Work Sets?



T

The Crow

Guest
I have always done three work sets. Obviously reps vary, but I have always
done three work sets, liking the pyramid simitry of putting in max effort
over three sets, with the middle set feeling slightly more comfortable than
the other two. (Probably because my warm up sets are not comprehensive
enough). But now I am reading a lot about doing only two, or maybe even one
work set? What kind of number of work sets do people find works for them?
 
On Wed, 25 Jan 2006 11:07:54 -0000, "The Crow"
<[email protected]> wrote:

>I have always done three work sets. Obviously reps vary, but I have always
>done three work sets, liking the pyramid simitry of putting in max effort
>over three sets, with the middle set feeling slightly more comfortable than
>the other two. (Probably because my warm up sets are not comprehensive
>enough). But now I am reading a lot about doing only two, or maybe even one
>work set? What kind of number of work sets do people find works for them?
>


There are various schools of thought all claiming to be right:

From:
http://www.brianmac.demon.co.uk/weight.htm

"How Many
The number of repetitions performed to fatigue is an important
consideration in designing a strength training program. The greatest
strength gains appear to result from working with 4-6RM. Increasing
this to 12-20RM favours the increase in muscle endurance and mass.

One set of 4-6RM performed 3 days a week is a typical strength
training program. The optimal number of sets of an exercise to develop
muscle strength remains controversial. In a number of studies
comparing multiple set programs to produce greater strength gains than
a single set, the majority of studies indicate that there is not a
significant difference.

Handling heavy weights in the pursuit of strength will require a
recovery of 3-5 minutes between sets, but only minimum recovery should
be taken if strength endurance is the aim. The majority of athletic
events are fast and dynamic, and therefore this quality must be
reflected in the athlete's strength work.

Muscular strength is primarily developed when 8RM or less is used in a
set. How much load you use depends upon what it is you wish to
develop:

1RM to 3RM - neuromuscular strength
4RM to 6RM - maximum strength by stimulating muscle hypertrophy
6RM to 12RM - muscle size (hypertrophy) with moderate gains in
strength (Fleck & Kraemer, 1996)
12RM to 20RM - muscle size and endurance "
 
On Wed, 25 Jan 2006 11:07:54 -0000, "The Crow"
<[email protected]> wrote in misc.fitness.weights:

>I have always done three work sets. Obviously reps vary, but I have always
>done three work sets, liking the pyramid simitry of putting in max effort
>over three sets, with the middle set feeling slightly more comfortable than
>the other two. (Probably because my warm up sets are not comprehensive
>enough). But now I am reading a lot about doing only two, or maybe even one
>work set? What kind of number of work sets do people find works for them?
>


Five sets of Five is the latest rage in powerlifting among drug free
lifters.
 
John Hanson wrote:
> On Wed, 25 Jan 2006 11:07:54 -0000, "The Crow"
> <[email protected]> wrote in misc.fitness.weights:
>
>
>>I have always done three work sets. Obviously reps vary, but I have always
>>done three work sets, liking the pyramid simitry of putting in max effort
>>over three sets, with the middle set feeling slightly more comfortable than
>>the other two. (Probably because my warm up sets are not comprehensive
>>enough). But now I am reading a lot about doing only two, or maybe even one
>>work set? What kind of number of work sets do people find works for them?
>>

>
>
> Five sets of Five is the latest rage in powerlifting among drug free
> lifters.


Hmmm. I like three sets of 8. Your twenty-five lifts sounds like it'd
beat my 24 lifts.

Dally
 
"John Hanson" <[email protected]> wrote

> On Wed, 25 Jan 2006 11:07:54 -0000, "The Crow"
> <[email protected]> wrote in misc.fitness.weights:
>
>>I have always done three work sets. Obviously reps vary, but I have
>>always
>>done three work sets, liking the pyramid simitry of putting in max effort
>>over three sets, with the middle set feeling slightly more comfortable
>>than
>>the other two. (Probably because my warm up sets are not comprehensive
>>enough). But now I am reading a lot about doing only two, or maybe even
>>one
>>work set? What kind of number of work sets do people find works for them?
>>

>
> Five sets of Five is the latest rage in powerlifting among drug free
> lifters.


