Which Group Shelter?

Discussion in 'General Fitness' started by Mark Anderson, Jan 4, 2006.

  1. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
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    Hi,

    I'm looking to purchase a group shelter and have looked around and see 4
    main options...

    Terranova Bothy Bags

    Outdoor Designs Shelters
    (http://www.outdoorgb.com/p/outdoor_designs_mountain_shelters/)

    Needlesports own

    JDS Bothy Bags (http://www.outdoorstore.co.uk/products/survivalshelters.asp)


    Anyway, my question is what are your experiences with these things and
    what recommendations do you have?

    Thanks in advance...

    - --
    Mark Anderson
    Email: maa [AT] scotclimb.org.uk
    WWW: www.scotclimb.org.uk

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    Tags:


  2. "Mark Anderson" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]
    > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
    > Hash: SHA1
    >
    > Hi,
    >
    > I'm looking to purchase a group shelter and have looked around and see 4
    > main options...


    I got the OD one from cotswold for taking kids from my school climbing.
    It's a council rule -SOP- even though it's roadside crags.

    Kids thought it was a giant condom when I got it out in the classroom !

    Nick
     
  3. Lindsay

    Lindsay Guest

    I don't think the make of Group Shelter makes much difference as it is
    only for a short time, unless an emergency arises. I think you need
    to decide the number of people that are likely to use it and decide on
    the size.

    I have both a four and an eight man one due to my work. Fortunately
    the clients have never needed either.

    If you do go out in groups you may find that others carry one so
    probably a 2 or 4 man would suffice rather than the bulk of a larger
    one.
     
  4. Lindsay

    Lindsay Guest

    I don't think the make of Group Shelter makes much difference as it is
    only for a short time, unless an emergency arises. I think you need
    to decide the number of people that are likely to use it and decide on
    the size.

    I have both a four and an eight man one due to my work. Fortunately
    the clients have never needed either.

    If you do go out in groups you may find that others carry one so
    probably a 2 or 4 man would suffice rather than the bulk of a larger
    one.

    Lindsay
    www.caledoniahilltreks.com
     
  5. W. D. Grey

    W. D. Grey Guest

    In article <[email protected]>,
    Lindsay <[email protected]> writes
    >I don't think the make of Group Shelter makes much difference as it is
    >only for a short time, unless an emergency arises. I think you need
    >to decide the number of people that are likely to use it and decide on
    >the size.
    >
    > I have both a four and an eight man one due to my work. Fortunately
    >the clients have never needed either.
    >
    >If you do go out in groups you may find that others carry one so
    >probably a 2 or 4 man would suffice rather than the bulk of a larger
    >one.
    >


    If the party comprises two people then the four man group shelter is a
    bit more comfortable.

    The 2 man shelter is a bit snug but OK
    --
    Bill Grey
    http://www.billboy.co.uk
     
  6. On Wed, 04 Jan 2006 20:43:02 GMT, Mark Anderson
    <[email protected]> wrote:

    >-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
    >Hash: SHA1
    >
    >Hi,
    >
    >I'm looking to purchase a group shelter and have looked around and see 4
    >main options...
    >
    >Terranova Bothy Bags
    >
    >Outdoor Designs Shelters
    >(http://www.outdoorgb.com/p/outdoor_designs_mountain_shelters/)
    >
    >Needlesports own
    >
    >JDS Bothy Bags (http://www.outdoorstore.co.uk/products/survivalshelters.asp)
    >
    >
    >Anyway, my question is what are your experiences with these things and
    >what recommendations do you have?


    I have a Terra Nova Bothy 4.

    It's comfortable for 2/3 people to picnic in the rain/sleet. That's
    all I've used it for.
     
  7. Peter Clinch

    Peter Clinch Guest

    Mark Anderson wrote:

    > I'm looking to purchase a group shelter and have looked around and see 4
    > main options...


    > Anyway, my question is what are your experiences with these things and
    > what recommendations do you have?


    I've used the Terra Nova 2 and 4 man and a homemade. Given that the
    homemade worked perfectly well I don't think there'll be /that/ much
    between the various flavours (and if you're handy with a sewing machine
    it gives you another option).

