Seattle Cheese Festival

Cindy Fuller wrote:
> I went down to Pike Place Market for the Cheese
> Festival with about 100,000 of our closest friends who didn't go to the
> University District Street Fair today. We first had lunch at Café
> Yamarka, a little Russian joint. .. Then we braved the crowds at the
> cheese tables. A couple of our big favorites:
>
> Humboldt Fog, from the Cypress Grove Creamery in California
> Estrella smoked provolone, a local company
>
> We finally got to try Cougar Gold and Crimson Fire cheeses from
> Washington State University, and various other offerings of goat, sheep,
> and bovine milk cheeses.
>
> The crowds were huge, which made getting any sample a contact sport.
> The street through the market was closed to vehicles, but there still
> wasn't much room to maneuver.


Oh dear, that does sound wonderful. You say the crowds were huge.
Otherwise it sounds like something worth flying cross coast for. When I
was working for a wine and cheese shop here, I liked Humboldt Fog a lot.
From the festival web page, I'm also familiar with the Rogue Creamery,
Point Reyes Farmstead, and Sierra Nevada Cheese, none of the others.


--Lia

In article <[email protected]>,
Julia Altshuler <[email protected]> wrote:

> Cindy Fuller wrote:
> > I went down to Pike Place Market for the Cheese
> > Festival with about 100,000 of our closest friends who didn't go to the
> > University District Street Fair today. We first had lunch at Café
> > Yamarka, a little Russian joint. .. Then we braved the crowds at the
> > cheese tables. A couple of our big favorites:
> >
> > Humboldt Fog, from the Cypress Grove Creamery in California
> > Estrella smoked provolone, a local company
> >
> > We finally got to try Cougar Gold and Crimson Fire cheeses from
> > Washington State University, and various other offerings of goat, sheep,
> > and bovine milk cheeses.
> >
> > The crowds were huge, which made getting any sample a contact sport.
> > The street through the market was closed to vehicles, but there still
> > wasn't much room to maneuver.
>
>
> Oh dear, that does sound wonderful. You say the crowds were huge.
> Otherwise it sounds like something worth flying cross coast for. When I
> was working for a wine and cheese shop here, I liked Humboldt Fog a lot.
> From the festival web page, I'm also familiar with the Rogue Creamery,
> Point Reyes Farmstead, and Sierra Nevada Cheese, none of the others.
>
>
Most of the cheeseries were ones we'd never heard of, either. We tried
the Point Reyes blue cheese, which SO declared too salty for his liking.
There was a wine tent at the festival, but the line was down the block.
We went to Caffe D'Arte to satisfy his addiction. I'm surprised he
didn't try the cheese rolled in coffee and lavender (a strange
combination) from the Beehive Creamery.

Cindy

--
C.J. Fuller

Delete the obvious to email me

Cindy Fuller wrote:

> Most of the cheeseries were ones we'd never heard of, either. We tried
> the Point Reyes blue cheese, which SO declared too salty for his liking.
> There was a wine tent at the festival, but the line was down the block.
> We went to Caffe D'Arte to satisfy his addiction. I'm surprised he
> didn't try the cheese rolled in coffee and lavender (a strange
> combination) from the Beehive Creamery.


If I understand you correctly, the different creameries each have a
booth with lots of cheese. The attendees wait in line or jostle around
to get free samples. I wonder if there's a more efficient way to do it
so the creameries would still have a chance to pitch their wares and the
potential customers would still have a chance to learn something without
just getting a packet of cheese and promotional materials.


Yeah, Point Reyes blue is salty, but as a general rule, I prefer
domestic blues to European ones. The real deal Roquefort is too salty
for me too, and it's too strong for me too. My all-over favorite blue
is plain, ordinary, Maytag.


Cheese rolled in coffee and lavender? Gee, and I thought I was a stick
in the mud for being suspicious of havarti with dill or Brie with
mushrooms mixed in. There may be exceptions, but I like cheese to get
its distinctive flavor from the milk and rennet, not add-ins.


