What are the benefits of being a Christian? Why should I become A Christian?

[Conniebiker]

It is also clearly stated that "thou shalt not kill" yet the "christian" government of the US is happy to send troops to kill as many as possible in places like Afghanistan and Iraq.

This is one of my main problems with christianity. The adherents pick and choose quotations out of context (and ignore contradictory ones) to support whatever their position is on the subject of the moment.

Thou shalt not commit Murder. Capital punnishment is not murder in this sense. Killing in a war where the enemy will kill innocents with no remorse and will not stop until it is dead is not murder.
Find me true contradictory quotes. Many have tried through the centuries to debunk the Bible and have not succeded yet. I will not deny the supposed religious who misquote and twist the text. That is both blasphemous and wrong. News reporters do it all the time, people on this forum do it all the time. Does that make the source of the quotes inherrently wrong? I think not. I make no appology for the hypocrite.

I recommend a visit to Landover Baptist Church
Be sure to check their T-shirt selection for some interesting bible quotations!
Hmmmm, how about this one?
"Suffer not a woman to teach nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence." Timothy 2:12-15
TD

My case in point.
If I did not know the context of your quote I would very easily have been offended at the statement. But, I do know and all it reveals is your lack of understanding the meaning of it.
I make every attempt possible to not be offensive to you or anyone else especially in the matter of my religious convictions and known facts. Nonetheless, I feel I must defend my side of the debate. I can continue this as long as you so choose, but do make them count.

 

[concord]

The brick that I worship and to which I make sacrifices tells me that heaven is a lonely place and when I die there will be just me and a bunch of bricks- and all the rest of the human race will spend eternity in a cement mixer.

Now if you'll excuse me, I must go and slaughter a chicken for my brick...

TD

Well... what surprises me about your view or belief and all the negative anger towards Christianity / Christians is that you use a Bible verse as your signature file. And I'll bet you didn't even know it.

 

[William Henry]

hey buddy go get run over by a car

I think that he can say what he wants
shut up dumb but

Go away.

 

[Susan Repp]

'How to get people wound up in one easy lesson 101' ..

Don't you know that there are 3 things you do not discuss in public unless you want a punch up ..

Sex/religion & politics .. ladies and gentlemen lets get back to biking .. before we start slitting each others .. bicycle tyres

Very Spiritually Fullfilled Atheist .. thank you very much ..

 

[tyler_derden]

Yes, I'm well aware that my signature comes from that book.

I chose that because I hope it might make people think about the "childish things" they refuse to give up. Santa Claus? The tooth fairy? The Easter bunny? We all give those up at an early age. For some reason, other fantasies, that have no more basis in fact than any of those others, stay with some of us. One of the things I thought I had given up was wasting time arguing about religion.

All this silliness is almost driving me to pray for it to end. As soon as I can figure out how to unsubscribe from this thread I will be gone...

By all means, let's please get back to biking and leave Jesus where he belongs.

TD

 

[Susan Repp]

Live and let live is what I go by .. don't ram things down my throat and I will give back the same 'respect' .. this debate is thousands of years old and will go on long after we return to the earth ..

 

[Trekker2017]

'How to get people wound up in one easy lesson 101' ..

Don't you know that there are 3 things you do not discuss in public unless you want a punch up ..

Sex/religion & politics .. ladies and gentlemen lets get back to biking .. before we start slitting each others .. bicycle tyres

Very Spiritually Fullfilled Atheist .. thank you very much ..

Hey... what's wrong with sex????

 

[Susan Repp]

Hey... what's wrong with sex????

Absolutely NOTHING in my book, it is a wonderful and natural act - trouble is the religion and politics get involved and there goes another punch-up - both have being trying to control that for thousands of years as well .. control, control and more control and does it work?????????????????? Absolutely not and never will .. with that I am going to set my heart and mind free .. and ride!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Nothing is going to change my mind and I am sure those who follow whatever they wish won't either. I'm happy, they are happy!

 

[rolfdevinci]

Hmmm....for those athiests......



Dear God
Lyric by: Andy Partridge



Dear God,
hope you got the letter, and...
I pray you can make it better down here.
I don't mean a big reduction in the price of beer
but all the people that you made in your image, see
them starving on their feet 'cause they don't get
enough to eat from God, I can't believe in you

Dear God, sorry to disturb you, but... I feel that I should be heard
loud and clear. We all need a big reduction in amount of tears
and all the people that you made in your image, see them fighting
in the street 'cause they can't make opinions meet about God,
I can't believe in you

Did you make disease, and the diamond blue? Did you make
mankind after we made you? And the devil too!

