story. The New Testament is internally contradictory and contains historical errors. The
story is filled with miracles and other outrageous claims. Consisting mostly of material borrowed
from pagan religions, the Jesus story appears to be cut from the same fabric as all other myths
and fables.

Why is Jesus so special? It would be more reasonable and productive to emulate real, flesh-and-blood
human beings who have contributed to humanity--mothers who have given birth, scientists who have
alleviated suffering, social reformers who have fought injustice--than to worship a character of
such dubious qualities as Jesus.
 
wholey_smoke wrote:

> Was Jesus Peaceable And Compassionate? The birth of Jesus was heralded with "Peace on Earth," yet
> Jesus said, "Think not that I am come to send peace: I came not to send peace but a sword."
> (Matthew 10:34) "He that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one." (Luke 22:36) "But
> those mine enemies, which would not that I should reign over them, bring hither, and slay them
> before me." (Luke 19:27. In a parable, but spoken of favorably.)
>
> The burning of unbelievers during the Inquisition was based on the words of Jesus: "If a man abide
> not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into
> the fire, and they are burned." (John 15:6)
>
> Jesus looked at his critics "with anger" (Mark 3:5), and attacked merchants with a whip (John
> 2:15). He showed his respect for life by drowning innocent animals (Matthew 8:32). He refused to
> heal a sick child until he was pressured by the mother (Matthew 15:22-28).
>
> The most revealing aspect of his character was his promotion of eternal torment. "The Son of man
> [Jesus himself] shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things
> that offend, and them which do iniquity; And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall
> be wailing and gnashing of teeth." (Matthew 13:41-42) "And if thy hand offend thee, cut it off: it
> is better for thee to enter into life maimed, than having two hands to go into hell, into the fire
> that never shall be quenched." (Mark 9:43)
>
> Is this nice? Is it exemplary to make your point with threats of violence? Is hell a kind,
> peaceful idea?
>
> Did Jesus Promote "Family Values"? "If any man come to me, and hate not his father, and mother,
> and wife, and children, and brethren, and sisters, yea, and his own life also, he cannot be my
> disciple." (Luke 14:26)
>
> "I am come to set a man at variance against his father, and the daughter against her mother, and
> the daughter in law against her mother in law. And a man's foes shall be they of his own
> household." (Matthew 10:35-36)
>
> When one of his disciples requested time off for his father's funeral, Jesus rebuked him: "Let the
> dead bury their dead." (Matthew 8:22)
>
> Jesus never used the word "family." He never married or fathered children. To his own mother, he
> said, "Woman, what have I to do with thee?" (John 2:4)
>
> What Were His Views On Equality And Social Justice? Jesus encouraged the beating of slaves: "And
> that servant [slave], which knew his lord's will, and prepared not himself, neither did according
> to his will, shall be beaten with many stripes." (Luke 12:47) He never denounced servitude,
> incorporating the master-slave relationship into many of his parables.
>
> He did nothing to alleviate poverty. Rather than sell some expensive ointment to help the poor,
> Jesus wasted it on himself, saying, "Ye have the poor with you always." (Mark 14:3-7)
>
> No women were chosen as disciples or invited to the Last Supper.
>
> What Moral Advice Did Jesus Give? "There be eunuchs which have made themselves eunuchs for the
> kingdom of heaven's sake. He that is able to receive it, let him receive it." (Matthew
> 19:12) Some believers, including church father Origen, took this verse literally and castrated
> themselves. Even metaphorically, this advice is in poor taste.
>
> a.. If you do something wrong with your eye or hand, cut/pluck it off

> b.. Marrying a divorced woman is adultery. (Matthew 5:32)
> c.. Don't plan for the future. (Matthew 6:34)
> d.. Don't save money. (Matthew 6:19-20)
> e.. Don't become wealthy. (Mark 10:21-25)
> f.. Sell everything and give it to the poor. (Luke 12:33)
> g.. Don't work to obtain food. (John 6:27)

