Wiggins / Cavendish out of Le Tour



plectrum

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Jul 26, 2007
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Just heard an interview with Wiggins where he states that both he and Mark Cavendish aren't racing le Tour becuase of it's proximity to the Olympics.
 
can't really blame them, though. why ride in french air (which you can do anytime) when you only get this one chance to suck in some fresh chinese factory air?
 
slovakguy said:
can't really blame them, though. why ride in french air (which you can do anytime) when you only get this one chance to suck in some fresh chinese factory air?
Also, you only get a chance to get stripped of Olympic Medals once every four years, when you can get stripped of the yellow jersey every year.
 
plectrum said:
Just heard an interview with Wiggins where he states that both he and Mark Cavendish aren't racing le Tour becuase of it's proximity to the Olympics.
mcgee did a world best of 4'16" (at the time) in Commonwealth Games Manchester in 02, coming off a Tour de France.

That would be impressive to see Wigga attempt to win the pursuit off a road base.

But he wont do it.


On the road v track. Alot has to do with energy systems. Wiggins kills it in the pursuit and madison, whereas Cav, although 6 years younger, struggled in the madison, relative to Wiggins, but Cav has no trouble fighting for wheels after 220km.

Wiggins on the other hand, if he could lay down the same power, in Roubaix, after 200km, he could be with Cancellara or Boonen, or he could be a puncheur in lesser events with Gilbert. I don't think his energy system is adeuate to be a hitter on the road. Similar to MCgee.

Mcgee is a great rider, 3 leaders jerseys in vuelta, giro and tour, many wins, and 8th on GC at the Tour. But I think Gilbert is a few classes above him on the road. Could have Mcgee been equivalent to Gilbert if he had not focussed on the track earl and had nurtured a 5 hour energy system. Perhaps. But his training with Charlie Walsh was based on many 200km days on the road.

Who knows if Gilbert Wigga and MCgee took some drugs, probably rectify the energy system deficit in an instant. Who knows if they dont partake though.

Wigga is a class above all other track riders, in the endurance. Even Ignatiev showed in the points and the scratch his ability was not mercurial. Wigga might have always had the power, but his ability really evolved between 21 and 24.

There are guys who are close to Phinney in terms of their times over 4km. Cam Meyer is only 30 months older, and very similar to him in time. Think 1-2 seconds. Howard is about 8 months older, and about 4 seconds out. Phinney, no matter what people say, had a huge base on him, done alot of quality miles in Italy and Boulder. And is precocious in terms of his physical development curve, probably shaving at 14 every second day. We will see where his development curve takes him. He might plateau when he hits the 4'18" and moves to the road. London will take a special ride to win in 2012. Probably near Boardman's wr in the illegal (now) position.

Dyudya as a 19-yo did about 4'18". He went back. Jamieson had signed with Qickstep Davitamon as a 20 yo and did about 2'24" as a 1970 in a non Olympic year.

Some guys stagnate for whatever reason. Think that is what differentiates Mcgee and Wiggins. They showed that they had few boundaries, and kept on breaking the plateaus. Mcgee has just lost too much weight. He looked like Rasmussen on the startline of the pursuit compared to the rest of them. Must have lost aheap on anaerobic power.
 
thunder said:
mcgee did a world best of 4'16" (at the time) in Commonwealth Games Manchester in 02, coming off a Tour de France.

That would be impressive to see Wigga attempt to win the pursuit off a road base....
Thanks thunder for the informative insights and analysis... :)
 
Crankyfeet said:
Thanks thunder for the informative insights and analysis... :)
world best = world record in current position. Wiggins since eclipsed it, and Huizenga also.

Boardman's position was outlawed. Superman position

who thinks that the starting bars, might have been able to be done away with. For the sake of the start, if the rider can get on top of the gear without having to get out of the saddle, and without depleting power for late in the ride, those bars are probably superfluous. (looking to do away with any remaining aero drags, as they tried to do away with everything by the looks of it anyhow.)
hr-boardman-hourrec.jpg
 
thunder said:
who thinks that the starting bars, might have been able to be done away with. For the sake of the start, if the rider can get on top of the gear without having to get out of the saddle, and without depleting power for late in the ride, those bars are probably superfluous. (looking to do away with any remaining aero drags, as they tried to do away with everything by the looks of it anyhow.)
Looks like Ben Lexcen's winged keel to me... :D .

Thunder - the start is so important though isn't it... to be able to get leverage? A good start can mean seconds in a short TT or pursuit. Those bars look pretty aero though. But I'm guessing that they did the pro/con calculation or test on their effects.
 
Crankyfeet said:
Looks like Ben Lexcen's winged keel to me... :D .

