Xes - Message Board

Discussion in 'Your Bloody Soap Box' started by limerickman, Nov 12, 2004.

  1. Brian Cotgrove

    Brian Cotgrove New Member

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    G'day fred why do you insist trying to make something out of nothing? If I told all I would be writing for ever, noone is going to be interested in that, not even you Fred?

    I've been accused of stupidly long post's, what do I do now, tell me the riders who say they don't know me and what regiment they were in, I've got nothing to hide mate, what I say is what happened, I don't need to justify myself to you or anyone else.

    If I had claimed to have won many "Important Races" then the records would show not so, but I have not, I lived in Ketwig, raced in Germany, Holland, Belgium, they are short train rides from that part of Germany, that's how we got around then.

    It was as an amateur, not professional, and I've never cliaimed to have been riding for money ever, although vouchers from local tradespeople could be exchanged for cash if you knew them? Chains, tyres, expendable items were usually given right down to tenth places, it's no secret, during summer time one could sign on and races local Critertions two or three night's a week.

    Road races were run too, local clubs were very willing to allow anyone to race no matter who they were as long as you paid the entry fee.

    I never went to either Suez or Korea, my posting was germany, first in Ketwig from March 1956 till June 1957 then with a new CO Major Cato, we were told we would be joining the real army and we moved lock stock and barrel to Beilefeild, you know where that is I take it and I stayed there till I was demobbed in February 1959.

    There was one thing that I missed out on and that was a posting to the BAHAMA"S, I didn't have enough time left to serve and I didn't play cricket, that was a strict requirement, Trutial Omen Scout's were being called for and I also put my name down for that, but I only had twelve months with the colours to serve, so I also missed out on that, the money was good for that posting too.

    I was still single when I left the service, and I only left because I didn't want to subject my wife to married services bullshit. We got married in 1960 and had planned to do that while I was serving with HM Forces.

    Before that I lived at home with my Father at Manor Park, I joined the Leyton CRC and my riding buddy's were, Dave Land, George Penson, Alec Bentley, Geoff Hall, we used to ride with a group which went out three night a week from Wanstead, Wally (Alan) Perkins, used ot work at Hobbs at Barbican, I think, he used to ride out withn us and we would ride the loop, picking up blokes on the way, Romford, Brentwood, Chipping Ongar, North Weald Basset, Epping, Theydon Bois, Buckhurst Hill and then back to Manor Park but George went on to West Ham, Dave Land lived near me and the rest lived in our area? What do you want Phone Numbers and Addresses too? Break it down Fred?

    The name of Ron Jowers is not familiar to me but I seem to remember his name whether I've read it back then I cannot say. The shop of Hobbs Of Barbican was run by Alf....? at Woodgrange Station, Romford Road, we, the blokes I mentioned above would gather there usually Saturdays, Alf would give us things to do around the shop, usually lacing wheel set up, however when we had worn out our welcome he would suggest in no uncertain terms to "ISS OFF" so we would then drift along to Rory O'Briens shop, Dave Bedwell would sometimes be there and would ride out from there he lived at Romford I think, We would ask, if he minded that we all tagged along and he would say it was a free world.

    It was Dave who advised me to buy a good road Iron from Rory's I was still riding a "Dawes Clansman", the bike in Rory's wasn't bad either, Sprints and Tubs, big Maes Bends, full Campag, above all it was my size which would equate to about 56cm in today's sizes, even though it was second hand, it was in good nic, and Dave said you'll not get a better buy anywhere, so I coughed up the cash, not sure exaclty how much but something in the nature of twenty five quid, whether Dave got a cut out of it was not my worry it was a good bike and I rode it till I sold it in 1968 just prior to coming here to OZ.

    Dave Bedwell was the sort of man who couldn't care less who you were or where you came from if you rode a bike he would pass the time of day and was a very friendly person. He would give encouragement to anybody who showed a bit of promise and was willing to listen, he used to frequent a cafe' at Romford roundabout, don't ask the name...? his food stop.

    He advised me on several things pertaining to hill climbing and also sprinting, he suggested I join a gym or get some weights to build my legs up, not that they were bean poles but he said the more strenght you have the better for all things associated with cyclling, which stands to reason. His legs were like the proverbial pillars of oak.

