Why do people like VDB

Discussion in 'Road Cycling' started by Hold My Beer An, Mar 1, 2003.

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  1. HGH and steroids in his house, and he claims its for his dog, making a joke of the whole thing.
    Instead of being ostracized, people think he's a hero.

    win (if there are any).

    Tafi, perhaps.
     
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  2. EPREX

    EPREX New Member

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  3. EPREX <[email protected]> schreef in berichtnieuws
    [email protected] <snip>
    > At what point do you think they (media & public) would act in a " moral vein " by ostracising
    > cyclists and teams whom are shown to have indulged in "preparations and special budgets" ?

    Well, I think that many others are just as doped as Vandenbroucke, even riders who have never been
    caught. Those others are lucky, but I'm not going to reward them for that by turning them into
    paragons of virtue as opposed to Vandenbroucke. As long as they've done their suspensions, they're
    all equally guilty (or innocent) and deserving of respect as far as I care.

    >
    > They wont.
    >
    > Not when money is involved.

    Most of the public does not receive money from Vandenbroucke, nor do they really care about the
    money he makes. Money is no factor in the public's support of him. Ofcourse, teh media wants to sell
    its papers and broadcastings, but that can also be done by sending out stories about doping, which
    are popular.

    Jonathan.
     
  4. Phil Stone

    Phil Stone Guest

    Because VDB is still the greatest talent to come out of Belgium in recent years,,,,with or
    without drugs.

    Phil
     
  5. "Phil Stone" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > Because VDB is still the greatest talent to come out of Belgium in recent years,,,,with or
    > without drugs.
    >
    > Phil

    Are Belgians reluctant to venture an opinion on Boonen, or is he viewed as having less
    talent than VDB?
     
  6. Carl Sundquist <[email protected]> schreef in berichtnieuws
    [email protected]
    >
    > "Phil Stone" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > news:[email protected]...
    > > Because VDB is still the greatest talent to come out of Belgium in
    recent
    > > years,,,,with or without drugs.
    > >
    > > Phil
    >
    > Are Belgians reluctant to venture an opinion on Boonen, or is he viewed as having less talent
    > than VDB?

    It's a bit early to say. His palmares doesn't yet come close to that of VDB.
     
  7. "hold my beer and watch this..." <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    >

    > HGH and steroids in his house, and he claims its for his dog, making a
    joke
    > of the whole thing. Instead of being ostracized, people think he's a
    hero.

    guy
    > win (if there are any).

    People are fascinated with talent. Plus, VdB comes from a family with a long cycling pedigree.

    My personal opinion is that he is a Tool. Any rider without his Talent and with his flaws would have
    been out of the sport long ago. I'll save my admiration for someone who gets the most out of what
    talent they have.

    Remember when VdB's Dog talked of winning the TdF? It seems a lifetime ago.
     
  8. Amit

    Amit Guest

    "hold my beer and watch this..." <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:<[email protected]>...

    > HGH and steroids in his house, and he claims its for his dog, making a joke of the whole thing.
    > Instead of being ostracized, people think he's a hero.

    > win (if there are any).
    >

    Because people like the bad-ass. They vicariously enjoy bad boy antics like taking speed, smashing
    up cars and making life hell for team bosses, especially if the guy still comes through with good
    performances. Randy Moss, Jose Canseco, Allen Iverson, VDB, those guys kick ass.

    -Amit
     
  9. "Amit" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > "hold my beer and watch this..." <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:<[email protected]>...

    EPO,
    > > HGH and steroids in his house, and he claims its for his dog, making a
    joke
    > > of the whole thing. Instead of being ostracized, people think he's a
    hero.

    guy
    > > win (if there are any).
    > >
    >
    > Because people like the bad-ass. They vicariously enjoy bad boy antics like taking speed, smashing
    > up cars and making life hell for team bosses, especially if the guy still comes through with good
    > performances. Randy Moss, Jose Canseco, Allen Iverson, VDB, those guys kick ass.

