What's the best way to pedal?



acoggan said:
Hard - preferably using both legs. :D
Pedal hard, sure, but that's only 1/3 of the secret. You've got to pedal fast too, and until the finish. I can often get one or two OK, but combining all three is tough.
 
I pretty much find the harder I peal the faster I go. Not the more circular, smoother or anything else. Just the harder. Funny thing is, that's what my power meater says also. Harder I stomp on the pedals the higher my power is. The higher my power is the faster I go... funny how that seems to work.
 
jerryz said:
I pretty much find the harder I peal the faster I go. Not the more circular, smoother or anything else. Just the harder. Funny thing is, that's what my power meater says also. Harder I stomp on the pedals the higher my power is. The higher my power is the faster I go... funny how that seems to work.



It's ideal for acceleration and sprinting but can you use it to produce maximum power when riding solo in the lowest and most aerodynamic upper body position. It's more powerful than the circular style because the smoother you make your circular style, the weaker it becomes due to the fact that you are reducing power input in the area where most pressure can be applied. A stomping style is power application concentration in about only 150 degrees of the pedalling circle, a circular style is attempted concentration through the entire 360 degrees. This means with circular pedalling you are trying to concentrate on both feet at the same time and this also contributes to a reduction in overall power.
 
n crowley said:
It's more powerful than the circular style because the smoother you make your circular style, the weaker it becomes due to the fact that you are reducing power input in the area where most pressure can be applied. A stomping style is power application concentration in about only 150 degrees of the pedalling circle, a circular style is attempted concentration through the entire 360 degrees. This means with circular pedalling you are trying to concentrate on both feet at the same time and this also contributes to a reduction in overall power.
Someone is finally speaking some sense on this thread.
 
Smartt/RST said:
Someone is finally speaking some sense on this thread.
Ah but he thinks that it can't be maintained. And thus circular is better. LOL I guess he's right. I concentrate on pushing down hard all the time and just keep getting faster. That darn Coyle fellow says that the Div 1 Pros all stomp on the pedals. Woner how much faster I would be if I learned how to pedal in circles?
 
jerryz said:
Ah but he thinks that it can't be maintained. And thus circular is better. LOL I guess he's right. I concentrate on pushing down hard all the time and just keep getting faster. That darn Coyle fellow says that the Div 1 Pros all stomp on the pedals. Woner how much faster I would be if I learned how to pedal in circles?

I don't see what all the fuss is about. The crankarm is a fixed length rotating around the BB spindle therefore one can't help but pedal in circles.
 
Squint said:
I don't see what all the fuss is about. The crankarm is a fixed length rotating around the BB spindle therefore one can't help but pedal in circles.
In this context, pedalling in circles means attempting to apply the force vector perpendicular to the crank arm at all points of the circle (ie, tangentially to the circle) to maximze the length of the torque arm and achieve maximum torque with less force. The non-circular pedallers may apply the force primarily vertically downward on each stroke, or some other variation.
 
jerryz said:
Ah but he thinks that it can't be maintained. And thus circular is better. LOL I guess he's right. I concentrate on pushing down hard all the time and just keep getting faster. That darn Coyle fellow says that the Div 1 Pros all stomp on the pedals. Woner how much faster I would be if I learned how to pedal in circles?
Did I misunderstand? that is funny. Perhaps I took it out of context...I thought crowley was simply saying that circular pedaling reduces overall power, so you shouldn't worry about doing it.
For what it's worth, and to be somewhat diplomatic about this, if you want to pedal in a 'circular' manner due to something that you 'feel', by all means do so, but I would suggest that you only do so at low power outputs because as soon as you need to apply power approaching your 1-hr power, and even more so for anything above that, you better just focus on 1-5 o'clock.
 
jerryz said:
Ah but he thinks that it can't be maintained. And thus circular is better. LOL I guess he's right. I concentrate on pushing down hard all the time and just keep getting faster. That darn Coyle fellow says that the Div 1 Pros all stomp on the pedals. Woner how much faster I would be if I learned how to pedal in circles?




