What Is Considered A "entry Level" Bike

Discussion in 'Bike buying advice' started by Uawadall, Sep 7, 2015.

  1. Uawadall

    Uawadall Well-Known Member

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    I often hear the term and its seems obvious enough,but what price range would you consider "entry level"? Anything that retails for under $800, under $1000?Are bikes labeled "entry level" based on components and specs alone?
     
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  2. mpre53

    mpre53 Well-Known Member

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    Entry level is alloy frame, cheap wheels, and either Claris or Sora for a component group. Some give you a carbon fork with an alloy steerer, some give you an alloy fork. Brakes are usually Tektro, and crank is FSA.

    $800 is a good starting point for Claris, although some of the second tier brands like Fuji, GT, Diamondback, and a lot of Bikes Direct models can be lower. I say second tier not because of quality, but because the brands are sold in box stores as well as bike shops, except for Bikes Direct, which is sold exclusively online. At $1000 you move into Sora territory and possibly slightly better wheels. I'd say $1500 is where you move out of the entry level price range, with respect to alloy frames.

    SRAM really doesn't have an entry level component group. Neither does Campy.
     
  3. sunshiney

    sunshiney Member

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    I think it's so dependent on what you're planning to use it for. Up until I was 20 or so I rode a variety of either cheap Walmart or Canadian Tire bikes mixed with a few random hand-me-downs. The last bike I had before I switched to a 'real' one was a super old, incredibly beat up retro style bike I got from an antique store.

    I was using it to commute with and my route was along a hilly, two lane route with no bike lanes and a gravel shoulder and it was just torture to ride. The front tire was slightly bent so it drifted to one side and it creaked like a haunted playground. That was when I was working on a small island that was a ferry ride away from my home, and on the last day of that job I just abandoned the bike at the ferry landing. The culture of that island was that someone else immediately started using that bike so for all I know it's still being passed around the community.

    All that considered, an 'entry level' bike for me is probably a bit less expensive than most people would go for but I think somewhere in the $200-$300 range either new from a department store or used from a more serious cyclist would probably be more than enough for a beginner.

    For me entry level is anything than can comfortably get you from point a to point b, on the road at least. Mountain biking is a bit of a different story as far as choosing the bike, but the same price range would probably still suffice.
     
  4. maydog

    maydog Well-Known Member

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    Entry level is what cost-conscious, experienced riders wield when crushing unsuspecting Freds.
     
  5. Uawadall

    Uawadall Well-Known Member

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  6. Volnix

    Volnix Well-Known Member

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    Campy Veloce is the same price with Shimano Claris in some parts... The deraileurs are more expensive but the shifters are same price... Much nicer then Claris IMO...
     
  7. mpre53

    mpre53 Well-Known Member

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    And I can't think of a single production bike sold in the US that has Veloce. I think the Trek Project 1 Campy options start at Athena?? Haven't looked in awhile.

    Scratch that. No Campy groups offered currently.
     
  8. mpre53

    mpre53 Well-Known Member

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    Ah, at last. Bianchi Infinito, $2699. A little above entry level.
     
  9. Froze

    Froze Well-Known Member

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    Entry level according to the average buyer is about $800 but I think that's way too high! I think $250 to $350 range is all a beginner should spend for a good used bike off of Craigslist. Problem with most beginner cyclist, or any fitness program, is that they do it for about 3 to 6 months then get lazy and quit, so then, in the case of cycling, the once beginner now has $800 plus for what is now called garage art. So buy a $250 used bike, and if you're still riding it in 3 years steadily then consider going to a new and better bike in the $1800 range, this will also give you 3 years or so to save money for the better bike.
     
  10. Volnix

    Volnix Well-Known Member

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    Yep Bianchi does Campy. Riddley too.

    Bottechia probably does Campy too. Bottechia is a sponsor in the local "nice" team here...
     
  11. Sunflogun

    Sunflogun Member

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    An entry level bike it's a cheap one, but this doesn't mean it doesn't has quality. We just need to buy it in the right place for that.
     
  12. mpre53

    mpre53 Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, when I think "entry level" in the States, I think 8-9 speeds, Claris or Sora. I consider Veloce, Apex, and even Tiagra as being a step above entry level.
     
  13. CAMPYBOB

    CAMPYBOB Well-Known Member

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    105 11-speed and an alloy frame is an entry level road bike in my area.

    While I do see clunky 9-speed hybrid bikes on the bike paths, even there the narrow trails are choked with $2000-$2500+ trikes and recumbents. Once folks decide to ditch the $400 Electra Townie with $300 worth of crap bolted to it they generally step up to Spesh Roubaix, Cannonwhale Synapse or one of the ten thousand Domane's smoothing out those ultra-harsh paved bike trails in N.E. Ohio.

