whats up with the italians

Discussion in 'Road Cycling' started by Jtn, Jun 19, 2003.

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  1. Jtn

    Jtn Guest

    how is it that 95% of all the positive drug tests are Italians. do they not know drugs are illegal?
    do they know the definition of illegal? what the hell?
     
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  2. It's in the wine "JTN" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > how is it that 95% of all the positive drug tests are Italians. do they
    not
    > know drugs are illegal? do they know the definition of illegal? what the hell?
     
  3. Davide Tosi

    Davide Tosi Guest

    "JTN" <[email protected]> wrote:

    >how is it that 95% of all the positive drug tests are Italians. do they not know drugs are illegal?
    >do they know the definition of illegal? what the hell?

    Italy is the only place where they started to do serious antidoping controls
     
  4. in article [email protected], Davide Tosi at [email protected] wrote on
    6/19/03 4:15 PM:

    > "JTN" <[email protected]> wrote:
    >
    >> how is it that 95% of all the positive drug tests are Italians. do they not know drugs are
    >> illegal? do they know the definition of illegal? what the hell?
    >
    > Italy is the only place where they started to do serious antidoping controls
    >

    Notice that very few Spanish riders test positive, and a curiously large number of foreign pros have
    moved to Spain.

    What's up with that?
     
  5. "Davide Tosi" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
    > "JTN" <[email protected]> wrote:
    >
    > >how is it that 95% of all the positive drug tests are Italians. do they
    not
    > >know drugs are illegal? do they know the definition of illegal? what the hell?
    >
    > Italy is the only place where they started to do serious antidoping controls

    France started before Italy although these 2 nations seem to be the only ones.

    OTOH, Italy is the only country where people dope up for cyclotourismo events.
     
  6. Jeff Jones

    Jeff Jones Guest

    "Kurgan Gringioni" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    >
    > "Davide Tosi" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > news:[email protected]...

    > > Italy is the only place where they started to do serious antidoping controls
    >
    > France started before Italy although these 2 nations seem to be the only ones.
    >
    Belgium has stepped up the pace a bit. A couple of weeks ago the "Flemish anti-doping bus" turned up
    to an amateur kermesse and tested 10(!) riders. Funny thing was that a) the bus only showed up in
    the last hour of the race
    b) they only tested one rider in the top 20 (Johan Verhaegen) and c) most of the riders picked for
    testing had already been dropped and had ridden home. They had to get them all to come back
    (which they did somehow), otherwise the riders who weren't there would have been given six months
    for "avoiding" a doping control that they didn't know about. Pretty funny.

    They could announce the riders who were going to be tested on the start line, but I guess that would
    open the possibility of a syringe in the last hour for certain *unscrupulous* types who were not on
    the list. The rule at the moment is that if you start, you have to stay until the end of the race in
    case there is testing.

    Btw, Bortolami was tested in Belgium, Caruso was tested in Australia, Loddo in Portugal and Di
    Falco in Italy.

    Jeff
     
  7. "Kurgan Gringioni" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    >
    > OTOH, Italy is the only country where people dope up for cyclotourismo events.
    >

    I wonder what the results would be if they tested riders on the Wednesday Tri-ride?
     
  8. Xzzy

    Xzzy Guest

    reply to the original post:

    I am all for drug testing but in this thread I think it's not "what's up with the Italians?" because
    they actually dared to crack down on drugs, but What is up with testing?

    Testing is a tough nut to crack because the users are far ahead of the legal process of testing.
    Further, sport's cannot be all things to all people, every company from the UCI, to your
    District, and from the Big Cheese, to the local Ma and Pa has to prioritize their money to bring
    in sales = in each part of Earth there is a business that sucks in most of the money and the
    other businesses in that region are competing to make that money their own. Maybe a couple
    sports have the extra money to completely manage the drug testing process, most do not. Many
    organizations seem to have a policy of looking the other way than spend the money to do the
    right thing.

    Good testing is a must and it must occur beginning with the local level of racing, and continue
    through the top of cycling. Further, manufacturers must be held accountable for of the
    distribution of their products.

    John Bickmore www.BicycleCam.com www.Feed-Zone.com
     
  9. Robert Chung

    Robert Chung Guest

    Any of these guys Padans?
     
  10. Bart

    Bart Guest

    "Kurgan Gringioni" <[email protected]> wrote
    >
    > OTOH, Italy is the only country where people dope up for cyclotourismo events.

    c'm on..... there are people who dope up for less than that, just to drop the buddies on
    sunday morning.
     
  11. "Carl Sundquist" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    >
    > "Kurgan Gringioni" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > >
    > > OTOH, Italy is the only country where people dope up for cyclotourismo events.
    > >
    >
    > I wonder what the results would be if they tested riders on the Wednesday Tri-ride?

    I know of at least one dude who would test positive. Unfortunately, after
    9/11, they closed the base to cyclists. We're screwed.
     
  12. "Jeff Jones" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    >
    > "Kurgan Gringioni" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > news:[email protected]...
    > >
    > > "Davide Tosi" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > > news:[email protected]...
    >
    > > > Italy is the only place where they started to do serious antidoping controls
    > >
    > > France started before Italy although these 2 nations seem to be the only ones.
    > >
    > Belgium has stepped up the pace a bit. A couple of weeks ago the "Flemish anti-doping bus" turned
    > up to an amateur kermesse and tested 10(!) riders.

