Why Do Mountain Bikers Always Resort to Threats and Violence?

[Mike Vandeman]

X-Apparently-To: [email protected] via 206.190.37.180; Sat, 09 Oct 2004
15:54:04 -0700
X-Originating-IP: [64.4.35.37]
Return-Path: <[email protected]>
Received: from 207.115.57.33 (EHLO ylpvm02.prodigy.net) (207.115.57.33)
by mta821.mail.sc5.yahoo.com with SMTP; Sat, 09 Oct 2004 15:54:03 -0700
X-Originating-IP: [64.4.35.37]
Received: from hotmail.com (bay12-f37.bay12.hotmail.com [64.4.35.37])
by ylpvm02.prodigy.net (8.12.10 083104/8.12.10) with ESMTP id
i99MsKYf031526
for <[email protected]>; Sat, 9 Oct 2004 18:54:21 -0400
Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC;
Sat, 9 Oct 2004 15:54:02 -0700
Received: from 156.34.16.13 by by12fd.bay12.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP;
Sat, 09 Oct 2004 22:53:02 GMT
X-Originating-IP: [156.34.16.13]
X-Originating-Email: [[email protected]]
X-Sender: [email protected]
From: "Brendan Flanagan" <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
Subject: artical
Date: Sat, 09 Oct 2004 22:53:02 +0000
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/html
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
X-OriginalArrivalTime: 09 Oct 2004 22:54:02.0060 (UTC)
FILETIME=[DEBB88C0:01C4AE52]



My comment is that your artical on mountain biking is not only bogus but makes
you as a person and a writer look like a total ass-hole. When a bike rides a
trail its the same as walking it wether you choose to go fast or slow scenery is
all the same at any speed, you say your so smart i say your really dumb because
eyes have memo sensories and can depict all scenery at any speed and thats why
when a car drives past you at 100 mph its a blur but when your in the car you
can still see fine.Another thing is that we as mountain-bikers destroy nature?
well walking a dog in the woods and leeting it pee on a tree is twice as
harmfull because of the toxians in the urine and fecies will kill your nature.
So Next time your talk about mountain biking in this manner i would think twice
because remember

"we all might just beat you up".


Take the effort out of being organized with MSN® Calendar. MSN Premium: Join now
and get the first two months FREE*
===
I am working on creating wildlife habitat that is off-limits to
humans ("pure habitat"). Want to help? (I spent the previous 8
years fighting auto dependence and road construction.)

http://home.pacbell.net/mjvande

 

[Tim K.]

Vandeman, you have no idea how much damage you are doing to the entire
concept of conservation. First, I will not be drawn into any sort of debate
about ecology with you because frankly, you aren't qualified. Nothing is
more grating than some iok who runs his Piled higher Deeper diploma up the
flagpole because he thinks it somehow lends credibility to anything he says.
You don't know any more about ecology than ecologists do about psychology.
Stick to your field.



Worse, you whine like a baby and play netcop at the slightest hint of
hostility. Here's a clue for you brightspark, people like you pretty much
breed hostility wherever they go. Deal with it, or take up a hobby that
doesn't involve pissing people off. This is usenet, not the reference
section of a library.



If we can't figure a way to manage public lands successfully for multiple
uses then the entire concept is doomed. Believe it or not there are many
people in this country who don't give a flying flip about setting natural
areas aside. But they might be inclined to support acquisition of lands if
it benefits them directly. Of course, there is also a boisterous, if not
ignorant group of property rights morons who feel no land should be held
publicly because it takes it off the tax roles. They are idiots and can't
be helped. But the vast majority of people have a favorable opinion of
conservation - even if for different reasons than what matters to you or me.



What really torques me off about you and people like you who have nothing
but an opinion, is that you are alienating many people who might otherwise
be allies in conservation. It's bad enough to be labeled an
"environmentalist" because I support conservation, but on top of that to be
labeled by people who think conservationists are all like you is disturbing
to me. So you can add "validates stereotypes" to "doesn't play well with
others" on your CV - but it still isn't helpful to the cause you claim to
support. I know biologists who ride - hell, I hunt ducks, that doesn't make
me anti-conservation. Get a clue, dipstick.



Sure, there are some bikers who are assholes - so are some hikers. At the
moment I can even think of an environmentalist who's an asshole. You would
do a lot better to try doing something positive. Instead of working
against, try working for.

Help some real biologists/ecologists with public education. You'll find
that bikers are much easier to work with than against. You'll find many, if
not most, eager to help police their own act. I would use an assumed name
if I were you though.

Help with the much larger threats to the ecological integrity of natural
areas - non-native species for example. Clean up some trails. Maybe even
try dating; just do something positive for Christ's sake. Otherwise you
leave us with no choice but to believe you just thrive on the confrontation
and aren't really interested in getting anything accomplished.



