"Ullrich can get over last year's defeat"

leif_ericson

>No it wasn't. He was riding too close to the spectators.

It was his fault, but it still was unlucky, and it had nothing to do
with his form.



--

benjo maso

"leif_ericson" <usenet-forum@cyclingforums.com> wrote in message
news:y5gic.121$tQ1.112@fe06.usenetserver.com...
> >No it wasn't. He was riding too close to the spectators.
>
> It was his fault, but it still was unlucky, and it had nothing to do
> with his form.


I'm not so sure. When a rider isn't in form, there is a fair chance he will
lose his concentration and make mistakes.

Benjo Maso

leif_ericson

>I'm not so sure. When a rider isn't in form, there is a fair chance he
>will lose his concentration and make mistakes.
>
>Benjo Maso

I doubt he was off form at that moment since he had just attacked most
of his rivals, and after losing all of that time from the fall, he still
came back and attacked again, and won the stage by over 40 seconds. I
don't think that that means he had bad form, dumbass.



--

Tom Kunich

"benjo maso" <benjo.maso@chello.nl> wrote in message
news:c6btrl$ae0sb$1@ID-75468.news.uni-berlin.de...
>
> And in 2003
> Armstrong made mistakes or wasn't as strong as he used to be. But he
didn't
> have bad luck.

Would you call it good luck to hook a spectators feedbag and come down hard
breaking the chain stay on your bike?

Tom Kunich

"Nev Shea" <spamtrap@garbage.net> wrote in message
news:byfic.6651$eZ5.199@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net...
>
> But I can also think of a bit of good luck -- when Beloki crashed, Lance
> was able to avoid him and go through the field because there was a little
> access for a tractor. If that access had been a few feet further down the
> road, LA would have crashed into a ditch.

I just happened to review that yesterday and I can tell you that he took
that route because it was most convenient (read "safer") and not because he
didn't have the option of turning inside of Beloki's wreck.

You can't change the past for sure, but I think that if that access wasn't
there Lance could have slowed enough to cut inside of Beloki.

benjo maso

"leif_ericson" <usenet-forum@cyclingforums.com> wrote in message
news:Zdhic.2142$tO1.364@fe28.usenetserver.com...
> >I'm not so sure. When a rider isn't in form, there is a fair chance he
> >will lose his concentration and make mistakes.
> >
> >Benjo Maso
>
> I doubt he was off form at that moment since he had just attacked most
> of his rivals, and after losing all of that time from the fall, he still
> came back and attacked again, and won the stage by over 40 seconds. I
> don't think that that means he had bad form, dumbass.


You really mean that in the Pyrenees stages Armstrong was in top form? That
he had the same form as the years before? That he didn't need much more
effort to win? That he didn't look much more tired? And you call me a
dumbass?

Benjo Maso

benjo maso

"Tom Kunich" <cyclintom@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:rBhic.6855$eZ5.3152@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net...
> "benjo maso" <benjo.maso@chello.nl> wrote in message
> news:c6btrl$ae0sb$1@ID-75468.news.uni-berlin.de...
> >
> > And in 2003
> > Armstrong made mistakes or wasn't as strong as he used to be. But he
> didn't
> > have bad luck.
>
> Would you call it good luck to hook a spectators feedbag and come down
hard
> breaking the chain stay on your bike?


Leif Hoste's flag incident in Paris-Roubaix was bad luck because if was
unavoidable. Armstrong's fall wasn't: he was riding too close to the
spectators.

Benjo Maso

h squared

leif_ericson wrote:
> dumbass.

er, do you even read this group for more than a minute a week? if you
cared about bike racing, i doubt you would be calling benjo a "dumbass".

heather, a dumbass for replying

Mapei81

Roll can be a personable and charming guy, and once in a while even insightful.
But he also is a pugnacious shill for Lance and to some degree for other
American riders, at least the ones that Lance likes. He doesn't care for Jan
and has said derogatory things about him before (he didn't deserve a good
sportsmanship award because he slowed for lance only when Tyler made a scen
about it, etc.).

He was basically trash-talking in this instance and is far from an impartial
journalist. He has no idea, really, why Jan isn't riding fast at the moment.

Steven Bornfeld

benjo maso wrote:
> "leif_ericson" <usenet-forum@cyclingforums.com> wrote in message
> news:Zdhic.2142$tO1.364@fe28.usenetserver.com...
>
>>>I'm not so sure. When a rider isn't in form, there is a fair chance he
>>>will lose his concentration and make mistakes.
>>>
>>>Benjo Maso
>>
>>I doubt he was off form at that moment since he had just attacked most
>>of his rivals, and after losing all of that time from the fall, he still
>>came back and attacked again, and won the stage by over 40 seconds. I
>>don't think that that means he had bad form, dumbass.
>
>
>
> You really mean that in the Pyrenees stages Armstrong was in top form? That
> he had the same form as the years before? That he didn't need much more
> effort to win? That he didn't look much more tired? And you call me a
> dumbass?