No I don't, a controlled version of stomping can be maintained throughout a time trial and as as I see it, the circular style is best for muscle relaxation or warming up purposes only. But there is a better way of pedalling in time trials. It uses concentration on maximum power application through 180 degrees of the pedalling circle with each leg and together they give continuous maximum power application to the chainwheel, maximum power even through the dead spot area. It's done by the successful combination and synchronization of upper body hand crank muscle power with lower body muscle power and is the technique which Anquetil used to fool the cycling world even to the present day.
 
n crowley said:
It's done by the successful combination and synchronization of upper body hand crank muscle power with lower body muscle power and is the technique which Anquetil used to fool the cycling world even to the present day.
Did you say "hand crank?" Are you talking about adding an offset handcrank to a typical bike to apply power through the dead spot? I've read your pedalling style posts for quite some time now and never really picked up on that until now. Is that what you meant, or is "hand crank muscle power a term for something else?" :confused:
 
frenchyge said:
Did you say "hand crank?" Are you talking about adding an offset handcrank to a typical bike to apply power through the dead spot? I've read your pedalling style posts for quite some time now and never really picked up on that until now. Is that what you meant, or is "hand crank muscle power a term for something else?" :confused:





The hand crank muscle power is real, the hand cranks are not. But it is possible to discreetly generate this power on fixed bars (hoods or drops) and divert it back to increase and extend leg power application to the pedals. For those who like to argue, by power here I mean resistance and pressure which would correspond to pulling and pushing on the hand cranks.
 
n crowley said:
The hand crank muscle power is real, the hand cranks are not. But it is possible to discreetly generate this power on fixed bars (hoods or drops) and divert it back to increase and extend leg power application to the pedals. For those who like to argue, by power here I mean resistance and pressure which would correspond to pulling and pushing on the hand cranks.
I recently started cycling, and just the other day I went out for a 23k spin close to my home. I completed this course 3-4 times already, I alway push it for the first 20k But this day I focused on pulling "lifting my knees" while pushing down with the oppisite leg. It was hard to do at first but I soon got the hang of it. It was also very tiring as I was using muscles never used before. when I did get tired I would focus on pushing for 2 circles and pulling for 2 circles this gave my quads a 50% rest while still keeping momentum. I could then revert back to the pushing/pulling at the same time when I felt a bit rested. at about 12k I reach a short climb. usually I drop to 10-11kph on this climb it is only about 400m long. however this day 13kph was the minimun on the climb while using this technique and instead of taking 5-7 min recovering, I felt revovered in far less time. Overall for my 20k split I increased my average speed by over 2kph with no noticable difference in weather conditions.
As I mentioned I am new to cycling and I will now attempt the high cadence practicing for a while to see if that has any difference on my times. but I believe that the push/pull technique is nothing to be snubbed at.

Graham
 
Be flexible with your pedalling. learn to move really far forward on the saddle and use your quads nearly full on...This produces a lot of power for me and therefore I adopt a forward saddle position and I know have rather developed quads. When I get tired of that position I can flick my heels up up at the bottom of the stroke and use my calves by tightening them and "ankling". After that I can move far back on the saddle and use my hips and hamstrings a lot more than lastly I can go out of the saddle. The key is to NOT think about it.
 
I'm surprised no one has yet mentioned one-legged pedal drills. Admittedly, I'm only about a week into this new sport, but did a fair bit of reading and messing about on my cycle commutes to and from work.

The idea is pretty simple, just get into a quite easy gear and unclip one foot, alternating feet after 20 or so strokes. The dead spot in your pedal stroke becomes immediately evident and one has no choice but to learn how to smooth the stroke through it. Having tried this only a couple of times, the logic of it just seems too solid for me to see how it could be counter productive. Maybe someone more experienced has information to the contrary.