Don't bother replying. You're a moron, and morons go in my killfile. I
just believe you are doing far more damage than good to the cause of
conservation, and that you are probably doing more harm than good for the
environment as a result. In fact I shall probably take up trail riding just
to **** you off. You might want to think about all that, if you think at
all.

 

[Scott Burley]

On 10 Oct 2004, Tim K. offered up this insight:

> Vandeman, you have no idea how much damage you are doing to the entire
> concept of conservation...

An excellent rant, which will most assuredly fall on deaf ears.

--
__ __ _ ___ ___
/ _|/ _/ |_ _|_ _|
\_ ( (( o | | | |
|__/\__\_/|_| |_|

[email protected]

 

[Mike Vandeman]

On Sun, 10 Oct 2004 16:30:19 GMT, "Tim K." <[email protected]> wrote:

..
..Vandeman, you have no idea how much damage you are doing to the entire
..concept of conservation. First, I will not be drawn into any sort of debate
..about ecology with you because frankly, you aren't qualified. Nothing is
..more grating than some iok who runs his Piled higher Deeper diploma up the
..flagpole because he thinks it somehow lends credibility to anything he says.
..You don't know any more about ecology than ecologists do about psychology.
..Stick to your field.

As usual, you conveniently avoided giving even ONE example of a misstatement.

..Worse, you whine like a baby and play netcop at the slightest hint of
..hostility. Here's a clue for you brightspark, people like you pretty much
..breed hostility wherever they go.

So I forced them to write that drivel?

Deal with it, or take up a hobby that
..doesn't involve pissing people off. This is usenet, not the reference
..section of a library.
..
..
..
..If we can't figure a way to manage public lands successfully for multiple
..uses then the entire concept is doomed. Believe it or not there are many
..people in this country who don't give a flying flip about setting natural
..areas aside. But they might be inclined to support acquisition of lands if
..it benefits them directly. Of course, there is also a boisterous, if not
..ignorant group of property rights morons who feel no land should be held
..publicly because it takes it off the tax roles. They are idiots and can't
..be helped. But the vast majority of people have a favorable opinion of
..conservation - even if for different reasons than what matters to you or me.
..
..
..
..What really torques me off about you and people like you who have nothing
..but an opinion, is that you are alienating many people who might otherwise
..be allies in conservation.

I don't "alienate" people. I just tell the truth.

It's bad enough to be labeled an
.."environmentalist" because I support conservation, but on top of that to be
..labeled by people who think conservationists are all like you is disturbing
..to me. So you can add "validates stereotypes" to "doesn't play well with
..others" on your CV - but it still isn't helpful to the cause you claim to
..support. I know biologists who ride - hell, I hunt ducks, that doesn't make
..me anti-conservation.

Yes, it does. It's hypocrisy.

Get a clue, dipstick.
..
..
..
..Sure, there are some bikers who are assholes - so are some hikers. At the
..moment I can even think of an environmentalist who's an asshole. You would
..do a lot better to try doing something positive. Instead of working
..against, try working for.

I would love to, but someone has to stop mountain biking. YOU aren't going to.

..Help some real biologists/ecologists with public education. You'll find
..that bikers are much easier to work with than against. You'll find many, if
..not most, eager to help police their own act. I would use an assumed name
..if I were you though.
..
..Help with the much larger threats to the ecological integrity of natural
..areas - non-native species for example. Clean up some trails. Maybe even
..try dating; just do something positive for Christ's sake. Otherwise you
..leave us with no choice but to believe you just thrive on the confrontation
..and aren't really interested in getting anything accomplished.

You obviously have no idea what I do, in spite of it being listed on my web
site.

..Don't bother replying. You're a moron, and morons go in my killfile. I
..just believe you are doing far more damage than good to the cause of
..conservation, and that you are probably doing more harm than good for the
..environment as a result. In fact I shall probably take up trail riding just
..to **** you off. You might want to think about all that, if you think at
..all.

It shows exactly where you are coming from. Thanks. You answered your own
letter.
===
I am working on creating wildlife habitat that is off-limits to
humans ("pure habitat"). Want to help? (I spent the previous 8
years fighting auto dependence and road construction.)

http://home.pacbell.net/mjvande

 

[Jeff Strickland]

"Mike Vandeman" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Sun, 10 Oct 2004 16:30:19 GMT, "Tim K." <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> .
> .Vandeman, you have no idea how much damage you are doing to the entire
> .concept of conservation. First, I will not be drawn into any sort of
debate
> .about ecology with you because frankly, you aren't qualified. Nothing is
> .more grating than some iok who runs his Piled higher Deeper diploma up
the
> .flagpole because he thinks it somehow lends credibility to anything he
says.
> .You don't know any more about ecology than ecologists do about
psychology.
> .Stick to your field.
>
> As usual, you conveniently avoided giving even ONE example of a
misstatement.
>

He said you are full of ****, he needs no example beyond the one you just
provided.

He is someone that would work to help you if you weren't such an idiot, but
your only response is that indeed you are an idiot. Good work.