    The TN4 can still be used by 2 so is a more flexible general option, but
    if there's only ever 1 or 2 of you then the 2 would make more sense.
    They're very good if you need a break out of the elements and there's no
    shelter about.

    Pete.
    --
    Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
    Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
    Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
    net [email protected] http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/
     
  8. In article <[email protected]>, Mark
    Anderson <[email protected]> writes
    >Hi,
    >
    >I'm looking to purchase a group shelter and have looked around and see 4
    >main options...
    >
    >Terranova Bothy Bags


    I have the 2 person one of these it is a good bit of kit.
    >
    >Outdoor Designs Shelters
    >(http://www.outdoorgb.com/p/outdoor_designs_mountain_shelters/)
    >
    >Needlesports own
    >
    >JDS Bothy Bags (http://www.outdoorstore.co.uk/products/survivalshelters.asp)


    I have a 6-8 person one of these and it is fine. It doesn't have windows
    like the Terranova but that keeps the weight down and make is less prone
    to failure (fewer seems, life of window material).

    I would go for the JDS if it matches your size requirements as they are
    fine and relatively cheap from what I remember.

    --

    Dominic Sexton
     
  9. Mike Clark

    Mike Clark Guest

    In message <[email protected]>
    Mark Anderson <[email protected]> wrote:

    > Hi,
    >
    > I'm looking to purchase a group shelter and have looked around and see 4
    > main options...
    >
    > Terranova Bothy Bags
    >
    > Outdoor Designs Shelters
    > (http://www.outdoorgb.com/p/outdoor_designs_mountain_shelters/)
    >
    > Needlesports own
    >
    > JDS Bothy Bags (http://www.outdoorstore.co.uk/products/survivalshelters.asp)
    >
    >
    > Anyway, my question is what are your experiences with these things and
    > what recommendations do you have?
    >
    > Thanks in advance...
    >


    I've got a 4 person Terra Nova and a 2 person Outdoor Designs, they both
    seem to do what they say on the tin, i.e. provide an emergency shelter
    big enough for the number quoted.

    The Outdoor Designs has a plastic window and both of them have a
    ventilation port.

    I've used the 4 person shelter for additional cover during an overnight
    bivvy in a snow-hole when trapped by adverse conditions ski-touring.
    Other than that they have occassionaly been used for snack stops in
    inclement weather.

    I often carry a bivvy shelter when out ski-touring, mountaineering or
    hill-walking and choose the size depending on the number in the party
    and also on whether others are also taking emergency shelter along.


    Mike
    --
    o/ \\ // || ,_ o Mike Clark, "An antibody engineer who also
    <\__,\\ // __o || / /\, likes the mountains"
    "> || _`\<,_ // \\ \> | Cambridge Climbing and Caving Club
    ` || (_)/ (_) // \\ \_ <URL:http://www.path.cam.ac.uk/~mrc7/cccc/>
     
  10. On Wed, 04 Jan 2006 20:43:02 GMT, Mark Anderson
    <[email protected]> wrote:

    >-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
    >Hash: SHA1
    >
    >Hi,
    >
    >I'm looking to purchase a group shelter and have looked around and see 4
    >main options...
    >
    >Terranova Bothy Bags
    >


    I've got a 2 man one of these. For lunching out of the weather type
    use, a 4 man wou8ld be better for 2, but for emergency use a 2-man is
    preferable, as there's less air to have to warm up so it's hotter (at
    least that's the theory).

    If it is for emergencies, I'd recommend each person carrying a
    lightweight bivvy bag anyway (one of those silver things, so light and
    small you hardly notice you're carrying it). A group shelter for
    emergencies is all very well if the group stays together, but if the
    emergency is caused by a fall for instance this may not be the case.