    I wouldn't criticize VdB if he was a troublemaker and still brought his "A" game to the competition
    like Allen Iverson does.

    His difficulties have led to him not bringing it. He had phenomenal results in his first few years
    as a pro and has wallowed ever since.

    OTOH, his "the clenbutorol was for my dog" excuse was one of the best lines ever. It would make a
    good t-shirt (only in America no one would know what it meant). It would be fun to get that printed
    and wear it around Belgium.
     
  10. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    On Sun, 02 Mar 2003 02:30:29 GMT, "Kurgan Gringioni"
    <[email protected]> wrote:

    >I wouldn't criticize VdB if he was a troublemaker and still brought his "A" game to the competition
    >like Allen Iverson does.

    You obviously wrote this before Het Volk. Who is Allen Iverson?

    >
    >OTOH, his "the clenbutorol was for my dog" excuse was one of the best lines ever. It would make a
    >good t-shirt (only in America no one would know what it meant). It would be fun to get that printed
    >and wear it around Belgium.
    >

    Almost as funny as USPS' claim that the drugs were for a "non-cycling member". Or that they forgot
    to register thier rider's use of corticosteriods for a "saddle sore".

    Of course, nobody here in "America" would get that, either.
     
  11. Bret Wade

    Bret Wade Guest

    Kurgan Gringioni wrote:

    > People are fascinated with talent. Plus, VdB comes from a family with a long cycling pedigree.

    I think he threw the family history thing out the window when he he walked away from his Lotto
    contract while Jean-Luc was director. You are right about the fascination with talent. I have little
    respect for VDB, but the image of his ride in the '99 Ronde van Vlaanderen remains one of the most
    beautiful in cycling for me. He recovered from a crash to chase down Museeuw and Van Petegem in the
    final kilometers. Maybe if he'd won that sprint, things would have gone differently. I'm not saying,
    he wouldn't have been a cheater, or would have grown more character, just that things might have
    gone differently.

    Bret
     
  12. news:eek:[email protected]...
    > On Sun, 02 Mar 2003 02:30:29 GMT, "Kurgan Gringioni"
    > <[email protected]> wrote:
    >
    >
    > >I wouldn't criticize VdB if he was a troublemaker and still brought his
    "A"
    > >game to the competition like Allen Iverson does.
    >
    > You obviously wrote this before Het Volk. Who is Allen Iverson?

    VdB's Doggie has not been bringing his "A" game for several years now.

    the palmares on his home page says:

    1995: 7 wins
    1996: 15 wins
    1997: 8 wins
    1998: 12 wins
    1999: 8 wins
    2000: 1 win
    2001: 0 wins
    2002: 0 wins
     
  13. Bret Wade

    Bret Wade Guest

    Amit wrote:

    > Because people like the bad-ass. They vicariously enjoy bad boy antics like taking speed, smashing
    > up cars and making life hell for team bosses, especially if the guy still comes through with good
    > performances. Randy Moss, Jose Canseco, Allen Iverson, VDB, those guys kick ass.
    >
    > -Amit

    VDB actually looks pretty good compared to those three. They've all been convicted of violent crimes
    within the last year. You really admire them? I don't.

    Bret
     
  14. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    >VdB's Doggie has not been bringing his "A" game for several years now.
    >

    OK, I am not sure what you mean by that, but VDB seems to have done a great ride in Het Volk today,
    supporting Museew and Bettini. I think that the other teams must have felt pretty stupid after
    Lefevre had his riders attack.

    VDB was an essential part of the attack, perhaps the most important part save Museeuw. VDB can ride
    away from almost anybody even now, and the other teams knew that, and covered his attacks. It was
    pretty easy for Museeuw and Bettini to cover the threat that everybody knew VDB was.

    And, what about that Tom Boonen? Nice ride.
     