    I have always worked full time, I've never had the luxury of being able to ride a bike for a living, and have always opted for a steady job with good pay, that's why I can travel the world today because of that phylosophy. Being a professional bike rider is to say the least a very unstable occupation, well it was when I was a younger man. My Father advised me to opt for security which I did, it's not a sign of weakness or anything else, most like me go a certain path, others another, we all end up dead in the end, and noone is immune Fred, not even you.

    There is of course one regret, if I had known the trouble and cost of a new bike's here I would have shipped my prized possesions out here with me but we were advised by the migration authority's not to bring anything of that nature because of the restrictions with the ammount of stuff we were allowed to pack and ship, I also sold the track iron too that was a Hobbs.

    Fred there is nothing sinister in my story and why you insist in trying to trip me up is beyond me, if there is a problem then it dwells in your head, as I already said I've never claimed to be a super duper rider, I told BRF the same thing, I represent the majority or riders who make up the numbers, without us there would be no CTC, no club races, in fact nothing for you blokes to crow about, your wins whatever they might be would be very hollow.

    I have also said before, if the Tour of anything was riden by only a handful of riders the big money would not be there, as it is at present and the public would think less of our sport than they do at present.

    If this doesn't fit into your agenda then tough, it worries me not, get a life mate, I have a good one here and I also enjoy every day too, I don't go around picking holes in anyone for any reason, doing so only makes one a very bitter twisted person. If "I" don't fit in with your expectations then such is life, "I" don't give a shit about that either. I ceased to get upset by anything when I had a NDE several years ago and realised the importance of being happy on a daily basis, none of us know how long we'll be here for so I live each day as if it were my last one, I would suggest to anyone to do the same?

    JUDGE JURY EXECUTIONER, yes you honour, or should I say Cheif Inquistitor?

    The Name Is Brian Cotgrove, nothing else, not .......?
     


  2. Brian Cotgrove

    Brian Cotgrove New Member

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    G'day MM, Comfrey, definitely, it's not a quick fix unfortunately, but then nothing is, although it's a pain you'll just have to give it a little time, it is the body's innate wisdom built into us that repairs all things, but slowly, you need to give it the right treatment.

    You may remember me telling you of my knock down by the 4WD in May 2003, that ended up with me getting a dislocated shoulder and put paid to the "ARCHERY" for the rest of that year. The hospital suggested a shoulder reconstruction but they can't replace anything like the original and I said no, as I have said before the best places to stay out of.

    I just turned the handle bars of the bike up a bit to make it easier to still ride, I know it looked crapppy, but then I'm not out ot impress anyone, anyway. I got a few strange looks but who gives a shit anyway. It has taken till this year for me to get back into the Archery, but it was worth the wait, I didn't plan on Nationals or even States, maybe next year.

    The Glucosamine does take a while to work but it's worth it, my knees were very sore back in 1992 from playing the round ball game, but taking Glucosamine since then I can still run without pain today. Not that it took all that time, it's a gradual improvement, the pain will slowly go as if by magic. It works for me, give it a try if you don't get to take on the Nationals this year, next year, you'll be even stronger for the wait.

    Did you bash Sailor boy again, I told you not to get so rough with him, he's one of our gaurdians you know. I don't envy him the surgery, except being nursed by you, what do I need to do, don't suggest anything too painful, me old body couldn't stand it?

    Ok I'm off to me bed, catch yer soon?TBC
     
  3. FredC

    FredC New Member

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    I hope you don't mind Brian, but I've edited your post into cycling history without changing any words. We've got a bit of cycling life as it was in your youth, that's all we wanted.
    Don't forget that Bedwell died in 1999, so he won't be writing much. That chap who is constructing a site in memory of his great achievements will take all these snippets of information to build up the picture if you send it to him.
    The formation of road racing started with the breakaway BLRC, otherwise there would have been zilch. Most of these chaps are dead now, but BRF and me still know a good few of them up north. Club life as we knew it is disintegrating at an alarming rate these days in this country. So the more little anecdotes the better.
    You see Brian, it has it's advantages, so when you meet Bruce Hunt, he's about 60 now, you and he were in the same club, now that's a good starting point isn't it?
     
