Campy casette lockring - hand tight?

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In article <[email hidden]>,

Bill said:

I read the following advice on a touring tips website.
My own experience is that the cogs get loose if the lockring
is not wrench tight.
Would like to hear comments from others.
Here's the advice:
-------------------
Inevitably, you will break a spoke out in the middle of nowhere, and chances
are it will be on the "drive" side of the rear wheel. Thus, to replace the
spoke means having to know how to remove the rear cassette. Typically,
instruction manuals on doing this would have you use a chain whip, heavy
wrench, or even a vise -- not the kinds of things you want to be carrying
around on a bike. However, if you followed my advice about using a "Campy"
cogset, none of those tools are necessary. What I do is barely hand-tighten
the lockring on the cassette. Because the lockring is not geared, it will
not tighten up over time as you pedal. All you need to carry around is the
special lockring adapter, which weighs a few grams.
--------------------------

_ Pretty silly when you can get a perfectly adequate tool that
weighs very little and is designed for exactly this application.

http://www.sheldonbrown.com/harris/tools/cassette.html

_ Booker C. Bense

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Or better yet, get a Fiber Fix(tm) replacement spoke and forget about removing the cassette until you get home or to a proper shop.

I used to worry about this, carrying 3 spokes, one for each size my wheelset.

Bill who? said:

I read the following advice on a touring tips website. My own
experience is that the cogs get loose if the lockring is not wrench
tight. Would like to hear comments from others. Here's the advice:

Quoted message said:

# Inevitably, you will break a spoke out in the middle of nowhere,
# and chances are it will be on the "drive" side of the rear
# wheel. Thus, to replace the spoke means having to know how to
# remove the rear cassette. Typically, instruction manuals on doing
# this would have you use a chain whip, heavy wrench, or even a vise
# -- not the kinds of things you want to be carrying around on a
# bike. However, if you followed my advice about using a "Campy"
# cogset, none of those tools are necessary. What I do is barely
# hand-tighten the lockring on the cassette. Because the lockring is
# not geared, it will not tighten up over time as you pedal. All you
# need to carry around is the special lockring adapter, which weighs
# a few grams.

You didn't say what sort of freewheel or cassette you use. Cassettes
with ratcheting lock rings do not need to be tighter than a few clicks
beyond taking up slack between sprockets. They do not get involved in
transmitting pedaling torque. These are then easily removable even
with a small screwdriver in the absence of a tool.

However, if you use 36 spoke wheels, you don't need to replace the
spoke until you get home or to a shop that can do this. For instance,
I just got back from a ride over Tioga and Sonora passes starting and
finishing in Sonora on which my friend broke a spoke before noon on
the first day. His wheel required no adjustment and was not repaired
until after we got back home.

I suppose so few people ride reasonable wheels or frames (with
clearance) today that they can't imagine that this was once possible.
I was recently passed by a bicycle racer on a mountain pass riding a
superb new bicycle. A half hour later I saw him standing at the edge
of the road with one broken spoke on his paired spoke wheel. The
wheel would not turn and there was no way he could have fixed it even
if he had a spoke and tools. These wheels cannot be field repaired.
That is where we are today.

That is sadly where we are today.

Jobst Brandt
[email hidden]

Bill said:

I read the following advice on a touring tips website.
My own experience is that the cogs get loose if the lockring
is not wrench tight.
Would like to hear comments from others.
Here's the advice:
-------------------
Inevitably, you will break a spoke out in the middle of nowhere, and chances
are it will be on the "drive" side of the rear wheel. Thus, to replace the
spoke means having to know how to remove the rear cassette. Typically,
instruction manuals on doing this would have you use a chain whip, heavy
wrench, or even a vise -- not the kinds of things you want to be carrying
around on a bike. However, if you followed my advice about using a "Campy"
cogset, none of those tools are necessary. What I do is barely hand-tighten
the lockring on the cassette. Because the lockring is not geared, it will
not tighten up over time as you pedal. All you need to carry around is the
special lockring adapter, which weighs a few grams.
--------------------------

unless the rider is merely cruising to the shops at the end of the road
and doesn't mind damaging their freehub body, that's very poor advice.
loose sprockets move & movement causes wear, which in turn causes more
movement & even more wear. it won't happen immediately, but in due
course, you're looking at an expensive remedy.

as mentioned by others, merely carry a fiber fix spoke.

Quoted message said:

You didn't say what sort of freewheel or cassette you use. Cassettes
with ratcheting lock rings do not need to be tighter than a few clicks
beyond taking up slack between sprockets. They do not get involved in
transmitting pedaling torque. These are then easily removable even
with a small screwdriver in the absence of a tool.