 

[Birdman42]

> In fact I shall probably take up trail riding just
> to **** you off. You might want to think about all that, if you think at
> all.
>
>

At last, your mean-spirited colors show through your mindless babble.
Vandy hasn't changed any minds one way or another and a single 4-year
presidential administration will do more harm to the environment than ten
thousands Vandy's could ever do. Think about that and stop playing with
Vandy.

 

[Tim K.]

"Birdman42" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> > In fact I shall probably take up trail riding just
> > to **** you off. You might want to think about all that, if you think
at
> > all.
> >
> >
>
> At last, your mean-spirited colors show through your mindless babble.
> Vandy hasn't changed any minds one way or another and a single 4-year
> presidential administration will do more harm to the environment than ten
> thousands Vandy's could ever do. Think about that and stop playing with
> Vandy.

Get over yourself.

 

[Birdman42]

"Tim K." <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> "Birdman42" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> >
> > > In fact I shall probably take up trail riding just
> > > to **** you off. You might want to think about all that, if you think
> at
> > > all.
> > >
> > >
> >
> > At last, your mean-spirited colors show through your mindless babble.
> > Vandy hasn't changed any minds one way or another and a single 4-year
> > presidential administration will do more harm to the environment than
ten
> > thousands Vandy's could ever do. Think about that and stop playing with
> > Vandy.
>
> Get over yourself.
>
>

Is that a gymnastic move or a levitation exercise?

 

[Tim K.]

"Birdman42" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> "Tim K." <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> >
> > "Birdman42" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> > news:[email protected]...
> > >
> > > > In fact I shall probably take up trail riding just
> > > > to **** you off. You might want to think about all that, if you
think
> > at
> > > > all.
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > > At last, your mean-spirited colors show through your mindless babble.
> > > Vandy hasn't changed any minds one way or another and a single 4-year
> > > presidential administration will do more harm to the environment than
> ten
> > > thousands Vandy's could ever do. Think about that and stop playing
with
> > > Vandy.
> >
> > Get over yourself.
> >
> >
>
> Is that a gymnastic move or a levitation exercise?

Neither - but it was a nice comeback!

 

[JoelM]

erm, where's the original 'article' that this thread is referring to?

 

[Mr_Kingkillaha]

erm, where's the original 'article' that this thread is referring to?

Just read any article about MTBs on Vandeman's site. They all have the same info.

 

[Mike Vandeman]

On Sat, 16 Oct 2004 10:12:59 +1000, JoelM
<[email protected]> wrote:

..
..erm, where's the original 'article' that this thread is referring to?

X-Apparently-To: [email protected] via 206.190.37.179; Sat, 09 Oct 2004
17:09:02 -0700
X-Originating-IP: [65.54.186.67]
Return-Path: <[email protected]>
Received: from 151.164.30.67 (EHLO mtac3.prodigy.net) (151.164.30.67)
by mta808.mail.yahoo.com with SMTP; Sat, 09 Oct 2004 17:09:02 -0700
X-Originating-IP: [65.54.186.67]
Received: from hotmail.com (bay16-f17.bay16.hotmail.com [65.54.186.67])
by mtac3.prodigy.net (8.12.10 inb shim/8.12.10) with ESMTP id
i9A091e3011095
for <[email protected]>; Sat, 9 Oct 2004 19:09:01 -0500 (CDT)
Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC;
Sat, 9 Oct 2004 17:09:00 -0700
Received: from 199.126.48.173 by by16fd.bay16.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP;
Sun, 10 Oct 2004 00:08:32 GMT
X-Originating-IP: [199.126.48.173]
X-Originating-Email: [[email protected]]
X-Sender: [email protected]
From: "Ryan Frecka" <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
Subject: MTBing Article
Date: Sat, 09 Oct 2004 18:08:32 -0600
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/html
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
X-OriginalArrivalTime: 10 Oct 2004 00:09:00.0991 (UTC)
FILETIME=[584DECF0:01C4AE5D]




I feel sorry for you. You took your precious time to write that article on how
mountain bikers destroy wilderness habitats. We are, in fact, the same as you,
just more skilled at what we do. The article you have written should be removed
because all it's done is made us feel more like beating the living **** out of
you! Not that I would ever need to resort to violence but this is going too far.
I think you should put that degree in psychology and stick it straight up your
biased little ass. As for the subjects noted in your article, they are
completely false. I'd like to see you ride a 40lb bike up a hill as fast as most
of us can and then ride it down over obstacles without going ass over teakettle.
Oh and by the way, I'M A MOUNTAIN BIKER!

RF


Don't just Search. Find! The new MSN Search: Fast. Clear. Easy.
===
I am working on creating wildlife habitat that is off-limits to
humans ("pure habitat"). Want to help? (I spent the previous 8
years fighting auto dependence and road construction.)

http://home.pacbell.net/mjvande