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Powder Coat vs. Wet Paint...  

post #1 of 15
Thread Starter 
"rosco" <reverse-the-following"ocsor_g"@hotmail.com> wrote in message
newsgPub.10560$Wy4.3535@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net...

> I'm considering having a frame repainted with 1 or 2 colors, and I'm trying to decide between the
> powder coat process vs. wet paint. If I powder coat, I'll most likely use Spectrum Powder Works
> (Colorado Springs), and if I wet paint, I'll probably use Hot Tubes (Worcester, MA). I've been
> lead to believe by some that powder coat is a somewhat more durable finish, while others have said
> the durability of the two is roughly the same. Since the cost is about the same from these two
> refinishers, price isn't the determining factor. Spectrum says they specialize in creating a
> powder coat with a wet paint "look". If this is true, the esthetics isn't an issue either. What
> experience have you folks had with these two methods?

It depends on what kind of paint Hot Tubes uses. If they use polyurethane like Imron, it's pretty
tough stuff. A good, thick powdercoat is probably tougher, though. Then there's the level of finish.
Powdercoat has traditionally been kind of "industrial" looking, but these days it's really good --
better than most production bike paint jobs. However, the best finishes are still with paint. I
guess it depends on how good you want your bike to look, and how much you're willing to spend.
Powdercoat is usually much cheaper.

Sometimes the best paint jobs can almost look too good -- especially if you don't have top-notch
components in really good condition. A less perfect finish can actually be a better match.

Matt O.
post #2 of 15

Re: Powder Coat vs. Wet Paint...

To demonstrate powdercoat, I take a sample tube and whack it on my workstand, producing a dent. then
I carve a curl of clearcoat off the tube. In both cases, no chipping. My former painter also used
PPG urethane and I don't look back. Tom

--
Bruni Bicycles "Where art meets science" brunibicycles.com
410.426.3420 rosco <reverse-the-following"ocsor_g"@hotmail.com> wrote in message
newsPQub.10645$Wy4.9114@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net...
> > It depends on what kind of paint Hot Tubes uses. If they use
polyurethane
> like
> > Imron, it's pretty tough stuff.
>
> They use PPG urethane paints.
post #3 of 15

Re: Powder Coat vs. Wet Paint...

"rosco" <reverse-the-following"ocsor_g"@hotmail.com> wrote in message
newsgPub.10560$Wy4.3535@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net...
> I'm considering having a frame repainted with 1 or 2 colors, and I'm
trying
> to decide between the powder coat process vs. wet paint. If I powder
coat,
> I'll most likely use Spectrum Powder Works (Colorado Springs), and if I
wet
> paint, I'll probably use Hot Tubes (Worcester, MA). I've been lead to believe by some that powder
> coat is a somewhat more durable finish, while others have said the durability of the two is
> roughly the same. Since the cost is about the same from these two refinishers, price isn't the
> determining factor. Spectrum says they specialize in creating a powder
coat
> with a wet paint "look". If this is true, the esthetics isn't an issue either. What experience
> have you folks had with these two methods?
>
There's a shop here in San Marcos that'll powder coat your frame for you for less than $100. They do
all of one of the local builder's frames and I haven't seen a bad one yet.

Whoever Russ Denny uses did a fantastic job on the pearl black powder coat on my track frame...

Pearls, candies, metallics, I've seen some pretty nice samples at the powder coating guy's shops.

Look around locally. You can probably find a shop in your area that'll do as good a job for a
lot less $$.

Mike
post #4 of 15
Thread Starter 

Re: Powder Coat vs. Wet Paint...

"Jeff Starr" <jstarr@peoplepc.com> wrote in message
news:10c5841f.0311191709.438f2c2d@posting.google.com...

> Hi, more questions, than answers. What is used on new bikes. Like the Trek products, LeMond and
> Klein? The Kleins I have seen have all had nice finishes, as did the Felts.

It's probably acrylic enamel, like most auto paint -- not nearly as tough as powdercoat or
polyurethane. Boutique frames usually have better paint, often polyurethane. Some are powdercoated,
like the original Bontragers.

> I would have to agree that shoddy, worn components, wouldn't look right with a high quality
> finish. But I would possibly find myself overly protective of a bike that had a custom paint job.
> Getting that first nick or scratch in a new bike or car is always a bummer, but after that, an
> occasional chip seems a part of life. Final question, what do these place charge for frame
> refinishing?