  4. FredC

    FredC New Member

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    I've just had a thought(very unusual). Why don't you take your x-ray plates down to a physio who deals with tennis injuries. I'm sure that they deal a lot with wrist and arm injuries.
    Be careful with BC's advice, he's likely to turn up at your door coloured head to foot in orange and throwing wichiti grubs and bark chippings in his camping kettle while chanting spells.
     
  5. Brian Cotgrove

    Brian Cotgrove New Member

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    G'day Fred, I am sorry to hear that the club scene in the UK is going down hill, unlike here, where we seem to have the best activity I've ever heard of/experienced, whether it's because of the AIS or Ozzy's Gold Medal Haul, I am not in a position to say. However it's a good sign that at least somewhere in the world we know cycling will not decline to a further degree, well at least, not in the next few years anyway.

    I was a member of our local Balmoral Club for a number of years, I stopped racing and thought, save the money as usual, but I still attend the track carnivals and local road races. I'm very heartened by the turn up at all meeting and not just by elite riders, but youngsters too, at track training Wednesday mornings the roll up of about between fifteen to twenty from age of eight to early teens shows that we have a continuing number who will possibly go on to bigger and better things.

    We have a proliferation of cycle shops in our area who all seem to do reasonably well, so it augers well for our future in cycling. I joined the "UNI Club" mainly because of my friendship and association with my very good friend Paul, he suggested it, mainly becausue they needed someone to motor pace and have some sort of credibility at meetings.

    Unless one is affiliated one cannot ride a pace m/cycle at the velodrome. As well as that I have some experience, not what a lot would consider vast, but I know what's involved, in preparing an athlete to a good standard. They are very certificate orientated here, as far as I'm concernd the paper is not the thing, it's the knowledge that counts, you cannot buy it either,,read it maybe from a book but the knowledge there is only as good as the person who wrote/imparted it?

    At our club dinner recently, I was extremely surprised by the support I received from a lot of the members who actually said thanks for the voice of experience, I am very touched by their kind words.

    With regards to Bruce Hunt I do not know him personally and I'm surprised he was a memnber of "Leyton CRC", he'll know of the others I've mentioned, and he'll also know of E3 and E6 where most of out TT's where conducted. He has not poked his head up yet but I'm still diging here, if he wants to be found then I'll let you know where and when, that's a promise, I will keep just for you Fred.

    With regards the BLRC I seem to remember it got a lot of bad publicity at the time but being a youngster it didn't really matter to me that much, bikes, girls, getting the next meal were my #1 prioity you understand. It is only in more recent years that I've taken more interest in what we really got up to in those days, I suppose it's because of my declining years. The pity of that phenomenon my old Father never talked much to me and that's a shame because so much of hystory has been lost forever.

    It's also a pity that Dave Is passed over too, he was and will always remain a good bloke in my eyes, I visited the places only as recently as 1996 where we "hung out" and there's nothing realy recognisable any more, Rory O'Briens shop is no more, where it stood is an Indian Deli. Whether it has moved to somewhere else or disbanded/closed is another matter, but the personel there were good blokes also, as was the case in those days, we all rode bikes and that was enough to get a wave out on the road, something that is sadly lacking today, even here.

    As far as the Memorial to Dave Bedwell, I did a Google search but all I got was a Photo of him with my other hero "Fausto Coppi" and the words "Site under construction" let me know who to send to and I'll be more than happy to write whatever I know of Dave!

    Time is of the essence and I have to go, the boss is having another of her get togethers with some of her old work mate and the kitchen has been a no go zone for me for the last twenty four hours, hoewever my services as head washer upper are needed.

    KTWIM,ADLB,UITSWYDOTLC?TBC
     
  6. Brian Cotgrove

    Brian Cotgrove New Member

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    G'day Fred your not just a pretty face are you, that's the best suggestion I've seen/heard from you in e'r'ages, just goes to show what can be accomplished by digging into that dark mind of yours.

    As far as the "Safron Robes" is concerned there's nothing wrong with them either, although I do not possess the mental discipline to be a Budhist, I do subscribe to the teaching of the Budha anyway. My daughter in law is a Budhist and is at present travelling through Korea, it's freezing cold she say's at present, living in a monastory, very spartan conditions too, rather her than me?

    We can all learn a lot from what the Budha did and preached?

    You may be aware of what I'm about to unload, maybe not, however Did you know, Phil Anderson is behind a team of riders here in OZ, it's a new adventure for him, his way of staying in touch so as to speak and possibly giving something back at the same time, he's very enthusiastic about the team as well.

