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Advice for Marathon pace

Started by Jude A. Thomas · · Last activity · 8 posts · 266 views

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General fitness, health and nutrition
Published
8 September 2004
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13 September 2004
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Jude A. Thomas
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  1. Hi,

    I am running a marathon in a few days and I have not settled on a
    target pace. This will be my second marathon, although my first was
    quite a few years ago. If anyone is kind enough to offer some advice I
    would GREATLY appreciate it.

    Below you will find some information about my training and racing this
    summer, as well as some other miscellaneous data. I have relied on the
    Runner's World intermediate training program, and I have adhered to it
    pretty much religiously, including the tempo runs and the repeats. On
    cross-training days I have been mountain biking and road biking. Also,
    some basic stats about me: I am 34 years old, 5'10" tall, I weigh 153
    pounds, and I'm very healthy -- if you don't count the stress of my
    insane life. This is just background info to give you some
    perspective.

    1. Sample of races I ran this summer:

    June 20th - 10K: pace = 6:56

    July 18th - Half-Marathon: pace = 7:14

    July 29th - XC 5K: pace = 6:50

    September 5th - 10K: pace = 6:50

    The half-marathon course I ran in July is identical to the marathon
    course which I will be running on September 12th (except, of course,
    I'll be running two laps instead of one). In the half-marathon I ran
    at 7:30 pace for about the first half and then I ran negative splits
    for the remainder of the course, to average 7:14 (finish time was
    1:34). I have run progressively better personal best times in each my
    last three or four half marathons.

    2. History:

    I have only run one full marathon in the past: the 2000 Pittsburgh
    Marathon. My performance was sloppy in terms of pace and the heat was
    pretty bad – that was the year of the Olympic trials when it was
    pretty brutal. I ran a time of 4:08, and my splits were very uneven: I
    ran the first half at 7-something pace and the second half much more
    slowly. Otherwise, I did mostly the right things: I drank water
    regularly, consumed sports beverages with the water every 10-15
    minutes, and I didn't ever really bonk – I just slowed down a lot. I
    felt fine when I finished, albeit very hot and a little woozy.

    3. Training:

    Most of my weekday training has been on a crushed limestone path and
    my long weekend runs have been on asphalt. My longest run took place 3
    weeks before the planned marathon – 22 miles – and I felt like I could
    have easily run another three or four miles. I also recovered very
    quickly from the 22-miler. All of my long training runs (everything
    over 10 miles) have been at a very relaxed pace of 9 minutes/mile. My
    shorter midweek runs are generally faster – anywhere between 7:30 and
    8:30 pace. Repeats, obviously, are run closer to my 5K pace. I have
    been injury-free throughout my entire training program this summer.

    I'd appreciate your thoughts on what pace I should aim to set, and any
    other tips that you might have.

    Thank you very much!

  2. Jude A. Thomas said:

    I am running a marathon in a few days and I have not settled on a
    target pace. This will be my second marathon, although my first was
    quite a few years ago. If anyone is kind enough to offer some advice I
    would GREATLY appreciate it.

    Below you will find some information about my training and racing this
    summer, as well as some other miscellaneous data. I have relied on the
    Runner's World intermediate training program, and I have adhered to it
    pretty much religiously, including the tempo runs and the repeats. On
    cross-training days I have been mountain biking and road biking. Also,
    some basic stats about me: I am 34 years old, 5'10" tall, I weigh 153
    pounds, and I'm very healthy -- if you don't count the stress of my
    insane life. This is just background info to give you some
    perspective.

    1. Sample of races I ran this summer:

    June 20th - 10K: pace = 6:56

    July 18th - Half-Marathon: pace = 7:14

    These two times are comparable.

    Quoted message said:

    July 29th - XC 5K: pace = 6:50

    This is uninterpretable -- XC is always slow. How slow depends on the course.

    Quoted message said:

    September 5th - 10K: pace = 6:50

    Your best performance. Probably not surprising -- you should expect to run
    better in Sept than in July.

    You didn't say anything about the temperatures in these races -- this does
    have an effect on performance, especially in races 10k and up.