    <snip>

    Did anyone test positive?

    The impression I got from some riders who spent a few years on the Belgian circuit is that it was
    totally drug ridden. I have no way of knowing whether it has cleaned up since then, but amphetamines
    seemed to rule the day.

    It'd be fun to sit around, crack open a few beers and exchange stories, but unfortunately this
    newsgroup isn't the place for such fun.
     
  13. Bob Schwartz

    Bob Schwartz Guest

    Bart <[email protected]> wrote:
    > "Kurgan Gringioni" <[email protected]> wrote
    >>
    >> OTOH, Italy is the only country where people dope up for cyclotourismo events.

    > c'm on..... there are people who dope up for less than that, just to drop the buddies on sunday
    > morning.

    Americans dope to get laid. Top that!

    Bob Schwartz [email protected]

    Living in the American glass house, not throwing stones.
     
  14. Jeff Jones

    Jeff Jones Guest

    "Kurgan Gringioni" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    >
    > Did anyone test positive?
    >
    Not sure yet. I doubt it.
    >
    > The impression I got from some riders who spent a few years on the Belgian circuit is that it was
    > totally drug ridden. I have no way of knowing
    whether
    > it has cleaned up since then, but amphetamines seemed to rule the day.
    >
    Without being too naiive, I think it has cleaned up a bit in recent years and hopefully will
    continue to do so with the threat of more doping controls. Not that it makes a difference to the
    results. Most of the races are won by about 10 guys, who are either ex-pros, wannabe pros, or career
    amateurs, who are smart enough to realise they'll make more money with less pressure this way.
    They're all strong, and don't need to dope to rip your legs off.

    I hear lots of stories too, some of them I can believe. I've spotted riders who are obviously dosed
    up on speed, and (a few years ago) I got a first hand account from a rider who did so for a 300 km
    race in the freezing rain. He said he felt great for the first 160 km and had to take all his layers
    of clothing off because it was too hot :) Then he ran out of gas but still finished. Of course, for
    a 120 km kermesse this isn't a problem.

    Jeff
     
  15. Davide Tosi

    Davide Tosi Guest

    "Robert Chung" <[email protected]> wrote:

    >Any of these guys Padans?

    Bortolami, who is from near Milan (but he's accused of using corticoids, a joke of a doping)

    the other 3 are southern scumbags
     
  16. Amit

    Amit Guest

    [email protected] (Davide Tosi) wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
    > "Robert Chung" <[email protected]> wrote:
    >
    > >Any of these guys Padans?
    >
    > Bortolami, who is from near Milan (but he's accused of using corticoids, a joke of a doping)
    >

    Hey what team was Bortolami on in the late 90s ?
     
  17. Robert Chung

    Robert Chung Guest

    "Davide Tosi" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
    > "Robert Chung" <[email protected]> wrote:
    >
    > >Any of these guys Padans?
    >
    > Bortolami, who is from near Milan (but he's accused of using corticoids, a joke of a doping)

    Ah. Well in that case, it's okay.

    > the other 3 are southern scumbags
     
  18. Us

    Us Guest

    Mapei... finished 2nd to Museeuw in the Mapei 96 sweep of Paris-Roubaix, JM, Bortolami, and Tafi.
    They did the Team Time Trial from The Forest to the end... The end of the races is funny viewing as
    the two Italians dispute (repaetedly) LeFevere's decision to have JM win the race. it was the year
    Ballerini flateed 4 times trying to repeat... finished 5.

    Amit wrote:

    > [email protected] (Davide Tosi) wrote in message
    > news:<[email protected]>...
    >
    >>"Robert Chung" <[email protected]> wrote:
    >>
    >>
    >>>Any of these guys Padans?
    >>
    >>Bortolami, who is from near Milan (but he's accused of using corticoids, a joke of a doping)
    >>
    >
    >
    > Hey what team was Bortolami on in the late 90s ?
     
  19. Kenny

    Kenny Guest

    > Mapei... finished 2nd to Museeuw in the Mapei 96 sweep of Paris-Roubaix, JM, Bortolami, and Tafi.
    > They did the Team Time Trial from The Forest to the end... The end of the races is funny viewing
    > as the two Italians dispute (repaetedly) LeFevere's decision to have JM win the race. it was the
    > year Ballerini flateed 4 times trying to repeat... finished 5.

    After (i think 2 years) at Mapei he joined Festina. It surpised me to see him leading the main field
    on colls of 2nd and 3rd category preparing an attack of Virenque. I found it very strange to see a
    classics rider doing that. I guess it was right to be suspicious. The tour '98 showed that.
     
  20. "JTN" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
    > how is it that 95% of all the positive drug tests are Italians. do they not know drugs are
    > illegal? do they know the definition of illegal? what the hell?

    I've heard that a mentality that exists or at least has existed in Italy is that the people think
    it's better that people take drugs to be better at sports rather than getting high on narcotics.

    That won't explain why so many get caught cheating but it certainly doesn't help the
    matter in Italy.
     
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