What is Quackery?

Discussion in 'Health and medical' started by John 'the Man', Nov 9, 2003.

  1. Alan Turley

    Alan Turley Guest

    On Thu, 13 Nov 2003 01:26:58 GMT, John wrote:

    >Now, you ... out of the blue ... start claiming that members of your
    >own rank practice alternative medicine, but are not Quacks because
    >they are Licensed Quacks. How sad. :(


    A truly pathetic mischaracterization, John. But, you call yourself a
    man, and you promised that you'd leave. So, this latest ruse should
    come as no surprise. We should be used to your being a liar by now.

    @~
     


  2. Once upon a time, our fellow Alan Turley
    rambled on about "Re: What is Quackery?."
    Our champion De-Medicalizing in sci.med.nutrition retorts, thusly ...

    > We should be used to your being a liar by now.


    We should all be used to your insistence on making a fool of yourself
    in public, too. But we all need a good chuckle every now and then.
    Thanks for the memories, Alan.

    Just thought that you might want to know. :)
     
  3. Alan Turley

    Alan Turley Guest

    On Thu, 13 Nov 2003 12:59:47 GMT, John wrote:

    >We should all be used to your insistence on making a fool of yourself
    >in public, too. But we all need a good chuckle every now and then.
    >Thanks for the memories, Alan.


    One can only imagine that you define /fool/ with all the skill and
    accuracy that you define medical terms. You almost certainly envision
    yourself to be quite clever, which is the hysterical irony after all.

    I imagine that you are quite happy with your lot in life, John. If
    ignorance's axiom is true, then you must certainly live in bliss.

    @~
     
  4. "Alan Turley" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]
    > On Wed, 12 Nov 2003 19:12:41 -0500, Orac wrote:
    >
    > >Actually, yes. I know several physicians who prescribe such things. I
    > >also know at least two who do scientific studies of herbs as anticancer
    > >therapies. You really need to get up to date here; your understanding of
    > >what is "conventional" and what is "alternative" is way behind the times.

    >
    > Now, hold the phone there, doc. Are you trying to suggest that you
    > are no longer practicing medicine by the guidelines to which doctors
    > might have adhered in 1928? Say it ain't so!
    >
    > Next, I suppose you'll try to make some sort of comments denying that
    > modern practitioners use magic to empower their therapies. Accepting
    > John's /learned/ counsel as true, I would find that sort of comment a
    > little hard to believe.
    >
    > @~


    Life expectancy still is rising, despite all the warnings from the
    medical-industrial complex that we are killing ourselves with bad habits.
    Each disease-militant shills for his or her own disease (example:
    cholesterol), while ignoring never showing that they are not doing anything
    more than changing what you die of. I was at an empidemology meeting last
    week where the joke was that now that funding for standard diseases is
    leveling off, if you want a new grant you have to show a new disease. Thus
    we have the shift into blame-the-patient, i.e food, exercise and lifestyle.
    Standard medicine is now going off in that direction.
     
  5. "Orac" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:eek:[email protected]
    > In article <[email protected]>,
    > John 'the Man' <[email protected]> wrote:
    >
    > > Once upon a time, our fellow Orac
    > > rambled on about "Re: What is Quackery?."
    > > Our champion De-Medicalizing in sci.med.nutrition retorts, thusly ...
    > >
    > > >It is not up to Mark (or me, for that matter) to do YOUR work and prove
    > > >YOUR assertion for you. He who asserts must prove.

    > >
    > > And, so we have.

    >
    > Really? When and where? I have yet to see your "proof." All I've seen so
    > far is opinion that isn't even supported by even a reasonable attempt to
    > post decent evidence or arguments. Certainly your "proof" has not been
    > posted here in this newsgroup, as far as I can tell.
    >
    >
    > >We are still waiting for an intelligent response
    > > with bated breath. :)

    >
    > And I'll try to give you one if and when you actually bother to post
    > some evidence backed by sound scientific studies, rather than anecdotes,
    > testimonials, confusion of fluoridosis with dental caries, or logical
    > fallacies. ;-)
    >
    >
    > > So, please stop ignoring our strongest replies with your silence.

