What's Fair is Clear by Arnie Baker, MD.

Discussion in 'Professional Cycling' started by roadhouse, Jul 27, 2010.

  1. roadhouse

    roadhouse New Member

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    Obviously Floyd has doped in all manners but here is some insight as to his argument concerning his one positive test, which he remains in his belief that it is wrong, that the UCI screwed up in its testing, that the lab made mistakes but just went ahead with the prosecution anyway and that they just can't admit that they were wrong, that in which leads directly to his being stripped of his Tour De France title.

    Arnie Baker M.D. is Floyd's first coach and lifelong friend, one of many professionals who found many faults in his test results.

    Come to your own conclusions.

    Floyd Landis, What's Fair is Clear : Arnie Baker : Free Download & Streaming : Internet Archive
     
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  2. gtm

    gtm New Member

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    Flandis is clearly attempting to have his cake & eat it.

    'Yes, I doped with everything I could lay my hands on throughout my career EXCEPT when I won the Tour De France & was thereafter stripped of my title - I was clean as a whistle then'

    It's not a particularly attractive argument & I think he should quietly drop it.
     
  3. pearl-drum-man

    pearl-drum-man New Member

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    Yes, clearly counter-intuitive to admit to the regular performance enhancing except when he had his biggest single success.
     
  4. TKOS

    TKOS New Member

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    So many others have been caught, finally admitted it, took their lumps and moved on. Landis will never ride again because of his post being caught antics. Sad for him as he could have already been back into competition by now (I mean real competition not that sad photo of him loosing a TT that was posted).
     
  5. Bro Deal

    Bro Deal New Member

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    FLandis is not claiming that he was clean during the 2006 Tour. He says he used blood transfusions. They were administered by Dr. Allen Lim, who is now with Radio Shack. He says that he was not using testosterone because he found the right dosage of HGH that worked better and was undetectable.

    Interesting enough, Joe Papp says that when he tested positive for testosterone he was not using it either, even though he was using EPO and other drugs at the time.
     
  6. roadhouse

    roadhouse New Member

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    I'd like to agree as it seems all too obvious that you just can't belive him an dhis words any longer, but outside of that, I do believe he has a case that is inargueably correct to take on the UCI and WADA and that is why he can't give up his fight now and I wish him luck in his path, I want to see it all come crashing down.


    it's just unbelievable the mishaps, mislabeling of his samples, the machines being non caliberated and decades old and no user manuals, the procedures that were not followed under WADA's own protocol, the fool proof carbon isotope test being completely fool proof and fallible what with the metallic handles not even taken off ( the basis is that the machine uses very high powered magnets to perform the test and these metal handles were to be removed upon machine installation but after two years were not and found out by Floyd's team) the lengths that these people will go to just to make them come out right even when they are not and I'm talking about the French lab and the UCI and WADA. I do believe, after reading his book, that Floyd was not nesccassarily innocent on this one test (but he very well could be) but that he has a case to take down the UCI ( I can't say with certainty about Lance) and I want him to win.
     
  7. gtm

    gtm New Member

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    Testosterone is certainly problematic. For example Robert Millar served a ban for abnormally high levels & I'm inclined to believe he wasn't the kind of rider to get involved with that kind of thing (& he swore he hadn't done anything wrong)
     
  8. Bro Deal

    Bro Deal New Member

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    The testing used during Millar's time is way different than what is used now. Back then they only used a T:TE ratio test. Now they use the T:TE test as an initial screen and then look at the carbon isotope ratio in the testosterone to determine whether the testosterone is natural. Supposedly this is foolproof, but I doubt they have done a false positive study...
     
  9. roadhouse

    roadhouse New Member

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    Mislabeling
    A and B samples, both have a bar code with Floyd's sample ID on them. Floyd's stage 17 sample ID number is 995474. In a page of the USADA packet summary his sample A ID number is stated as 994474, off by one digit. The correct lab ID number is 178/07, the lab ID number listed is 478/07, resulting in no clear way to even determine if the sample is even Floyd's. Of course through WADA they used wite out, something mandatory NOT to do by their own protocol (by protocol among any and all fields of lab and medicine if an error is made the technician is to cross out the number and hand write the correct number, sign and date it) to correct those numbers in a CERTIFIED ORIGINAL after packet summary. That's not original, that's lying to myself.

    In a summary sheet of the lab's record of abnormalities in three different samples (from three different riders tested) collected after stage 17 identifies Floyd's sample number as 995475, a sample number associated with another athlete's urine sample that was analyzed in the lab at the same time.

    Again, Floyd's sample number is 995474.
     
  10. roadhouse

    roadhouse New Member

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    Specimen Contamination

    WADA recognizes that contamination or degraded specimens cannot be fairly examined and should be discarded. Degradation can result from many factors, including bacterial contamination, improper storage, biological or other chemical contaminants (such as blood) and adulteration. The WADA contamination rule is clear: "The concentration of free testosterone and/or epitestosterone in the specimen is NOT TO EXCEED 5% of the respective glucuroconjugates."

    Like food with mold or maggots, it has deteriorated beyond use and should be thrown out.

    B sample, no evidence of the A sample ever being tested for contaminants, showed signs of degraded epitestosterone levels of 7.7% and according to Floyd's team and i do believe in a court of law it would hold up as well, the process should have stopped right then and there but it did not through WADA's in house judicial system.

    I'm just going to be throwing out these facts as I find them absolutely horrifying moreso than completely stunning to myself.
     
  11. roadhouse

    roadhouse New Member

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    i missed that, but you are correct which could mean that the test results for synthetic testosterone are incorrect as he still claims...??%$#[email protected]%?? :confused:

    Floyd Landis admits to using PEDs most of his career - ESPN

    As for his own positive test, Landis still maintains that result was inaccurate and that he had not used synthetic testosterone during the 2006 season -- although he now admits he used human growth hormone during that time. At this point, he said he does not want to dwell on any of the issues he and his lawyers hammered at during his case.
     
  12. roadhouse

    roadhouse New Member

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    Extreme Variation
    Lab rules state the ratio has to be within 30% of one another. In the results when the sample was initially screened for the T/E ratio, it was 4.9 to 1. When the sample was tested again to confirm the ratio, it was found to be 11.4 to 1 (the latter being the official result the UCI used to disqualify Floyd), differing from the average allowable ratio by double being 60% so should be considered null and void by ALL labs under WADA but was not.
     
  13. Ted B

    Ted B New Member

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    There is a big red flag waving here. HGH and steroidal anabolics (e.g. testosterone) are apples and oranges. Where the effect of anabolics are concerned, HGH is not an effective replacement. This being elementary, IF Floyd truly implied that one is synonymous with the other, that brings his entire storyline into serious doubt.


    My profession deals directly with third party laboratory confirmational results. Should the chain of custody for any sample show as much as a single irregularity (time gap, incorrect control number, etc.), the results are absolutely inadmissible in a court of law. Likewise, any testing conducted beyond what is legally defined as the 'test by' date is equally inadmissible, end of story.

    I'm making this point because we hear account after account about sample handling irregularities, true or false.
     
  14. Bro Deal

    Bro Deal New Member

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    Landis would have been using HGH for recovery not for building muscle. Usage may have been combined with other drugs similar to how body builders will stack HGH use with testosterone and insulin. Who knows what Dr. Ferrari told him to take and what effect Ferrari was aiming to achieve.

    P.S. I am not sure Ferrari was advising him during 2006. He may have been relying totally on Dr. Lim.
     
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