When Lance pushes Ullrich into the red...

Discussion in 'Road Cycling' started by trg, Jul 1, 2004.

  1. trg

    trg Guest

    Is this really a good idea-

    http://www.t-mobile-team.com/cms/tmoteam/en/archive/news/templateId=renderIn
    ternalPage/yearID=2004/monthID=5/itemID=24294/id=13740.html

    Live biometric readouts -

    Join the riders on the rough ride to Paris. Biometric readouts transmitted
    direct, via GPRS, from the rider's bike to your computer allow a totally new
    insight into the world's hardest race. Check out the riders' heart rate,
    power, speed and pedal cadence when they tackle the mountain time-trial up
    the Alpe d'Huez. A unique opportunity to witness the incredible physical
    demands this race places on the riders!

    Bruyneel will be able to monitor Ullrich's power and HR realtime???? Or
    maybe TMO will be feeding false info to bluff Armstrong :)

    Ditto for Saeco.
     
    Tags:


  2. Chris

    Chris Guest

    "trg" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]
    > Is this really a good idea-


    I think so. It will show that Armstrong is not so much stronger than some
    others. All of the hype from these last few years talking about how LA is
    some kind of superman has really mislead a lot of people IMO. That is a cool
    idea to exploit the unique opportunity of an uphill ITT.



    >

    http://www.t-mobile-team.com/cms/tmoteam/en/archive/news/templateId=renderIn
    > ternalPage/yearID=2004/monthID=5/itemID=24294/id=13740.html
    >
    > Live biometric readouts -
    >
    > Join the riders on the rough ride to Paris. Biometric readouts transmitted
    > direct, via GPRS, from the rider's bike to your computer allow a totally

    new
    > insight into the world's hardest race. Check out the riders' heart rate,
    > power, speed and pedal cadence when they tackle the mountain time-trial up
    > the Alpe d'Huez. A unique opportunity to witness the incredible physical
    > demands this race places on the riders!
    >
    > Bruyneel will be able to monitor Ullrich's power and HR realtime????


    They already do. Ever hear of VAM? Competitors often monitor one another up
    steep hills to see how their form is. I don't know how they can get the
    heart rates without cooperation riders, but everything else can be
    calculated simply through observation (with a watch, a topographical map and
    some math). Actually with GPS the only reason they need to observe is to get
    cadence.

    >Or maybe TMO will be feeding false info to bluff Armstrong :)


    > Ditto for Saeco.


    Ever hear the phrase "the race of truth"? This ITT leaves little room for
    bluffing.
     
  3. HardwareLust

    HardwareLust Guest

    Chris wrote:
    > "trg" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > news:[email protected]
    >> Is this really a good idea-

    >
    > I think so. It will show that Armstrong is not so much stronger than
    > some others. All of the hype from these last few years talking about
    > how LA is some kind of superman has really mislead a lot of people
    > IMO. That is a cool idea to exploit the unique opportunity of an
    > uphill ITT.


    LA doesn't need to be "so much stronger" than everybody else. Being on
    almost the same level physically, and having the added benefit of an almost
    unlimited development budget for equipment, training and preparation (not
    to mention having CC and JB is a *huge* advantage) has been enough to give
    him the edge over everybody else.

    I firmly believe that if you put Jan in LA's place, the results would be
    very similar. Jan alone has proven he has the talent to beat Lance, but is
    lacking just a little in motivation and preparation. Perhaps, if he had
    the preparation that Lance has had, he would have found the motivation
    somewhere along the way.

    It's a shame we will never know for sure what would have been.

    Regards,
    H.
     
  4. alex

    alex Guest

    Maybe I just got used to the bratwurst look, but today Jan was looking so
    extremely skinny that it was scary.

    He looked consumed!

    "HardwareLust" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:p[email protected]
    > Chris wrote:
    > > "trg" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > > news:[email protected]
    > >> Is this really a good idea-

    > >
    > > I think so. It will show that Armstrong is not so much stronger than
    > > some others. All of the hype from these last few years talking about
    > > how LA is some kind of superman has really mislead a lot of people
    > > IMO. That is a cool idea to exploit the unique opportunity of an
    > > uphill ITT.

    >
    > LA doesn't need to be "so much stronger" than everybody else. Being on
    > almost the same level physically, and having the added benefit of an

    almost
    > unlimited development budget for equipment, training and preparation (not
    > to mention having CC and JB is a *huge* advantage) has been enough to give
    > him the edge over everybody else.
    >
    > I firmly believe that if you put Jan in LA's place, the results would be
    > very similar. Jan alone has proven he has the talent to beat Lance, but

    is
    > lacking just a little in motivation and preparation. Perhaps, if he had
    > the preparation that Lance has had, he would have found the motivation
    > somewhere along the way.
    >
    > It's a shame we will never know for sure what would have been.
    >
    > Regards,
    > H.
    >
    >
     
  5. Baird Webel

    Baird Webel Guest

    On 7/2/04 3:29 PM, in article [email protected],
    "HardwareLust" <[email protected]> wrote:


    > I firmly believe that if you put Jan in LA's place, the results would be
    > very similar. Jan alone has proven he has the talent to beat Lance, but is
    > lacking just a little in motivation and preparation. Perhaps, if he had
    > the preparation that Lance has had, he would have found the motivation
    > somewhere along the way.


    You honestly think that Deutsche Telekom wouldn¹t have the same resources as
    US Postal when it comes to preparing for the Tour? If so, I'd say it's
    probably because DT came to the conclusion that Jan didn't have the
    motivation and discipline to make it worth putting the resources into him.