    >
    > Those were your "strongest" replies? I didn't realize that because all I
    > saw was a bunch of assertions without any scientific evidence to support
    > them. I had thought you were just dodging my questions, but apparently
    > you were "hitting me with your best shot." Sorry I didn't notice.
    >
    > You may or may not believe this, but I had been kind of hoping to be
    > challenged, to have someone who could actually make me think about the
    > issue in a way I hadn't thought about it before. Unfortunately, if those
    > were your "strongest" replies, it's obvious that you aren't the one who
    > is going to challenge me or to teach me anything new.
    >


    Of course, standard medicine does not offer proofs that life expectancy is
    the goal of treatments either. Rather, we have intermediate goals which
    support putting virtually everyone on a battery of highly profitable drugs
    and an ever-increase proportion of the national income going to the process
    at the rate of 16-20% increases per year.
     
  6. "Orac" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:eek:[email protected]
    > In article <[email protected]>,
    > "Marko Proberto" <[email protected]> wrote:
    >
    > > "Jez" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > > news:[email protected]
    > > >
    > > > "Orac" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > > > news:eek:[email protected]
    > > > > In article <[email protected]>,
    > > > > "Marko Proberto" <[email protected]> wrote:
    > > > >
    > > > > > "Jez" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > > > > > news:[email protected]

    >
    > > > > > > Water fluoridation has been proved to cause more
    > > > > > > caries than it prevents.
    > > > > > > Go read up on Basel..Switzerland.
    > > > > >
    > > > > > Provide the URL for your assertion.
    > > > >
    > > > > Personally, I'd prefer a reference to a scientific study published

    in
    > > > > the peer-reviewed scientific literature. Anyone can come up with a

    URL
    > > > > to some anti-fluoridation site run by "advocates," and I'm sure

    "Jez" is
    > > > > quite capable of coming up with the URL to some kook site or other.
    > > > >
    > > > Aww more asshole-ness
    > > > I'm against mass-medication...so therefore must be a 'kook'
    > > > Not with the Nazis were ya?

    > >
    > > BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! Sort of like calling Hitler a Jew.

    >
    > Well, we can't expect him to know of my small efforts combatting
    > Holocaust denial, now can we? ;-)


    Of course not. That would mean that jez has a clue.

    > > BTW, GODWIN.

    >
    > I beat you to it... ;-)


    OK, but it was so classical a Godwin violation that I just had to point it
    out.
     
  7. Orac

    Orac Guest

    In article <[email protected]>,
    John 'the Man' <[email protected]> wrote:

    > Once upon a time, our fellow Orac
    > rambled on about "Re: What is Quackery?."
    > Our champion De-Medicalizing in sci.med.nutrition retorts, thusly ...
    >
    > >> >> Originally medicine had only one mode of treatment: Medicine.
    > >>
    > >> >The use of herbal "medicines" by "alternative" medicine practioners is
    > >> >not "medicine"?
    > >>
    > >> Quoting Webster's 1828 Dictionary:
    > >> http://65.66.134.201/cgi-bin/webster/webster.exe?search_for_d:/inetpub/wwwr
    > >> oot
    > >> /cgi-bin/webster/web1828=medicine
    > >> "Simples, plants and minerals furnish most of our medicines."
    > >>
    > >> http://tutorials.naturalhealthperspective.com/history.html
    > >> "Until the 1800's most drugs were given by mouth as preparations of
    > >> crude plants: ground-up leave, flowers, and roots, or teas, extracts,
    > >> and tinctures of them."[3]
    > >>
    > >> So you are saying that physicians prescribe "ground-up leave, flowers,
    > >> and roots?"

    >
    > >Actually, yes. I know several physicians who prescribe such things.

    >
    > Ah! Then you know several practitioners of alternative medicine. How
    > fortunate for you.


    Well, not exactly. They are all oncologists who primarily use
    chemotherapy to treat cancer.
    --
    Orac |"A statement of fact cannot be insolent."
    |
    |"If you cannot listen to the answers, why do you
    | inconvenience me with questions?"
     