> i.. Make people want to persecute you. (Matthew 5:11)
> j.. Let everyone know you are better than the rest. (Matthew 5:13-16)
> k.. Take money from those who have no savings and give it to rich investors. (Luke 19:23-26)
> l.. If someone steals from you, don't try to get it back. (Luke 6:30)
> m.. If someone hits you, invite them to do it again. (Matthew 5:39)
> n.. If you lose a lawsuit, give more than the judgment. (Matthew 5:40)
> o.. If someone forces you to walk a mile, walk two miles. (Matthew 5:41)
> p.. If anyone asks you for anything, give it to them without question. (Matthew 5:42) Is this
> wise? Is this what you would teach your children?
>
> Was Jesus Reliable? Jesus told his disciples that they would not die before his second coming:
> "There be some standing here, which shall not taste of death, till they see the Son of man coming
> in his kingdom" (Matthew 16:28). "Behold, I come quickly." (Revelation 3:11) It's been 2,000
> years, and believers are still waiting for his "quick" return.
>
> He mistakenly claimed that the mustard seed is "the least of all seeds" (Matt. 13:32), and that
> salt could "lose its savour" (Matthew 5:13).
>
> Jesus said that whoever calls somebody a "fool" shall be in danger of hell fire (Matthew 5:22),
> yet he called people "fools" himself (Matthew 23:17).
>
> Regarding his own truthfulness, Jesus gave two conflicting opinions: "If I bear witness of myself,
> my witness is not true" (John 5:31), and "Though I bear record of myself, yet my record is true"
> (John 8:14).
>
> Was Jesus A Good Example? He irrationally cursed a fig tree for being fruitless out of season
> (Matthew
> 21:18-19, and Mark 11:13-14). He broke the law by stealing corn on the Sabbath (Mark 2:23), and he
> encouraged his disciples to take a horse without asking permission (Matthew 21).
>
> The "humble" Jesus said that he was "greater than the temple" (Matt 12:6), "greater than Jonah"
> (Matthew 12:41), and "greater than Solomon" (Matthew
> 12:42). He appeared to suffer from a dictator's "paranoia" when he said, "He that is not with me
> is against me" (Matthew 12:30).
>
> Why Jesus? Although other verses can be cited that portray Jesus in a different light, they do not
> erase the disturbing side of his character. The conflicting passages, however, prove that the New
> Testament is contradictory.
>
> The "Golden Rule" had been said many times by earlier religious leaders. (Confucius: "Do not unto
> others that you would not have them do unto you.") "Turn the other cheek" encourages victims to
> invite further violence. "Love thy neighbor" applied only to fellow believers. (Neither the Jews
> nor Jesus showed much love to foreign religions). A few of the Beatitudes ("Blessed are the
> peacemakers") are acceptable, but they are all conditions of future reward, not based on respect
> for human life or values.
>
> On the whole, Jesus said little that was worthwhile. He introduced nothing new to ethics (except
> hell). He instituted no social programs. Being "omniscient," he could have shared some useful
> science or medicine, but he appeared ignorant of such things (as if his character were merely the
> invention of writers stuck in the first century).
>
> Many scholars are doubtful of the historical existence of Jesus. Albert Schweitzer said, "The
> historical Jesus will be to our time a stranger and an enigma." No first-century writer confirms
> the Jesus story. The New Testament is internally contradictory and contains historical errors. The
> story is filled with miracles and other outrageous claims. Consisting mostly of material borrowed
> from pagan religions, the Jesus story appears to be cut from the same fabric as all other myths
> and fables.
>
> Why is Jesus so special?

Jesus answers as written in John 14:

6Jesus answered, "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except
through me..."

> It would be more reasonable and productive to emulate real, flesh-and-blood human beings who have
> contributed to humanity--mothers who have given birth, scientists who have alleviated suffering,
> social reformers who have fought injustice--than to worship a character of such dubious qualities
> as Jesus.

I prefer the truth.

Humbly,

Andrew

--
Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD
Board-Certified Cardiologist
http://www.heartmdphd.com
 
This really belongs in a religion group, not sci.med.cardiology but since you posted - now you know
why us Jews have and will never accept jesus as their "moshiach", for the reasons in your post and
many others.
 
"Pete C." wrote:

> This really belongs in a religion group, not sci.med.cardiology but since you posted - now you
> know why us Jews have and will never accept jesus as their "moshiach", for the reasons in your
> post and many others.

