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Back from being lost at sea (long report)

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General fitness, health and nutrition
Published
14 September 2004
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15 September 2004
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Doug Lerner
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  1. Hi, people. It's been a while since I posted - since May 26th when I set out
    for my one month trip to the U.S to be exact. Since then I have been having
    terrible problems sticking to just about any diet and have been pretty lost
    at sea.

    I think I may have finally found my sea legs, though, so thought I'd drop a
    line and say hello. It has been a topsy-turvy three-and-a-half months.

    May 26th
    --------
    After several weeks of "low cal, lower carb" dieting I am down to 109 kg and
    looking forward, with some trepidation, to a month's family and business
    trip to the U.S. - Boston, Columbia (MO) and New Orleans. I am wavering
    between whether to try to follow low cal or low carb during the trip and
    eventually opt for low carb because it seemed like less psychological
    pressure.

    May 26th - June 26th
    --------------------
    While I didn't have access to a scale for the entire month, I stayed on my
    diet surprisingly well. I was especially proud of myself when I was by
    myself, living in my Missouri house for two weeks, packing it up so I could
    rent it to neighbors. I shopped at the supermarket and ate only healthy
    foods, low-carb tortillas, simple things, an occasional all-you-can-eat
    place - but only low carb choices. I did have popcorn once at the movies
    though. But basically really good all month. Even in New Orleans for the
    week at a conference I was very good, occassionally doing the salad bar at
    nearby Hurrahs, but again choosing only the simplest, low carb foods with no
    sauces, etc.

    Note: I was surprised by two things while shopping for low-carb foods in the
    U.S. (1) Since last September, when I was last there, there seems to an
    *explosion* in the availability of low-carb food choices and (2) almost all
    the special low-carb foods are practically inedible! Really! They are mostly
    junk! The exception are those foods that are naturally low-carb by adding
    fiber, like low-carb tortillas. Those are actually pretty good.

    When I got back to Tokyo at the end of June I anxiously weighed myself. I
    was 112.5 kg.

    OK. I put on 3.5 kg over a month of traveling in the U.S. Not so bad I
    thought. It certainly could have been worse.

    Then, after being good while on travel for a month, I completely fell off
    the wagon! Agh!

    After that my journal is crazy.

    First week - ate lots of really bad stuff - donuts, fried foods. In less
    than a week I was up to 115 kg!

    2nd week - tried to go back on Atkins induction. Got back to 113 kg really
    quickly. Then I lost my will power and those fried donuts (really good!)
    beckoned to me again. Since I did them in I figured why not eat everything
    else in sight? Soon I was up to 116 kg!

    3rd week - Get ahold of yourself, Doug! Maybe it's time to count calories
    again. Tried this for a few days and got down to 114 kg. But I was hungry
    all the time, and had upset stomachs. So I went off my diet again and zoomed
    up to 117 kg! You can see the (dangerous) roller coaster pattern I was on by
    now.

    4th week - OK, I said to myself, obviously my body just cannot tolerate all
    those carbs. Better to stabalize blood sugar, etc., first and stick with
    Atkins. Went back on and dropped down to 113 again. Then, without going off
    low-carb, I started to creep up again... 114, 114.5, 115, 115.5,
    116....Feeling depressed I went off my diet again and zoomed up to 117.5 kg.

    5th week - Agh! OK, I said to myself, as much as I like low-carb eating I am
    just eating TOO MUCH. I can't violate conservation of energy. Better try
    low-cal again. Got down to 115 kg before losing will power again and zoomed
    up to 118 kg.

    6th week - Now I am completely convinced, again, that low-cal just doesn't
    work for me and I have to go back to low-carb.

    In the meantime, I am starting to notice joint pains I never had before -
    particular when I stand up and start walking again. Am I getting arthritis
    at 48?

    Anyway, this goes back and forth and back and forth and back and forth over
    the ensuing weeks. One week I'm convinced that low-cal is the only possible
    way of losing weight. The next week I'm convinced I can't stay on any diet
    but low-carb. Then I go off either and start gorging myself again.

    Finally, about 10 days ago, I reached the psychologically devastating weight
    of 119.5 kg - a full 10.5 kg more than what I weighed when I left for my
    trip and just a scale's tick away from 120 kg, which I definitely do not
    want to see again!