  8. Orac

    Orac Guest

    In article <%lMsb.8232$p%[email protected]>,
    "Marko Proberto" <[email protected]> wrote:

    > "Orac" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > news:eek:[email protected]
    > > In article <[email protected]>,
    > > "Marko Proberto" <[email protected]> wrote:
    > >
    > > > "Jez" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > > > news:[email protected]
    > > > >
    > > > > "Orac" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > > > > news:eek:[email protected]
    > > > > > In article <[email protected]>,
    > > > > > "Marko Proberto" <[email protected]> wrote:
    > > > > >
    > > > > > > "Jez" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > > > > > > news:[email protected]

    > >
    > > > > > > > Water fluoridation has been proved to cause more
    > > > > > > > caries than it prevents.
    > > > > > > > Go read up on Basel..Switzerland.
    > > > > > >
    > > > > > > Provide the URL for your assertion.
    > > > > >
    > > > > > Personally, I'd prefer a reference to a scientific study published

    > in
    > > > > > the peer-reviewed scientific literature. Anyone can come up with a

    > URL
    > > > > > to some anti-fluoridation site run by "advocates," and I'm sure

    > "Jez" is
    > > > > > quite capable of coming up with the URL to some kook site or other.
    > > > > >
    > > > > Aww more asshole-ness
    > > > > I'm against mass-medication...so therefore must be a 'kook'
    > > > > Not with the Nazis were ya?
    > > >
    > > > BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! Sort of like calling Hitler a Jew.

    > >
    > > Well, we can't expect him to know of my small efforts combatting
    > > Holocaust denial, now can we? ;-)

    >
    > Of course not. That would mean that jez has a clue.


    Well, in all fairness, it would require a Google search of my posting
    habits on the three or so e-mail addresses I routinely used over the
    last five years to have figured it out. ;-)


    > > > BTW, GODWIN.

    > >
    > > I beat you to it... ;-)

    >
    > OK, but it was so classical a Godwin violation that I just had to point it
    > out.


    Fair enough, particularly since it came out of the blue.
    --
    Orac |"A statement of fact cannot be insolent."
    |
    |"If you cannot listen to the answers, why do you
    | inconvenience me with questions?"
     
  9. Once upon a time, our fellow George Conklin
    rambled on about "Re: What is Quackery?."
    Our champion De-Medicalizing in sci.med.nutrition retorts, thusly ...

    >I was at an empidemology meeting last
    >week where the joke was ....


    YOU :)

    Ha, ... Hah, Ha!
     
  10. Once upon a time, our fellow Orac
    rambled on about "Re: What is Quackery?."
    Our champion De-Medicalizing in sci.med.nutrition retorts, thusly ...

    >> >Actually, yes. I know several physicians who prescribe such things.


    >> Ah! Then you know several practitioners of alternative medicine. How
    >> fortunate for you.


    >Well, not exactly. They are all oncologists who primarily use
    >chemotherapy to treat cancer.


    Treat cancer with simples???

    Ha, ... Hah, Ha!

    Yeah, ... Sure, Right! I can tell you a few tall tales, too.
     
  11. Once upon a time, our fellow Orac
    rambled on about "Re: What is Quackery?."
    Our champion De-Medicalizing in sci.med.nutrition retorts, thusly ...

    >Orac |"A statement of fact cannot be insolent."
    > |
    > |"If you cannot listen to the answers, why do you
    > | inconvenience me with questions?"


    Proving that Orac once again is insolent, but neither a fact nor the
    answer.

    Orac is more of an oddity.

    Ha, ... Hah, Ha!
     
  12. Orac

    Orac Guest

    In article <[email protected]>,
    John 'the Man' <[email protected]> wrote:

    > Once upon a time, our fellow Orac
    > rambled on about "Re: What is Quackery?."
    > Our champion De-Medicalizing in sci.med.nutrition retorts, thusly ...
    >
    > >Orac |"A statement of fact cannot be insolent."
    > > |
    > > |"If you cannot listen to the answers, why do you
    > > | inconvenience me with questions?"

    >
    > Proving that Orac once again is insolent, but neither a fact nor the
    > answer.


    It is a statement of fact that you went straight for the gambit of
    calling someone you disagree with a "Nazi," completely justifying mine
    and Mark's invoking of Godwin's Law.

    [Snip]
    --
    Orac |"A statement of fact cannot be insolent."
    |
    |"If you cannot listen to the answers, why do you
    | inconvenience me with questions?"
     