    The team is "MG XPOWER" one of the corporate sponsors is "BIANCHI", so they ride "Carbon" Bianchi bikes, they look very neat, another is Telstra "BIG POND", the story goes they will contest as many of the races they can get a start in and the tour down under was a starting point? National Champs was another, riders so far are limited numbers but they already have signed up Robert McGlochlan, and Troy Glenon, as well as others, don't ask who?

    Both RM and TG are very promising riders. Robert McGlochlan came second to Robbie MCEwen in the Nationals just recently, that's was the report, I was scribbling furiously while trying to listen to the report at the same time.

    Not trained as a reporter, can't adapt to doing the two things at once, routine, I have always had difficulty walking and talking at the same time, that's why I rode a bike, many things can be accomplished aboard a cycle?

    Graeme Brown has so far won three stages of the Lankawi tour plus two seconds as well?

    The guests are arriving, I'm going to show willing?

    TBC
     
  7. bikeriderfrance

    bikeriderfrance New Member

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    :rolleyes: :rolleyes: hi there, emmmmmmmmm, to Mlle meow, please forget all the mumbo jumbo about health potions, chineese throw ups, vietnanmeees crap, just listen,on the 1st of january 1990 i did a reliabilty trail, 100 miles in 6 hrs, they were all the rage, we had just set off and after about 2 miles, i attacked down the outside of a 100 up group,, what an attack, straight into a VW golf coming the other way.. well long story short, 10 stiches in right leg, cut open by the front bumper, BUT a completely dislocated left shoulder.. the coller bone was stuck in mi jaw... PAIN. after i had been cleaned up, the chineese doctor (true) said that the best thing to do was strap the lot up as NEAR as they could but the coller bone joint into the shoulder will be proud... it will look a mess ( it is), but if they operate and pin the bone together i will loose 50% of upper arm movement,, it looks bloody silly i must say but i am now 100% ok.. why am i saying this,, after the drugs had worn off, i just took a couple of paracetmol ? when the pain got too much, thats all, by by March i was winning, what did i do,, went for a holiday in spain where it was warm,,, 2 weeks,(you have this weather FREE ) all healed up, bang away i went eeeessy peeezzyy, just built up the miles...the body heals itself, just be patient with it...but NO MUMBO JUMBO DRUGS...bon courage..
     
  8. Brian Cotgrove

    Brian Cotgrove New Member

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    G'day BRF, It's nice to hear that someone else looks at life the natural way, I fully concur with the Sun, Rest, and slow recuperation, as you say the human body has a way of repairing itself without drugs and all that other stuff.

    My very good friend, he's an American Chiropractor and Naturopath, used to be the head honcho of the Dallas Cowboys? his words, not mine (The Body's Inate Wisdom heals all if you give it time) The biggest problem today every body wants "Instant Fix" either out of a jar, a tin, or a packet, it don't work that way.

    As I have said before, (also his words) there has never been a body put on this planet that has ever been deficient of drugs?

    MM just needs to get up here to Queensland and R&R it better?

    I can feel the pain of the shoulder, mine too, don't recommend it to anyone?

    Keep the wheels in motion, and don't look back, unless it's to see who you dropped on the last climb? TBC
     
  9. Brian Cotgrove

    Brian Cotgrove New Member

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    G'day Fred, another name came to mind over the weekend while I was talking to my mate about the old days of bike riding, my Wife said what about "Clive Howell", he was another one of our group of riders, Essex Boy's, East Ender's.

    He went off to France in ? (1959) not exact;y sure of the time or date, may have been earlier or later, anyhow he was a real charger, tongue hanging out stuff! Very nice bloke would give you the shirt off his back, share his tucker on the road etc., lend a tyre, stand around while you change it, the normal, moral support, didn't want to get his hands dirty?

    I'm off to finish the car repairs? TBC
     
  10. FredC

    FredC New Member

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    Do you remember the bit about Peter Hill from Anquetils crew who now lives at Elbeuf Rouen, Normandy. I think I've got it sorted. I used to call him Peter Head, but in fact I used to race against Peter Head in England, I also knew someone named Peter Hill who didn't race.
    The riders who helped the most in Brittainy were Francois le Bihan, and Cyril Guimard.
     
