What is rest?

Discussion in 'General Fitness' started by Bear G, Oct 11, 2004.

  1. Bear G

    Bear G Guest

    I know I need to go into a rest cycle, but what is rest? One of
    our coaches suggested skipping running entirely for about a month,
    but I knew that if I did that I wouldn't resume running until next
    spring.

    Or is this a moot point as winter approaches? I know you guys run
    through 4' snow drifts wearing nothing but shorts, sports bras
    (Dot) and smiles, but I'm a wimp and expect storms to play havoc
    on my schedule.

    The alternative is to plan to do all of my runs on the street with
    trail runs as a pleasant surprise. I was planning to shift to
    street running anyway (in preparation for a street marathon) but
    was hoping to shift about 10%/month from trail to asphalt. That
    is, I'm currently about 30/70 (asphalt/trail) and would go to
    40/60, 50/50, etc. in November and December.
     
    Tags:


  2. On 2004-10-11, Bear G <[email protected]> wrote:
    > I know I need to go into a rest cycle, but what is rest?


    If you're doing it right, you'll know. Rest could mean taking it easy
    or a complete layoff or cross training.

    > One of our coaches suggested skipping running entirely for about
    > a month, but I knew that if I did that I wouldn't resume running
    > until next spring.


    A complete layoff that long is unnecessary, and I wouldn't even recommend
    it for most people. Maybe a week layoff followed by a week of easy
    cross training.

    > Or is this a moot point as winter approaches?


    Well, in that you won't be able to do your track work in winter, yes. But
    do you evn do track work ?

    > I know you guys run
    > through 4' snow drifts wearing nothing but shorts, sports bras
    > (Dot) and smiles, but I'm a wimp and expect storms to play havoc
    > on my schedule.


    Dead right you're a wimp. Put on some warm clothes and get the hell
    outside and run. Running in the cold is much more fun than running in
    the heat, once you push yourself out the door and get moving. Wimp.

    > The alternative is to plan to do all of my runs on the street with
    > trail runs as a pleasant surprise. I was planning to shift to
    > street running anyway (in preparation for a street marathon) but
    > was hoping to shift about 10%/month from trail to asphalt. That
    > is, I'm currently about 30/70 (asphalt/trail) and would go to
    > 40/60, 50/50, etc. in November and December.


    Whatever. Any surface that's not covered in a foot of snow will do just
    fine. Depending on where you live, that could narrow it down considerably.

    Cheers,
    --
    Donovan Rebbechi
    http://pegasus.rutgers.edu/~elflord/
     
  3. Sam

    Sam Guest

    I say rest is a complete lack of activity or at least exercise that includes
    cross training activities. Others say it is reduced training. You choose.
    I would like to be the dictator of a definition but I am not Daniel Webster.

    I do believe there are times when training should be cut way back. For
    instance, many African runners take a month "off" with no formal training.
    Some do no training at all (maybe letting injuries heal); others will run
    leisurely and maybe not everyday as they normally do in training.

    I think that a month completely off unless there is an injury or true
    overtraining (which would be rare) is not necessary or a good thing. You
    lose a lot of fitness over a month (heck even a week shows noticeable
    detraining measures). Now taking a month say after a marathon or a racing
    season and running nothing but easy stuff and maybe taking a few more rest
    days.


    "Donovan Rebbechi" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]
    > On 2004-10-11, Bear G <[email protected]> wrote:
    > > I know I need to go into a rest cycle, but what is rest?

    >
    > If you're doing it right, you'll know. Rest could mean taking it easy
    > or a complete layoff or cross training.
    >
    > > One of our coaches suggested skipping running entirely for about
    > > a month, but I knew that if I did that I wouldn't resume running
    > > until next spring.

    >
    > A complete layoff that long is unnecessary, and I wouldn't even recommend
    > it for most people. Maybe a week layoff followed by a week of easy
    > cross training.
    >
    > > Or is this a moot point as winter approaches?

    >
    > Well, in that you won't be able to do your track work in winter, yes. But
    > do you evn do track work ?
    >
    > > I know you guys run
    > > through 4' snow drifts wearing nothing but shorts, sports bras
    > > (Dot) and smiles, but I'm a wimp and expect storms to play havoc
    > > on my schedule.

    >
    > Dead right you're a wimp. Put on some warm clothes and get the hell
    > outside and run. Running in the cold is much more fun than running in
    > the heat, once you push yourself out the door and get moving. Wimp.
    >
    > > The alternative is to plan to do all of my runs on the street with
    > > trail runs as a pleasant surprise. I was planning to shift to
    > > street running anyway (in preparation for a street marathon) but
    > > was hoping to shift about 10%/month from trail to asphalt. That
    > > is, I'm currently about 30/70 (asphalt/trail) and would go to
    > > 40/60, 50/50, etc. in November and December.