  13. Orac

    Orac Guest

    In article <[email protected]>,
    John 'the Man' <[email protected]> wrote:

    > Once upon a time, our fellow Orac
    > rambled on about "Re: What is Quackery?."
    > Our champion De-Medicalizing in sci.med.nutrition retorts, thusly ...
    >
    > >> >Actually, yes. I know several physicians who prescribe such things.

    >
    > >> Ah! Then you know several practitioners of alternative medicine. How
    > >> fortunate for you.

    >
    > >Well, not exactly. They are all oncologists who primarily use
    > >chemotherapy to treat cancer.

    >
    > Treat cancer with simples???
    >
    > Ha, ... Hah, Ha!
    >
    > Yeah, ... Sure, Right! I can tell you a few tall tales, too.


    Three examples: One of them has made a name for himself studying the use
    of PC-SPES in prostate cancer. The other is studying the use of PC-Hope
    in the treatment of pancreatic cancer. A third is interested in the use
    of green tea and Chinese herbs for preventing colorectal cancer.

    Sorry if such a trio challenges your preconceptions about "conventional"
    doctors.
    --
    Orac |"A statement of fact cannot be insolent."
    |
    |"If you cannot listen to the answers, why do you
    | inconvenience me with questions?"
     
  14. "Orac" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:eek:[email protected]
    > In article <%lMsb.8232$p%[email protected]>,
    > "Marko Proberto" <[email protected]> wrote:
    >
    > > "Orac" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > > news:eek:[email protected]
    > > > In article <[email protected]>,
    > > > "Marko Proberto" <[email protected]> wrote:
    > > >
    > > > > "Jez" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > > > > news:[email protected]
    > > > > >
    > > > > > "Orac" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > > > > > news:eek:[email protected]
    > > > > > > In article <[email protected]>,
    > > > > > > "Marko Proberto" <[email protected]> wrote:
    > > > > > >
    > > > > > > > "Jez" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > > > > > > > news:[email protected]
    > > >
    > > > > > > > > Water fluoridation has been proved to cause more
    > > > > > > > > caries than it prevents.
    > > > > > > > > Go read up on Basel..Switzerland.
    > > > > > > >
    > > > > > > > Provide the URL for your assertion.
    > > > > > >
    > > > > > > Personally, I'd prefer a reference to a scientific study

    published
    > > in
    > > > > > > the peer-reviewed scientific literature. Anyone can come up with

    a
    > > URL
    > > > > > > to some anti-fluoridation site run by "advocates," and I'm sure

    > > "Jez" is
    > > > > > > quite capable of coming up with the URL to some kook site or

    other.
    > > > > > >
    > > > > > Aww more asshole-ness
    > > > > > I'm against mass-medication...so therefore must be a 'kook'
    > > > > > Not with the Nazis were ya?
    > > > >
    > > > > BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! Sort of like calling Hitler a Jew.
    > > >
    > > > Well, we can't expect him to know of my small efforts combatting
    > > > Holocaust denial, now can we? ;-)

    > >
    > > Of course not. That would mean that jez has a clue.

    >
    > Well, in all fairness, it would require a Google search of my posting
    > habits on the three or so e-mail addresses I routinely used over the
    > last five years to have figured it out. ;-)
    >
    >
    > > > > BTW, GODWIN.
    > > >
    > > > I beat you to it... ;-)

    > >
    > > OK, but it was so classical a Godwin violation that I just had to point

    it
    > > out.

    >
    > Fair enough, particularly since it came out of the blue.


    I would have said it came out of the brown...
     
  15. Jez

    Jez Guest

    "Orac" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:eek:[email protected]
    > In article <[email protected]>,
    > "Jez" <[email protected]> wrote:
    >
    > > "Orac" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > > news:eek:[email protected]
    > > > In article <[email protected]>,
    > > > "Jez" <[email protected]> wrote:
    > > >
    > > > > "Marko Proberto" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > > > > news:[email protected]
    > > > > >
    > > > > > "Jez" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > > > > > news:[email protected]
    > > >
    > > > > > > Water fluoridation has been proved to cause more
    > > > > > > caries than it prevents.
    > > > > > > Go read up on Basel..Switzerland.
    > > > > >
    > > > > > Provide the URL for your assertion.
    > > > > >
    > > > > Am I part of your research team ?
    > > > > Google is available to all..........
    > > >
    > > > It is not up to Mark (or me, for that matter) to do YOUR work and

    prove
    > > > YOUR assertion for you. He who asserts must prove. So prove your
    > > > assertion that water fluoridation causes more caries than it prevents.