Hope for your sake, God the Father accepts your excuse.

It remains my belief that He won't. Sorry.

Humbly,

Andrew

--
Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD
Board-Certified Cardiologist
http://www.heartmdphd.com/
 
Have you noticed Pete C that Chung and his first Lieutenant MU_lti_Facets_Of_Lunacy always sign of
with threats. The fact's are there and are indisputable.

"Pete C." <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> This really belongs in a religion group, not sci.med.cardiology but since you posted - now you
> know why us Jews have and will never accept jesus as their "moshiach", for the reasons in your
> post and many others.
 
"Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> wholey_smoke wrote:
>
> > Was Jesus Peaceable And Compassionate? The birth of Jesus was heralded with "Peace on Earth,"
> > yet Jesus said, "Think not that I am come to send peace: I came not to send peace but a sword."
> > (Matthew 10:34) "He that hath no sword, let him sell his
garment,
> > and buy one." (Luke 22:36) "But those mine enemies, which would not that
I
> > should reign over them, bring hither, and slay them before me." (Luke
19:27.
> > In a parable, but spoken of favorably.)
> >
> > The burning of unbelievers during the Inquisition was based on the words
of
> > Jesus: "If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather
> > them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned." (John 15:6)
> >
> > Jesus looked at his critics "with anger" (Mark 3:5), and attacked
merchants
> > with a whip (John 2:15). He showed his respect for life by drowning
innocent
> > animals (Matthew 8:32). He refused to heal a sick child until he was pressured by the mother
> > (Matthew 15:22-28).
> >
> > The most revealing aspect of his character was his promotion of eternal torment. "The Son of man
> > [Jesus himself] shall send forth his angels,
and
> > they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them
which
> > do iniquity; And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of
> > teeth." (Matthew 13:41-42) "And if thy hand
offend
> > thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter into life maimed, than having two hands to go
> > into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched." (Mark 9:43)
> >
> > Is this nice? Is it exemplary to make your point with threats of
violence?
> > Is hell a kind, peaceful idea?
> >
> > Did Jesus Promote "Family Values"? "If any man come to me, and hate not his father, and mother,
> > and wife,
and
> > children, and brethren, and sisters, yea, and his own life also, he
cannot
> > be my disciple." (Luke 14:26)
> >
> > "I am come to set a man at variance against his father, and the daughter against her mother, and
> > the daughter in law against her mother in law.
And a
> > man's foes shall be they of his own household." (Matthew 10:35-36)
> >
> > When one of his disciples requested time off for his father's funeral,
Jesus
> > rebuked him: "Let the dead bury their dead." (Matthew 8:22)
> >
> > Jesus never used the word "family." He never married or fathered
children.
> > To his own mother, he said, "Woman, what have I to do with thee?" (John
19:28)
> >
> > What Were His Views On Equality And Social Justice? Jesus encouraged the beating of slaves: "And
> > that servant [slave], which knew his lord's will, and prepared not himself, neither did
> > according to
his
> > will, shall be beaten with many stripes." (Luke 12:47) He never
denounced
> > servitude, incorporating the master-slave relationship into many of his parables.
> >
> > He did nothing to alleviate poverty. Rather than sell some expensive ointment to help the poor,
> > Jesus wasted it on himself, saying, "Ye have
the
> > poor with you always." (Mark 14:3-7)
> >
> > No women were chosen as disciples or invited to the Last Supper.
> >
> > What Moral Advice Did Jesus Give? "There be eunuchs which have made themselves eunuchs for the
> > kingdom of heaven's sake. He that is able to receive it, let him receive it."
(Matthew
> > 19:12) Some believers, including church father Origen, took this verse literally and castrated
> > themselves. Even metaphorically, this advice is
in
> > poor taste.
> >
> > a.. If you do something wrong with your eye or hand, cut/pluck it off

> > b.. Marrying a divorced woman is adultery. (Matthew 5:32)
> > c.. Don't plan for the future. (Matthew 6:34)
> > d.. Don't save money. (Matthew 6:19-20)
> > e.. Don't become wealthy. (Mark 10:21-25)
> > f.. Sell everything and give it to the poor. (Luke 12:33)
> > g.. Don't work to obtain food. (John 6:27)

