Why I'm pretty sure I didn't properly adjust the spokes on my bike wheel

[brianduffy]

So, last Friday the front wheel of my bike, an old road bike, developed a wobble. Not a minor wobble where the tire just drags on the brake pad as it rolls, but a really bad wobble where the tire periodically slams against the side of the brake pad. A "your face will soon be bloody and lying on pavement if you don't attend to this Real Soon" kinda wobble.

I managed to make it home OK on Friday and on Sunday I got out my spoke wrench and tended to the wobble. I had read several pages on the Web that assured me that adjusting the spokes on a bike wheel was a relatively simple procedure that most cyclists could do on their own.

Since I had already had experience adjusting brakes and changing brake cables, adjusting derailleurs, changing tires, changing seats, etc., I felt I could probably handle it.

So flipped my bike upside down and gave the front wheel a spin. Wobbledy-wobble WOBBLE wobble it went. I took off the brake pads to see the full extent of the wobble and the tire was actually hitting the fork of the bike on he single big wobble it had.

I put the brake pads back on but pulled away from the tire as far as possible, then centered the tire as well as I could in the fork and spun the wheel, using the brake pads to check the wobble.

The instructions I found online said to locate the area where the wobbling was at its worst, then locate a spoke on the opposite side of the wheel from the direction of the wobble, and give the spoke 1/4 turn tighter with the spoke wrench, which I did. Then I looked at the wobble to see what had changed.

So far as I could see, nothing had changed. So I did this some more. I did it a lot, in fact, and to an amazing degree, nothing changed.

After awhile I decided that this quarter turn business might be for milder wobbles that didn't involve the wheel hitting the frame, and that something bolder might be in order. I might have stuck with the 1/4 turn business longer if the wobble of the wheel had imparted information of any sort to me, but it just didn't. No matter what I did, the wobble didn't change in any way I could detect.

So I literally ratcheted thing up, giving 1/4 turns tightness to the spoke on the opposite direction from the wobble, and then giving 1/4 turns looseness to spokes on the same side as the wobble. I figured the combination of tighter spoke in the opposite direction and looser ones in the direction of the wobble would take the starch out of any wobble in short order.

And eventually, the wobble changed. It didn't get smaller, it just changed, and once again, not in any way I could get useful information from. Wobbleddy, WOBBLE, wibble wibble. Or maybe it hadn't changed, I was just misinterpreting what I was seeing. It was hard to tell, and in any event, no useful information could be gleaned from what the wheel was doing in any event. The simple and obvious change that would let me know what to do just wasn't there.

I thought about it and decided that maybe the brake pads were interfering with the wheel's true rotation and keeping it from delivering useful information to me, such as, what the hell is going on with this wobble.

(I also did a lot of cursing while working on the bike. It didn't work, but it helped, if you know what I mean.)

So I took the brake pads up and tried adjusting the tire on the basis of its widest wobble in relation to the bike fork, using the same "tighten one by 1/4 turn, loosen two by 1/4 turn" technique.

This did not really work, either. The wobble changed but not in any informationally useful way. Specifically there was no notable lessening of the large wobble. Wible, WOBBLE wibble wobble wibble.

Finally, I tried putting one eye right about at the center of the tire and closing the other eye and stopping the tire when it was at its widest.

This method ultimately worked. It was very easy to see the widest extent of the wobble because it obscured one end of the axle completely. I was able to get the one large wobble down to a series of smaller wobbles. Wobble wibble wobble wobble wibble. Although the tire was still far from true, it was ridable, and I'd been at it for about 4 or 5 hours and was really tired of working at the tire, so I adjusted the brakes and rode it into work the next day, a distance of (total guesswork here) 5 or 6 miles.

The trip in to work, the bike worked fine. But I was walking it up a steep hill on my lunch break and the tire started sticking on me. So I gave it a hard push when it stuck next time, and then the tire felt REALLY wobbly.

I looked down and discovered that the reason the tire felt wobbly was that the axle had sheared in half and the tire was now hanging by one bolt instead of two. The other bolt was still in place on the tire fork, but there was no axle to connect it to the tire.