    > >
    > > No, it is up to those who wish to
    > > force mass-medication upon us to prove that it works.
    > > They haven't.

    >
    > Really? There's lots of evidence in the published scientific literature
    > that it does work. Could you kindly show me the evidence demonstrating
    > that it doesn't work, describe the specific flaws in the evidence
    > supporting its use, and put together a coherent argument showing that
    > your evidence trumps the existing evidence supporting fluoridation?


    Why bother?
    Assholes who want forced medication aren't worth a wank....

    --
    Ho hum
    Jez
    "Few of us can easily surrender our belief that
    society must somehow make sense. The thought
    that the State has lost its mind and is punishing so
    many innocent people is intolerable. And so the
    evidence has to be internally denied."
    - Arthur Miller
     
  16. Jez

    Jez Guest

    "Orac" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:eek:[email protected]
    > In article <[email protected]>,
    > "Jez" <[email protected]> wrote:
    >
    > > "Rich Shewmaker" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > > news:[email protected]
    > > >
    > > > "Jez" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > > > news:[email protected]
    > > > >
    > > >
    > > > > > > Water fluoridation has been proved to cause more
    > > > > > > caries than it prevents.
    > > > > > > Go read up on Basel..Switzerland.
    > > > > >
    > > > > > Provide the URL for your assertion.
    > > > > >
    > > > > Am I part of your research team ?
    > > > > Google is available to all..........
    > > > >
    > > >
    > > > Use of the term "has been proved" puts the obligation on YOU to

    provide
    > > the
    > > > source of that proffered proof. Anything you state as a fact without

    > > citing
    > > > your source, we may reasonably presume to have been made up on the

    spot.
    > > >
    > > > As for Basel, Switzerland, the cheerleader article echoed all over the
    > > > anti-fluoridation web world is about politics, not science, and proves
    > > > nothing about the risk/benefit profile of fluoridation of public water
    > > > supplies.

    > >
    > > The onus is on those who would force un-proven medication upon us
    > > to prove it's safety....They have not.

    >
    > Saying that they have not proven its safety doesn't make it so (no
    > matter how much you appear to think otherwise), particularly since you
    > haven't been able to produce even one scientific study supporting your
    > contention that it's unsafe and or ineffective.


    As I said before, do your own research.

    So you'd allow un-proven drugs to be used eh?
    Ah..just like Ritalin for kiddies eh......

    Probably belived Saddam had WMD's too eh.....


    --
    Ho hum
    Jez
    "Few of us can easily surrender our belief that
    society must somehow make sense. The thought
    that the State has lost its mind and is punishing so
    many innocent people is intolerable. And so the
    evidence has to be internally denied."
    - Arthur Miller
     
  17. Once upon a time, our fellow Orac
    rambled on about "Re: What is Quackery?."
    Our champion De-Medicalizing in sci.med.nutrition retorts, thusly ...

    >Sorry if such a trio challenges your preconceptions about "conventional"
    >doctors.


    Sorry, if they are using alternative treatment methods then they are
    not "conventional" doctors by definition. :)

    Perhaps, if you were to concentrate? Ha, ... Hah, Ha!
     
  18. "Jez" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]
    >
    > "Orac" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > news:eek:[email protected]
    > > In article <[email protected]>,
    > > "Jez" <[email protected]> wrote:
    > >
    > > > "Orac" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > > > news:eek:[email protected]
    > > > > In article <[email protected]>,
    > > > > "Jez" <[email protected]> wrote:
    > > > >
    > > > > > "Marko Proberto" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > > > > > news:[email protected]
    > > > > > >
    > > > > > > "Jez" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > > > > > > news:[email protected]
    > > > >
    > > > > > > > Water fluoridation has been proved to cause more
    > > > > > > > caries than it prevents.
    > > > > > > > Go read up on Basel..Switzerland.
    > > > > > >
    > > > > > > Provide the URL for your assertion.
    > > > > > >
    > > > > > Am I part of your research team ?
    > > > > > Google is available to all..........
    > > > >
    > > > > It is not up to Mark (or me, for that matter) to do YOUR work and

    > prove
    > > > > YOUR assertion for you. He who asserts must prove. So prove your
    > > > > assertion that water fluoridation causes more caries than it

    prevents.
    > > >
    > > > No, it is up to those who wish to
    > > > force mass-medication upon us to prove that it works.
    > > > They haven't.