--Lia

On May 20, 8:35 am, Julia Altshuler <[email protected]> wrote:
> Cindy Fuller wrote:
> > Most of the cheeseries were ones we'd never heard of, either. We tried
> > the Point Reyes blue cheese, which SO declared too salty for his liking.
> > There was a wine tent at the festival, but the line was down the block.
> > We went to Caffe D'Arte to satisfy his addiction. I'm surprised he
> > didn't try the cheese rolled in coffee and lavender (a strange
> > combination) from the Beehive Creamery.
>
> If I understand you correctly, the different creameries each have a
> booth with lots of cheese. The attendees wait in line or jostle around
> to get free samples. I wonder if there's a more efficient way to do it
> so the creameries would still have a chance to pitch their wares and the
> potential customers would still have a chance to learn something without
> just getting a packet of cheese and promotional materials.
>
> Yeah, Point Reyes blue is salty, but as a general rule, I prefer
> domestic blues to European ones. The real deal Roquefort is too salty
> for me too, and it's too strong for me too. My all-over favorite blue
> is plain, ordinary, Maytag.
>
> Cheese rolled in coffee and lavender? Gee, and I thought I was a stick
> in the mud for being suspicious of havarti with dill or Brie with
> mushrooms mixed in. There may be exceptions, but I like cheese to get
> its distinctive flavor from the milk and rennet, not add-ins.
>
> --Lia

There is a very nice soft cheese available in Scotland that is rolled
in (of course) oatmeal . Unfortunately I have forgotten its name and
when we asked ( 20 or so years ago) about finding it in Canada we were
told that it didn't travel well

John Kane wrote:
>
> There is a very nice soft cheese available in Scotland that is rolled
> in (of course) oatmeal . Unfortunately I have forgotten its name and
> when we asked ( 20 or so years ago) about finding it in Canada we were
> told that it didn't travel well


You got me curious so I googled on "cheese of Scotland". My first hit
was: I found this: http://www.taste-of-scotland.com/cheese.html where
I found this:


"Cream Cheese: several versions, mostly based on revived traditional
Highland recipes and rolled in oatmeal, including Caboc (Ross-shire),
Howgate (Perthshire) and Lochaber-smoked. Available plain or with
peppercorns, garlic or herbs."


I'm going to guess that a big part of the reason for the cheese tasting
so good in Scotland has to do with different laws regarding
pasteurization between Scotland, Canada and the U.S.


Pasteurization saves lives. We really couldn't have milk delivered to
so many people and places today if it weren't pasteurized.
Pateurization also kills flavor. That's not a big problem with aged
cheeses. It's legal to sell un-pasteurized hard cheeses (aged over 60
days) in the U.S. The question comes up for the fresh cheeses (aged
under 60 days).


I don't know the laws in Canada or Scotland. I do know that when I
traveled in France, I couldn't believe how good the fresh cheeses
tasted. They were spectacular. I tried getting the same thing in the
U.S., and they were nothing the same. I later learned that the reason
for the difference is that I was getting unpasteurized fresh cheeses
there that weren't available, by law, here.


I'm guessing that explains why you haven't been able to get that great
Scottish cheese in Canada-- but I'm not sure about the Canadian laws so
I can't be sure.


--Lia

Cindy Fuller <[email protected]> wrote:

> We first had lunch at Café
> Yamarka, a little Russian joint.

I'd bet it is "Yarmarka" (which means "fair").

> The borscht was tasty, but the pierogi
> weren't anything to write home about.

Were they pierogi or pirogi/pirozhki (i.e. Polish dumplings or Russian
pastries (pies))? What was the filling?

If the place is really Russian, they have no business serving Polish
pierogi, as there are Russian pelmeni and Russian-Ukrainian vareniki, as
well as a lot of other alternatives from the former Russian/Soviet
empire, such as the Georgian khinkali, Armenian boraki, Uzbek manty, or
Lithuanian koldunai to serve instead. Well, Poland used to be a part of
the empire, too, but it's been a while...

> We finally got to try Cougar Gold and Crimson Fire cheeses from
> Washington State University, and various other offerings of goat, sheep,
> and bovine milk cheeses.

.... caprine, ovine and bovine...

Victor

Victor Sack wrote:
> Cindy Fuller <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> We first had lunch at Café
>> Yamarka, a little Russian joint.
>
> I'd bet it is "Yarmarka" (which means "fair").
>
>> The borscht was tasty, but the pierogi
>> weren't anything to write home about.
>
> Were they pierogi or pirogi/pirozhki (i.e. Polish dumplings or Russian
> pastries (pies))? What was the filling?
>
> If the place is really Russian, they have no business serving Polish
> pierogi, as there are Russian pelmeni and Russian-Ukrainian vareniki, as
> well as a lot of other alternatives from the former Russian/Soviet
> empire, such as the Georgian khinkali, Armenian boraki, Uzbek manty, or
> Lithuanian koldunai to serve instead. Well, Poland used to be a part of
> the empire, too, but it's been a while...
>
>> We finally got to try Cougar Gold and Crimson Fire cheeses from
>> Washington State University, and various other offerings of goat, sheep,
>> and bovine milk cheeses.
>
> ... caprine, ovine and bovine...
>
> Victor