So, I'm pretty sure I didn't true that tire properly. I'm guessing that the tensions that were communicated to the tire by the spokes just totally screwed up the tire on the way in to work, and the shearing at lunch was the proverbial camel's straw kinda thing.

I could be wrong, of course. Could have been the axle shearing that made the tire wobbly in the first place. I don't really know. I just know what happened.

Now my kid's back tire is developing a wobble (he rides to school on his bike) and I really don't have much confidence in my ability to fix it. So if anybody can clue me in on what went on I'd appreciate it. Any pointers to useful info on truing wheels might be useful As you may already have guessed, I don't have much mechanical aptitude, but I'm very patient. Plus I know lots of great curse words.

 

[kdelong]

In this case I would say that your axle failing was the cause of your wobble. There is no way that your adjusting of the spoke tension could have effected the axle. You are lucky that the axle didn't shear when you were riding instead of walking the bike ! Just for the record, if you have a large wobble, the easiest way that I have found to repair it is to loosen all of the spokes and begin trueing the wheel from there. It is maddening to tighten this spoke and loosen that one to try to get one wobble to go away. As you stated, this usually results in a bunch of little wobbles. Also, by loosening all of the spokes, you can see if the rim is bent or if the wobble was a result of uneven tension. In your case, you may have even found your axle problem.

The best resource that I have found for trueing a wheel, or any bicycle repair procedure, is The Bicycling Guide to Complete Bicycle Maintenance & Repair for Road & Mountain Bikes by Todd Downs. This is the most comprehensive repair manual at a reasonable price that I have ever found. You can buy it at almost any major book store in the U.S. for around US$20.00. If you are not in the U.S., you can find it on www.amazon.com, www.bicycling.com, or www.rodalestore.com. And before anyone gets the wrong impression, I do not work for Bicycling or Rodale Press, and I am not Todd Downs nor do I even know him. I have just been using a version of this book for over 20 years and it has not been wrong yet. It is great and a copy of it should be included with every bicycle that is sold anywhere in the world. Of course this is not going to happen because it would put an end to all of the LBS Service Departments as soon as people found out how simple bicycle service really is. [end rant here]

 

[scotty72]

In this case I would say that your axle failing was the cause of your wobble. There is no way that your adjusting of the spoke tension could have effected the axle. You are lucky that the axle didn't shear when you were riding instead of walking the bike ! Just for the record, if you have a large wobble, the easiest way that I have found to repair it is to loosen all of the spokes and begin trueing the wheel from there. It is maddening to tighten this spoke and loosen that one to try to get one wobble to go away. As you stated, this usually results in a bunch of little wobbles. Also, by loosening all of the spokes, you can see if the rim is bent or if the wobble was a result of uneven tension. In your case, you may have even found your axle problem.

The best resource that I have found for trueing a wheel, or any bicycle repair procedure, is The Bicycling Guide to Complete Bicycle Maintenance & Repair for Road & Mountain Bikes by Todd Downs. This is the most comprehensive repair manual at a reasonable price that I have ever found. You can buy it at almost any major book store in the U.S. for around US$20.00. If you are not in the U.S., you can find it on www.amazon.com, www.bicycling.com, or www.rodalestore.com. And before anyone gets the wrong impression, I do not work for Bicycling or Rodale Press, and I am not Todd Downs nor do I even know him. I have just been using a version of this book for over 20 years and it has not been wrong yet. It is great and a copy of it should be included with every bicycle that is sold anywhere in the world. Of course this is not going to happen because it would put an end to all of the LBS Service Departments as soon as people found out how simple bicycle service really is. [end rant here]

There is no way that spoke tension could possibly shear an axle. You'd have to have suspension bridge grade wire unless the spokes would snap.

Sounds like the axel caused the wobble.

Tip (as hunted above). If in doubt, lossen all the spokes (but not so the thread leaves the nipple - just so they are very loose). Then spin. A good rim should be reasonably straight anyway. It will wobble about some. But if it is slaming against the forks - as you descrised - I'd be discussing the rim's future with it in serious tones.