> > i.. Make people want to persecute you. (Matthew 5:11)
> > j.. Let everyone know you are better than the rest. (Matthew 5:13-16)
> > k.. Take money from those who have no savings and give it to rich investors. (Luke 19:23-26)
> > l.. If someone steals from you, don't try to get it back. (Luke 6:30)
> > m.. If someone hits you, invite them to do it again. (Matthew 5:39)
> > n.. If you lose a lawsuit, give more than the judgment. (Matthew 5:40)
> > o.. If someone forces you to walk a mile, walk two miles. (Matthew
19:29)
> > p.. If anyone asks you for anything, give it to them without question. (Matthew 5:42) Is this
> > wise? Is this what you would teach your children?
> >
> > Was Jesus Reliable? Jesus told his disciples that they would not die before his second
coming:
> > "There be some standing here, which shall not taste of death, till they
see
> > the Son of man coming in his kingdom" (Matthew 16:28). "Behold, I come quickly." (Revelation
> > 3:11) It's been 2,000 years, and believers are
still
> > waiting for his "quick" return.
> >
> > He mistakenly claimed that the mustard seed is "the least of all seeds" (Matt. 13:32), and that
> > salt could "lose its savour" (Matthew 5:13).
> >
> > Jesus said that whoever calls somebody a "fool" shall be in danger of
hell
> > fire (Matthew 5:22), yet he called people "fools" himself (Matthew
19:30).
> >
> > Regarding his own truthfulness, Jesus gave two conflicting opinions: "If
I
> > bear witness of myself, my witness is not true" (John 5:31), and "Though
I
> > bear record of myself, yet my record is true" (John 8:14).
> >
> > Was Jesus A Good Example? He irrationally cursed a fig tree for being fruitless out of season
(Matthew
> > 21:18-19, and Mark 11:13-14). He broke the law by stealing corn on the Sabbath (Mark 2:23), and
> > he encouraged his disciples to take a horse
without
> > asking permission (Matthew 21).
> >
> > The "humble" Jesus said that he was "greater than the temple" (Matt
19:31),
> > "greater than Jonah" (Matthew 12:41), and "greater than Solomon"
(Matthew
> > 12:42). He appeared to suffer from a dictator's "paranoia" when he said,
"He
> > that is not with me is against me" (Matthew 12:30).
> >
> > Why Jesus? Although other verses can be cited that portray Jesus in a different
light,
> > they do not erase the disturbing side of his character. The conflicting passages, however, prove
> > that the New Testament is contradictory.
> >
> > The "Golden Rule" had been said many times by earlier religious leaders. (Confucius: "Do not
> > unto others that you would not have them do unto
you.")
> > "Turn the other cheek" encourages victims to invite further violence.
"Love
> > thy neighbor" applied only to fellow believers. (Neither the Jews nor
Jesus
> > showed much love to foreign religions). A few of the Beatitudes
("Blessed
> > are the peacemakers") are acceptable, but they are all conditions of
future
> > reward, not based on respect for human life or values.
> >
> > On the whole, Jesus said little that was worthwhile. He introduced
nothing
> > new to ethics (except hell). He instituted no social programs. Being "omniscient," he could have
> > shared some useful science or medicine, but
he
> > appeared ignorant of such things (as if his character were merely the invention of writers stuck
> > in the first century).
> >
> > Many scholars are doubtful of the historical existence of Jesus. Albert Schweitzer said, "The
> > historical Jesus will be to our time a stranger
and an
> > enigma." No first-century writer confirms the Jesus story. The New
Testament
> > is internally contradictory and contains historical errors. The story is filled with miracles
> > and other outrageous claims. Consisting mostly of material borrowed from pagan religions, the
> > Jesus story appears to be
cut
> > from the same fabric as all other myths and fables.
> >
> > Why is Jesus so special?
>
> Jesus answers as written in John 14:
>
> 6Jesus answered, "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to
the
> Father except through me..."
>
>
> > It would be more reasonable and productive to emulate real, flesh-and-blood human beings who
> > have contributed to humanity--mothers who have given birth, scientists who have alleviated
> > suffering, social reformers who have fought injustice--than to worship a character of such
> > dubious qualities as Jesus.
>
> I prefer the truth.