Austria must have been part of the Russian Empire, or Russia part of the
Austro-Hungarian, how, otherwise, did we have Taschkerln there? )

margaret suran <[email protected]> wrote:

> Austria must have been part of the Russian Empire, or Russia part of the
> Austro-Hungarian, how, otherwise, did we have Taschkerln there? )

Ha! We've been there before. Austria must have been a part of the
Polish empire, because the Taschkerln you described were all made in the
manner of Polish pierogi, boiled, not baked or fried, as real Taschkerln
should be. That's because they were made by your Teta, who was from
Poland. Ha!

Bubba

In article <[email protected]>,
Julia Altshuler <[email protected]> wrote:

> I don't know the laws in Canada or Scotland. I do know that when I
> traveled in France, I couldn't believe how good the fresh cheeses
> tasted. They were spectacular. I tried getting the same thing in the
> U.S., and they were nothing the same. I later learned that the reason
> for the difference is that I was getting unpasteurized fresh cheeses
> there that weren't available, by law, here.

A couple of the local cheese producers (the artisans who show up at
the farmers' markets here) sell raw-milk cheese. They do it legally
by labeling it "pet food" or "fish bait" along with a description of
the cheese (including an explanation of why it cannot be sold
labeled for human consumption). One producer in particular makes a
_very_ smooth goat cheese -- er, goat fish bait. I had to try it --
I'm not much of a fisherman. ;-)

sd

On Sun, 20 May 2007 17:21:16 -0500, sd wrote:

> A couple of the local cheese producers (the artisans who show up at
> the farmers' markets here) sell raw-milk cheese. They do it legally
> by labeling it "pet food" or "fish bait" along with a description of
> the cheese (including an explanation of why it cannot be sold
> labeled for human consumption). One producer in particular makes a
> _very_ smooth goat cheese -- er, goat fish bait. I had to try it --
> I'm not much of a fisherman. ;-)

That's an interesting work-around. Can they offer free samples
of that pet food?

Maybe they can start importing some of that pet food from other
countries under the same guise. Can't be any worse than what we
got from China.

-sw

Victor Sack wrote:
> margaret suran <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> Austria must have been part of the Russian Empire, or Russia part of the
>> Austro-Hungarian, how, otherwise, did we have Taschkerln there? )
>
> Ha! We've been there before. Austria must have been a part of the
> Polish empire, because the Taschkerln you described were all made in the
> manner of Polish pierogi, boiled, not baked or fried, as real Taschkerln
> should be. That's because they were made by your Teta, who was from
> Poland. Ha!
>
> Bubba

Yes, we have been there before, but Taschkerln were made by Austrians,
Viennese and I can prove it. In the 1930's there was a popular song,
ein Schlager, called "Mehlspeisen". Every cake, cookie and other
dessert that was made with Mehl, flour, was mentioned in that song,
including Taschkerln. I believe it was a Hermann Leopoldi song, but I
would not bet on it. "Our" dessert Taschkerln were filled with pot
cheese or blueberries or sour cherries or Plum butter (Powidl) and
served with plain sugar, cinnamon sugar and sour cream. Yes, Teta made
them and they were wonderful and half moon shaped, but Urwiener
establishments featured them on their menus, too.

As soon as I find the time, I will go to the Lower East Side and get
some blueberry Taschkerln.

In article <1hye4e8.q4fx5v1c1jem8N%[email protected]>,
[email protected] (Victor Sack) wrote:

> Cindy Fuller <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> > We first had lunch at Café
> > Yamarka, a little Russian joint.
>
> I'd bet it is "Yarmarka" (which means "fair").

Cindy's infamous SO (and culinary co-conspirator) replies:

Yes, it is Yarmarka, as you can see in the picture of the place in this
document:

<http://pikeplacemerchantsassociation.com/News/Dec_05/120510.pdf>

> > The borscht was tasty, but the pierogi
> > weren't anything to write home about.
>
> Were they pierogi or pirogi/pirozhki (i.e. Polish dumplings or Russian
> pastries (pies))? What was the filling?

They were boiled dumplings, although I can't recall whether the menu
used the pierogi or pirogi spelling. I always thought that these were
essentially the same thing, and that piroshki were the baked pies.