    My "diet cycles" over the last few months told me several things, but among
    them was that while low-carb dieting helps control my appetite to some
    extent, it eventually always brings me back to the 116-117 kg level. Granted
    that is better than my weight before starting to diet a year ago March - I
    was 131 kg then - it just isn't the way to go for the long run. Not if I
    really want to someday get to goal. My experience seems to be very common
    from what I read lately - low-carbing helps for about 6 months, but then it
    doesn't necessarily help in the long run.

    So I recommitted myself to low-calorie dieting 10 days ago. I decided to
    take it nice and slow and stick to an average of 2000 calories per day.
    Previously I had tried either 1800 or 1500 and just found it too confining.

    I also tried to think long and hard about which individual foods were giving
    me problems, without considering their carb contents per se. I discovered,
    to my surprise (and disappointment), that tofu seemed to be giving me
    digestive problems, so I dropped eating tofu, tofu milk, soybeans and other
    soybean-based products and have had no stomach problems since.

    The first 4 days of low-cal dieting were very hard. But then I noticed that
    appetite suppression kicked in, much like it does after 4 days of Atkins. In
    other words, I'm not really finding huge cravings right now even after
    eating something high carb, like an ear of corn.

    To "fill me up" when I get hungry I've stocked up on low-calorie soups and
    microwavable dishes in the 100-250 calorie range (yes, this includes rice
    and pasta dishes).

    My feeling is that at the end of the day I truly do believe in conservation
    of energy. I just *know* that if I can stick with low-calorie eating that I
    *must* eventually lose weight.

    The first 7 days I lost 4.5 kg = almost 10 lb. I was amazed. That was
    actually the largest first week weight loss I've ever experienced on any
    diet. Sure - it must have been a lot of water bloat. But it proves that you
    can also get dramatic initial weight losses by just counting calories and
    ignoring carbs completely.

    I'm down to 115 kg now. Still higher than when I got back, but safely pulled
    away from that dangerous 120 kg mark.

    And over the past week my joint pain has greatly abated. Last night, when
    walking Tao, I actually - couldn't believe it myself - *jogged* part of the
    course. It was just a short distance, but I felt like moving faster and
    running. Maybe I'll get some good running shoes. Who knows?

    I also, to be honest, feel less lethargic than when just on low-carb. Less
    brain fog too. I think, maybe, that healthy carbs are maybe not so bad for
    the body after all. They might be good for you! I'm not eating sweet things
    at all at any rate - mostly because they are too high in calorie, not
    because they are high in carbs. In other words, a low-calorie diet also
    seems to naturally control carbs to some degree. (The reverse isn't true
    though - when you just count carbs it is *easy* to eat way too many
    calories! That's the exact same problem that a low-fat diet has.)

    Anyway, that's where I am right now. These last 10 days are the first time
    since I've been back where I finally feel like I have things under some sort
    of control again. My food basket at the supermarket even looks healthy:
    vegies, sometimes fruits, fish, cottage cheese, tomato juice (for homemade
    sauce), low cal heat-up packages... No saturated-fat filled packages of
    bacon or chicken skin or Camembert cheese or all those things I would snack
    on while low-carbing.

    The variety is actually thrilling. I even ate at Wendy's last week with a
    friend and had a spicy chicken filet sandwich (317 calories) and a Caesers
    salad (137 calories), all dutifully recorded.

    Yes, it's too early to predict what will happen now. But you have to keep on
    trying, right? And I'm just happy I stopped myself from gaining all my
    weight back!

    Doug

  2. Ignoramus13229 wrote:
    || Doug, it is always interesting to see these human stories of struggle
    || with weight. Just two things that I want to say, one, low carb and
    || low cal are not incompatible -- one could eat low calorie while at
    || the
    || same time eating low carb,

    As far as most people are concerned, the two, imo, are the same for weight
    loss.

    and two, bacon contains only 1/3 of its
    || fat as saturated, 2/3 of bacon fat is not saturated.
    ||
    || Also, you mentioned stable blood sugars in passing. If you are really
    || a diabetic or a pre-diabetic, keeping blood sugar stable is very
    || important, because unstable blood sugar causes terrible
    || complications. So, I would give this issue more than a passing
    || reference.

    Yes, a low-calorie high carb diet might be trouble. It depends.

  3. Thanks for your reply!

    Yes - I know that low carb and low cal are not necessarily incompatible.
    Well, at least low cal and *lower* carb are not. I think it would be very
    hard to eat low cal and keep carbs at, say, under 30 gm per day!