Dear God, don't know if you noticed, but... your name is on
a lot of quotes in this book, and us crazy humans wrote it, you
should take a look, and all the people that you made in your
image still believing that junk is true. Well I know it ain't, and
so do you, dear God, I can't believe in I don't believe in

I won't believe in heaven and hell. No saints, no sinners, no
devil as well. No pearly gates, no thorny crown. You're always
letting us humans down. The wars you bring, the babes you
drown. Those lost at sea and never found, and it's the same the
whole world 'round. The hurt I see helps to compound that
Father, Son and Holy Ghost is just somebody's unholy hoax,
and if you're up there you'd perceive that my heart's here upon
my sleeve. If there's one thing I don't believe in

it's you... Dear God.




© 1986 Reproduced by permission of EMI Virgin Music Ltd, London WC2H 0QY

Me.........an agnostic who tries to be a decent, caring person and sees divinity in this place we call Earth.

" I don`t need no one to tell me about Heaven, I look at my daughter and I believe.
I don`t need no proof about God and truth, I look at the sunrise and I believe..."

 

[Olasnah]

<><>Killing in a war where the enemy will kill innocents with no remorse and will not stop until it is dead is not murder. <><>

What are you smoking? War IS murder. Sorry, but this "War is sanctioned by God and isn't murder" nonsense is an excuse. This is not a guiltless act we are engaged in. We are killing, and the consequences should be the same. Just because the laws of our government and our power prevents those in the military or those giving the orders from suffering the consequences of their actions, doesn't mean that they shouldn't be held accountable for them in some way. You want to villainize the enemy, go ahead, but they have just as much of a right to kill you for sending infidel soldiers into their homeland as we 'don't' for trying to steal their oil and economic future from them. We kill innocents with no remorse too. It's war, but it isn't moral. You find me a soldier who feels good or justified about killing, I'll show you a certifiably insane person. I was involved in the deaths of 'people' back in the first Gulf war, and although it was not my decision in so many words, I pulled the trigger, and I will pay for it when the time comes. I'm not religious, but personally, it would be a just thing for me to have some sort of reckoning before or after I die.

 

[meehs]

Find me true contradictory quotes...

Are you KIDDING me??? The Bible is loaded with contradictions! It's one of the primary arguments that "non-believers" throw out there. There are tons of blogs and websites dedicated to discussing contradictions in the Bible! You can start here:

http://www.infidels.org/library/modern/jim_meritt/bible-contradictions.html#good_to_all

Here's a better one:

http://www.atheists.org/christianity/contradictions.html

Let me know if you want more.

I'm fascinated by religion and I don't really want to dissuade anyone from their beliefs at all. I'm agnostic as hell myself (pun intended). But c'mon, making a statement like that only shows your naivity when it comes to this subject.

What gets me is how Christains pretty much condemn to "hell" the billions of people throughout the world (far outnumbering Christians themselves) who believe in much older religions (which are supported by their own "mystic tomes" that are older and - to their followers - just as just as viable as The Bible by the way). They evidently either ignore or just disbelieve these books, but their beloved Bible is beyond reproach.

 

[Conniebiker]

Are you KIDDING me??? The Bible is loaded with contradictions! It's one of the primary arguments that "non-believers" throw out there. There are tons of blogs and websites dedicated to discussing contradictions in the Bible! You can start here:

http://www.infidels.org/library/modern/jim_meritt/bible-contradictions.html#good_to_all

I'm fascinated by religion and I don't really want to dissuade anyone from their beliefs at all. I'm agnostic as hell myself (pun intended). But c'mon, making a statement like that only shows your naivity when it comes to this subject.

What gets me is how Christains pretty much condemn to "hell" the billions of people throughout the world (far outnumbering Christians themselves) who believe in much older religions (which are supported by their own "mystic tomes" that are older and - to their followers - just as just as viable as The Bible by the way). They evidently either ignore or just disbelieve these books, but their beloved Bible is beyond reproach.

Ill put it to you this way. I do not have all the arguments in my memory, but I have grown up being taught the stuff, went to a Bible college, and I have yet to see a person who truly looked for themselves find these "contradictions" to be accurate.
Furthermore, I do not care what someone says on the matter in relation to my faith, I am a believer and that is that. If you are not, it is your right not to, but I do not agree with it.

