Weekly time in L3/L4 zones ?
- Thread starter peterwright
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You may be right [that my FT is understated], because it usually takes me longer to "discover" a new FT, in the form of a more spirited group ride or a TT of at least ~1hr. The way I set my interval targets is based on my MP/duration curve and I depend on an "inspired" interval or group ride where I was pushed by somebody or was chasing somebody to bump up my MP/duration curve. For intervals of all durations other than very short (e.g., <1min), I use 90%MP for the given duration. For example, I have a 3.5 mile, 6% avg grade hill on my standard route. That's about a 14min climb for me, give or take a little. So, I pick my target power for that climb based on 90% of my 14min MP/duration curve. Fortunately, I have some technology that allows me to compute these interval target powers automatically and tell me my target power during the whole ride. I sort of cringe when we have a strong, flyweight rider with us on my group ride because I'm thinking, "Here we go again, new targets!" because I know I'm going to go harder than normal on all the climbs.yzfrr11 said:
I'd say it's less likely with someone who uses shorter interval workouts as their 'breakthrough' workouts. RDO typically limits his intervals at 90% of his MP for that duration, which means that they aren't pushing him beyond what he's done before. His breakthough workouts tend to be spirited group rides where some young buck wants to strut a bit. That's when post-ride analysis shows RDO that his FT has increased somewhat.whoawhoa said:
Edit: Doh! A little late with the reply....
You know, I take the other approach (using interval performance to set my FT) but now that I think of it, my FT estimate probably isn't any better than yours. I use 3x20 sets to estimate FT (since I don't trust myself not to try to 'nail' a 2x20 set, and thus overstate FTRapDaddyo said:Couldn't have said it better myself.
) but since I haven't done any spirited group rides, I really don't know how hard I *could* push if I wanted. In any case, I'm okay with having a slightly understated FT, and if it's off by so much that my L4 workouts are really L3 workouts (which would really be a lot!) then I have a pleasant surprise waiting for me later this spring.
Isn't that the truth. I keep smiling any time someone suggests that my FT is understated because I think it is pretty damn high. What a nice surprise that would be!frenchyge said:In any case, I'm okay with having a slightly understated FT, and if it's off by so much that my L4 workouts are really L3 workouts (which would really be a lot!) then I have a pleasant surprise waiting for me later this spring.
I've really been learning a lot from you guys. Good stuff.frenchyge said:In any case, I'm okay with having a slightly understated FT, and if it's off by so much that my L4 workouts are really L3 workouts (which would really be a lot!) then I have a pleasant surprise waiting for me later this spring.
However, I am concerned that by understating FT you are not exercising as close to FT as you could be. I realize that there are many ways to stimulate FT - and L3 is potent, but most would agree that best bang for the buck FT stimulus is at FT, no?
Actually, I've seen articles which indicate that the best FT bang for the buck is the 'upper L2 - lower L4' sweet spot.yzfrr11 said:
Not sure if you are joking here, but here's my situation. I do 3x20 at my estimated FT. Rather than using 2x20 power, I use 3x20 power because it gives me a greater confidence that it is a power level that I can hold for a continuous hour, or at least is slightly conservative. I don't believe I am understating my FT, and in any case I *know* that I'm not understating it by 10%, which is the amount of error that would be required for me to be doing my intervals in the wrong level. As Whoawhoa says, it's pretty easy to tell if I'm at an intensity that I could hold for ~1hr under race conditions +5/-10%. If I'm off by a couple (heck, even 5-10) watts, then that's really no big deal, and I'd rather be understating than overstating at this point in the season.
I'd expect most people can tell which level they're in without having to look at the PM.
Actually, this is done indoors. The mental part is the biggest obstacle for me. After the first 30 min. you say to yourself, "OK-only two more chunks of 30". I won't be riding outside for a couple more months. I think I was over-eager when I considered blocking this workout. I have managed to do three per week, but I haven't tried it back-to-back yet.peterwright said:
Maybe, as others have posted with regards to Rapdaddyo, I am underestimating my FT at this point. Where what was once low L4 becomes high L3. On the bright side, that means my training is working. My 2x20's seem almost easy because the duration seems so short in comparison.
As for the 1's and 30"s, I mentioned that I don't count them as training time. I just want to make sure my legs remember what it feels like to ride at 150% FT, so that when I start L5 training in the 112-120% range, I'll have a psychological advantage.
I'm finding that 4 sets of 6x1' on, 1' off, with 4 min between sets, using 150% FT for the work intervals and 50% FT for the recovery intervals, or 2 sets of 20x30" on, 30" off with the same work/recovery levels, is not too hard to recover from: although I don't really know what system I am targeting.
I started racing last season (2 races). My first race this year is in 2 months.
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