We're all Dinosaurs



M

MSeries

Guest
[Not Responding] wrote:
> On Sun, 12 Dec 2004 06:39:49 -0700, MSeries <[email protected]>
> wrote:
>
>
>>>It appears that however much I dislike web forums, they do seem to be
>>>taking over as the internet discussion tool.

>>
>>So why do you C+ forum then ? What is your point ? That everyone should
>>be using usenet instead of web forums ?

>
>
> My "point" was merely an observation that in the past if you wanted to
> discuss your favoured subject, you used usenet and so did all other
> interested parties on the internet. Today most people and certainly
> the new generation of users turn to web forums by default.
>
> I'm not sure I was saying everyone *should* use usenet; it's a matter
> of choice. But we as a community are certainly losing something
> collectively as the division, privatisation and censorship of
> discussion takes place.
>
> Why do I use the C+ forum? Because I like talking about cycling. The
> fact that I don't rate then venue is secondary.
>


I use the C+ forum for the same reason as you.
 
P

Paul - xxx

Guest
David Hansen vaguely muttered something like ...
> On Sun, 12 Dec 2004 10:32:26 -0000 someone who may be "Paul - ***"
> <[email protected]> wrote this:-
>
>> There _are_ some good ones out there, specialist
>> forums that cater for very particular niches that might not be tolerated
>> or be OT in many newsgroups

>
> Indeed. I lurk in one.


I use three very limited appeal forums. Of those I only actually read two
portions of each one ... ;)

--
Paul ...
http://www.4x4prejudice.org/index.php
"A ****** is a ******, no matter what mode of transport they're using."
(8(|) Homer Rules !!!
 
D

David Hansen

Guest
On Sun, 12 Dec 2004 13:06:27 +0000 someone who may be Simon Brooke
<[email protected]> wrote this:-

>>>> It appears that however much I dislike web forums, they do seem to
>>>> be taking over as the internet discussion tool.

>>
>> Enclosure of the Commons?

>
>Precisely.


That was claimed to make food production more efficient, freeing
people to take part in the industrial revolution. Time will tell
whether the two events are comparable.


--
David Hansen, Edinburgh | PGP email preferred-key number F566DA0E
I will always explain revoked keys, unless the UK government
prevents me by using the RIP Act 2000.
 
D

David Hansen

Guest
On Sun, 12 Dec 2004 07:14:39 -0700 someone who may be MSeries
<[email protected]> wrote this:-

>In some
>respects the unthreaded way of forums follows real life more, hwoever
>confusing and difficult that may be it is what everyone is most familiar
>with. You are in a room with say 6 others talking about say, dynamos v
>battery lights. Points are made all the time in no order really other
>than chronological. Some are responding to earlier ones some or new.
>Some replies carry a mix of both. No real thread exists in real life one
>has to remember the material that went before.


That works when one is in one room at a time.


--
David Hansen, Edinburgh | PGP email preferred-key number F566DA0E
I will always explain revoked keys, unless the UK government
prevents me by using the RIP Act 2000.
 
G

garryb59

Guest
[snipped]

>Web forums are..... policed


[snipped]

....which I don't necessarily think is always a bad thing.
One example I'd cite in this respect is BentRider Online. I'm pretty
sure the forum section of the web-site is moderated, and in comparison
to the usenet newsgroup, 'alt.rec.bicycles.recumbent' which has become
poisoned with so much boring mindless ********, this is refreshingly
welcome.

Garry
 
J

Jon Senior

Guest
garryb59 wrote:
> ********


*beep* This is a rude word. Please refrain from expressing yourself in a
public medium.

Jon
 
J

Just zis Guy, you know?

Guest
On Sun, 12 Dec 2004 17:15:06 +0000, garryb59
<[email protected]> wrote in message
<[email protected]>:

>I'd cite in this respect is BentRider Online. I'm pretty
>sure the forum section of the web-site is moderated, and in comparison
>to the usenet newsgroup, 'alt.rec.bicycles.recumbent' which has become
>poisoned with so much boring mindless ********, this is refreshingly
>welcome.