 

[Susan Repp]

How can war ever be justified? In particular a Holy war. What would a God think of what we do in his/her name? For the simple reason that others believe in something else. How many innocents can we count in thousands of years who have died for not believing in what another believes? Do we learn anything from history or do we not wish to? I cannot hate or wish ill on another human being purely because they are not white, female, non-religous, 5' 5" or any other ridiculous reason. Where is the tolerance that religion speaks of as I see none .. if I had been born 400 years ago I would have been tortured and burnt at the stake for my beliefs and my thinking .. such was the sin then ..

It was stated and presumed that I do not have peace within my heart because I don't have a God. How can you know this when you never want to ask about what I believe in but only about what you have found. I have yet to have an open discussion with a religious person on the subject .. why is this? What is so scary about us non-believers? Does it make you question your belief, is your head and heart still questioning! How can I possibly find strength and purpose without such a God? I have and will continue to do so!

Who is this person that started this thread and why is it we do not know who this person is or where he/she lives ..

 

[Susan Repp]

Speaking of religious books .. do people of a particular faith read anything of other religions just to see what they are about? There is a book out there that many would chose not to read and is called "The Hammer of Witches" - the book written by the clergy to rid Europe of non-believers .. how about a couple of million souls later .. interesting and very, very scary stuff.

 

[Conniebiker]

How can war ever be justified? In particular a Holy war. What would a God think of what we do in his/her name? For the simple reason that others believe in something else. How many innocents can we count in thousands of years who have died for not believing in what another believes? Do we learn anything from history or do we not wish to? I cannot hate or wish ill on another human being purely because they are not white, female, non-religous, 5' 5" or any other ridiculous reason. Where is the tolerance that religion speaks of as I see none .. if I had been born 400 years ago I would have been tortured and burnt at the stake for my beliefs and my thinking .. such was the sin then ..

It was stated and presumed that I do not have peace within my heart because I don't have a God. How can you know this when you never want to ask about what I believe in but only about what you have found. I have yet to have an open discussion with a religious person on the subject .. why is this? What is so scary about us non-believers? Does it make you question your belief, is your head and heart still questioning! How can I possibly find strength and purpose without such a God? I have and will continue to do so!

Who is this person that started this thread and why is it we do not know who this person is or where he/she lives ..

I agree that this is not the best venue for such a debate. "holy war" is not a christian thing. The nearest resemblance was the twisted idiotic era of the crusades, an era marked by ignorance. The God in whom I believe has no wish for people to die in an ideal sense. He also has a perspective outside that of our corporeal senses, so I will not claim to understand the full purpose for calamity and disaster other than the world is not perfect. It was in the beginning, but God gave us the choice of doing what we wished with it and one of those choices was selfishness, which separated our fellowship with him. In our separated state we fabricate all manner of things to mask this natural place in our being. False gods, idols, worshiping earth, etc.
To those of us who find the true God and fellowship with him, he forgives our inherent guilt and imperfection and grants us entrance to heaven. There is no imperfection in his presence, thus no man can enter his presence unless he is forgiven and 'cleansed from all unrighteousness'. We do not earn this status, that is the element of true christianity that requires faith and that no other religion can allow.

 

[Susan Repp]

To those of us who find the true God and fellowship with him, he forgives our inherent guilt and imperfection and grants us entrance to heaven. There is no imperfection in his presence, thus no man can enter his presence unless he is forgiven and 'cleansed from all unrighteousness'. We do not earn this status, that is the element of true christianity that requires faith and that no other religion can allow.[/QUOTE]

Call wars what you will; but, the majority of wars present and past tie for the same cause. Christians are not the only culprits. The Crusades you speak of where based in ignorance but at the time they believed they were doing what God wished them to do. All faiths believe they are correct, all believe they are doing Gods work but when does this God say enough is enough? Where does all this lead and end? how many people have to die? You say you do not know what the full purpose of all this is .. why does God not tell his followers so they do understand. He appears to tell his followers of other things. If he has the ability to stop all of this then surely he should. Does he not care for his flock? Who decides what is a false God! How do you truly know that you have chosen the correct God!

I noticed that you mentioned worshipping the earth? Is this the earth which your God created? This beautiful earth that we destroy on a daily basis when it sustains our life! (another thread). I admire and respect that you and others love your God and live by his commandments. What I do not embrace is the fact that you cannot return the respect. My faith in whatever I believe in is just as strong as yours and has as much meaning though it is different. I don't tell you that horrible things will happen if you don't comply, I don't presume I am better than you and last but not least I do not try to disuade you from your faith. It is very presumptious to think that the followers of your faith are the only ones that have the 'right' to go to heaven' .. it is one perspective out of many ..