Usually $1-200 for powdercoat, $150-400 and up for polyurethane -- depending on which colors, how
many colors, fades, other designs, and even decals. Here are a couple of links for paint shops, but
there are many, many more:

http://spectrumpowderworks.com/

http://www.campyonly.com/joebell.html

If you have a bike like a Klein or Waterford, you can just send it back to the factory (who in turn
probably sends it to someone like Joe Bell).

Most cities have shops that do powdercoating, for everything from signs to off road truck parts. You
may find a really good deal from a place like that, but a bicycle specialist is likely to do a
better job. Still, I've seen really nice jobs done for $100 or so -- well worth it.

Look for a shop in your home town anyway. Even if it's not cheaper, you'll save a lot on the
shipping charges.

Matt O.
post #5 of 15

Re: Powder Coat vs. Wet Paint...

On an episode of "American Chopper", they powder coated a set of aluminum rims with this red, that
turned out really shiny.. almost like an anodized red, but with a really high polish. It looked
amaaaazing. The guy that looks like hulk holgan then said that he prefers powder coating, because
the finish is so much more rich.

By that fact alone, I'd go powder coat

Mike http://mikebeauchamp.com

"rosco" <reverse-the-following"ocsor_g"@hotmail.com> wrote in message
newsgPub.10560$Wy4.3535@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net...
> I'm considering having a frame repainted with 1 or 2 colors, and I'm
trying
> to decide between the powder coat process vs. wet paint. If I powder
coat,
> I'll most likely use Spectrum Powder Works (Colorado Springs), and if I
wet
> paint, I'll probably use Hot Tubes (Worcester, MA). I've been lead to believe by some that powder
> coat is a somewhat more durable finish, while others have said the durability of the two is
> roughly the same. Since the cost is about the same from these two refinishers, price isn't the
> determining factor. Spectrum says they specialize in creating a powder
coat
> with a wet paint "look". If this is true, the esthetics isn't an issue either. What experience
> have you folks had with these two methods?
post #6 of 15

Re: Powder Coat vs. Wet Paint...

jstarr@peoplepc.com (Jeff Starr) wrote in message
>
> Hi, more questions, than answers. What is used on new bikes. Like the Trek products, LeMond and
> Klein? The Kleins I have seen have all had nice finishes, as did the Felts.

A few years back I had a discussion with a PPG factory rep and was told that Klein uses PPG Deltron
paint (polyurethane). The rep was familar since he delt with them on a regular basis. This was back
when Klein was located in the northwest.

Ed
post #7 of 15

Re: Powder Coat vs. Wet Paint...

....friend of mine just used Spectrum for a tri-color fade. Very nice and not cheap! Email off-list
and I'll send a .jpg if you want. The powdercoater's here vary in sophistication. Some can do
"candy" colors and fades; others, not! Find a good industrial powdercoater who also does motorcycle
frames and parts and you'll be in business!

Gene Tampa, FL
post #8 of 15

Re: Powder Coat vs. Wet Paint...

On 19 Nov 2003 17:09:03 -0800, jstarr@peoplepc.com (Jeff Starr) wrote:

>What is used on new bikes. Like the Trek products, LeMond and Klein? The Kleins I have seen have
>all had nice finishes, as did the Felts.

Trek has both powder coat and wet paint lines. Some bikes get a powder coat base color, then the
second color is wet paint. Take a look at some Gary Fisher MTBs for examples.

I think carbon (and bonded aluminum) frames get only wet paint (temperature of powder coat process
too high?).

Generally top of the line bikes get wet paint.
post #9 of 15

Re: Powder Coat vs. Wet Paint...

jstarr@peoplepc.com (Jeff Starr) wrote in message
news:<10c5841f.0311191709.438f2c2d@posting.google.com>...

> Hi, more questions, than answers. What is used on new bikes. Like the Trek products, LeMond
> and Klein?

Not sure I would want to replicate the paint quality on a Lemond. I have a frame that is just over
two years old and the paint is peeling off in sheets. *IF* I keep that frame it will need to be
painted or powdercoated in the near future. Sigh.

- rick
post #10 of 15

Re: Powder Coat vs. Wet Paint...