FWIW, I used to use this technique (a few clicks past snug) and didn't
have any problems for years. But just a few months ago, I traced the
hideous rattle on the back end of my urban MTB to a loose cassette
(which also explained the substandard shifting). I've taken to
snugging them down a bit more as a result (since like you mentioned in
the part I trimmed, my wheels all have enough spokes to finish the
ride with a broken spoke).

Mark Hickey
Habanero Cycles
http://www.habcycles.com
Home of the $695 ti frame

bill-<< What I do is barely hand-tighten
the lockring on the cassette. >><BR><BR>

Balderdash...make it wrench tight and if ya gotta loosen it to take off the
cogset, take a chainstay mounted 'cog breaker' type tool..

Peter Chisholm
Vecchio's Bicicletteria
1833 Pearl St.
Boulder, CO, 80302
(303)440-3535
http://www.vecchios.com
"Ruote convenzionali costruite eccezionalmente bene"

Jobst-<< These wheels cannot be field repaired.
That is where we are today.

That is sadly where we are today. >><BR><BR>

Not all doom and gloom. Altho product managers today have their collective
heads in their arses, many bike shops still make a bunch of wheels. We make far
more than any shop sells out of boxes around The Republic and most that get
these other wheels eventually see the error of their ways, either because of
the expense, the pisspoor rear hub(ksyrium) or the high expense to repair. Then
somebody like us builds them a reliable wheelset.

Peter Chisholm
Vecchio's Bicicletteria
1833 Pearl St.
Boulder, CO, 80302
(303)440-3535
http://www.vecchios.com
"Ruote convenzionali costruite eccezionalmente bene"

Qui si parla Campagnolo said:

bill-<< What I do is barely hand-tighten the lockring on the cassette.

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

<BR><BR>

Balderdash...make it wrench tight and if ya gotta loosen it to take off
the cogset, take a chainstay mounted 'cog breaker' type tool..

I looked for one of those a couple years ago. Could not find it. Do you
have them (for Campy lockrings)?

--

David L. Johnson

__o | "What am I on? I'm on my bike, six hours a day, busting my ass.
_`\(,_ | What are you on?" --Lance Armstrong
(_)/ (_) |

"jim beam" wrote: (clip) as mentioned by others, merely carry a fiber fix
spoke.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Would someone please tell me more? How good a fix is this, and are they
available at the LBS?

Qui si parla Campagnolo said:

Not all doom and gloom. Altho product managers today have their collective
heads in their arses, many bike shops still make a bunch of wheels. We
make far more than any shop sells out of boxes around The Republic and
most that get these other wheels eventually see the error of their ways,
either because of the expense, the pisspoor rear hub(ksyrium) or the high
expense to repair. Then somebody like us builds them a reliable wheelset.

Maybe in the real 'Merica things are different. I just started riding
with a new club, so I kept out of the conversation 3-4 of the riders were
having about wheels. One was saying that his wheels were "shot", even
though they seemed perfectly true and could not have more than 10K miles
on them. He was trying to find which new boutique wheels to get.

I was just amazed. Here he had spent nearly $1000 for the wheels he had,
and was going to replace them simply because (it would seem) he was tired
of them. It may be that the bearings needed service, but sheesh.

Actually, Peter, you seem to be going about this the wrong way. He was
willing to drop another $1000 or more to replace perfectly servicable
wheels that he had already spent buckets of money on. Paint your rims
blue and fiddle with the spokes some, and you could be a rich man.

--

David L. Johnson

__o | "It doesn't get any easier, you just go faster." --Greg LeMond
_`\(,_ |
(_)/ (_) |

Leo Lichtman said:

"jim beam" wrote: (clip) as mentioned by others, merely carry a fiber fix
spoke.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Would someone please tell me more? How good a fix is this, and are they
available at the LBS?

Dear Leo,

Sheldon Brown recently added fiber to his diet again:

http://www.sheldonbrown.com/harris/tools/touring.html

About the middle of the page, $9.95. It comes in a little
plastic tube with instructions.

It's a Kevlar string about twice as long as a spoke, with a
threaded piece on one end to go into the spoke nipple, and a
doohickey on the other end to snug it up after you pass it
through the spoke-hole in the hub.

Being a string, it can be passed though even a spoke-hole
next to the gears without removing the cluster.

I carry one as a charm against breaking spokes (it doesn't
work in that respect). I never use it when spokes do break,
since my ride is so close to home and it's easy to adjust
things on 36-spoke wheels. But the fiberfix spoke might be
useful for someone touring long-distance.

Sheldon also sells the Stein mini cassette lock tool on the
same page, for removing cassettes on the road to install
real spokes.

Carl Fogel