Who is on the list of BANNED, GUILTY FIRED etc. cyclists due to doping

Discussion in 'Professional Cycling' started by CJ Smith, Jul 19, 2008.

  1. CJ Smith

    CJ Smith New Member

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    Who is on this list?

    This came to mind in a split second :eek:

    Floyd Landis
    Marco Pantani
    David Millar
    Ivan Basso
    Jan Ulrich
    Ricco what's his name...
    Vino
    Michael Rasmussen
    "Tricky" Beltran

    WHO ELSE???
     
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  2. i saw elvis

    i saw elvis New Member

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    Do you get taken off the list when you're dead ?
     
  3. CJ Smith

    CJ Smith New Member

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    Taken off like Pantani... OK you're right. I will say to my kids it is ok to be a doper as long as you die from a cocaine O.D. Sorry Elvis I am starch on this one, no insult to your question, just to Marco.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marco_Pantani

    A roll model he was not.

    Oh you can toss Tyler Hamilton on that list as well... Except he's not dead.:eek:
     
  4. cyclocommuter

    cyclocommuter New Member

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    here are some more...

    Alex Zulle
    Bjarne Riis

    ...plus many of the personalities currently in Rock Racing... including Hamilton.
     
  5. CJ Smith

    CJ Smith New Member

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    Thanks Cyclo... I appreciate the help! What was the name of the guy who's girlfriend (I think it was) was found with doping materials in her car trunk??

    ~CJ~
     
  6. cyclocommuter

    cyclocommuter New Member

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    Can't remember the name of the guy... if I recall right he was from the former Soviet Union. However I just remembered another guy who confessed to doping and this is the former King of the Mountains Richard Virenque who was a member of the infamous Festina team, a team which was also accused of organizing the use of performance enhancing drugs by all its members.
     
  7. CJ Smith

    CJ Smith New Member

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    LOL Cyclo... DUH ON ME! I have the Lotto Domo Jersey (STILL) from the Virenque (Spell check me) years... Dunno how I forgot him... I am sure there are a ton of other names... Lemme google "Cycling Dopers" etc... :p
     
  8. CJ Smith

    CJ Smith New Member

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    :mad: Third time I am trying this... :mad: These come from this link:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operaci%C3%B3n_Puerto_doping_case

    Francisco Mancebo

    Constantino Zaballa
    Alejandro Valverde

    Jose Ignacio Gutierrez
    Jose Enrique Gutierrez
    Santiago Botero

    Carlos Zarate
    Koldo Gil


    Oscar Sevilla

    Jorge Jaksche

    Carlos Garcia Quesada

    Michele Bartoli
    Angel Casero
    Roberto Heras
    Santiago Perez
     
  9. CJ Smith

    CJ Smith New Member

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    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/special_report/1998/07/98/tour_de_france/134842.stm


    Along with Virenque his Festina teammates were Alex Zulle, Pascal Herve, Laurent Dufaux, Christophe Moreau, Armin Meier, Didier Rous and Neil Stephens. They were all thrown out of 1998 TdF.

    1987

    Mark Walsham, Great Britain

    Willi Tackaert, Belgium



    2008

    Barloworld

    Moisés Dueñas Nevado



    Frankie Andreu (He is the lisping guy :p on the Versus Network… WTF!... :eek: )

    http://www.nytimes.com/2006/09/12/sports/othersports/12cycling.html?scp=7&sq=cyclist%20EPO&st=cse



    I am all for a lifetime ban on cyclists Pro or otherwise giving the rest of us a bad name… I know that paying attention to this sport is probably more prominent in Europe than it will ever be here in the US, but someone should make a real stand… You want to ban Astana… Great (Stupid).. Then hand out lifetime bans to riders as well… Otherwise the world gets filled with guys who make Hall of Fames like drug addicts that struggle to come clean. i.e. Lawrence Taylor from the NFL. How many times was he given a second chance… There were so many stories about him on the news … even after retirement that it all blurred into one story. Now over time people are forgetting his actions because of other sports bad boys. These are the role models of our children? IS this all we have? The best we can do? NICE! I don’t even want to touch upon baseball… I have lost faith in the serious depth of it’s governing body. I used to say, “Barry Bonds!” That became, “Barry who?” which changed into, “Barry? Who cares!” It is that final label that the players want most, that means people have begun giving up the convictions and the issue is that much closer to slipping from mind… it isn’t forgiveness it becomes more like forget-ness and that is not a proper sentence for substance abuse. The worst thing is it becomes a terrible teaching tool to future generations of athletes.



    In closing I want to say that it would be great if we could differentiate between drug addicts, cheaters and athletes.



     
  10. ClemmonsHoo

    ClemmonsHoo New Member

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    I don't know why cycling gets such a bad rap. Testing in football, baseball, and soccer is a complete joke. The doping problems in those sports are at least as bad as in cycling, but I guess there's more money to be made by those larger organizations when superstars break records, and those organization know that's what brings in the fans and sells merchandise. I used to have to bite my lip at work and just shake my head when the die hard, frothing at the mouth football and baseball types dissed cycling because - heaven forbid - they had dopers. I guess "denial" is not just a river in Egypt.
     