Scotty

 

[Retro Grouch]

Those cold remedies that they sell in the drug store. They all say that they stop the symptoms but don't really cure the cold.

Trueing bicycle wheels is like that too. If your rim is bent you can sometimes pull it back into line by monkeying around with the spoke tension, but you can't fix it that way. At some point in time, maybe next week maybe next year, it's going to fail you.

The "A" answer for a bent rim is to lace up a new rim.
The "B" answer is to losen all of the spokes and try to straighten the rim.
Anything else is kidding yourself.

To be honest, your wheel sounds to me like maybe it was run into by a car or something which both bent the rim and broke the axle. Unless you have a real nice hub the cheapest solution is to replace the whole wheel.

Your son's bike might be different. How old is the boy? If he's in that 10 to 16 stage and you see ramps in the street, he probably has a bent rim and my original advice applies. If he's under 10 and rides more sedately, he probably just has some uneven spoke tension and his wheel can be trued by adjusting the spokes.

 

[daveornee]

Those cold remedies that they sell in the drug store. They all say that they stop the symptoms but don't really cure the cold.

Trueing bicycle wheels is like that too. If your rim is bent you can sometimes pull it back into line by monkeying around with the spoke tension, but you can't fix it that way. At some point in time, maybe next week maybe next year, it's going to fail you.

The "A" answer for a bent rim is to lace up a new rim.
The "B" answer is to losen all of the spokes and try to straighten the rim.
Anything else is kidding yourself.

To be honest, your wheel sounds to me like maybe it was run into by a car or something which both bent the rim and broke the axle. Unless you have a real nice hub the cheapest solution is to replace the whole wheel.

Your son's bike might be different. How old is the boy? If he's in that 10 to 16 stage and you see ramps in the street, he probably has a bent rim and my original advice applies. If he's under 10 and rides more sedately, he probably just has some uneven spoke tension and his wheel can be trued by adjusting the spokes.

I agree with Retro Grouch and add that bent/broken axle and/or crack(s) in the rim at the spoke holes can keep add to the difficulty.
Tension balance, proper tension (something around 100 kgf for front and right rear spokes) and true all at the same time is the goal.
I have taught classes in wheel building/truing. It seems that some people catch on quickly and others take more time/experience. If you really want to learn it you can. Tools like a truing stand and spoke tension guage help. I like to have the tire off the rim so I can use the "feelers" on the truing stand in radial and lateral truing at the same time. I also like good lighting and a quiet work place so I can pluck the spokes and make initial determinations as to what spoke to tighten or loosen to improve true in each adjustment. There is always interaction in spoke tension, especially with the "crossing mate" and the spokes directly across the hub from the one adjusted.

 

[brianduffy]

In this case I would say that your axle failing was the cause of your wobble. There is no way that your adjusting of the spoke tension could have effected the axle. You are lucky that the axle didn't shear when you were riding instead of walking the bike !

I am glad to hear it was not the spoke adjustment, but a failure of the axle. It's still pretty damn strange ... that axle was shared off like it had been cut with hacksaw, smooth as can be. And it did occur to me that I was lucky the axle didn't shear when I was riding ...

Just for the record, if you have a large wobble, the easiest way that I have found to repair it is to loosen all of the spokes and begin trueing the wheel from there. It is maddening to tighten this spoke and loosen that one to try to get one wobble to go away. As you stated, this usually results in a bunch of little wobbles. Also, by loosening all of the spokes, you can see if the rim is bent or if the wobble was a result of uneven tension. In your case, you may have even found your axle problem.

The best resource that I have found for trueing a wheel, or any bicycle repair procedure, is The Bicycling Guide to Complete Bicycle Maintenance & Repair for Road & Mountain Bikes by Todd Downs. This is the most comprehensive repair manual at a reasonable price that I have ever found. You can buy it at almost any major book store in the U.S. for around US$20.00. If you are not in the U.S., you can find it on www.amazon.com, www.bicycling.com, or www.rodalestore.com. And before anyone gets the wrong impression, I do not work for Bicycling or Rodale Press, and I am not Todd Downs nor do I even know him. I have just been using a version of this book for over 20 years and it has not been wrong yet. It is great and a copy of it should be included with every bicycle that is sold anywhere in the world. Of course this is not going to happen because it would put an end to all of the LBS Service Departments as soon as people found out how simple bicycle service really is. [end rant here]

I'll remember that, because I'm sure this will be a handy thing to be able to do.