It's there in front of you.
>
>
> Humbly,
>
> Andrew
>
> --
> Dr. Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD Board-Certified Cardiologist http://www.heartmdphd.com
 
"wholey_smoke" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...

>>>>> Jesus never used the word "family." He never married or fathered
children.
> To his own mother, he said, "Woman, what have I to do with thee?" (John 2:4)<<<

This is a bit part of verses. Jesus was talking to His mother who was calling on Him to resolve the
problem of them running out of wine. He told her that 'His hour had not yet come'. He would have
known that miracles in the wrong place would have been wasted and out of context. His mother will
also have known who He was and that a time would come when she would see Him perform the miracles
she knew would happen.

If you go back and read it in context you will notice that it is the sigh of a man who knows that
His mother knows who _He_ is and what wonders He can do. All miracles are ageless and have lessons
for each generation. Jesus wasn't anti-women at all, far from it.

Those who want to read more will find it in John Chapter 2 (John 2) Verse 3-4 , where you can read
it in context.

"When the hour had come, He sat down, and the twelve apostles with Him." Luke 22:14

You see, when His hour did come, 'He knew because He knew all things to come'.

Carol T
 
"wholey_smoke" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>.. .
>>>>>>>>>> Was Jesus Peaceable And Compassionate?
> The birth of Jesus was heralded with "Peace on Earth," yet Jesus said, "Think not that I am come
> to send peace: I came not to send peace but a sword." (Matthew 10:34) "He that hath no sword, let
> him sell his garment, and buy one." (Luke 22:36) "But those mine enemies, which would not that I
> should reign over them, bring hither, and slay them before me." (Luke 19:27. In a parable, but
> spoken of favorably.)<<<<<<<<<<

Peace comes with a price; like a fruitful tree the bad bits have to be pruned out so that it can
grow gloriously and produce great generations. God knows that Satan cannot be reasoned with, or
trusted, and that his forces only know violence as a way to win people over. Therefore only by what
they know to fear should they stand broken and obedient. It's only then, if any are still to be
saved, they will come to understand the message in the Word of God.

Hence, Jesus was honest and told people how it was to be with the world.

Carol T
 
"wholey_smoke" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...

>>>>>>>>>> The burning of unbelievers during the Inquisition was based
on the words of
> Jesus: "If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather
> them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned." (John 15:6)
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

"Abide in Me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, unless it abides in the vine,
neither can you, unless you abide in
Me." John 15:4

This was a message to _you_ personally, to your children, their children, and your
neighbours children.

What _fruit_ are you bearing for your own branch? If it is not good for God's children why would you
want to be a part of their tree? Isn't it better to cut off those branches which bear rotten fruits
which sap the goodness out of young fruit?

Any killing during the Inquisition was not done by people who were part of the vine, but those who
wanted power and importance for 'themselves'. They did not know who their neighbours were, therefore
could not have been Christian's.

Carol T
 
"wholey_smoke" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...

>>>>> Jesus looked at his critics "with anger" (Mark 3:5), and
attacked merchants with a whip (John 2:15). He showed his respect for life by drowning innocent
animals (Matthew 8:32). He refused to heal a sick child until he was
> pressured by the mother (Matthew 15:22-28).<<<<<<<<<<<<

Who challenges Who over what is and isn't work on a Sabbath? ............. Mark 3:5, this is a
challenge to men's audacity at interpreting The laws of God wrongly.

He drove them out of the temple along with the animals with a whip he made out of cord. How else are
they to be treated, that they had the audacity to stand in a house of God and do what they were
doing? Evil does not understand reasoning. Dispelled from His Father's house with the fear 'they
understand' meant that they would never return, and the body of the church can be rebuilt without
its rotten core.

This is a lesson for all the churches of all time; the work inside them is for our Father alone.

As for the sick child whose mother sought healing....Parent's who
have children 'vexed by the devil' (or demons) even in today's world
cannot have their children healed by God until the parent understands.

If parent's make The Word of God unworthy to their children they will allow the demons in through
their own lack of faith.

Even a dog is worthy of bread from under the table, so why aren't our children worthy of the Lord's
bread if we love them more than our animals?