  11. huboon

    huboon New Member

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    Kashechkin
    Mayo
    Kessler
    Petacchi
     
  12. root

    root New Member

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    Marco Pantani is still inspiring to me to this day. He is one of the greatest climbers of all time, not withstanding drug use. I think we all know by now that all pro riders use some kind of drugs. It has been part of the sport since the beginning of Tour de France. Cycling is hard and "no one wins the tour on mineral water" :D.
     
  13. jhuskey

    jhuskey Moderator

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    Sinkeitz!
     
  14. Frigo's Luggage

    Frigo's Luggage New Member

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    Lance Armstrong
     
  15. CJ Smith

    CJ Smith New Member

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    Sorry Armstrong only makes the list in the minds of those who want him to be guilty. No matter how much you may dislike him, he is still clean in the eyes of history (drug tested and settled) and that footprint now rests for all of time so it seems... I can't imagine his case being reopened unless some very serious proof comes forward... Not impossible, just doubtful.
     
  16. doctorSpoc

    doctorSpoc New Member

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    hard proof... like six b samples that contained EPO aren't proof enough... what a joke!!!

    sure he isn't officially guilty but c'mon... you don't see that he got off on a technicality? and a completely idiotic one at that.. you need both an a and b sample to get a positive.. but he actually had SIX POSITIVE B's.. so it's all good?? :rolleyes: the naivety of some is pretty pathetic! please get a clue!

    Lance Armstrong was definitely busted with 6 positive sample containing EPO.. only in the eyes of the ignorant, naive or those who really want him to be clean is he innocent.
     
  17. doctorSpoc

    doctorSpoc New Member

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    Tammy Thomas

    yes... yes that's a female i.e. 1st name is Tammy.. she might actually do jail time like Marion Jones for lying to congress...
    [​IMG]
     
  18. CJ Smith

    CJ Smith New Member

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    You seem to be in the know and since I have spent much of my time deployed, perhaps you could enlighten me and all of us less informed with where the positive "A" samples or test results are. So like you said, "I haven't a clue".

    I heard it put this way once: If females were the "A" samples, males were the "B" samples and Noah could only round up the "B"s... The issues with "B"s die like the Armstrong "B" situation did.
     
  19. CJ Smith

    CJ Smith New Member

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    Thanks for the photo... I was gonna eat dinner this evening, but now I think I will skip it...

    :(
     
  20. doctorSpoc

    doctorSpoc New Member

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    it's a long sworded tail..

    the samples that contained EPO were from 1999... when a urine sample is taken from an athlete it's separated into an A vile and a B vile so it can go through the testing procedure twice so positives can be confirmed. the A samples were tested at that time.. a time when there was no test for EPO, so of course they came back negative... the B samples were never used since the A's were negative... but were kept frozen for research.

    In 2005 the UCI ordered a retrospective research, anonymous test of the B samples left over from the 1999 tour in order to see how well their current tests were working.. 1999 would be at a time when no one was actually trying to hide their use since EPO was undetectable at the time... so they could also see what percentage of the peleton would use a product if it was undetectable.. there would be lots of use for the project...

    when a urine sample is given the same code is attached to the paper work and the sample so that the sample, the paper work and the athlete can be linked up later. Unfortunately/fortunately WADA used this same code for its samples they tested in 2005... but they didn't have the paper work to link it to athletes, so the test was still anonymous.

    long story short a scheming LeMond reporter who saw and had a copy of the results of 1999 B samples and saw the codes along the side managed to get Armstrong and the head of the UCI's permission to show him and even to photocopy Armstrong's paper work from 1999... under the false pretence that he wanted to write a story to prove that Armstrong didn't have any special permission to use EPO because of his cancer (a common misperception that some even now believe). anyway, with the forms from the 1999 tour that had the codes and the tests of the B samples from 1999, tested in 2005 which also had the same codes it was possible to see which samples were Armstrong's... turns out 6 of the sample from the 1999 tour that contained EPO over the limit were Armstrong's.

    these results can never be used to ban or secure a positive result for Armstrong because 1) they are B samples and by the letter... you need an A and a B sample positive to get a positive test. 2) the WADA procedures were not followed to the letter since this was meant to be a research project and never meant to convict anyone.. but of course this is a world renowned lab... they did follow standard lab procedures

    but you need to ask yourself if just two sample.. an A and a B can be used to corroborate each other and is enough to convict someone of drug use... what do you make of 6 samples, many on consecutive days of the tour that contain EPO? sure he can never be deemed positive officially because of the technicalities but C'MON... it's a technicality, the guy is guilty as hell... that's obvious to anyone with two brain cells to rub together.
     
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