 

[brianduffy]

There is no way that spoke tension could possibly shear an axle. You'd have to have suspension bridge grade wire unless the spokes would snap.

Sounds like the axel caused the wobble.

Great, then I don't have to worry about my wheels catching fire and exploding whenever I adjust the spokes.

 

[brianduffy]

I have taught classes in wheel building/truing. It seems that some people catch on quickly and others take more time/experience. If you really want to learn it you can. Tools like a truing stand and spoke tension guage help. I like to have the tire off the rim so I can use the "feelers" on the truing stand in radial and lateral truing at the same time. I also like good lighting and a quiet work place so I can pluck the spokes and make initial determinations as to what spoke to tighten or loosen to improve true in each adjustment. There is always interaction in spoke tension, especially with the "crossing mate" and the spokes directly across the hub from the one adjusted.

A tru9ing stand would be nice, and a spoke tension gauge would be, too, but I can probably get along without the truing stand and the last time I checked, the most affordable (i.e., cheapest) spoke tension gauge was more than $50, which frankly is more than I pay for an entire used bike at Goodwill, and just about enough to buy a new bike at Walmart.

 

[dhk2]

A tru9ing stand would be nice, and a spoke tension gauge would be, too, but I can probably get along without the truing stand and the last time I checked, the most affordable (i.e., cheapest) spoke tension gauge was more than $50, which frankly is more than I pay for an entire used bike at Goodwill, and just about enough to buy a new bike at Walmart.

IMO, it's not worth your money or time to buy tools and learn to true junk wheels. Even if you succeed in getting them reasonably true, they'll likely go out as soon as you start riding. If you really plan to ride the bike, best bet would be to have the LBS built up a sturdy set of low-priced wheels for you. A well-built set of wheels shouldn't need any truing for a long long time, and the axles won't break, which is a real plus in my book

Starting over with another <$100 Wal-mart bike means you'll just be starting over with another set of junk wheels and hubs/axles. Attempting to keep a $10 wheel in true isn't how I want to spend my leisure time....I'd rather be out riding the bike than fiddling constantly with junk parts which may or may not get me home.

 

[garage sale GT]

... that axle was shared off like it had been cut with hacksaw, smooth as can be. And it did occur to me that I was lucky the axle didn't shear when I was riding ...

That's a fatigue failure. A fatigue crack slowly spread through the axle until there was no longer enough metal to hold, possibly years before it finally broke. The cracked ends polished themselves against one another due to road vibration. I bet there was at least a small portion of the axle which wasn't smooth; that's what failed when it got really bad.

Since even many new wheels will get out of true, I think spending a bit of time on an old bike is not a bad idea. The spokes have frequently gotten loose somehow and all it needs is a tension and true. My '84 Schwinn is still on the original front wheel. I had a shop tension it up and true it. Of course, it didn't need any massive repairs.

 

[kdelong]

IMO, it's not worth your money or time to buy tools and learn to true junk wheels. Even if you succeed in getting them reasonably true, they'll likely go out as soon as you start riding. If you really plan to ride the bike, best bet would be to have the LBS built up a sturdy set of low-priced wheels for you. A well-built set of wheels shouldn't need any truing for a long long time, and the axles won't break, which is a real plus in my book

Starting over with another <$100 Wal-mart bike means you'll just be starting over with another set of junk wheels and hubs/axles. Attempting to keep a $10 wheel in true isn't how I want to spend my leisure time....I'd rather be out riding the bike than fiddling constantly with junk parts which may or may not get me home.