"Then Jesus answered and said to her, "O woman, great is your faith! Let it be to you as you
desire." And her daughter was healed from that very hour. (Mat 15:28 NKJ)

How great is your faith to save your children and the children around you from the demons which make
them sick and take their childhood away?

Carol T
 
"wholey_smoke" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "And if thy hand offend
> thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter into life maimed, than having two hands to go
> into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched." (Mark 9:43)<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

The body in Christ hurts when it cuts off one of it's parts, but it saves the rest of its body from
the silently insidious nature of evil.

Carol T
 
"wholey_smoke" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...

>>>>>>>>>>> Did Jesus Promote "Family Values"?
> "If any man come to me, and hate not his father, and mother, and wife, and children, and brethren,
> and sisters, yea, and his own life also, he cannot be my disciple." (Luke 14:26)<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

This is true, the distance between God and the love for your yourself, parents, spouse and children
is so great that in comparison man can only understand it as hate. If called a disciple of Jesus'
will go and not look back.

>>>>>>>>> "I am come to set a man at variance against his father, and
the daughter
> against her mother, and the daughter in law against her mother in law. And a man's foes shall be
> they of his own household." (Matthew 10:35-36)<<<<<<<<<<<<<

This is true, so powerful will the love of Christ be that those in His presents will challenge those
who have become Christian's rather than face their own sin before Him. (as you do now) Jesus told
the truth so that we would know and understand the battles and minds of men.

Carol T
 
"wholey_smoke" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...

> When one of his disciples requested time off for his father's funeral, Jesus rebuked him: "Let the
> dead bury their dead." (Matthew 8:22)

They cannot have tended to their family needs and been a disciple of Jesus, their love of Him had to
be more powerful than all things.

Carol T
 
"wholey_smoke" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
> Was Jesus Peaceable And Compassionate?

> What Were His Views On Equality And Social Justice? Jesus encouraged the beating of slaves: "And
> that servant [slave], which knew his lord's will, and prepared not himself, neither did according
> to his will, shall be beaten with many stripes." (Luke 12:47) He never denounced servitude,
> incorporating the master-slave relationship into many of his parables.<<<<<<<<<<<<<

This is a part of a parable about making preparation as servants of The Lord. Jesus was not
advocating any method's used in His day, simply utilising how people behaved at that time to press
home a message. If you are prepared for Him at all times then you will have your just rewards for
the work you do as a steward/servant of His household.

He didn't need to tell them physical violence was wrong against another human being as He made it
clear what the second Commandment was.

Carol T
 
"wholey_smoke" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...

>>>>>>>>> He did nothing to alleviate poverty. Rather than sell some
expensive
> ointment to help the poor, Jesus wasted it on himself, saying, "Ye have the poor with you always."
> (Mark 14:3-7)<<<<<<<<<<<

Jesus has done more to relieve poverty than any other human being on earth. She gave to God
unconditionally what was precious to her because she loved Jesus. It was not His place to stop her
anointing Him so that he could sell it. Jesus was not in the practice of taking to give, only in
teaching people to give unconditionally. The poor have always been with the church and though the
body of the Christian church people have given and given since the day Jesus died.

Does the devil part with his spoils to feed the poor?

Carol T


>
> No women were chosen as disciples or invited to the Last Supper.
>
> What Moral Advice Did Jesus Give? "There be eunuchs which have made themselves eunuchs for the
> kingdom of heaven's sake. He that is able to receive it, let him receive it." (Matthew
> 19:12) Some believers, including church father Origen, took this verse literally and castrated
> themselves. Even metaphorically, this advice is in poor taste.
>
> a.. If you do something wrong with your eye or hand, cut/pluck it off

> b.. Marrying a divorced woman is adultery. (Matthew 5:32)
> c.. Don't plan for the future. (Matthew 6:34)
> d.. Don't save money. (Matthew 6:19-20)
> e.. Don't become wealthy. (Mark 10:21-25)
> f.. Sell everything and give it to the poor. (Luke 12:33)
> g.. Don't work to obtain food. (John 6:27)