  15. news:[email protected]...
    >
    > >
    > >VdB's Doggie has not been bringing his "A" game for several years now.
    > >
    >
    > OK, I am not sure what you mean by that, but VDB seems to have done a great ride in Het Volk
    > today, supporting Museew and Bettini. I think that the other teams must have felt pretty stupid
    > after Lefevre had his riders attack.

    I meant the part that you snipped out:

    the palmares on his home page says:

    1995: 7 wins
    1996: 15 wins
    1997: 8 wins
    1998: 12 wins
    1999: 8 wins
    2000: 1 win
    2001: 0 wins
    2002: 0 wins
     
  16. "Kurgan Gringioni" <[email protected]> wrote in message

    > I wouldn't criticize VdB if he was a troublemaker and still brought his
    "A"
    > game to the competition like Allen Iverson does.

    I never thought Iverson was the trouble maker that everyone makes him out to be. Yeah, the guy got
    into trouble in his past and he likes to party (especially during the off season). Mostly because of
    his image (corn rows, tattoos, ebonics, posse) I think that the press really tries to play up every
    hint of a disagreement between him and Larry Brown. Every time that I've seen the guy interviewed,
    he's been nothing but respectful of Larry, his teammates, and even other players/coaches. Kobe on
    the other hand LOOKS like a nice guy, but is really a dick.

    One things for sure: that little bastard is as tough as nails and loves to play. He gets the shit
    knocked out of his 6-ft ass every game, and he still wants the ball and he's still gonna come at
    you. I just wish he'd take fewer low-percentage shots.

    > His difficulties have led to him not bringing it. He had phenomenal
    results
    > in his first few years as a pro and has wallowed ever since.

    I interpret this as when he was young and took all the drugs that he could get his hands on, he rode
    great. Now that the heats on him he doesn't ride as well.

    >
    > OTOH, his "the clenbutorol was for my dog" excuse was one of the best
    lines
    > ever. It would make a good t-shirt (only in America no one would know what it meant). It would be
    > fun to get that printed and wear it around Belgium.
     
  17. EPREX

    EPREX New Member

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  18. EPREX

    EPREX New Member

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  19. "Bret Wade" <[email protected]> wrote in message

    > VDB actually looks pretty good compared to those three. They've all been convicted of violent
    > crimes within the last year. You really admire them? I don't.

    Brett,

    Please post a reference to the violent crime that Allen Iverson was convicted of in the last year.

    Thanks in advance, Brian
     
  20. Kenny

    Kenny Guest

    "Carl Sundquist" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:<[email protected]>...
    > "Phil Stone" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > news:[email protected]...
    > > Because VDB is still the greatest talent to come out of Belgium in recent years,,,,with or
    > > without drugs.
    > >
    > > Phil
    >
    > Are Belgians reluctant to venture an opinion on Boonen, or is he viewed as having less talent
    > than VDB?

    Here in Belgium there's never been talked about Boonen having more or less talent than VDB. Boonen
    was a great rider in the youth categories. VDB too, but he got a lot more publicity even when he was
    only 17 years. I think the cause of that is that VDB has allways been supported is the Flemish and
    the Walloon media. Boonen only got some publicity in the flemish papers when he was an espoir. It's
    a fact that VDB turned pro when he was only 19 year. They are both different riders. Boonen is
    typically a rider for the classics of the north. A possible worldcup winner. VDB has more
    possibilities. When he was a youth rider he was concidered to be once the winner of the tour the
    france. Right now we know that won't happen but he still can make the difference on other tracks
    than Boonen. He's able to win L-B-L, he's able to ride top 10 in Tour , Giro or Vuelta, and he even
    won Paris-Nice. Those are things that Boonen cannot do. You just have to watch the difference in
    their physical building. Boonen is really a big guy (over 1m80, certainly 75kg), has thighs like
    trees, he's one block of power. VDB is much smaller, much lighter,is very fragile and slim. It's
    almost unbelievable that he has so much power in his legs. I think VDB has more talent and
    possibilities but here we don't compare the two, we are just happy have both riders.
     
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