    Based on your times, I get about a 3:17 for your marathon, based on WAVA tables.
    Using the slightly weaker half marathon performance, I get about 3:18:30

    http://www.panix.com/~elflord/wava.html

    Quoted message said:

    The half-marathon course I ran in July is identical to the marathon
    course which I will be running on September 12th (except, of course,
    I'll be running two laps instead of one). In the half-marathon I ran
    at 7:30 pace for about the first half and then I ran negative splits
    for the remainder of the course, to average 7:14 (finish time was
    1:34). I have run progressively better personal best times in each my
    last three or four half marathons.

    A predicition based on your half marathon time should be fairly conservative,
    if the half marathon was run in warm weather and the marathon will be under
    cool conditions.

    On the other hand, if you have a warm weather marathon (and anything above
    60 is at least a little "warm"😉, the marathon will probably be even more
    affected by heat than the half.

    Cheers,
    --
    Donovan Rebbechi
    http://pegasus.rutgers.edu/~elflord/

  3. Quoted message said:

    Below you will find some information about my training and racing this
    summer, as well as some other miscellaneous data. I have relied on the
    Runner's World intermediate training program, and I have adhered to it
    pretty much religiously, including the tempo runs and the repeats. On
    cross-training days I have been mountain biking and road biking. Also,
    some basic stats about me: I am 34 years old, 5'10" tall, I weigh 153
    pounds, and I'm very healthy -- if you don't count the stress of my
    insane life. This is just background info to give you some
    perspective.

    I assume you've already plugged these values into a pace calculator, but
    this is what I got:

    Quoted message said:

    June 20th - 10K: pace = 6:56

    43:05 10K = 3:22:11 marathon

    Quoted message said:

    July 18th - Half-Marathon: pace = 7:14

    1:34:50 half marathon = 3:20:00 marathon

    Quoted message said:

    July 29th - XC 5K: pace = 6:50

    Too many variables in a xc race, IMO

    Quoted message said:

    September 5th - 10K: pace = 6:50

    42:27 10K = 3:19:13 marathon

    Quoted message said:

    3. Training:

    Most of my weekday training has been on a crushed limestone path and
    my long weekend runs have been on asphalt. My longest run took place 3
    weeks before the planned marathon – 22 miles – and I felt like I could
    have easily run another three or four miles. I also recovered very
    quickly from the 22-miler. All of my long training runs (everything
    over 10 miles) have been at a very relaxed pace of 9 minutes/mile. My
    shorter midweek runs are generally faster – anywhere between 7:30 and
    8:30 pace. Repeats, obviously, are run closer to my 5K pace. I have
    been injury-free throughout my entire training program this summer.

    I think the 2 most important factors in determining your marathon
    readiness are weekly mileage and long runs. You didn't state your weekly
    mileage or how many long runs in the 18+ mile range you have run.
    Everything else looks very good.

    Personally, I'm more of an over-prepared type of runner. My training and
    racing shows that I should be able to go sub 3:20, but I'm shooting for
    sub 3:30. I'm looking to qualify for Boston with a 3:30. Anything faster
    would be icing on the cake. So I'm being conservative in order to avoid
    blowing up.

    My racing times are very close to yours. My plan is to start at an
    8:00/mi pace and gradually make adjustments throughout so that I'm
    running the last 10K at a 7:38/mi pace.

    Phil M.

    --
    "Learn from the mistakes of others. You can't live long enough to make
    them all yourself." ­Martin Vanbee

  4. Jude A. Thomas said:

    I am running a marathon in a few days and I have not settled on a
    target pace. This will be my second marathon, although my first was
    quite a few years ago. If anyone is kind enough to offer some advice I
    would GREATLY appreciate it.


    Donovan and Phil have given you good advice. I came into my first
    marathon with similar 10K and
    1/2M times to you. I started off at 8min/mile pace and reached the 1/2
    way comfortably in 1:45.
    From there I was able to pick up the pace a bit through the second half
    and finish in 3:26.
    If you can run negative splits in a marathon, you should finish feeling
    good, and psychologically it is a
    great boost running past a lot of runners in the second half of the race.

    You don't say where the marathon is - but as Donovan pointed out, the
    weather conditions can play
    a big part. If the temps and/or humidity are high, you should consider
    targetting a slower pace.