Besides that, I've found the following to give me a noticeable difference in reducing effort while doing some laps up a small local hill:
- dropping my heels from 11:00 to 3:00
- "scraping the bottom bracket" at 3:00
- lifting my heel from somewhere around 8:00 up to 10:00 where it evens out to begin the next drop at 11:00

Seems like a lot to think about I guess, but it comes fairly smoothly for me already, unless of course I stand or am tired... then it all goes to shite.

Like I said, I'm very new to serious road riding so could be way off base, but given my extreme lack of power or endurance, I feel as though technique is the only thing getting me through these early rides and the above stroke just seems to work better for me.
 
fiend said:
I'm surprised no one has yet mentioned one-legged pedal drills. Admittedly, I'm only about a week into this new sport, but did a fair bit of reading and messing about on my cycle commutes to and from work.

The idea is pretty simple, just get into a quite easy gear and unclip one foot, alternating feet after 20 or so strokes. The dead spot in your pedal stroke becomes immediately evident and one has no choice but to learn how to smooth the stroke through it.
Of course you have a choice. There has to be a reason to try to apply force (torque) throughout the stroke. Personally, I don't and I see no reason to. I can't wait to get my foot to the 5 o'clock position so my leg can start resting for the next downstroke. So, a one-legged pedal drill makes sense only if it helps solve a problem.
 
Boy there's a lot of ******** on this thread. Your pedal stroke does matter. No, you don't want to mash down on your down stroke. It's inefficient and you'll put your feet to sleep. There's a reason we clip in to the pedals. You're supposed to use the whole stroke as you pedal. A smart place to start is to consider what type of cyclist you are and what type of physiology you have to work with. If you've got a large muscle mass in your leg then chances are you're better served pushing the big gears as you're less likely to be fatigued. Bigger guys tend to have a stronger upstroke as they pedal through and pull up. Big glutes and big ham string, along with big quads are great for pulling through with the whole leg and creating a great deal of power - usually at a somewhat lower rpm. Think Magnus Backstedt or Ullrich. Those guys have legs like trees and pedal through the stroke with great power. On the flip side you have Armstrong or Basso. Both subscribe to a higher cadence but have a much "lighter" stroke. They run a high rpm and aren't susceptible to much fatigue as they're running a high cadence in an "easier" gear.

Everyone is different. Take a look at your atypical climber, sprinter or time trialist. They're built differently and have different capacities because of it. the good news is that it's something you can work on. Find a guy in the pro peloton who's built like you and watch closely. You'll see some specific techniques to pedal stroke that may do you well. There is no one way that works best for all. Go with what works for you and you'll be fine. Best of luck.
 
grahamhyland said:
I recently started cycling, and just the other day I went out for a 23k spin close to my home. I completed this course 3-4 times already, I alway push it for the first 20k But this day I focused on pulling "lifting my knees" while pushing down with the oppisite leg. It was hard to do at first but I soon got the hang of it. It was also very tiring as I was using muscles never used before. when I did get tired I would focus on pushing for 2 circles and pulling for 2 circles this gave my quads a 50% rest while still keeping momentum. I could then revert back to the pushing/pulling at the same time when I felt a bit rested. at about 12k I reach a short climb. usually I drop to 10-11kph on this climb it is only about 400m long. however this day 13kph was the minimun on the climb while using this technique and instead of taking 5-7 min recovering, I felt revovered in far less time. Overall for my 20k split I increased my average speed by over 2kph with no noticable difference in weather conditions.
As I mentioned I am new to cycling and I will now attempt the high cadence practicing for a while to see if that has any difference on my times. but I believe that the push/pull technique is nothing to be snubbed at.
Hey Ric, here's another average cyclist who's gained 40% by learning to pull up. Add him to the list... :D
 
Just slap a power meter on it and problem solved. :D All it really matters is cadence. The faster you can spin up on a climb with the same power output, you will last longer in a long, hilly race. Less likely you will experience cramp. How to pedal??? Smooth circle and equal force throughout the stroke.

frenchyge said:
Hey Ric, here's another average cyclist who's gained 40% by learning to pull up. Add him to the list... :D
 

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