Wheel bearing grease types?

[jim beam]

[email protected] wrote:
> "The next time water contacts the interface, it wicks into the gap by
> capillary action and begins to fill the bearing;"
> An elmer's blue school glue bottle is in use here for dispensing
> (significant upgrade)valvo synth trans lube onto the chain and not the
> south 40. The elmers is left outside atop a railroad tie. The trans
> lube is cloudy with water not that the rains are heavy here.
> "There doesn't seem to be a consensus on cup-and-cone bearings vs the
> cartridge bearings": hereabouts in S. Fla, a brief survey of LBS found
> the most common opinion as "those cartridge hubs are ****." However,
> as stated finding a phil wood hub owner is akin to the extinct
> woodpecker.

and that's the essential point. i've never heard any complaints about
the bearings phil uses. from what i can tell, they use a decent grade
of bearing with a decent seal. cheapo bike cartridge bearings use a
"loose spec" seal, that really isn't a seal at all. if you take off one
side of these "sealed" bike bearings and hold it up to the light, you'll
see an air gap under the remaining seal and the inner race. hence
leakage. that gap doesn't exist in true industrial grade bearings. my
cosmos hub, which have skf bearings [which are darned expensive btw]
have no gap and seal just great. slightly "draggy", but i bought them
for the wet. and they're excellent. i've not had to maintain their
butter smoothness in two full seasons and two wet seasons. shimano are
fine in the dry, but 105 rear hubs need attention every month or so in
the wet.

> One of the fine elements of cycling is the common ability to grok the
> equipment more readily than ur morgan or maserati -8 and so with the
> bearing repack: how much grease? Well, we know the lbs is cheating us
> on grease and 2) we're not running the salt flats or Verdun although
> there are times when, so packing the cup good and solid is a good idea
> so come the next maintenance interval when your too busy and time
> slips away for 6-7 months, the bearing will retain a small quantity at
> 1 year plus, right?
> Gee, "a bimmer:" auto's have brake heat driving the moisture away as
> the grease evaps and pressures outward as you drive to the course at
> pebble for a few rounds with clint.
> Actually, not schooled as a mechanical engineer, I rather see grease
> as stated; fudge with walnuts. Notice how the walnuts disappear into
> the batter when operating the beater. The walnuts go down then come up
> on the outside against the bowl wall. That's what I saw when grokking
> the front hub.
> THIS IS GREASE'S TRUE FUNCTION!!! Absorbing dirt, dog ****, broken
> campy hub particles and shimano oil seals.
>

 

[jim beam]

John Henderson wrote:
> [email protected] wrote:
>
>> I re-greasing the wheel bearings next week. I need a tip on
>> the preferences for wheel bearing grease. I have ball bearing
>> hubs and I was considering using Black Moly grease. Other than
>> the color making for an ugly mess as the grease slowly crawls
>> out of the hub over the miles, are there any bad reasons to
>> use it? The last wheel bearing grease I used was that thick
>> viscous green Phil Wood stuff.
>
> MoS2 (moly) grease was my choice for wheel bearings last time I
> needed to repack. That was aeons ago, and they're still
> running as smooth as silk with no play.
>
> It's not for nothing that this stuff is specified for the likes
> of Shimano internal-gear hubs and automotive CV joints.
>
> John

moly grease is not usually recommended for rolling element bearings -
much more common in sliding bearings. cv joints are the perfect example
of that application. reason is that the bearings tend to skid and
flat-spot. marine grease is the way to go if there's any problems with
standard spec.

 

[John Henderson]

jim beam wrote:

> moly grease is not usually recommended for rolling element
> bearings -
> much more common in sliding bearings. cv joints are the
> perfect example of that application. reason is that the
> bearings tend to skid and flat-spot. marine grease is the way
> to go if there's any problems with standard spec.

I've heard this before, and also seen the claim disputed before.
I wonder if there's hard evidence. While I respect your
opinion, let me just say that I've been using moly grease with
excellent results for well over 30 years. It's what I usually
use for automotive wheel bearings (taper roller), for example.
In this application, there is always some play, and I've seen
no evidence of flat spots or shorter component life.

John

 

[[email protected]]

"i've been using this for years and..."
there's a lot of that around!*
now that i consider this for a moment, there is a standard standup
routine we could digress too beginning with methusula, alexander going
thru lincoln to liilienthal, george burns but...
I discarded the auto grease after a side by side examkination of how
the cycle and auto grease spread out over a 90 degree metal surface.
by the way, google 'greases'? or try 'grease\lubricants' at
GlobalSpec?

 

[[email protected]]

> and that's the essential point. i've never heard any complaints about
> the bearings phil uses. from what i can tell, they use a decent grade...
at that price someone wudda shot phil by now if ...
the deore 570XT?? runs like a train and i am amazed there's no play
on @3500 miles with a HD touring load both ridden and left in the
rain.

i don't interpret the LBS comments as saying the cartridge hubs are
badly designed and worthless,
but more of a subjective negative opinion with an i prefer attached

 

[[email protected]]

>
> I think there may be a name for a new Ben & jerry ice cream in the
> above.

bimmerbrimmer?-

 

[jim beam]

John Henderson wrote:
> jim beam wrote:
>
>> moly grease is not usually recommended for rolling element
>> bearings -
>> much more common in sliding bearings. cv joints are the
>> perfect example of that application. reason is that the
>> bearings tend to skid and flat-spot. marine grease is the way
>> to go if there's any problems with standard spec.
>
> I've heard this before, and also seen the claim disputed before.
> I wonder if there's hard evidence.

it's on one of the manufacturer web sites - i think skf.

> While I respect your
> opinion, let me just say that I've been using moly grease with
> excellent results for well over 30 years.

may well be. fwiu, it's more of a problem in roller bearings,
particularly when subject to contamination - the contaminant particle
stops the roller rolling and the low friction of the moly lets the whole
shebang skid, particularly if the point loading is low. since you're
already into maintenance, you probably keep everything clean enough for
this not to happen. that's not an option for everybody. and you have
to consider the evidence of where moly greases are used in industry - cv
joints are a classic, but as before, there's more sliding going on there
than rolling. apart from cv joints, i can't offhand think of a rolling
element bearing that has moly grease from factory.

> It's what I usually
> use for automotive wheel bearings (taper roller), for example.
> In this application, there is always some play, and I've seen
> no evidence of flat spots or shorter component life.
>
> John

 

[John Henderson]

jim beam wrote:

> ... it's more of a problem in roller bearings, particularly
> when subject to contamination - the contaminant particle stops
> the roller rolling and the low friction of the moly lets the
> whole shebang skid, particularly if the point loading is low.

OK, thanks. I understand that potential for non-rotation of the
ball or roller. And I intuitively figured any problem would
tend to be more likely with rollers than balls because of the
play in the former.

It had occurred to me that rollers and balls always slide in
operation anyway, simply because the trip around a bearing cup
is longer than the trip around the cone. So in a clean
environment, perhaps I'm vindicated in using moly grease.

John