    Otherwise it sounds like you know about good hydration. Personally I
    drink only sports drinks - making
    sure to drink 150-200 mls (5-7 ounces) every 15-20 minutes.

    Good luck - and let us know how it goes.

    Anthony.

  5. 7:30 pace should be do able.
    "Jude A. Thomas" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    Hi,

    I am running a marathon in a few days and I have not settled on a
    target pace. This will be my second marathon, although my first was
    quite a few years ago. If anyone is kind enough to offer some advice I
    would GREATLY appreciate it.

    Below you will find some information about my training and racing this
    summer, as well as some other miscellaneous data. I have relied on the
    Runner's World intermediate training program, and I have adhered to it
    pretty much religiously, including the tempo runs and the repeats. On
    cross-training days I have been mountain biking and road biking. Also,
    some basic stats about me: I am 34 years old, 5'10" tall, I weigh 153
    pounds, and I'm very healthy -- if you don't count the stress of my
    insane life. This is just background info to give you some
    perspective.

    1. Sample of races I ran this summer:

    June 20th - 10K: pace = 6:56

    July 18th - Half-Marathon: pace = 7:14

    July 29th - XC 5K: pace = 6:50

    September 5th - 10K: pace = 6:50

    The half-marathon course I ran in July is identical to the marathon
    course which I will be running on September 12th (except, of course,
    I'll be running two laps instead of one). In the half-marathon I ran
    at 7:30 pace for about the first half and then I ran negative splits
    for the remainder of the course, to average 7:14 (finish time was
    1:34). I have run progressively better personal best times in each my
    last three or four half marathons.

    2. History:

    I have only run one full marathon in the past: the 2000 Pittsburgh
    Marathon. My performance was sloppy in terms of pace and the heat was
    pretty bad - that was the year of the Olympic trials when it was
    pretty brutal. I ran a time of 4:08, and my splits were very uneven: I
    ran the first half at 7-something pace and the second half much more
    slowly. Otherwise, I did mostly the right things: I drank water
    regularly, consumed sports beverages with the water every 10-15
    minutes, and I didn't ever really bonk - I just slowed down a lot. I
    felt fine when I finished, albeit very hot and a little woozy.

    3. Training:

    Most of my weekday training has been on a crushed limestone path and
    my long weekend runs have been on asphalt. My longest run took place 3
    weeks before the planned marathon - 22 miles - and I felt like I could
    have easily run another three or four miles. I also recovered very
    quickly from the 22-miler. All of my long training runs (everything
    over 10 miles) have been at a very relaxed pace of 9 minutes/mile. My
    shorter midweek runs are generally faster - anywhere between 7:30 and
    8:30 pace. Repeats, obviously, are run closer to my 5K pace. I have
    been injury-free throughout my entire training program this summer.

    I'd appreciate your thoughts on what pace I should aim to set, and any
    other tips that you might have.

    Thank you very much!

  6. (Jude A. Thomas) said:

    I am running a marathon in a few days

    Good luck (althouth you're probably running it now). Let us know how it
    goes.

    Phil M.

    --
    "Learn from the mistakes of others. You can't live long enough to make
    them all yourself." ­Martin Vanbee

  7. THANK YOU ALL.

    I completed the marathon yesterday in 3:26:21. Temperatures were a
    little warmer than I had hoped (peaking at about 71 degress F), but
    not unreasonable. Arguably, I may have been a little too comfortable
    out there -- I never seriously suffered. However, I would probably
    have set my goals at even less-ambitious levels if not for your
    advice. Thanks you again.

    Jude

  8. (Jude A. Thomas) said:

    THANK YOU ALL.

    I completed the marathon yesterday in 3:26:21. Temperatures were a
    little warmer than I had hoped (peaking at about 71 degress F), but
    not unreasonable. Arguably, I may have been a little too comfortable
    out there -- I never seriously suffered. However, I would probably
    have set my goals at even less-ambitious levels if not for your
    advice. Thanks you again.

    You're welcome and congratulations. Now we just need a race report. Minimum
    of two pages double spaced. ;-)

    Phil M.

    --
    "Learn from the mistakes of others. You can't live long enough to make
    them all yourself." ­Martin Vanbee

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