Cindy ordered the pirogi with potato and cheese filling. I tried a
couple of them. Very bland, even when dunked in the accompanying brown
sauce and/or sour cream. But that's been the case with most of the
Russian pirogi and pelmeni that I've had.

I prefer piroshki, and there is another Russian joint in the Pike Place
Market that does them well. The place is called "Piroshki Piroshki".
It's a tiny walk-up joint, a few doors down from the original Starbucks
cafe. They have a huge selection of piroshki fillings, both sweet and
savory varieties. Their salmon pate filling is wonderful. Anthony
Bourdain raved about this place in the Pacific Northwest episode of his
"No Reservations" TV series.

--
Julian Vrieslander

Julian wrote:

> I prefer piroshki, and there is another Russian joint in the Pike Place
> Market that does them well. The place is called "Piroshki Piroshki".
> It's a tiny walk-up joint, a few doors down from the original Starbucks
> cafe. They have a huge selection of piroshki fillings, both sweet and
> savory varieties. Their salmon pate filling is wonderful. Anthony
> Bourdain raved about this place in the Pacific Northwest episode of his
> "No Reservations" TV series.

Hey, I've been there! Last time I went to Seattle, I ended my visit by
picking up a steelhead and some crab legs at the Pike Place Market. On my
way back to the car, I got a couple piroshky to eat on the drive back to
Sacramento. I got a salmon piroshky and one made with some kind of berries
(huckleberries?) and cream cheese. Yes, they were very good indeed.

Bob

[email protected] writes:
>In article <1hye4e8.q4fx5v1c1jem8N%[email protected]>,
> [email protected] (Victor Sack) wrote:
>
>> Cindy Fuller <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>> > We first had lunch at Cafe
>> > Yamarka, a little Russian joint.
>>
>> I'd bet it is "Yarmarka" (which means "fair").
>
>Cindy's infamous SO (and culinary co-conspirator) replies:
>
>Yes, it is Yarmarka, as you can see in the picture of the place in this
>document:
>
><http://pikeplacemerchantsassociation.com/News/Dec_05/120510.pdf>
>
>> > The borscht was tasty, but the pierogi
>> > weren't anything to write home about.
>>
>> Were they pierogi or pirogi/pirozhki (i.e. Polish dumplings or Russian
>> pastries (pies))? What was the filling?
>
>They were boiled dumplings, although I can't recall whether the menu
>used the pierogi or pirogi spelling. I always thought that these were
>essentially the same thing, and that piroshki were the baked pies.
>
>Cindy ordered the pirogi with potato and cheese filling. I tried a
>couple of them. Very bland, even when dunked in the accompanying brown
>sauce and/or sour cream. But that's been the case with most of the
>Russian pirogi and pelmeni that I've had.

their stuffed cabbage is good

In article <[email protected]>,
tert in seattle <[email protected]> wrote:

> their stuffed cabbage is good

Actually, that's what I ordered at Cafe Yarmarka. It was tasty, but I
prefer the traditional Jewish deli version, with sweet and sour tomato
sauce.

BTW, I misspelled the name of the other place - it's "Piroshky Piroshky"
(ending in y, not i). I just discovered that they have a website

http://www.piroshkybakery.com/

Just try to look at the photo page without getting hungry...

--
Julian Vrieslander

margaret suran <[email protected]> wrote:

> Yes, we have been there before, but Taschkerln were made by Austrians,
> Viennese and I can prove it.

You do not have to, because no one has ever disputed this.

> "Our" dessert Taschkerln were filled with pot
> cheese or blueberries or sour cherries or Plum butter (Powidl) and
> served with plain sugar, cinnamon sugar and sour cream. Yes, Teta made
> them and they were wonderful and half moon shaped, but Urwiener
> establishments featured them on their menus, too.

See
<http://groups.google.com/group/rec.food.cooking/msg/cfb6af3c4ef787f5>
and
<http://groups.google.com/group/rec.food.cooking/msg/351a41bec971d748>
Ha!

> As soon as I find the time, I will go to the Lower East Side and get
> some blueberry Taschkerln.

Pierogi, most probably, or maybe vareniki...

Bubba

Julian Vrieslander <[email protected]> wrote:

> [email protected] (Victor Sack) wrote:
>
> Cindy's infamous SO (and culinary co-conspirator) replies:
>
> Yes, it is Yarmarka, as you can see in the picture of the place in this
> document:
>
> <http://pikeplacemerchantsassociation.com/News/Dec_05/120510.pdf>

And here is their pirozhki display:
<http://www.cornichon.org/albums/yarmarka/Display%20case.jpg>.