    S.
    --
    Oppose ID cards and the database state - sign the pledge at
    http://www.pledgebank.com/refuse
     
  11. Mike Clark

    Mike Clark Guest

    In message <[email protected]>
    Simon Caldwell <[email protected]> wrote:

    > On Wed, 04 Jan 2006 20:43:02 GMT, Mark Anderson
    > <[email protected]> wrote:
    >
    > >-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
    > >Hash: SHA1
    > >
    > >Hi,
    > >
    > >I'm looking to purchase a group shelter and have looked around and see 4
    > >main options...
    > >
    > >Terranova Bothy Bags
    > >

    >
    > I've got a 2 man one of these. For lunching out of the weather type
    > use, a 4 man wou8ld be better for 2, but for emergency use a 2-man is
    > preferable, as there's less air to have to warm up so it's hotter (at
    > least that's the theory).
    >
    > If it is for emergencies, I'd recommend each person carrying a
    > lightweight bivvy bag anyway (one of those silver things, so light and
    > small you hardly notice you're carrying it). A group shelter for
    > emergencies is all very well if the group stays together, but if the
    > emergency is caused by a fall for instance this may not be the case.
    >
    > S.


    I think the really lightweight silver bivvy bags offer a false sense of
    security. I remember snow-holing in an emergency with a group of
    friends. Two of them pulled out silver bags and climbed in, one had a
    pertex sleeping bag cover, and three of us used a four man bivvy
    shelter.

    Even inside in the still air of a snow-hole the two with the silver bags
    found them shredding to pieces within an hour or so of use. The three of
    us in the shared space of the bivvy shelter were definitely the warmest
    in the group.

    The larger and more robust vacuum packed silver bivvy bags with
    multi-layered air pockets probably are OK but I've never used one. The
    nylon bivvy shelters or a nylon or pertex bivvy bag are more likely to
    be useful in a real emergency bivvy, particularly in an exposed and
    windy location and they can also double up as handy shelters for food
    stops on more routine occasions in inclement weather.

    Mike
    --
    o/ \\ // || ,_ o Mike Clark, "An antibody engineer who also
    <\__,\\ // __o || / /\, likes the mountains"
    "> || _`\<,_ // \\ \> | Cambridge Climbing and Caving Club
    ` || (_)/ (_) // \\ \_ <URL:http://www.path.cam.ac.uk/~mrc7/cccc/>
     
  12. Peter Clinch

    Peter Clinch Guest

    Mike Clark wrote:

    > The larger and more robust vacuum packed silver bivvy bags with
    > multi-layered air pockets probably are OK but I've never used one.


    Blizzard Packs. Pals of mine leading a tour in Norway deployed one when
    a client twisted his knee badly in a fall. He was consequently Not
    Doing Very Much in subzero temperatures for quite some time and reported
    being quite toasty. Everyone present was, I'm told, quite impressed.
    Following that report we've got them for the place of bivvi bags in the
    Just In Case section for ski tours where we're not planning bivvis:
    saves carrying an emergency small sleeping bag and a bivvi sack and
    packs down to about the size of a VHS cassette (vacuum packed, so it
    won't pack down that small afterwards, though the company do a repacking
    service).

    We also carry a TN Bothy Bag, because that can be a great asset in
    completely routine use where you need a break but there just isn't
    anywhere much to shelter. On our Most Epic Day Yet (TM) the BB made the
    difference between turning back (with resultant potentially expensive
    and slightly depressing get-out to return to Finse as we only had 1 day
    left) and getting on with it. Sound bit of kit.

    Pete.
    --
    Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
    Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
    Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
    net [email protected] http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/
     
  13. On Fri, 06 Jan 2006 12:13:45 GMT, Mike Clark <[email protected]>
    wrote:

    >
    >I think the really lightweight silver bivvy bags offer a false sense of
    >security.


    Only if you think they're going to be as good as a heavier bag! I
    view them purely as a 'better than nothing' option, and as such
    they're, well, better than nothing. The chances of an emergency are
    slim, and of an emergency where the group is divided so not everyone
    has access to a bothy bag are even slimmer. For such a small risk I
    couldn't justify the extra weight of anything other than an ultra
    lightweight bag.

    S.

    --
    Oppose ID cards and the database state - sign the pledge at
    http://www.pledgebank.com/refuse
     
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