    >
    > Whatever. Any surface that's not covered in a foot of snow will do just
    > fine. Depending on where you live, that could narrow it down considerably.
    >
    > Cheers,
    > --
    > Donovan Rebbechi
    > http://pegasus.rutgers.edu/~elflord/
     
  4. MWL

    MWL Guest

    X-No-Archive: yes
    Bear G <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]_s03>...
    > I know I need to go into a rest cycle, but what is rest?


    Rest is what you do on Columbus Day.
    Before and after you come back from all those great shopping deals.

    Praise be to Columbus who made all this possible!!
    Imagine if it were for those natives, we would
    still be eating corn instead of getting all
    these sweet deals.

    http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article7055.htm


    MWL

    --------
    Can't wait till Happy Thanksgiving Day.
     
  5. << cross training >>

    Multi-user
    Game play,
    Say, S&M,
    B&D, or
    Simple
    D&S,
    Or P&S.
    Confess, now,
    Which
    Ru?

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  6. << You choose.
    I would like to be the dictator of a definition but I am not Daniel Webster.
    >>


    Ah, you're not?
    Your preference?
    Miriam, Funk,
    Wagnal, HM,
    SS, Grove, MS,
    Corbis,
    Or Oxford
    Class?
    Got sass,
    Got class?
    We must,
    Of course include,
    UC Man of Style.
    And then
    There's NYPL
    Usage style,
    Too.
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  7. << shorts, sports bras
    > > (Dot) and smiles >>


    Dot likes you,
    Marathon man,
    Or you her?
    Ah, you're
    Taken,
    Finally!

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  8. Bear G

    Bear G Guest

    Grrr, I just realized my TBR filter also caught Donovan.
    Hopefully it's fixed now. The newsgroup is _so_ much quieter
    after filtering out all traffic from AOL.

    Sam wrote:
    > I think that a month completely off unless there is an injury or true
    > overtraining (which would be rare) is not necessary or a good thing. You
    > lose a lot of fitness over a month (heck even a week shows noticeable
    > detraining measures). Now taking a month say after a marathon or a racing
    > season and running nothing but easy stuff and maybe taking a few more rest
    > days.


    That was the idea - I've been pushing hard for close to a year and
    was developing overuse injuries. That pain is gone but I keep
    reading that it's a mistake to believe that you're healed and can
    resume a full training schedule just because your acute pains have
    ended.

    Hence the question - how do experienced runners balance recovery
    and climbing the wall because of short mileage? How long should a
    rest cycle last? Does that include the taper?

    > "Donovan Rebbechi" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > news:[email protected]
    >>On 2004-10-11, Bear G <[email protected]> wrote:
    >>
    >>>Or is this a moot point as winter approaches?

    >>
    >>Well, in that you won't be able to do your track work in winter, yes. But
    >>do you even do track work ?


    I did during the marathon prep work but I believe it was a
    mistake. I'm not planning to do anything more than strides until
    spring.

    >>>The alternative is to plan to do all of my runs on the street with
    >>>trail runs as a pleasant surprise. I was planning to shift to
    >>>street running anyway (in preparation for a street marathon) but
    >>>was hoping to shift about 10%/month from trail to asphalt. That
    >>>is, I'm currently about 30/70 (asphalt/trail) and would go to
    >>>40/60, 50/50, etc. in November and December.

    >>
    >>Whatever. Any surface that's not covered in a foot of snow will do just
    >>fine. Depending on where you live, that could narrow it down considerably.


    A foot of snow isn't that unusual. Even several feet of snow
    isn't unheard of.

    But the problem isn't that, it's the muddy mess that you get when
    that foot of snow melts - I've had mud come close to ripping a
    hiking boot off my foot. Or the icy mess you get when it's cold
    enough that the roads remain largely snowpacked but there's
    patches where the snow has melted and refrozen.

    A bike path runs literally 20' from my front door and I know that
    there are plenty of runners most days during winter. (But not
    all.) I don't know how it affects their plans, e.g., whether
    they'll go on unusually long runs on the weekends when the weather
    and roads are clear. If I can't keep to a schedule I would prefer
    to treat it as the rest period with shorter miles.
     