I do not know any more than the next person that is certain. I want to learn about all mankind because it is knowledge. I never want to become so narrow-minded that I no longer see other people for what they are - different! This is what makes the world so fascinating and yes, sometimes frightening.

You should be able to worship your God just as I should live my life as I see fit. What happens if someone decides that you are no longer following the 'right' God and persecutes you? I can imagine that you will stand firm and fight for your cause and rightly so!

 

[Conniebiker]

I fully understand your points. To explain why I know why the God I trust and belive is the true god is hard to explain within the confines of this medium. Yes every religion claims to have the absolute way to heaven(or nirvana or whatever), but the nature of absolutes is that there is only one.
When I say that the will of God is not for me to know, I do not mean that in airheaded flippantness. I mean that He grants us what part of His will is for us to know and do, the rest is beyond our needs(and sometimes thoughts).
I can say with all earnesty, that I will not condemn you and say you are a heathen. That is not my place. My duty is to present to you as best I can the facts I know and the peace within my soul that only comes from the true God. What you do with them is up to you.

 

[Susan Repp]

I fully understand your points. To explain why I know why the God I trust and belive is the true god is hard to explain within the confines of this medium. Yes every religion claims to have the absolute way to heaven(or nirvana or whatever), but the nature of absolutes is that there is only one.
When I say that the will of God is not for me to know, I do not mean that in airheaded flippantness. I mean that He grants us what part of His will is for us to know and do, the rest is beyond our needs(and sometimes thoughts).
I can say with all earnesty, that I will not condemn you and say you are a heathen. That is not my place. My duty is to present to you as best I can the facts I know and the peace within my soul that only comes from the true God. What you do with them is up to you.

I also find it hard to explain with mere 'words' the complexity of this subject. We could disect and evaluate each side of the table until the cows come home. If there is one, then what 'One' is the 'one' and all proclaim to have it and that is where faith holds fast to each. Wouldn't a God wish for his followers to know so that they can truly reach what he requires of you? We might never reach this because we are not perfect but I believe most people would like to strive to be better people. I know I do. It would also not be my place to call you other than what you are and that is a believer of your God. I cannot even say you are wrong because it is right for you.

I do have peace in my soul, believe it or not, and I do not know of any person who can judge what is inside my heart. They cannot see inside and tell me it does not exist. All I know is it is there. In my life the people who judge me and others are religious and the people who have not are of similar thinking to me.

One of the strangest things I find living her in the U.S. is I have never had my 'faith or non faith' questioned so much. I was always judged on 'me' the person. I still to this day do not know what faith my friends belong to and nor do I care & vice-versa.

Despite our differences I am enjoying this debate though restrained through the written word.

 

[Conniebiker]

I too find this stimulating.
This is simple subject with many aspects and complications. Having grown up as a missionarie's kid in the Asia region I have been used to being one of many religions. But they lack completeness in my opinion. To term true christianity as a religion is not something I like to do. It is not religion I am out for. Catholics have that down to a t, but they lack certainty. Almost all of the religions I have observed lacked the certainty of eternal security. I know that when I die I am going to the better place. We are most definitely imperfect people, that is why the forgiveness of God is so significant. When we truly realise we cannot earn our way to eternity or nirvanna or whatever you want to call it, and we ask Him to forgive us for trying to find our own way without him, He will extend to us his love. This love covers our imperfections in the view of eternity. That does not mean that I have carte blance to be unholy. Far be it. It makes me more greatful and want to please him and do his will. It is this fact that drives true believers to evangelise and help people.
The words of God for us to know apart from prayer are in the Bible, aka the Word of God. Not the catholic book or the book of mormon, they were both corruptions of the long existing Holy Bible. It even predates the Koran.

 

[Ike90]

Not the catholic book or the book of mormon, they were both corruptions of the long existing Holy Bible. It even predates the Koran.

There is no such thing as an "uncorrupted" Holy Bible. If you wish to believe that God "wrote it," that's your business, but it was assembled, edited, and produced by man, therefore it is by definition "corrupted," at least to some extent. There are many "books" which have been added and/or deleted from the Bible through the centuries, and those changes were always made by man, not by God.

I also find it interesting that you purport to know how a person can make their way to "eternity or Nirvana or whatever you want to call it," yet you clearly state that "whatever we want to call it" is unachievable without disavowing all "corrupted" books.

Who would ever guess that the only way to fulfill God's wishes is to follow one specific and extremely narrow path of which only a tiny fraction of this planet's residents are even aware? That is one cruel God.