Thunder - the start is so important though isn't it... to be able to get leverage? A good start can mean seconds in a short TT or pursuit. Those bars look pretty aero though. But I'm guessing that they did the pro/con calculation or test on their effects.
oh, I am talking one hour record.

In the pursuit, no way you can do away with those bars. Zip.

I was talking over one hour. That is a pic referenced to the one hour attempt. If it was from the attempt, they obviously have the bars.

You would have thought they did the calculations. But they might have just "assumed" it was there, and got the designer to do the most aero bars. That, and the fact the bars are in front of the legs.

But the latest progress on aero designs is the fork that is seperated from the wheel by an inch or so, because they tested the aero fork contiguously alligned to the front wheel and it showed more drag, that the wheel + the fork outside the wheel's wind drag. Forgot which manufacturer it is. Might be Trek if I remember.
 
oh and Crank, Vaughters got Giro to change their fairing tt helmets, and they got a 10 watt reduction (assume 50kmph).

So, very very minor things can reduce drag. So, how much drag are on those bars? 10 watts might make one minute difference over an hour effort.
 
thunder said:
oh and Crank, Vaughters got Giro to change their fairing tt helmets, and they got a 10 watt reduction (assume 50kmph).

So, very very minor things can reduce drag. So, how much drag are on those bars? 10 watts might make one minute difference over an hour effort.
Yeah..I wasn't thinking about his world hour record. The start wouldn't be that important compared to the effects of an hour of air resistance.
 
thunder, Leigh Howard just did a 3.18 3000m pursuit in the worlds omnium. Within a second of Phinneys 3000m time.
 
classic1 said:
thunder, Leigh Howard just did a 3.18 3000m pursuit in the worlds omnium. Within a second of Phinneys 3000m time.
classic, not that impressive, his birthday is in November, and he went 3'19" high last year at u19 3km Aus titles.

If Dave Sanders, like Connie Carpenter, had LH focussing on the pursuit, dare say he would have gone close to Phinney's 3km WR last year, in the world jnr pursuit.

He ended up going 3'20" losing to Cam Meyer. Think he was third actually. But he was riding off 3v4. His time for 3rd, was better than Meyer's for the 1 v 2 rideoff.

Ford went 3'17" mid. Olman rode a 3'19". Mcgee a 3'19". Cam Meyer a 3'18", but came Meyer was a very old 18yo, birthday in first week of Jan. Trav Meyer has a 3'19". Andy Tennant of UK has a 3'19".

Talking times like that, you should know how fast the tracks were etc, but that is all I can give you.

But I doubt Dave Sanders has Howard riding pursuits and working on his tt bike, and pursuit and tt thresholds. He would be negligent to, better develop an all round rider. With Phinney, it is accepted because the US have no pursuiters to compete at the Olympics, so it is worth him putting a year of his racing into developing his tt threshold and pursuiting capacities.
 
and no chance Phinney could go around Bayley in a wheelrace. I was surprised Howard only did a 10.86 in the flying 200, but then I accepted his training focus on all round, and the fact he is dropping kilos, and weight by the day. Repeating, if Sanders had him working on his flying 200 he would be negligent, that type of measurement iwll never be a part of his armoury unless he focusses on an omnium, but he is more talented than an omnium rider.
 
Thunder,

I was thinking the sme thing concerning the handle bars but arn't their basics which need to be present to constitute 'being a bike'.

Another interesting admission in interview by Brailsford was that throughout the last 2 years British cycling have been progressively running out new advancements in their bike design and only for the olympics will they bring all of the new parts together.
 
plectrum said:
Thunder,

I was thinking the sme thing concerning the handle bars but arn't their basics which need to be present to constitute 'being a bike'.

Another interesting admission in interview by Brailsford was that throughout the last 2 years British cycling have been progressively running out new advancements in their bike design and only for the olympics will they bring all of the new parts together.
they need new tt bars for sure. All were like bull horns and just looked like they were funnelling air into the chest cavity.

Better to find a carbon structure which can be customised according to the rider. All the good tters who have been in the windtunnel have narrow set elbow position. The elbows on the UK tt bars are not wide, but they are not narrow.
 
thunder said:
they need new tt bars for sure. All were like bull horns and just looked like they were funnelling air into the chest cavity.

Better to find a carbon structure which can be customised according to the rider. All the good tters who have been in the windtunnel have narrow set elbow position. The elbows on the UK tt bars are not wide, but they are not narrow.
What i understood from the interview was that they have tested different set ups throughout the season but have yet put the finished product together as they wanted both competitive testing but also to hold something back for the Olympics.
 

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