  11. Miss Meow

    Miss Meow New Member

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    As long as it's not a bucket of cod liver oil and a bag of leeches.

    Thanks for the advice. Our local physios are generalists so I'll hunt for a tennis/golf type chappy.
     
  12. Miss Meow

    Miss Meow New Member

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    Ouch. I'm glad you are OK after that experience. It happens all too often to cyclists.

    Dinner is ready so I am off. Have a great day, everyone.
     
  13. bikeriderfrance

    bikeriderfrance New Member

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    mmmmmmmmmm well you say i am all right, when i was sat int ospital, mi wife mrs brf came to pick me up,, she said "what an idiot ",thuoght that was a bit much as i was sat in a wheelchair with a blanket over me, (they had to cut off £100 's of clothing..."will you ever learn",,,,,, no not really, in 1997, i was out with the boys,(now in france), and this big gale was blowing,, i was using A PAIR OF ZIPP3000 WHEELS, 3 SPOKE JOBS, CARBON FIBRE, SPRINTS, THE RIMS WERE ABOUT 5 INCHES DEEP, well silly bugger here, paid no heed to mrs brf when i was about to set off,,, " a bit windy today for those wheels darling"..windy, me change wheels for a bit of wind, never, what about my image,,, result, about 1 hour later i was in the local clinic, yes blown completely off the bike, going downhill at 50kph...the wheels just caught a big gust between a high hedge and the farm track entrance.... result, mrs brf picking me up from ospital, and saying,"will you ever learn", well er yes err tomorrow.... good day on sunday, 110kms, got over the big climb with the grimpeurs, only 3 of us left, thats the first time this year,,,, then banged em in the sprint into amelie les bains,,,,,must be doing something right.... ytd 1820 kms,, should be well over 2000kms by end of next week.. bon courage.
     
  14. bikeriderfrance

    bikeriderfrance New Member

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    hi there, yes peter hill lived in askern nr doncaster, very good rider, could speak fluent school french, went to ride in france and joined anquetils team, never left them,as you say still in france, must be french by now.. peter head was a londoner, he was going to set the world alight, very good junior, but g waterhouse did im in the bcf jnr champs in yorkshire ( run by mi dad ) ,,, went abroad but just faded away,,, where is he now ????. BC just a quickie, strange you do not know/heard of ron jowers (he was from down saaarf),,50 rttc comp record holder plus others,, very smooth rider, was in the same hotel with him in 1958 in the I of M,, he had on his bike, the first EVER campag grand sport chainset .. we just stood there and drooled......talking of that,, isnt it strange that shimano has brought back the multi splined BB axle (isis),,,do you remember those gnutti cranks from iti land,they were splinned,, nobody wanted them, why, campag was 4 square, and that was LE MODE... now the japs bring em back into fashion, and campag square type axles are now a" no go area..". bon courage. ps its still raining. my new gutters work..
     
  15. FredC

    FredC New Member

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    Thanks for that, it's now all cleared up and in place now. For months I couldn't get it out of mind as I should have known them both, and indeed I did come across them both. Must have been my mind playing tricks, after all it was 40 years ago. I wonder is Les West riding the Champs in Austria, he's tearing the legs off the lvrc lot here.
    Anyway, you seem on target with your schedule.
    Charlie C was 61 yesterday, he's not happy with that. One of his stock phrases was that when you dropped down the categories you should be shot and put out of your misery. When he was in hospital before his triple bypass he was telling visitors which bits of his bikes they could have should he die under the knife. He used to call the cardiac consultant the Chief Butcher of the slaughterhouse, and on the eve of his op, he said sorry to him, it was only a joke. Jesus, we've had some fun over the years.
     
  16. limerickman

    limerickman Moderator

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    BBC 2 last night : did anyone see the cycling event where a 53 year old rock band musician was challenged to take part in the RAAM (race across the USA) ?
    San Diego to Atlanta, 3,000 miles.
    Each team has four cyclists and they basically ITT across the USA in a relay
    format.

    The guy selected for the challenge was Johnny Waughman - a fit, 53 year old.
    He had 9 weeks to get himself fit and to take part with three blokes from the RAF.

    This program is part of a series of ordinary people taking part in extraordinary physical challenges.