You can always kf Ed, you know ;-)

Guy
--
"then came ye chavves, theyre cartes girded wyth candels
blue, and theyre beastes wyth straynge horn-lyke thyngs
onn theyre arses that theyre fartes be herde from myles
around." Chaucer, the Sheppey Tales
 
G

garryb59

Guest
On Sun, 12 Dec 2004 18:04:25 +0000, "Just zis Guy, you know?"
<[email protected]> wrote:

>On Sun, 12 Dec 2004 17:15:06 +0000, garryb59
><[email protected]> wrote in message
><[email protected]>:
>
>>I'd cite in this respect is BentRider Online. I'm pretty
>>sure the forum section of the web-site is moderated, and in comparison
>>to the usenet newsgroup, 'alt.rec.bicycles.recumbent' which has become
>>poisoned with so much boring mindless ********, this is refreshingly
>>welcome.

>
>You can always kf Ed, you know ;-)


Sure, I guess this would be the sensible option really, apart from the
fact that I've got some kind of inexplicable aversion to 'killfiling',
it's against my religion even though I have none! He's ok sometimes,
and he expresses his 'world view' with a kind of literary elequence
that is almost persuasive to the uninformed [:-], but other times it's
so very, very draining and depressing. Still, it is the internet
afterall.

Be interesting to meet him in RL though...is he really like that????
Bizzare stuff.

Garry
 
G

garryb59

Guest

> 'alt.rec.bicycles.recumbent'


Actually, I have to take back what I said about this ng, it's not
'that' bad!

Garry
 
P

Patrick Herring

Guest
MSeries <[email protected]> wrote:

| Just zis Guy, you know? wrote:
|
| >
| > The biggest drawback of web forums is you have to visit them each in
| > turn. Also, few of them follow the threading model particularly well.
| >
|
| What threading model ? the usenet one ? why should they ? In some
| respects the unthreaded way of forums follows real life more, hwoever
| confusing and difficult that may be it is what everyone is most familiar
| with. You are in a room with say 6 others talking about say, dynamos v
| battery lights. Points are made all the time in no order really other
| than chronological. Some are responding to earlier ones some or new.
| Some replies carry a mix of both. No real thread exists in real life one
| has to remember the material that went before.

That's why usenet is better. It enforces some useful organisation.

I don't know why web-forums don't do threading properly -
Dejanews/Google managed it. I have a suspicion that their users also
don't grok "top-posting v bottom-posting".

I'd guess the main reason web-forums appear to be proliferating and to
be popular is that they can be set up unilaterally (AIUI alt.* doesn't
really have that, despite the rumours) so any special interest subject
can have one. I'd favour a convergence towards newsgroups, but maybe
the hierarchy system wouldn't cope.

Patrick Herring, http://www.anweald.co.uk/ph.html
 
C

Chris Malcolm

Guest
[email protected] (Patrick Herring) writes:

>MSeries <[email protected]> wrote:


>| Just zis Guy, you know? wrote:


>| > The biggest drawback of web forums is you have to visit them each in
>| > turn. Also, few of them follow the threading model particularly well.


>| What threading model ? the usenet one ? why should they ? In some
>| respects the unthreaded way of forums follows real life more, hwoever
>| confusing and difficult that may be it is what everyone is most familiar
>| with. You are in a room with say 6 others talking about say, dynamos v
>| battery lights. Points are made all the time in no order really other
>| than chronological. Some are responding to earlier ones some or new.
>| Some replies carry a mix of both. No real thread exists in real life one
>| has to remember the material that went before.


>That's why usenet is better. It enforces some useful organisation.


>I don't know why web-forums don't do threading properly -
>Dejanews/Google managed it. I have a suspicion that their users also
>don't grok "top-posting v bottom-posting".