  9. << You choose.
    I would like to be the dictator of a definition >>

    Or perhaps,
    On 2nd thought.
    We will limit your
    Domain: You get
    1 definition, 1 word
    To rule. Say,
    Take:
    "Heathen."
    All yours.
    Define;
    Begin your
    New job,
    Perform your
    Duty.

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  10. << caught Donovan >>

    Where?!
    Got S*P*I*K*E*D
    Or spoken for?
    That DonVon
    Fall from
    Grace?
    Or lost
    A race!
    Leave a
    Trace...
    M&Ms or
    Reeses
    Fine...

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  11. << detraining measures >>

    OOOOOOO
    Sounds interesting...
    Tell me more !

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  12. << A foot of snow >>

    No, that properly should read
    As follows:

    "Letterhead * Leonardo * Lettersnow"

    *look & logo*

    [Hey!]

    Who else wants to join?
    Just come ~
    You're most
    Welcome...

    ~ waves ~
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  13. << shorter >>

    Really?
    I'm sorry to hear.

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  14. << a rest cycle, but what is rest? One >>

    Seen my new Spincycle?
    Tres kewl!

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  15. << Dead right >>

    Onto a dirt road...

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  16. Dot

    Dot Guest

    Bear G wrote:
    > I know I need to go into a rest cycle, but what is rest? One of our
    > coaches suggested skipping running entirely for about a month,


    I've seen that suggested also, but frequently people may lightly
    cross-train during that time. Some people may do just a couple weeks. It
    depends a lot on the person and their goals.

    but I
    > knew that if I did that I wouldn't resume running until next spring.
    >
    > Or is this a moot point as winter approaches? I know you guys run
    > through 4' snow drifts wearing nothing but shorts, sports bras (Dot)
    > and smiles,


    trust me, I'm wearin' a whole lot more than that in winter ;)


    > but I'm a wimp and expect storms to play havoc on my schedule.


    IIRC, you're in Colorado which has mostly dry snow, I think. You
    shouldn't get the ice like we get. Those 4' snow drifts are great for
    snowshoe running - just watch out for the dips (but poles can help) :)
    Colorado is a hotbed for snowshoe running. I lived in Ft Collins for 5.5
    yrs, and I think there were only a few days in that time when the snow
    was too deep or too much ice to ride a road bike (5-speed schwinn) so
    running wouldn't have been a problem. I think you're in Boulder, which
    would be a little higher and perhaps more snow?

    >
    > The alternative is to plan to do all of my runs on the street with trail
    > runs as a pleasant surprise.


    Snowshoe running should allow you to run on trails most of the winter.


    Here's the way I've dealt with rest, periodization, and weather in the
    past. I could describe it generally, but it doesn't make any sense
    unless you know why. Your situation will obviously be different, but
    this may give you some ideas.

    Being a field ecologist, I'm in the field much of the summer, although
    less so in the last couple years. So I have had a built-in "rest" from
    running in the summer - which means I do most of my running in the
    winter, as do many other field workers. Hauling 20-30 lbs of gear up a
    hillside and bringing down 50+ lb pack with soils uses different muscles
    from running and is sort of a rest, but not really (at least not when
    57). In the past years, I'd get done my field work in late Aug to mid
    Oct, maybe take a week or two (probably no running for about a week) to
    recover (mentally and physically) from field work, get house, car, and
    things winterized, then gradually build back for another couple weeks.
    About the time I'm getting my legs under me, we get the first snow or
    ice or whatever. If I haven't gotten my legs back before this, it's a
    really slow process since then most of my runs are in slippery snow and
    the dark.

    If it gets really icy in Jan or Feb, I used to get a 30-day fitness
    center membership and do machines (no free weights there) for PT and the
    versaclimber. Treadmills (all 2 of them) usually had lines and were
    limited 20 min but I'd try to get on one once a week and run hard. My
    other runs would still be outside, but they were more just to be outside
    relaxing than any real fitness benefit. That's mostly before I started
    this structured running.

    The last 2 yrs, I've had some injuries in the fall so welcomed the firm
    footing of a 2-hr cross-training class at a different fitness center on
    Sat mornings (late Oct thru Jan or Feb). If the price structure were
    different, I'd do it every 2 wks (alternating with long runs), and maybe
    take it through to Feb or Mar, depending on weather / trail conditions.
    As it is, I do 4 wks, then take a week or two for long runs or ss
    run/walk then another 4 wks, etc. My recovery time from the class is
    such that I haven't been able to do long runs the same weeks I do this.
    For some reason, I'm not fond of 2-hr long runs after work in the dark
    in subzero F weather. Daylight on Sat or Sun mornings that's fine, but
    I'm sore on Sun after the class which leaves only nights for running.

