best grand tour domestique ever?



vitamin s

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Feb 21, 2007
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criteria:

1) must have been a domestique for entire career.
2) the only reason the domestique could go for a gc standing was because the team leader could for some reason not fulfill that role

my vote goes to sean yates but my knowledge is limited to 1986 and after.

discuss!
 
Frankie Andreu & USPO.

He injected EPO for the benefit of Lance Armstrong in TDF 1999, 2000, 2001, this nullifying those voictories to drug cheating.

He later confessed under oath in a civil case, then again publicly via the New York Times.

Frankie Andreu is the ultimate grand tour doper/helper/cheater/loyal/teammate.
 
vitamin s said:
criteria:

1) must have been a domestique for entire career.
2) the only reason the domestique could go for a gc standing was because the team leader could for some reason not fulfill that role

my vote goes to sean yates but my knowledge is limited to 1986 and after.

discuss!
Yates is very good pick.

I will throw in Kloden.
 
Flyer's.Finale! said:
Frankie Andreu & USPO.

He injected EPO for the benefit of Lance Armstrong in TDF 1999, 2000, 2001, this nullifying those voictories to drug cheating.

He later confessed under oath in a civil case, then again publicly via the New York Times.

Frankie Andreu is the ultimate grand tour doper/helper/cheater/loyal/teammate.
You never quit, has anyone ever called you a **** head?

BTW I wouldn't, however just curious.
 
Tim Lamkin said:
You never quit, has anyone ever called you a **** head?

BTW I wouldn't, however just curious.
For the record then:

Tm Lamkin supports drug cheats (those that confess AND those that deny)

You're a credit to your race.
 
Thank you, although coming from you it just doesn’t seem like you really like me....you know the feeling the same one your parents give you. :D
 
Tim Lamkin said:
Thank you, although coming from you it just doesn’t seem like you really like me....you know the feeling the same one your parents give you. :D
Yes, I personally know people who collect fees from Nike.

They are proud of the gross sales generated by their drug cheats:
Lance Armstrong
Barry Bonds
Marion Jones
Jason Giambi
Justin Gatlin
Tim Montgomery
LaTasha Jenkins
Kelli White
Regina Jacobs
Michelle Collins
Tori Edwards
Team Discovery
 
yeah, i guess kloden fits my criteria. i forgot that jan was the original gc in the 06 tour. with that said, i guess a case could be made that kloden is by far the ultimate domestique. in fact, it will be intersting to see what happens this year.

do you think vino will be the leader over kloden?
 
INO Vino is still an unknown resource on a team...jury still out on him, not as cyclist but...
 
Without doubt Eddie Scheapers (spelling ?) who rode for Roche and helped in win the 87 Tour & Giro....... speaking of domestique's, I love this story from Hampsten on the 86 Tour between LeMond and Hinault....
________

CM: Yeah, I remember the '86 La Vie Claire team - it was just phenomenal.

AH: Yeah, they were pretty much the best results from any Tour team that's ever been.

CM: What was your first Tour de France like?

AH: Ah, it was hard (laughter on both ends again, at the typical understatement). I was fourth in it overall, which was a great result for a first Tour. But I think sometimes that the only reason I did so well is that I had no idea how hard it would be, or what it would do to my body - what my body would have to go through. Otherwise, I might've freaked out (more laughter)! But it worked out pretty well.

CM: It must have been a great realization to know that your body could take the stress of a terribly difficult three week race, after finishing so high in the general classification.

AH: Yeah, and that's what I was shooting for. That's what I was really hoping to do.

CM: What stands out in your mind as most memorable from the '86 season?

AH: Ah, certainly the Tour de France. Helping Greg LeMond win, which was the whole team's objective all year. But, of course, Hinault changed his mind during the race and raced for himself. And I can understand that. Certainly winning six would've have been something extraordinary. But he had promised Greg that he would help him. He ended up just making a really good race out of it. It was really hard for Greg - it was hard for me and the other guys on the team, having that fratricide happen within our own team. But on the other hand, Hinault did destroy the entire field, and Greg did only have one guy to ride against - it just happened to be his teammate.