On 20 Nov 2003 22:20:54 -0800, carlfogel@comcast.net (Carl Fogel) wrote:

>But now you've said that black touches up better, and I expect that your experience is considerably
>greater than Stoss's.
>
>So do you find that black touches up better, but needs touch-up more often than other colors? Does
>Stoss's notion about factory-fresh black being more delicate strike you as true?

I like black too. My CAAD 4 Cannondale is not glossy but flat black. It touches up effortlessly and
invisibly with Testor's flat black model paint.
post #11 of 15

Re: Powder Coat vs. Wet Paint...

> I like black too. My CAAD 4 Cannondale is not glossy but flat black. It touches up effortlessly
> and invisibly with Testor's flat black model paint.

I use that very same paint on a glossy bike, and on sandblasted parts - hard to beat it for a
touch-up paint!

The Real Lee Casey
post #12 of 15

Re: Powder Coat vs. Wet Paint...

A Muzi <am@yellowjersey.org> writes:

> My black bikes look much better over the long term than anything else. Black is the only color
> that touches up acceptably.

In any case, black is always the, err, new black. It is guaranteed to look smart, and won't go out
of fashion.

--
simon@jasmine.org.uk (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

;; I'd rather live in sybar-space
post #13 of 15

Re: Powder Coat vs. Wet Paint...

> In a way, it reminds me of a day when I happened to listen to an internal medicine specialist and
> a neurosurgeon talking about coumadin.
>
> The internist wanted a program to track coumadin dosages, since this blood-thinning drug is
> sensitive and has to be watched carefully, but is quite helpful to lots of patients at risk for
> clotting. (He's the guy who likes white because it hides existing imperfections.)
>
> The neurosurgeon was a bit depressed, having had to tell a family that their mother was dead--she
> fell, hit her head, and bled copiously inside her skull because she was on coumadin and didn't
> clot worth a damn.
>
> The goddamn stuff, after all, is literally used as rat poison, to quote my unhappy childhood
> friend, who loathes the stuff like many neurosurgeons. (He's the guy who prefers black because
> it's easy to touch up and hates white because it's so hard to match.)
>
> Honest, I wasn't putting Stoss up to contradict you, but to illustrate how interesting the
> difference was between black as an original paint and black as a paint to maintain.
>
> Carl Fogel

I'd just like to tell you that, with a combination of 24 letters and a bit of punctuation, you have
just written the strangest thing I have ever read.

May God have mercy on your soul.
post #14 of 15

Re: Powder Coat vs. Wet Paint...

> > May God have mercy on your soul.
>
> Dear Adam,
>
> This (modest cough) is nothing.
>
> You should see what I can do when I use a semi-colon. With a few of those, I could have dragged
> Shakespeare and Marlowe into the post, covered them with black and white paint until they looked
> like zebras, and left you all shaking your heads.
>
> Speaking of zebras and black and white paint, there's an interesting essay by the late Stephen Jay
> Gould about whether they are white animals with black stripes or black animals with white stripes.
>
> If designed to suit Andrew, the zebra would be a white animal with black touch-up stripes.
>
> Alas, a few zebras fail to form their stripes properly, resulting in dots instead of solid and
> confusing stripes. The dotted, poorly formed stripes are always white, showing that the default
> zebra background color is black and that only its stripes are white.
>
> So to touch up any zebras that arrive defective from the factory, you need to apply white paint,
> which is probably why Andrew works in a bike shop instead of a zoo--he has found that black is the
> only color that touches up worth a damn.
>
> See essay 29 in "Hen's Teeth and Horse's Toes."
>
> Carl Fogel

Carl, between your responce and your preferred literature, all the subjunctive invocations of divine
mercy in the world couldn't save you.
post #15 of 15

Re: Powder Coat vs. Wet Paint...

> > Carl, between your responce and your preferred literature, all the subjunctive invocations of
> > divine mercy in the world couldn't save you.
> Nonsense--both Andrew and Peter assure me that a few dabs with a magic marker will touch my soul
> up just fine.

In contrast, I swiped the Xylene touch up paint from a white recumbent last summer--I'm good to go.

> Don't let your prelapsarian pre-cognomen rush you into anything. You and Eve must consider divine
> grace. [SNIP]

That one does not look familiar--could you point me to the source? Whoever he is, he's dipped too
much acid.
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