> i.. Make people want to persecute you. (Matthew 5:11)
> j.. Let everyone know you are better than the rest. (Matthew 5:13-16)
> k.. Take money from those who have no savings and give it to rich investors. (Luke 19:23-26)
> l.. If someone steals from you, don't try to get it back. (Luke 6:30)
> m.. If someone hits you, invite them to do it again. (Matthew 5:39)
> n.. If you lose a lawsuit, give more than the judgment. (Matthew 5:40)
> o.. If someone forces you to walk a mile, walk two miles. (Matthew 5:41)
> p.. If anyone asks you for anything, give it to them without question. (Matthew 5:42) Is this
> wise? Is this what you would teach your children?
>
> Was Jesus Reliable? Jesus told his disciples that they would not die before his second coming:
> "There be some standing here, which shall not taste of death, till they see the Son of man coming
> in his kingdom" (Matthew 16:28). "Behold, I come quickly." (Revelation 3:11) It's been 2,000
> years, and believers are still waiting for his "quick" return.
>
> He mistakenly claimed that the mustard seed is "the least of all seeds" (Matt. 13:32), and that
> salt could "lose its savour" (Matthew 5:13).
>
> Jesus said that whoever calls somebody a "fool" shall be in danger of hell fire (Matthew 5:22),
> yet he called people "fools" himself (Matthew 23:17).
>
> Regarding his own truthfulness, Jesus gave two conflicting opinions: "If I bear witness of myself,
> my witness is not true" (John 5:31), and "Though I bear record of myself, yet my record is true"
> (John 8:14).
>
> Was Jesus A Good Example? He irrationally cursed a fig tree for being fruitless out of season
> (Matthew
> 21:18-19, and Mark 11:13-14). He broke the law by stealing corn on the Sabbath (Mark 2:23), and he
> encouraged his disciples to take a horse without asking permission (Matthew 21).
>
> The "humble" Jesus said that he was "greater than the temple" (Matt 12:6), "greater than Jonah"
> (Matthew 12:41), and "greater than Solomon" (Matthew
> 12:42). He appeared to suffer from a dictator's "paranoia" when he said, "He that is not with me
> is against me" (Matthew 12:30).
>
> Why Jesus? Although other verses can be cited that portray Jesus in a different light, they do not
> erase the disturbing side of his character. The conflicting passages, however, prove that the New
> Testament is contradictory.
>
> The "Golden Rule" had been said many times by earlier religious leaders. (Confucius: "Do not unto
> others that you would not have them do unto you.") "Turn the other cheek" encourages victims to
> invite further violence. "Love thy neighbor" applied only to fellow believers. (Neither the Jews
> nor Jesus showed much love to foreign religions). A few of the Beatitudes ("Blessed are the
> peacemakers") are acceptable, but they are all conditions of future reward, not based on respect
> for human life or values.
>
> On the whole, Jesus said little that was worthwhile. He introduced nothing new to ethics (except
> hell). He instituted no social programs. Being "omniscient," he could have shared some useful
> science or medicine, but he appeared ignorant of such things (as if his character were merely the
> invention of writers stuck in the first century).
>
> Many scholars are doubtful of the historical existence of Jesus. Albert Schweitzer said, "The
> historical Jesus will be to our time a stranger and an enigma." No first-century writer confirms
> the Jesus story. The New Testament is internally contradictory and contains historical errors. The
> story is filled with miracles and other outrageous claims. Consisting mostly of material borrowed
> from pagan religions, the Jesus story appears to be cut from the same fabric as all other myths
> and fables.
>
> Why is Jesus so special? It would be more reasonable and productive to emulate real, flesh-and-
> blood human beings who have contributed to humanity--mothers who have given birth, scientists who
> have alleviated suffering, social reformers who have fought injustice--than to worship a character
> of such dubious qualities as Jesus.
 
"wholey_smoke" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...

> No women were chosen as disciples or invited to the Last Supper.

Women were not His disciples, it wouldn't have been fruitful for His body. Jesus did not devalue
women, far from it.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>> What Moral Advice Did Jesus Give?
> "There be eunuchs which have made themselves eunuchs for the kingdom of heaven's sake. He that is
> able to receive it, let him receive it." (Matthew
> 19:12) <<<<<<<<<<<<

There were men who loved Jesus so much that they no longer wanted the desires of men, they had no
need of it. For God it is a great accolade. Do not feel sorry for them as they had/have so much more
than you could ever know.