    Discovering snowshoe running *and* having decent snow last year was a
    lot of fun and challenging training - and presents another issue for
    periodization. I'd had the shoes for a couple years, but no decent snow.
    In the past, I've just run (regular) all winter, and we didn't have any
    local races, so it just made sense to build time. Now with having
    snowshoe races to do, there may be some more event opportunities there
    (peak in late Feb?). And nationals are up here this year where I hope to
    volunteer.

    The magic about snowshoes is that they have cleats on them - and running
    ones only weigh about 1 lb apiece. When streets may be icy, snow may
    just have a light covering of ice and the cleats grab quite nicely. If
    the ice is thicker though on top of snow, you crash through with each
    step and that's brutal. The ss is also a very stable platform on
    reasonable snow = less likelihood of injury, I think. Horse and
    dog-walker tracks are covered by them. (On crappy snow, it accentuates
    the unevenness, so more likely for injury.)

    Where I am we have enough different slopes, aspects, drainages that I
    can usually rotate through the various trails depending on conditions -
    to either get half way decent snow or bare ground or something that
    approaches being runnable. But there will probably be a week or two of
    breakup in the spring, that are a good time to back off until the
    conditions improve before transitioning to summer running.

    In other words, my year tends to get broken into about 3-month intervals
    with some weather breaks between them -
    summer field season (Jun-Aug, sometimes mid-May to early Oct);
    fall recovery and trying to get things back before snow and ice
    (possibly lasting until Dec);
    winter - snowshoe, ski, run, or xt in gym depending on snow/ice (Jan to
    Mar or April);
    spring mileage ramp up for May races (til May).


    Hmm, no wonder my mileage has always been so low, but that's also why
    I've focused on base building and hills rather than speedwork. The
    strength from hills will carry over, whereas the physiological benefits
    of speedwork are quickly lost - or at least that's my understanding.

    Going forward, I won't have field seasons as I've known them (maybe 1 or
    2 wks consulting but dates can be varied to accommodate my running), so
    I won't have that built-in break, but I'll still have weather time
    periods where it's just easier to back off for a week than to fight
    conditions. The problem is trying to plan it.

    Just a first guess for the future is to have
    last race in Sept or early Oct,
    then 1 or 2 wks none, slow, or hike or whatever;
    Nov-Dec: run and xt;
    mid-Dec to Mar (Apr): ss, xc ski, run, xt depending on weather (can't ss
    or ski if no snow; skiing on flats will maintain fitness without
    pounding; ss races are in Jan & Feb but we don't usually get local snow
    until Dec);
    May-Sept: run with the races tending to be in late July and Aug, maybe
    Sept, maybe one in May. Should be able to maintain reasonable schedule
    of hard / med / easy wks in this time period.


    Sorry to be so long winded but I was just thinking about this driving
    home tonight, since I've never had time between field season and winter
    to do significant running, let alone races (like this year). And unless
    the weather turns suddenly cruddy, I want to get a long run in this
    weekend (none since early July), but this is also about when I should be
    doing a rest break. I'll probably end up doing a run / walk so that I
    get outside for 1.5-2 hrs, but not risk injury. Then little or nothing
    the next week, then start xt on 23rd, maybe 30th. I've gotten a lot more
    running in this year than in the past so I'm very mindful of being sure
    appropriate rest is in there.

    Oh, and FWIW, I've never seen a formal schedule that accommodates winter
    weather conditions ;) (Glover's beginning book at least has a picture
    of people running in the snow on the cover.) That's why I've tried to
    understand what systems the various workouts train, what effects endure
    the longest or at least as long as any breaks I've had, and put them
    together the best I can. (For instance, downhill effects are supposed to
    last about 6 wks; I can space hills with substantial downhills on both
    sides of 3 wks of field work and have built-in rest between efforts and
    still be able to build legs for downhills.) Then just deal with what
    Mother Nature dishes out. And hope by race day, I can put the pieces
    together.

    Dot

    --
    "So many people get stuck in the routine of life that their dreams waste
    away. This is about living the dream." - Cave Dog
     
  17. << The magic >>

    ....is doggone real...

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  18. << Then just deal with what
    Mother Nature dishes out. And hope by race day, I can put the pieces
    together.

    Dot >>

    yes, agreed.
    O & you will...you're great!
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  19. <<
    << The magic >>

    ....is doggone real...>>

    ....just wish that dog
    was here,
    not gone!

    [Hey!]

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  20. << Dot > >
    *dasH*

    *smile,
    or simile*

    [Snap]
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