    > >
    > > Really? There's lots of evidence in the published scientific literature
    > > that it does work. Could you kindly show me the evidence demonstrating
    > > that it doesn't work, describe the specific flaws in the evidence
    > > supporting its use, and put together a coherent argument showing that
    > > your evidence trumps the existing evidence supporting fluoridation?

    >
    > Why bother?
    > Assholes who want forced medication aren't worth a wank....


    BWHAHAHAHAHAHA! Is that the best you can do?

    Try www.getaclue.com
     
  19. "Jez" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]
    >
    > "Orac" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > news:eek:[email protected]
    > > In article <[email protected]>,
    > > "Jez" <[email protected]> wrote:
    > >
    > > > "Rich Shewmaker" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > > > news:[email protected]
    > > > >
    > > > > "Jez" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > > > > news:[email protected]
    > > > > >
    > > > >
    > > > > > > > Water fluoridation has been proved to cause more
    > > > > > > > caries than it prevents.
    > > > > > > > Go read up on Basel..Switzerland.
    > > > > > >
    > > > > > > Provide the URL for your assertion.
    > > > > > >
    > > > > > Am I part of your research team ?
    > > > > > Google is available to all..........
    > > > > >
    > > > >
    > > > > Use of the term "has been proved" puts the obligation on YOU to

    > provide
    > > > the
    > > > > source of that proffered proof. Anything you state as a fact without
    > > > citing
    > > > > your source, we may reasonably presume to have been made up on the

    > spot.
    > > > >
    > > > > As for Basel, Switzerland, the cheerleader article echoed all over

    the
    > > > > anti-fluoridation web world is about politics, not science, and

    proves
    > > > > nothing about the risk/benefit profile of fluoridation of public

    water
    > > > > supplies.
    > > >
    > > > The onus is on those who would force un-proven medication upon us
    > > > to prove it's safety....They have not.

    > >
    > > Saying that they have not proven its safety doesn't make it so (no
    > > matter how much you appear to think otherwise), particularly since you
    > > haven't been able to produce even one scientific study supporting your
    > > contention that it's unsafe and or ineffective.

    >
    > As I said before, do your own research.
    >
    > So you'd allow un-proven drugs to be used eh?
    > Ah..just like Ritalin for kiddies eh......


    It is probably one of the top five most studied medications. Get a clue.

    >
    > Probably belived Saddam had WMD's too eh.....
    >
    >
    > --
    > Ho hum
    > Jez
    > "Few of us can easily surrender our belief that
    > society must somehow make sense. The thought
    > that the State has lost its mind and is punishing so
    > many innocent people is intolerable. And so the
    > evidence has to be internally denied."
    > - Arthur Miller
    >
    >
     
  20. Oliver Wendel Homes (1809-1894), graduate of Harvard Medical School,
    described Homeopathy as a “mingled mass of perverse ingenuity, of
    tinsel erudition, of imbecile credulity, and of artful
    misrepresentation.”

    Obviously that was a mis-characterization of what Homes had intended
    to say. :(

    Homes was obviously before his time when he talked about the dated
    Science Geek hasbins the world has left behind on these ngs, like
    Orac.

    While the majority of contemporary physicians are cognizant of the
    fact that the world has changed, that alternative therapies are now
    accepted as mainstream treatment modalities, these Geeks are truly a
    “mingled mass of perverse ingenuity, of tinsel erudition, of imbecile
    credulity, and of artful misrepresentation.”

    Just my opinion. But, I am *right* as usual!
    --
    John Gohde,
    Feeling Great and Better than Ever!

    Alternative medicine was yesterday's quackery, is today's
    complementary medicine, and will be tomorrow's new branch of medicine.
    http://tutorials.naturalhealthperspective.com/history.html
     
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