CM: Right, so it was as sharply divided within the team at the '86 Tour as it appeared from the outside?

AH: Yeah, it really was. It was funny - Steve Bauer and I were helping Greg, which, you know, was the original team plan. The two Swiss guys [Niki Ruttimann and Guido Winterberg] were really upset about everything - confused, and didn't want to take sides. Jean-Françoise Bernard was doing all he could to help Hinault. The two older French veterans, Charly Berard and Alain Vigneron - they weren't strong enough to take the race apart, but I seem to recall them groaning, and saying, "Oh my God I'm getting dropped already!" whenever Hinault talked to them - they were pretty smart (laughs). And then there was some other French kid on the team that was kind of in over his head. The situation was really bad.

Steve and I had to chase down Hinault going into St. Etienne, when he broke away with Roche, of all people, and that wasn't any fun. We had to do it, but, you know, it was horrible chasing down your own teammate, and especially one who's our hero. But it worked out pretty well. I thought it was really bad . . . I mean, there was good leadership by Paul Koechli, but it was beyond him what he could do.

And there was an interesting moment, where I got a flat in that last week. We were going along on the rolling hills and it was really, really fast, and I wasn't right at the front, so I didn't see the two Swiss guys. I only saw the French guys on my team going off the back, and I thought, "Well, the team car is pretty close - I'll be able to get back on, but I better not make any mistakes!" So, I get my wheel changed, and I'm chasing back up through the cars, and sure enough, there were Charly Berard and Alain Vigneron, the old veterans had dropped back to help me. They took me straight to the front - they did a really good job. I thanked them after the stage, you know, when I could thank them properly. I went and found them, and said, "Oh gosh, thanks guys . . . it's really bad, because we're racing against each other and I really appreciate you helping me, even though I know that, it seems that Hinault . . . I don't know if he's going to be mad at you guys." And they both just looked at me and said, "Are you crazy?! You're in fourth place! That's 80,000 French Francs!" (laughter on both ends) They had the prize money totally worked out! These guys were so smart - true pros." (laughter continues)

CM: So, the next year you ended up going back to 7-Eleven, right?
 
whiteboytrash said:
. And then there was some other French kid on the team that was kind of in over his head. The situation was really bad.

who was the other french kid?
 
Klodifan said:
Andreas Kloden! :D
I agree.

Klodi a 2nd place in the TDF as a domestique to Ullrich (who faltered along the way). A 3rd place (2nd if/when Landis gets done) again a domestique to Ullrich but got the nod as number 1 a day or 2 prior to race start.

So for a domestique in a Grand Tour, Klodi has some good runs on the board.

otherwise perhaps Hincape? a tonne of hard yards all for Armstrong year after year with no option to go for any stage win or take advantage of an opportunity. (excepting the one stage win in 05, which I don't think was the intended plan)
 
Flyer's.Finale! said:
Yes, I personally know people who collect fees from Nike.

They are proud of the gross sales generated by their drug cheats:
Lance Armstrong
Barry Bonds
Marion Jones
Jason Giambi
Justin Gatlin
Tim Montgomery
LaTasha Jenkins
Kelli White
Regina Jacobs
Michelle Collins
Tori Edwards
Team Discovery

What the hell does this have to do with the best Domestiques? Please try to stay on topic. And take your ADD medication.
 
^^^ lol. i wonder how hampsten and jean francois bernard got along when they both rode for banesto towards the end of the their careers. they must have had some bad blood between them from back in their la vie claire days.
 
To come back to topic, an older one would have to be Andrea Carrea, Fausto Coppi's right-hand man.
 
Great domestiques :

Gerard Rue - domestique to Miguel Indurain must be a contender.

Sean Yates - a great domestique.

Udo Bolts - worked tirelessly for Ullrich/Riiss.

Hernan Diaz Zabela - superdomestique at ONCE for Zulle and Jalabert.

Jos Huysman and Roger Swerts - domestiques to the Cannibal.