BTW, the word comes from the German "Jahrmarkt".

> > Were they pierogi or pirogi/pirozhki (i.e. Polish dumplings or Russian
> > pastries (pies))? What was the filling?
>
> They were boiled dumplings, although I can't recall whether the menu
> used the pierogi or pirogi spelling. I always thought that these were
> essentially the same thing, and that piroshki were the baked pies.

No, pierogi are Polish dumplings; pirogi are large Russian baked pies;
pirozhki are small Russian baked or fried pies. Notice the spelling of
pirozhki; "piroshki" is a mistransliteration.

For a comprehensive explanation and recipes see
<http://groups.google.com/group/rec.food.cooking/msg/706fcf2bfb6a6d46>.

> Cindy ordered the pirogi with potato and cheese filling.

Pierogi! In Poland, they are called "ruskie pierogi", i.e. "Russian
pierogi", for some reason, even though no such things exist in Russia or
the Ukraine.

> I tried a
> couple of them. Very bland, even when dunked in the accompanying brown
> sauce and/or sour cream. But that's been the case with most of the
> Russian pirogi and pelmeni that I've had.

Delete "pirogi". Pelmeni are nearly always made with meat and correctly
made ones are always made with at least two, better still three kinds of
meat. The filling has to be spiced - then they are tasty.

> I prefer piroshki, and there is another Russian joint in the Pike Place
> Market that does them well. The place is called "Piroshki Piroshki".

I wish they would learn to transliterate 'em correctly. It is "zh", not
"sh".

> It's a tiny walk-up joint, a few doors down from the original Starbucks
> cafe. They have a huge selection of piroshki fillings, both sweet and
> savory varieties. Their salmon pate filling is wonderful. Anthony
> Bourdain raved about this place in the Pacific Northwest episode of his
> "No Reservations" TV series.

Well, if I ever find myself in Seattle, I'll try to remember to visit
both places.

Victor

Victor Sack wrote:
> margaret suran <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> Yes, we have been there before, but Taschkerln were made by Austrians,
>> Viennese and I can prove it.
>
> You do not have to, because no one has ever disputed this.
>
>> "Our" dessert Taschkerln were filled with pot
>> cheese or blueberries or sour cherries or Plum butter (Powidl) and
>> served with plain sugar, cinnamon sugar and sour cream. Yes, Teta made
>> them and they were wonderful and half moon shaped, but Urwiener
>> establishments featured them on their menus, too.
>
> See
> <http://groups.google.com/group/rec.food.cooking/msg/cfb6af3c4ef787f5>
> and
> <http://groups.google.com/group/rec.food.cooking/msg/351a41bec971d748>
> Ha!
>
>> As soon as I find the time, I will go to the Lower East Side and get
>> some blueberry Taschkerln.
>
> Pierogi, most probably, or maybe vareniki...
>
> Bubba

So sad, you still have not learned anything about Viennese Taschkerln,
Joseph Wechsberg's recipe is for Krapferln, not Taschkerln, which were
boiled, not baked. The first time I saw fried Pierogi was in 1940 in a
Dairy Restaurant in The Bronx and my parents and I were horrified.

margaret suran <[email protected]> wrote:

> So sad, you still have not learned anything about Viennese Taschkerln,
> Joseph Wechsberg's recipe is for Krapferln, not Taschkerln, which were
> boiled, not baked. The first time I saw fried Pierogi was in 1940 in a
> Dairy Restaurant in The Bronx and my parents and I were horrified.

Nonsense! And you are nasty, Resi! Joseph Wechsberg included Krapfen
recipes, too, for Faschingskrapfen and for Indianerkrapfen! He lived in
Vienna both before and after the war, on Prinz Eugen Straße 28, and he
died there in 1983. Besides, I have already pointed you to a hundred
year old recipe for Wiener Tascherl at
<http://www.naturverstand.at/rezept_detail.php?zahl=1&auswahl=Wiener_Tascherl>

And here are some more pointers, all from the source, so to say.

<http://www.ama-marketing.at/index.php?id=826>

<http://www.kleine.at/freizeit/lokalerezepte/rezepte/vorspeisen/antipastipikantes/28234/index.do>

<http://www.schweizerhaus.at/1024/eng/about4.html>

This is not to say that Tascherl are never boiled - of course a lot of
them are, particularly Powidltascherl, which are, of course, actually an
imported Bohemian dish, called Lekvárové pirohy there. Also, they are
made of dough made with flour and potatoes.

Bubba