How does that break down John?

Are the first two warm ups, followed by two heavy sets and then a "back off"
set? Or??

Details man, we want details!!!
 
Dally <[email protected]> writes:

> John Hanson wrote:
>> On Wed, 25 Jan 2006 11:07:54 -0000, "The Crow"
>> <[email protected]> wrote in misc.fitness.weights:
>>
>>> I have always done three work sets. Obviously reps vary, but I
>>> have always done three work sets, liking the pyramid simitry of
>>> putting in max effort over three sets, with the middle set feeling
>>> slightly more comfortable than the other two. (Probably because my
>>> warm up sets are not comprehensive enough). But now I am reading a
>>> lot about doing only two, or maybe even one work set? What kind of
>>> number of work sets do people find works for them?
>>>

>> Five sets of Five is the latest rage in powerlifting among drug free
>> lifters.

>
> Hmmm. I like three sets of 8. Your twenty-five lifts sounds like
> it'd beat my 24 lifts.
>
> Dally


Five by Five gets you a little more rest, a little more total volume,
and you can use more weight in each set as well. Of course, there are
approximately a million variations on the "classic" 5x5. YMMV.

Jason
 
On Wed, 25 Jan 2006 09:30:11 -0500, "Lee Michaels"
<leemichaels*nadaspam*@comcast.net> wrote in misc.fitness.weights:

>
>"John Hanson" <[email protected]> wrote
>
>> On Wed, 25 Jan 2006 11:07:54 -0000, "The Crow"
>> <[email protected]> wrote in misc.fitness.weights:
>>
>>>I have always done three work sets. Obviously reps vary, but I have
>>>always
>>>done three work sets, liking the pyramid simitry of putting in max effort
>>>over three sets, with the middle set feeling slightly more comfortable
>>>than
>>>the other two. (Probably because my warm up sets are not comprehensive
>>>enough). But now I am reading a lot about doing only two, or maybe even
>>>one
>>>work set? What kind of number of work sets do people find works for them?
>>>

>>
>> Five sets of Five is the latest rage in powerlifting among drug free
>> lifters.

>
>How does that break down John?
>
>Are the first two warm ups, followed by two heavy sets and then a "back off"
>set? Or??


All five sets are done at the same weight. You will gain weight:)

>
>Details man, we want details!!!
>


This is Big Brad's 5x5. It's based on a projected max with no gear
and no belt. Nick Tylutki has a similar one where he wears more gear
later in the program. I have them both, as well as the Russian Front
Squat program, in an excel spreadsheet. You just plug in your
max/projected max.

5x5 sets are done in 20-30 minutes. 8x2 sets are done High Bar with
close stance in 10-15 minutes.

Week Weight Sets Percentage Gear
1 5x5 52.50% None/No Belt
2 5x5 57.50% None/No Belt
3 5x5 62.50% None/No Belt
4 8x2 60.00% None/No Belt
5 5x5 65.00% None/No Belt
6 5x5 70.00% None/No Belt
7 8x2 60.00% None/No Belt
8 5x5 75.00% None/No Belt
9 8x2 60.00% None/No Belt
10 5x5 67.50% None/No Belt
11 5x5 72.50% None/No Belt
12 8x2 60.00% None/No Belt
13 5x5 77.50% None/No Belt
14 8x2 60.00% None/No Belt
15 3x1 Max Full Gear
16 8x2 60.00% None/No Belt
 
John Hanson <[email protected]> wrote:
> "Lee Michaels" wrote:
>>"John Hanson" <[email protected]> wrote:
>>> Five sets of Five is the latest rage in powerlifting among drug
>>> free lifters.

>>
>>How does that break down John?
>>
>>Are the first two warm ups, followed by two heavy sets and then a
>>"back off" set? Or??

>
> All five sets are done at the same weight. You will gain weight:)
>>
>>Details man, we want details!!!