    Baird
     
  6. Chris

    Chris Guest

    "Baird Webel" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:BD0B7DEA.46562%[email protected]
    > On 7/2/04 3:29 PM, in article [email protected],
    > "HardwareLust" <[email protected]> wrote:
    >
    >
    > > I firmly believe that if you put Jan in LA's place, the results would be
    > > very similar. Jan alone has proven he has the talent to beat Lance, but

    is
    > > lacking just a little in motivation and preparation. Perhaps, if he

    had
    > > the preparation that Lance has had, he would have found the motivation
    > > somewhere along the way.

    >
    > You honestly think that Deutsche Telekom wouldn¹t have the same resources

    as
    > US Postal when it comes to preparing for the Tour? If so, I'd say it's
    > probably because DT came to the conclusion that Jan didn't have the
    > motivation and discipline to make it worth putting the resources into him.
    >
    > Baird


    Don't forget that Telekom has always had more expensive mouths to feed. They
    have a lot of the world's bests cyclist that can win all year. USPS spends
    most of its R&D on one person for one race and their salary budget *has to
    be* much larger than USPS. AFAIK, they spend about the same in any given
    year so that means that Jan is not going to have the same focus year around
    simply because the team is filled with top cyclists racing to win from
    January to October.
     
  7. trg

    trg Guest

    Chris wrote:
    > "trg" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > news:[email protected]
    >> Is this really a good idea-

    >
    > I think so. It will show that Armstrong is not so much stronger than
    > some others. All of the hype from these last few years talking about
    > how LA is some kind of superman has really mislead a lot of people
    > IMO. That is a cool idea to exploit the unique opportunity of an
    > uphill ITT.
    >
    >
    >
    >>

    >

    http://www.t-mobile-team.com/cms/tmoteam/en/archive/news/templateId=renderIn
    >> ternalPage/yearID=2004/monthID=5/itemID=24294/id=13740.html
    >>
    >> Live biometric readouts -
    >>
    >> Join the riders on the rough ride to Paris. Biometric readouts
    >> transmitted direct, via GPRS, from the rider's bike to your computer
    >> allow a totally new insight into the world's hardest race. Check out
    >> the riders' heart rate, power, speed and pedal cadence when they
    >> tackle the mountain time-trial up the Alpe d'Huez. A unique
    >> opportunity to witness the incredible physical demands this race
    >> places on the riders!
    >>
    >> Bruyneel will be able to monitor Ullrich's power and HR realtime????

    >
    > They already do. Ever hear of VAM? Competitors often monitor one
    > another up steep hills to see how their form is. I don't know how
    > they can get the heart rates without cooperation riders, but
    > everything else can be calculated simply through observation (with a
    > watch, a topographical map and some math). Actually with GPS the only
    > reason they need to observe is to get cadence.
    >
    >> Or maybe TMO will be feeding false info to bluff Armstrong :)

    >
    >> Ditto for Saeco.

    >
    > Ever hear the phrase "the race of truth"? This ITT leaves little room
    > for bluffing.


    Ever hear the phrase "knowledge is power"? Competitors currently have no way
    to measure each other's HR. By reading someone's HR over a long stage, you
    can tell when they go beyond their LT. According to the Armstrong camp, his
    advantage is that he can produce more watts without going over his LT than
    the other guys. When he (and Postal) ride exactly at this level of effort,
    he's remaining "fresh" while the others are tiring themselves out before the
    final climb. Then, when it's time for the final effort up La Mongie, or
    wherever, he's got more in the tank than the others and he pulls away.

    I agree that if it's just data during l'Alpe d'Huez, it's not too much of
    an advantage, but I read it differently. That the data will be available for
    every stage ("Join the riders on the rough ride to Paris.") and especially
    interesting (in their view) will be the data at ITT. Knowing when to put
    the pedal down on a 200km stage with 5 rated climbs-, is the other guy
    bluffing, or is he really hurting like he looks, or conversely, maybe he's
    putting up a good front but he didn't recover well from yeasterday's stage
    and now is the time to push harder ...) could be a huge advantage.

    I was wondering last year when it looked like Ullrich was almost about to
    pull away on Le Tourmalet and Lance was consistantly 50-100 meters back, if
    he wasn't faking, getting Ullrich to push harder than he should have on the
    next to last climb so that he's have less in the tank when they got to Luz.
    Imagine if Ullrich had Armstrong's realtime HR available to him then? He'd
    know whether to ease up a bit and save himself, or maybe push it even
    harder, go into the red because Armstrong would be suffereing even more.
     
  8. Are they doing this for all the teams or just T-Mobile? The link at the T-Mobile
    site takes me to http://www.livebiodata.de/T-Mobile/EN/index.html which has live
    readouts for a T-Mobile rider (Kessler) and a Saeco rider (Ludewig).




    J. Spaceman



    trg wrote:

    > Is this really a good idea-
    >
    > http://www.t-mobile-team.com/cms/tmoteam/en/archive/news/templateId=renderIn
    > ternalPage/yearID=2004/monthID=5/itemID=24294/id=13740.html
    >
    > Live biometric readouts -
    >
    > Join the riders on the rough ride to Paris. Biometric readouts transmitted
    > direct, via GPRS, from the rider's bike to your computer allow a totally new
    > insight into the world's hardest race. Check out the riders' heart rate,
    > power, speed and pedal cadence when they tackle the mountain time-trial up
    > the Alpe d'Huez. A unique opportunity to witness the incredible physical
    > demands this race places on the riders!
    >
    > Bruyneel will be able to monitor Ullrich's power and HR realtime???? Or
    > maybe TMO will be feeding false info to bluff Armstrong :)
    >
    > Ditto for Saeco.


    --
    My email address ([email protected]) is fake. Email sent to it will
    only get caught in my spam tarpit.
     
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