Carol T
 
"wholey_smoke" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...

>>>>>>>>>>> Many scholars are doubtful of the historical existence of
Jesus. Albert Schweitzer said, "The historical Jesus will be to our time a stranger and an enigma."
No first-century writer confirms the Jesus story. <<<<<<<<<<<<<

You might like to read some of the Dead Sea Scroll translations and their reference to the
'Great Teacher'

Cornelius Tacitus (55-120 AD), "the greatest historian" of ancient Rome: Gaius Suetonius
Tranquillas, chief secretary of Emperor Hadrian (117-138 AD): Flavius Josephus (37-97 AD), court
historian for Emperor Vespasian: Julius Africanus, writing around 221 AD, found a reference in the
writings of Thallus, who wrote a history of the Eastern Mediterranean around 52 AD, which dealt with
the darkness that covered the land during Jesus's crucifixion: Pliny the Younger, Roman governor of
Bithynia in Asia Minor around 112 AD: Emperor Trajan, in reply to Pliny: Emporer Hadrian (117-138
AD), in a letter to Minucius Fundanus, the Asian proconsul: The Jewish Talmud, compiled between 70
and 200 AD: Lucian, a second century Greek satirist: Mara Bar-Serapion, of Syria, writing between 70
and 200 AD from prison to motivate his son to emulate wise teachers of the past: GNOSTICS SOURCES
The Gospel of Truth, probably by Valentius, around 135-160 AD: The Aprocryphon of John, probably by
Saturninus, around 120-130 AD: The Gospel of Thomas, probably from 140-200 AD: The Treatise On
Resurrection, by uncertain author of the late second century, to Rheginos: LOST WORKS QUOTED IN
OTHER SOURCES Acts of Pontius Pilate, reports sent from Pilate to Tiberius, referred to by Justin
Martyr (150 AD): Phlegon, born about 80 AD, as reported by Origen (185-254 AD), mentioned that Jesus
made certain predictions which had been fulfilled. ANCIENT CHRISTIAN SOURCES (extra-biblical)
Clement, elder of Rome, letter to the Corinthian church (95 AD): Ignatius, bishop of Antioch, letter
to the Trallians (110-115 AD): Ignatius, letter to the Smyrneans (110-115 AD): Ignatius, letter to
the Magnesians (110-115 AD): Quadratus, to Emperor Hadrian about 125 AD: (Pseudo-)Barnabas, written
130-138 AD: Justin Martyr, to Emperor Antoninus Pius about 150 AD: Justin Martyr, in Dialogue with
Trypho, around 150 AD:

http://www.carlislecofc.org/extrabiblical.htm

Also if you have not read it Psalm 22

Carol T
 
[email protected] (Pete C.) wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...

>>>>>>>>>> This really belongs in a religion group, not
sci.med.cardiology but
> since you posted - now you know why us Jews have and will never accept jesus as their "moshiach",
> for the reasons in your post and many others.<<<<<<<<<<<

Look at your neighbours and know that those who are in their true faith have no need of a saviour.
If you know of anyone, ask him/her who their neighbours are that they are above them and cannot see
or relieve their pain or distress.

Which Jewish child will be worthy to be called forward to bring peace and understanding to _all
men_, that they will allow the Jews to rule over all others and the Nations through the respect and
wisdom of God's ways? In which time is this saviour to come if it is not to be a time of illiteracy,
when a record cannot have been made, or a time when imagery can stand in the way of love.

How do the Jews fulfil their destiny whilst they deny it has its pathways?

Carol T
 
On 27 Jan 2004 09:00:44 -0800, [email protected] (Carol T) wrote:

>"wholey_smoke" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Many scholars are doubtful of the historical existence of
>Jesus. Albert Schweitzer said, "The historical Jesus will be to our time a stranger and an enigma."
>No first-century writer confirms the Jesus story. <<<<<<<<<<<<<
>
>
>You might like to read some of the Dead Sea Scroll translations and their reference to the
>'Great Teacher'

Even though biblical archaeology is one of my passions, can you explain to me what any of this
thread has to do with cardiology?