    The prog starts with JW getting a full medical from the Olympic GB doc and then getting a nice Giant carbon bike and having a training prog.
    5 hours per day everyday.
    He gets advice on nutrition, mental prep.

    His first test was to do a "10" ITT - his time was 33mins.
    The RAF were looking for him to do it in 30mins.
    So he went off and trained and a couple of weeks later, did the 10 in 31mins.
    The RAF selected him.

    The prog moved on to the States and we see JW suffering in training.
    He couldn't climb and he was only averaging 12mph.
    The RAF were looking for an average 25mph.

    You see him suffering and he fell off his bike a couple of times.
    I have to say I had a lot of sympathy for the guy because he tried hard but
    there was no way that he could manage a 25mph average (they ITT, for an hour, and then the next team mate does the next hour and so on).

    The RAF eventually didn't select him to race.
    Unfortunately for the RAF, having won it previously, this year they finished 3rd with a time of 5 days, 21hours = average speed of 21mph.

    It was a good program.
     
  17. FredC

    FredC New Member

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    I think Karmer Prozac lithium man Transubstantiated my word into Buddha all, I was referring to the Aboriginal practices which was quite obvious. I didn't know that buddhists ate witchiti grubs. Is he still practising blood letting?
     
  18. bikeriderfrance

    bikeriderfrance New Member

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    hi there, yes saw that program,, just shows how bloody hard cycling is.. i was quite surprised to see hoecould not beat 30 mins in that first 10 TT, he was doing 500 miles a week,,, i think that was a bit of a con because you saw him on a turbo then on canal cycle paths,,,,, the second 10 he only did a 31, after another 1000 miles (sic)..... then in the states he went from bad to worse,, even falling off a couple of times up the hills.... i do wonder if he threw in the towel long before and just went along for the ride...nice bike thuogh... i was surprised at a few quotes from the raf team manager,, they expected "the team" to do only 27 mins for a 10tt, thats nowt, i did a 24.09 when i was 13,on 82 fixed, and a junior club record to boot..(stop bragging brf) , he wanted them to train at 25 mph.. not many guys can do that,, not for 100 miles as he said.. still there you go.. it was aimed at a public audience so not such a problem,,, did SK do it last year.?. i just may look into it, i think it would be a experiance sorry mrs brf.. only joking,, (i never joke) BON COURAGE.
     
  19. Brian Cotgrove

    Brian Cotgrove New Member

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    Once again Fred, Bite yer BUM Chum, the native Australian's do not cover with red ochre, mostly white, for ceremonial dances. However the "Kadicha Man" can sometimes use yellow ochre, especially when he's going to point the bone, beware Fred, beware?

    Blood letting is now being resurected in your country Fred, doctors are also using maggots for clearing badly infected ulcers, maggots only eat rotting flesh. It is a new practise of all the European Country's too, as well as Australia.

    Didn't you ever go fishing with maggots hatched in the shed, Fred

    Leaches, likewise, Fred, in France, Germany, UK, Holland, Italia and Australia are all getting back to stuff that was considered old hat, as far as the medical profession is concerned, they too are turning to alternative forms of treatment because they have discovered what most of us who believe, work, and have worked for more years than the modern medical profession has been in existance.

    Every thing old is new again, it's a pity you can't recycle yourself Fred, you might just begin to be funny.

    If your reading Les, polish up them medals, I'll have a look at 'em soon?

    KTWIM,ADLB,UITSWYDOTLC?TBC
     
  20. limerickman

    limerickman Moderator

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    I reckon that the RAF team didn't want him all along.
    After he improved from 33mins to 31mins for the 10 : they said he was part of the team.
    As you say, 31min for a 10 isn't very fast.

    But I looked at the tape of the program again last night, BRF, and the RAF finished third in a time of 141 hours (5 days, 21 hours) which means an average speed of 21mph.
    That's way off the average speed that the RAF manager was looking for (25mph).
    Were they expecting him to improve from 20mph to 25mph ?

    It gives the lie to training on turbo/rollers : all very well pedalling along at
    27mph (as they said he was doing on the prog), when you're on the road it's a different matter, isn't it ?

    Mileage is going well at the moment - 245 miles since 01/02/05.
    That will be up to 320 by Friday and hopefully Sat and Sun will see another
    140 on top.
    The 1,000 just might be gettable this month !
     
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