>
> This is Big Brad's 5x5. It's based on a projected max with no gear
> and no belt. Nick Tylutki has a similar one where he wears more gear
> later in the program. I have them both, as well as the Russian Front
> Squat program, in an excel spreadsheet. You just plug in your
> max/projected max.
>
> 5x5 sets are done in 20-30 minutes. 8x2 sets are done High Bar with
> close stance in 10-15 minutes.
>
> Week Weight Sets Percentage Gear
> 1 5x5 52.50% None/No Belt
> 2 5x5 57.50% None/No Belt
> 3 5x5 62.50% None/No Belt
> 4 8x2 60.00% None/No Belt
> 5 5x5 65.00% None/No Belt
> 6 5x5 70.00% None/No Belt
> 7 8x2 60.00% None/No Belt
> 8 5x5 75.00% None/No Belt
> 9 8x2 60.00% None/No Belt
> 10 5x5 67.50% None/No Belt
> 11 5x5 72.50% None/No Belt
> 12 8x2 60.00% None/No Belt
> 13 5x5 77.50% None/No Belt
> 14 8x2 60.00% None/No Belt
> 15 3x1 Max Full Gear
> 16 8x2 60.00% None/No Belt


Is it just one 5x5 day per week for each exercise?
 
On 26 Jan 2006 04:35:38 GMT, DZ
<[email protected]> wrote in
misc.fitness.weights:

>John Hanson <[email protected]> wrote:
>> "Lee Michaels" wrote:
>>>"John Hanson" <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>> Five sets of Five is the latest rage in powerlifting among drug
>>>> free lifters.
>>>
>>>How does that break down John?
>>>
>>>Are the first two warm ups, followed by two heavy sets and then a
>>>"back off" set? Or??

>>
>> All five sets are done at the same weight. You will gain weight:)
>>>
>>>Details man, we want details!!!

>>
>> This is Big Brad's 5x5. It's based on a projected max with no gear
>> and no belt. Nick Tylutki has a similar one where he wears more gear
>> later in the program. I have them both, as well as the Russian Front
>> Squat program, in an excel spreadsheet. You just plug in your
>> max/projected max.
>>
>> 5x5 sets are done in 20-30 minutes. 8x2 sets are done High Bar with
>> close stance in 10-15 minutes.
>>
>> Week Weight Sets Percentage Gear
>> 1 5x5 52.50% None/No Belt
>> 2 5x5 57.50% None/No Belt
>> 3 5x5 62.50% None/No Belt
>> 4 8x2 60.00% None/No Belt
>> 5 5x5 65.00% None/No Belt
>> 6 5x5 70.00% None/No Belt
>> 7 8x2 60.00% None/No Belt
>> 8 5x5 75.00% None/No Belt
>> 9 8x2 60.00% None/No Belt
>> 10 5x5 67.50% None/No Belt
>> 11 5x5 72.50% None/No Belt
>> 12 8x2 60.00% None/No Belt
>> 13 5x5 77.50% None/No Belt
>> 14 8x2 60.00% None/No Belt
>> 15 3x1 Max Full Gear
>> 16 8x2 60.00% None/No Belt

>
>Is it just one 5x5 day per week for each exercise?


Yes and this is just for squat but could be used for any number of
exercises I would think.
 
John Hanson wrote:
> On 26 Jan 2006 04:35:38 GMT, DZ
> <[email protected]> wrote in
> misc.fitness.weights:
>
>
>>John Hanson <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>>>"Lee Michaels" wrote:
>>>
>>>>"John Hanson" <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>Five sets of Five is the latest rage in powerlifting among drug
>>>>>free lifters.
>>>>
>>>>How does that break down John?
>>>>
>>>>Are the first two warm ups, followed by two heavy sets and then a
>>>>"back off" set? Or??
>>>
>>>All five sets are done at the same weight. You will gain weight:)
>>>
>>>>Details man, we want details!!!
>>>
>>>This is Big Brad's 5x5. It's based on a projected max with no gear
>>>and no belt. Nick Tylutki has a similar one where he wears more gear
>>>later in the program. I have them both, as well as the Russian Front
>>>Squat program, in an excel spreadsheet. You just plug in your
>>>max/projected max.
>>>
>>>5x5 sets are done in 20-30 minutes. 8x2 sets are done High Bar with
>>>close stance in 10-15 minutes.
>>>
>>>Week Weight Sets Percentage Gear
>>>1 5x5 52.50% None/No Belt
>>>2 5x5 57.50% None/No Belt
>>>3 5x5 62.50% None/No Belt
>>>4 8x2 60.00% None/No Belt
>>>5 5x5 65.00% None/No Belt
>>>6 5x5 70.00% None/No Belt
>>>7 8x2 60.00% None/No Belt
>>>8 5x5 75.00% None/No Belt
>>>9 8x2 60.00% None/No Belt
>>>10 5x5 67.50% None/No Belt
>>>11 5x5 72.50% None/No Belt
>>>12 8x2 60.00% None/No Belt
>>>13 5x5 77.50% None/No Belt
>>>14 8x2 60.00% None/No Belt
>>>15 3x1 Max Full Gear
>>>16 8x2 60.00% None/No Belt