    That's just my little corner of the universe though.

    Campy? Not one rider in a hundred even knows it exists. Of the 1% that do, 95% are too damned cheap to spend the money on it...preferring to buy that sweet 'Laminated Leather' recliner for the den. Since shitmaNO reduced the road bike to an appliance not one rider in 1000 has the good taste or good sense to ride a high quality component...even after springing $7,500 on a 650 gram paper-thin wall carbon frame.
     
  14. Froze

    Froze Well-Known Member

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    Campy Bob, I like you so don't take this as a rub against you. I use to live in California and knew quite a few cat3 racers in Bakersfield, and back in the early 2000's when I lived there there were quite a few Cat 3ers using Shimano 105 and alloy frames, or Shimano 105 and CF frames. Why was that? Because these racers were self financed, and racing in the amateur level is often an experience of crash marred events which destroyed components and or frames, and for the average self financed racer they couldn't afford to replace Dura Ace parts or expensive CF frames or CF forks or CF wheels. I never knew any amateur racer that was running $7,500 CF wheels or even $3,750 wheels at least back then. Maybe in some cities where there's a gaggle of very wealthy amateur riders you might see that but I never did.

    I have a bike with 07 Campy Athena on it, is it superior to the 13 Shamino 105 I have? (actually I'm using Ultegra rear and Dura Ace 9000 cables) Honestly I don't know because I haven't ridden that bike much, but it does seem a tiny bit smoother than a bike I tried that had all 105 and lower end cables, with my setup I can't tell the difference even though supposedly Athena compares to Ultegra not 105; durability cannot be answered by me at this time; and intuitively the Shamino wins again in my opinion. The only reason I got the Campy was because I bought the bike in England and the bike shop could get me Athena for about the price of the previous year of Tiagra would have cost here in America! So I couldn't pass that deal up. But really the biggest difference between the two is in the looks department, Athena (at least the 07 model) looks far better. Here in America 105 is the best all around groupset for the money in my opinion, some will argue that the Ultegra is the best value for the money, but I don't see it.

    But for you to go off and say Campy the best and the rest is junk isn't very knowledgeable. If that were true most pros would be riding the better groupset. Now Campy is running in fear mode, their recently released Record looks very much like the ugly Shamino Dura Ace. People that buy Campy do so because it's iconic and unusual which in that last department is it's downfall here in America where sometimes getting parts means waiting. I think that Super Record is superior to anything that Shamino puts out but I can't recall one pro racer that uses that stuff. And with Shamino 10 speed you can mix and match cheaper parts like cassettes, chains, and chain rings, but you can't do that with Campy. However Campy has, or use to have, fully rebuildable levers, Shamino does not. But Shamino splined BB is more durable than Campy's square taper however having owned square tapers including one that has over 160,000 miles on it I don't see the advantage.

    Here's another take on Campy: http://www.faston2wheels.com/f2/2010/04/19/my-thoughts-and-experience-with-campagnolos-11-speed-chorus-groupset/

    I guess in a nutshell it reminds me of an old saying: You are not the contents of your wallet; nor are you defined by the component group you choose.
     
  15. CAMPYBOB

    CAMPYBOB Well-Known Member

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    I ran the wheel support truck for a LOCAL road race back about 10 years ago. The Cat. 4 race stuffed my truck with SPARE Powertap wheels and the bed reaked of carbon. Self-financed? Yeah...with the ephasis on 'finance'. I watched a fall going up the first climb of 5 race (morons up front forgot to shift or over-estimated their legs) when two guys tangles at 7-10 MPH and just fell over on each other. One got up and stood his bike up to find the head tube had snapped of the frame and the cables were the only thing holding it on. Yeah...back-of-the-pack riders on carbon in a 5 race. And Ohio is NOT a particularly wealthy state.

    Either you have it or you don't. It's just that simple. Sure, there's tham that got, but George squints when the wallet is opened. There's descriptive phrases for those sorts.

    This is America, comrade. We are, indeed, defined by our wallets. To say otherwise is dishonest. In the race you need legs. In life you need dollars. In bike racing you need both.

    In complete agreement with your sentiment that some 'smart' racers bomb the crits on alloy el cheapo frames and a mix of parts bin components as an insurance policy. Those guys are pretty rare in my area and when it's a road race those bikes stay at home and the Cinelli or Dogma comes out to play. And God help you if you show up at the local 20K ITT or TTT on anything less than the latest aero road rocket in a skinsuit, aero lid, aero bottles, aero wheels worth a couple grand or more. Yeah, there's always 'that guy' that shows up with fabric wheel covers (oh...all right. We'll let you enter with those...), but then again, there's always going to be 'that guy' in any endeavor.