That's why they are so useful and should be encouraged. They're so
much easier and more friendly for people to use who can't follow
discussions. In time most of those twits should migrate to them and
stop polluting newsgroups with their complaints & attempts to emulate
pub conversation, which is what most of them think "Real Life" is.

--
Chris Malcolm [email protected] +44 (0)131 651 3445 DoD #205
IPAB, Informatics, JCMB, King's Buildings, Edinburgh, EH9 3JZ, UK
[http://www.dai.ed.ac.uk/homes/cam/]
 
S

Simon Brooke

Guest
in message <[email protected]>, Patrick Herring
('[email protected]') wrote:

> I'd guess the main reason web-forums appear to be proliferating and to
> be popular is that they can be set up unilaterally


The only reason web forums proliferate is because people believe you can
make money out of them. And, indeed, you can - if you develop a really
good focussed community and then sell advertising assiduously. However,
most don't, and where it works it is in my opinion verging on the
immoral, simply from the 'enclosing the commons' effect.

--
[email protected] (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/
; gif ye hes forget our auld plane Scottis quhilk your mother lerit you,
; in tymes cuming I sall wryte to you my mind in Latin, for I am nocht
; acquyntit with your Southeron
;; Letter frae Ninian Winyet tae John Knox datit 27t October 1563
 
T

Tony Raven

Guest
Simon Brooke wrote:
>
> The only reason web forums proliferate is because people believe you can
> make money out of them. And, indeed, you can - if you develop a really
> good focussed community and then sell advertising assiduously. However,
> most don't, and where it works it is in my opinion verging on the
> immoral, simply from the 'enclosing the commons' effect.
>


The Singletrack forum seems to work, not that I use it much, but I
suspect its by raising the profile of the magazine and therefore the
number of subscriptions rather than pure advertising.

Tony
 
P

Patrick Herring

Guest
[email protected] (Patrick Herring) wrote:
....
|
| Patrick Herring, http://www.anweald.co.uk/ph.html

ug, no .sigsep, hmm.

I recently finally got tired of Netscape4 being so often so crinkly
(and IE6 being so smug) so I went through an exercise of trying all
the latest versions, what fun. Settled on Opera7 for browsing and
Mozilla Thunderbird for email (didn't like Operas "filters" for
sub-folders) but stuck with Free Agent for news (I /like/ quoting with
"|" even if no one else does). Except I see MoTh puts in the .sigsep
whereas Free Agent doesn't, so now I need two .sig files, ug.

--
Patrick Herring, http://www.anweald.co.uk/ph.html
 
M

MSeries

Guest
David Hansen wrote:
> On Sun, 12 Dec 2004 07:14:39 -0700 someone who may be MSeries
> <[email protected]> wrote this:-
>
>
>>In some
>>respects the unthreaded way of forums follows real life more, hwoever
>>confusing and difficult that may be it is what everyone is most familiar
>>with. You are in a room with say 6 others talking about say, dynamos v
>>battery lights. Points are made all the time in no order really other
>>than chronological. Some are responding to earlier ones some or new.
>>Some replies carry a mix of both. No real thread exists in real life one
>>has to remember the material that went before.

>
>
> That works when one is in one room at a time.
>
>


Which I always am. :) Don't get me started with x-posting.
 
D

Dave Larrington

Guest
garryb59 wrote:

> One example I'd cite in this respect is BentRider Online. I'm pretty
> sure the forum section of the web-site is moderated, and in comparison
> to the usenet newsgroup, 'alt.rec.bicycles.recumbent' which has become
> poisoned with so much boring mindless ********, this is refreshingly
> welcome.


AFAIK 'BROL only gets moderated when Bryan thinks things have gone too far.
a.r.b.r. is 99% a Bunch of ****.

--

Dave Larrington - http://www.legslarry.beerdrinkers.co.uk/
World Domination?
Just find a world that's into that kind of thing, then chain to the
floor and walk up and down on it in high heels. (Mr. Sunshine)
 

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