>>
>>Is it just one 5x5 day per week for each exercise?

>
>
> Yes and this is just for squat but could be used for any number of
> exercises I would think.


Within reason...if you're doing 7 exercises like this per day you're
going to have to show your credit card records to your wife so she can
see their are no hotel charges on there.
 
On Thu, 26 Jan 2006 13:43:57 +0800, spodosaurus
<spodosaurus@_yahoo_.com> wrote in misc.fitness.weights:

>John Hanson wrote:
>> On 26 Jan 2006 04:35:38 GMT, DZ
>> <[email protected]> wrote in
>> misc.fitness.weights:
>>
>>
>>>John Hanson <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>
>>>>"Lee Michaels" wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>"John Hanson" <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>Five sets of Five is the latest rage in powerlifting among drug
>>>>>>free lifters.
>>>>>
>>>>>How does that break down John?
>>>>>
>>>>>Are the first two warm ups, followed by two heavy sets and then a
>>>>>"back off" set? Or??
>>>>
>>>>All five sets are done at the same weight. You will gain weight:)
>>>>
>>>>>Details man, we want details!!!
>>>>
>>>>This is Big Brad's 5x5. It's based on a projected max with no gear
>>>>and no belt. Nick Tylutki has a similar one where he wears more gear
>>>>later in the program. I have them both, as well as the Russian Front
>>>>Squat program, in an excel spreadsheet. You just plug in your
>>>>max/projected max.
>>>>
>>>>5x5 sets are done in 20-30 minutes. 8x2 sets are done High Bar with
>>>>close stance in 10-15 minutes.
>>>>
>>>>Week Weight Sets Percentage Gear
>>>>1 5x5 52.50% None/No Belt
>>>>2 5x5 57.50% None/No Belt
>>>>3 5x5 62.50% None/No Belt
>>>>4 8x2 60.00% None/No Belt
>>>>5 5x5 65.00% None/No Belt
>>>>6 5x5 70.00% None/No Belt
>>>>7 8x2 60.00% None/No Belt
>>>>8 5x5 75.00% None/No Belt
>>>>9 8x2 60.00% None/No Belt
>>>>10 5x5 67.50% None/No Belt
>>>>11 5x5 72.50% None/No Belt
>>>>12 8x2 60.00% None/No Belt
>>>>13 5x5 77.50% None/No Belt
>>>>14 8x2 60.00% None/No Belt
>>>>15 3x1 Max Full Gear
>>>>16 8x2 60.00% None/No Belt
>>>
>>>Is it just one 5x5 day per week for each exercise?

>>
>>
>> Yes and this is just for squat but could be used for any number of
>> exercises I would think.

>
>Within reason...if you're doing 7 exercises like this per day you're
>going to have to show your credit card records to your wife so she can
>see their are no hotel charges on there.


I would only do 5x5 with major compound movements. Squats, bench,
etc. I rarely do more than 4 exercises in a workout anyway. Three of
them would be minor assistance movements like kelso shrugs for a set
or two of 50 or DB curls for a couple of sets of ten. I'll do 5-7
exercises following a weekend speed bench workout but they would be
for 8-12 reps and for triceps, shoulders and upper back (kelsos) as
well as biceps. I can finish those workouts in 30 minutes or less but
the intensity is fairly low and one doesn't need much recovery between
sets or movements.

Many times I'll not do anything besides the five sets of five in the
squat except walk on the treadmill for 20 minutes. Once you start
going heavier later in the program, just getting the five sets in is a
major accomplishment.