Is this a first for you, Benjo?

Steve

>
> Benjo Maso
>
>

benjo maso

"Steven Bornfeld" <dentaltwinnospam@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:408AD7BB.4080407@earthlink.net...
>
>
> benjo maso wrote:
> > "leif_ericson" <usenet-forum@cyclingforums.com> wrote in message
> > news:Zdhic.2142$tO1.364@fe28.usenetserver.com...
> >
> >>>I'm not so sure. When a rider isn't in form, there is a fair chance he
> >>>will lose his concentration and make mistakes.
> >>>
> >>>Benjo Maso
> >>
> >>I doubt he was off form at that moment since he had just attacked most
> >>of his rivals, and after losing all of that time from the fall, he still
> >>came back and attacked again, and won the stage by over 40 seconds. I
> >>don't think that that means he had bad form, dumbass.
> >
> >
> >
> > You really mean that in the Pyrenees stages Armstrong was in top form?
That
> > he had the same form as the years before? That he didn't need much more
> > effort to win? That he didn't look much more tired? And you call me a
> > dumbass?
>
> Is this a first for you, Benjo?



To be called "dumbass"? On rbr: yes (except by Kurgan and of course that
doesn't count). On the other hand, I'm not completely unfamiliar with it. As
a student I worked with small children for some time and they were also
convinced that calling names reinforced their arguments significantly.

Benjo Maso

Tom Kunich

"benjo maso" <benjo.maso@chello.nl> wrote in message
news:c6caou$alutq$1@ID-75468.news.uni-berlin.de...
>
> "Tom Kunich" <cyclintom@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:rBhic.6855$eZ5.3152@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net...
> >
> > Would you call it good luck to hook a spectators feedbag and come down
> > hard breaking the chain stay on your bike?
>
>
> Leif Hoste's flag incident in Paris-Roubaix was bad luck because if was
> unavoidable. Armstrong's fall wasn't: he was riding too close to the
> spectators.

Benjo, how many times have you seem this in the past? Especially on places
like the high mountains where the roads are so packed with spectators that
you ride within scant inches of them whether you want to or not.

Mayo was right behind him. It was Armstrong's bad luck to get snagged and
not Mayo.

Tom Kunich

"Mapei81" <mapei81@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20040423215319.14685.00000191@mb-m23.aol.com...
> Roll can be a personable and charming guy, and once in a while even
insightful.
> But he also is a pugnacious shill for Lance and to some degree for other
> American riders, at least the ones that Lance likes. He doesn't care for
Jan
> and has said derogatory things about him before (he didn't deserve a good
> sportsmanship award because he slowed for lance only when Tyler made a
scen
> about it, etc.).
>
> He was basically trash-talking in this instance and is far from an
impartial
> journalist. He has no idea, really, why Jan isn't riding fast at the
moment.

Bob Roll is a commentator and not a news caster. There's nothing wrong with
him having a bit of bias towards past teammates. If you check back you'll
see that Paul Sherwin does as well.

If he makes some comment about Jan I'm adult enough to take it with a grain
of salt.

benjo maso

"Tom Kunich" <cyclintom@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:x8Gic.11047$e4.10804@newsread2.news.pas.earthlink.net...
> "benjo maso" <benjo.maso@chello.nl> wrote in message
> news:c6caou$alutq$1@ID-75468.news.uni-berlin.de...
> >
> > "Tom Kunich" <cyclintom@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> > news:rBhic.6855$eZ5.3152@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net...
> > >
> > > Would you call it good luck to hook a spectators feedbag and come down
> > > hard breaking the chain stay on your bike?
> >
> >
> > Leif Hoste's flag incident in Paris-Roubaix was bad luck because if was
> > unavoidable. Armstrong's fall wasn't: he was riding too close to the
> > spectators.
>
> Benjo, how many times have you seem this in the past? Especially on places
> like the high mountains where the roads are so packed with spectators that
> you ride within scant inches of them whether you want to or not.


Sure, sometimes it seems a miracle that accidents don't happen. At Alpe
d'Huez for instance. But this time there was room enough.


> Mayo was right behind him. It was Armstrong's bad luck to get snagged and
> not Mayo.


I don't think so. The kid with the sack didn't make some unexpected
movement. Armstrong just came too close to him. He took a risk and without
the sack he probably would have got away with it. In that respect it was
"bad luck", but that doesn't mean it wasn't his own fault. It's like riding
on my bike trough a red light, which I do all the time in Amsterdam (like
everybody there I take a red light only as an advice). It almost never
causes me trouble, but about once in two or three years I'm seen by a
policeman. Is that "bad luck"?

Benjo Maso