    "But for you to go off and say Campy the best and the rest is junk isn't very knowledgeable."

    A Buick isn't junk. But it sure as Hell isn't a Corvette. To say that there is NOT a difference isn't very knowledgeable IMO.


    "If that were true most pros would be riding the better groupset."

    Professionals ride what they are paid to sit on...except for when the names are blacked out with a magic marker or tape.


    "Now Campy is running in fear mode, their recently released Record looks very much like the ugly Shamino Dura Ace."

    What you meant to say was their crankset looks very much like the ugly shitmaNO stuff. Except that the Campy version is both carbon fiber and very handsome. What you forgot to mention was that shitmaNO copied 4-arm spiders that were around for years in the mountain bike product range.


    "People that buy Campy do so because it's iconic and unusual which in that last department is it's downfall here in America where sometimes getting parts means waiting."

    Iconic? Well, I buy it for its superior function, superior durability, superior finishes, superior materials, superior technology, superior designs and superior craftsmanship. As far as parts go, I can get just about any Campy part I need to rebuild or repair or replace what I own in under 48 hours. Most shitmaNO small parts are just plain unavailable over any time period and their components are not repairable or rebuildable. That's just one more area of Campagnolo superiority.

    All of the local bike shops sell shitmaNO. NONE of them stock shitmaNO pieces parts. Not even shitmaNO cables...Jagwire or such, yes. I wanted to try shimaNO pedal on that TREK I bought last winter. Guess what? Not a single local area shop had 105, Ultegra or Dura-Ass in stock. None. Chain Reaction and Planet Cylclery supplied those and the 39-53 rings and the 11-25 cassette I needed. shitmaNO availability? Yeah...maybe if you can ride with the crap that bolted onto all the geezer bikes shitmaNO equips nowadays. For me? Not so much.‚Äč


    "I think that Super Record is superior to anything that Shamino puts out but I can't recall one pro racer that uses that stuff."

    There are several Pro Tour, Pro Continental and Continental teams using Campagnolo.


    "And with Shamino 10 speed you can mix and match cheaper parts like cassettes, chains, and chain rings, but you can't do that with Campy."

    Where did you come up with this? I use Chorus/Athena chains and cassettes on Record cranksets and derailleurs. You're losing me here....

    I used to mix Victory with C-Record back in the 1980's.


    "However Campy has, or use to have, fully rebuildable levers, Shamino does not. But Shamino splined BB is more durable than Campy's square taper however having owned square tapers including one that has over 160,000 miles on it I don't see the advantage."

    I'm not sure what you just said there, but I think you just argued with yourself...and lost the argument.


    "Here's another take on Campy: http://www.faston2wh...horus-groupset/"

    He lost all validity with this statement: "Having been a Shimano person for a long time,". Sorry to hear that, but some folks are just not any more fixable than shitmaNO, itself.

    Then the writer spews this bit of moronic bullshit: "Quite simply, no one was able to get this groupset to shift right for me.". Oy Vey! Either this dweeb that couldn't even work on his own bike went to five of the dumbest wrenches on the planet or he's the most cursed bike rider in the universe! A bicycle, even an 11-speed mechanically shifted one, is a VERY simple device.

    Even then, we have supposedly intelligent men on this forum flat out stating the Hirth Joint has an "air gap" in it if you shim the spindle of an UltraTorque crank.

    Frankly, when it comes to cycling I've never met so many cheap bastards afraid to spend a buck on a device they spend untold hours of their lives putting energy into getting it to move onward and upward AND as many idiots that can't even get their machines to shift better than a 1970's friction setup. It blows my mind to know there are that many stupid people on this little rock hurtling through space.


    "I guess in a nutshell it reminds me of an old saying: You are not the contents of your wallet; nor are you defined by the component group you choose."

    While not the sole defining attributes of a rider by any means, both factors are definitely in the mix. Let's just agree that we disagree on both of your assertions.

    And Froze, nothing you said was taken personally and nothing in my reply is intended to be fodder for trolling on my part. Just my nearly worthless opinion of 45 seasons on Campy (with some Zeus, Triplex Sport, Huret, Simplex and what not thrown in for variety) and one 1000-mile Winter on the new 11-speed 105. Just FWIW, the 105 is mostly Meh crap, but the Ultegra pedals are really some pretty decent units.
     