Junk wheels are the best wheels to use when learning how to true wheels. You don't have to worry about warping a $120.00 Rim or ripping out the flange holes on a $200.00 hub. And if you can true up a set of junk wheels, you certainly can true up the good stuff. There is no way that I would have attempted to learned how to true wheels on a set of Mavics or Fortes. As it was, I had an old set of Suntour Hubs with Weinman Rims that cost $80.00 for the set 20 years earlier. They were perfect for learning how to true, and then later, how to build wheels.

BTW, if you are serious about maintaining your bikes and saving money, buy an inexpensive trueing stand like the Minoura Workman Pro for around $45.00 on line, and look into a tensiometer. You should be able to find one for less than $50.00.

 

[scotty72]

IMO, it's not worth your money or time to buy tools and learn to true junk wheels. Even if you succeed in getting them reasonably true, they'll likely go out as soon as you start riding. If you really plan to ride the bike, best bet would be to have the LBS built up a sturdy set of low-priced wheels for you. A well-built set of wheels shouldn't need any truing for a long long time, and the axles won't break, which is a real plus in my book

Starting over with another <$100 Wal-mart bike means you'll just be starting over with another set of junk wheels and hubs/axles. Attempting to keep a $10 wheel in true isn't how I want to spend my leisure time....I'd rather be out riding the bike than fiddling constantly with junk parts which may or may not get me home.

With respect, what a load of garbage.

It is more than worth it. You get wheels that are built to your standards, you learn a new skill and you get very good at it.

SCotty

 

[dabac]

A tru9ing stand would be nice....

If you have a vise available, a steel fork cannibalized from a scrapped bike can be used as decent trueing stands at shoestring budgets. Stick the fork upside down in the vise, insert wheel and get to work. You can either simply tape feelers to the fork legs to help you track how the rim is moving, or you can drill holes through the fork legs level with the rim, insert a screw though the hole until it just touches the rim and use that as a reference.
If you have luck scrounging maybe you can get two forks, then one of them can be spread (using brute force) until it can take a rear wheel. It is possible to use ONE fork for both tasks by spreading it and compressing it as needs dictates. Eventually it will probably crack, but it'll be able to take several trueing sessions before that happens. Turning the wheel over in the stand will let you check if it's centered over the axle.

If you haven't got a vise available there's always the possibility to attach the the fork to some sort of base, which would allow you to put it on a table.

..last time I checked, the most affordable (i.e., cheapest) spoke tension gauge was more than $50,

Tension gauges are fun, but the main thing is to have some sort of reference(or sufficient experience). If you have one wheel available that you "know" has the right tension, then it won't be too hard to get another one into the right ballpark.

..$50, which frankly is more than I pay for an entire used bike at Goodwill, and just about enough to buy a new bike at Walmart.

Well, as long as you are aware that to a considerable degree you get what you pay for, and if you find yourself doing serious miles you'd might as well start looking a slightly more expensive bike....

 

[AdamVW]

So, last Friday the front wheel of my bike, an old road bike, developed a wobble. Not a minor wobble where the tire just drags on the brake pad as it rolls, but a really bad wobble where the tire periodically slams against the side of the brake pad. A "your face will soon be bloody and lying on pavement if you don't attend to this Real Soon" kinda wobble.

I managed to make it home OK on Friday.

Hi Brian

I also suffered this fate as I am sure many of us have.

In fact, we bought our daughter a new bike a few years ago when she was about nine or ten and she road twenty metres up the road, rode back and promptly crashed into her next door neighbour on his bike and she bent BOTH wheels that required replacement

My own experience though was similar to yours, riding home and suddenly the headwind seemed a lot stronger and riding was no longer fun at all.

Got home (it happened only a few hundred metres from home) and found that my rear wheel was bent.

The solution... Capaccino!!

Ahh yes ...took the bike down to the good fellow at my local bike shop and went and had a Capaccino while he replaced the wheel as it was not worth repairing. Granted it was not an expensive wheel.

Very relaxing day it turned out to be in the end and my bike is much the happier for it, as am I

I am not mechanically inclined but I do know a good coffee when I meet one.

cheers,

AdamVW