  16. CAMPYBOB

    CAMPYBOB Well-Known Member

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    4-arm cranksets have been around since the dawn of recorded history...OK, maybe a little less time than that, but...

    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/c/c9/Phoenix_chainring.jpg

    [​IMG]

    I have a Campagnolo 3-arm (often called a 3-pin) Gran Sport crankset. When shitmaNO goes into the next new fad thing...I'm suing the bastards!

    [​IMG]

    The next big thing?
     
  17. CAMPYBOB

    CAMPYBOB Well-Known Member

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    "I think that Super Record is superior to anything that Shamino puts out but I can't recall one pro racer that uses that stuff."

    Allow me to refresh your memory...

    There's a race going on in Spain right now...being won by a guy named Fabio Aru. On Campagnolo...the world's finest components. You may also have heard of his team mate...Nibali. AKA "The Accelerator"...Fuglsang...Lars Boom...Dario Cataldo...Scarponi...Tiralongo...Westra...Zeits...Taarame...Grivko...Guardini...

    Yes, Astana rides Campagnolo.

    As does Lotto Soudal. Declercq...Gallopin...Greipel...Van den Broeck...Adam Hansen...Debusschere...Boeckmans...Monfort...

    As do the boys from Europcar. Tommy Voeckler...Boudet...Arashiro...Coquard...Rolland...

    And the Movistar squad with their twin threats Nairo Quintana and the venerable Valverde. Also...Andrey Amador...Alex Dowsett...Cappechi...Benat Intxausti...Izagirre...Soler...Giovanni Visconti...Ventoso...John Gadret...

    Aside from those, Bardiani Valvole, Vini Fantini, Wiggle Honda and some other notable squads and racers use the finest components ever designed...Campagnolo!

    If you can't remember even a single racer that excels on Campagnolo, perhaps you can not remember why Campagnolo is the very best...far and away the premier components of both professional and amateur road cycling.

    Mr. Aru...the picture should help jog your memory...

    [​IMG]
     
  18. CAMPYBOB

    CAMPYBOB Well-Known Member

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    More riders on Campagnolo...

    Enrico Battaglin...Nicola Boem...Andrea Manfredi...Damiano Cunego...

    JLT-Condor ride the finest! Decidely NOT entry level goods.

    [​IMG]
     
  19. CAMPYBOB

    CAMPYBOB Well-Known Member

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    Entry level Campagnolo on a Bianchi alloy frame: A 2014 C2C Impulso model. In a few weeks the 2015 equivalent will be on sale somewhere for around the same money.

    http://www.slanecycles.com/bianchi-c2c-impulso-57cm-veloce-bike-celeste-black-2014-p-25208.html?language=en&currency=USD&delivery=223&fo_c=322&fo_k=8213a664fe98682bff111eec5fcee6c4&fo_s=gplaus&gclid=CJ6a4ezJ8scCFYM9aQod2ycCIw

    [​IMG]

    That's around $1,300 U.S. at Slane.

    Or a 2015 Nirone with Xenon for $1240. Not having shitmaNO never looked so good!

    [​IMG]
     
  20. Froze

    Froze Well-Known Member

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    A Buick isn't junk. But it sure as Hell isn't a Corvette. To say that there is NOT a difference isn't very knowledgeable IMO.

    You're not doing a fair comparison, if Shamano is a Buick, then Campy would be a Cadillac not a Corvette, having Campy doesn't make the bike faster. There isn't a lot of difference between Shamano and Campy other than what I already mentioned with looks, maybe durability might be a tad better but when you're paying quite a bit more for Campy durability should be better! This expense thing is why I didn't go with Dura Ace on my newest bike, because Dura Ace uses titanium gears which don't last as long as steel, but more importantly the cost dollar to gram goes way up while the durability goes down.

    And you mentioned pro teams, well I found a website that shows what teams are using what and the use of Campy on pro bikes, out of 18 teams only 5 are using Campy, and 3 are using SRAM, which means that the majority of race teams are using Shamano; see: http://cdn.velonews.competitor.com/files/2014/01/chart.jpeg That chart is for the 2014 pro teams. However for 2015 some teams have dropped away from Campy, this year there are only 3 teams running Campy, and SRAM has taken a hit too with only 1 team, this means the overwhelming majority has gone with Shamano; http://inrng.com/2015/01/2015-pro-team-bikes/

    So your beloved Campy isn't doing so well in the pro circuit why is that? Price vs durability, while it might be true that Campy may be a tad more durable (note I said might be) it isn't enough durability to justify the price and teams need to save money so they go with the brand that offers the best of both worlds.

    Ok, that's weird I can't get the blue out of the last paragraph.
     
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