    I didn't realize that about bacon fat. Interesting.

    About blood sugar - I am a bit worried about that. A year ago March I
    started Atkins after a diabetes scare - symptoms, blood sugar over 200, A1C
    of 10.6. After a time on low carb it came under control - blood sugar about
    100, AIC of just 4.6, etc.

    I wish I had something to measure my blood sugar without running over to the
    hospital all the time. That is the only thing I am worried about.

    Surely, though, I can get the blood sugar control benefits of low carb by
    just sticking to low glycemic index foods, rather than low carb foods, can't
    I?

    Thanks,

    doug

    Ignoramus13229 said:

    Doug, it is always interesting to see these human stories of struggle
    with weight. Just two things that I want to say, one, low carb and low
    cal are not incompatible -- one could eat low calorie while at the
    same time eating low carb, and two, bacon contains only 1/3 of its fat
    as saturated, 2/3 of bacon fat is not saturated.

    Also, you mentioned stable blood sugars in passing. If you are really
    a diabetic or a pre-diabetic, keeping blood sugar stable is very
    important, because unstable blood sugar causes terrible
    complications. So, I would give this issue more than a passing reference.

    i

  4. Doug Lerner said:

    Hi, people. It's been a while since I posted - since May 26th when I
    set out for my one month trip to the U.S to be exact. Since then I
    have been having terrible problems sticking to just about any diet
    and have been pretty lost at sea.


    [snipped remainder]

    Good luck to you, Doug - I hope you find a path that works for you. I would
    naively think that low-cal and (relatively) high carb would be a fairly easy
    diet to follow in Japan. At any rate, I lost a bunch of weight in law
    school on a low-cal high-carb way of eating - I was doing weight watchers,
    and I would save points for carby study snacks every night - it wasn't an
    impossible way to live and worked until I went off plan. Good luck figuring
    it all out.

    --
    carla
    http://geekofalltrades.typepad.com/geek

  5. Doug Lerner wrote:

    || I
    || think it would be very hard to eat low cal and keep carbs at, say,
    || under 30 gm per day!
    ||

    Why?

  6. "Doug Lerner" <[email hidden]> ha scritto nel messaggio
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    Hi, people. It's been a while since I posted - since May 26th when I set


    out

    Quoted message said:

    for my one month trip to the U.S to be exact.

    Hi Doug, welcome back!

    Quoted message said:

    The first 7 days I lost 4.5 kg = almost 10 lb.

    Congrats, that's quite an initial weight loss!

    Quoted message said:

    when you just count carbs it is *easy* to eat way too many
    calories!

    It's just the opposite for me! I'm mainly (moderately) low-carbing, and if I
    want to stick to my desired daily carb intake (in the range or 40-50 grams
    of carbs a day), my calorie intake is always low (in the 1200ies). Then I
    try to up the caloric intake a bit and always get above my carb budget. I'm
    still (re-) learning to balance that.
    Another confirmation that different things work for different people, I
    guess 🙂

    Quoted message said:

    And I'm just happy I stopped myself from gaining all my
    weight back!

    That certainly deserves a big pat on the back (I never managed to do that,
    personally. I somehow never realize that I'm not only +2 kg above my goal
    weight, but much, much more 🙁

    WTG for realizing what the problem was and fixing it straight away!

    Elly

  7. "Doug Lerner" <[email hidden]> ha scritto nel messaggio
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:

    I wish I had something to measure my blood sugar without running over to


    the

    Quoted message said:

    hospital all the time. That is the only thing I am worried about.

    What you can do is buy those urine sticks (like keto-sticks) that check for
    glucose in the urine. The bottle usually has the chart so you can tell
    easily (by comparing the stick to the chart/color on the box) if your
    *urine* glucose level is elevated. If it is, that's a good time to go to the
    hospital and have your *blood* sugar levels
    controlled.
    Here (Italy) we buy those urine sticks in the pharmacy, I'm sure you can get
    them without the prescription where you are as well.

    Elly

  8. if your suffering from joint pain (would it be gout?) then a low carb
    way of dieting i find tends to aggravate that condition. it may just be
    that my protein intake was way very high but it was definately the low
    carb diet i went on that triggered severe gout in me a few years back.

  9. On 9/14/04 8:42 PM, in article [email hidden], "Roger

    Zoul said:

    Doug Lerner wrote:

    || I
    || think it would be very hard to eat low cal and keep carbs at, say,
    || under 30 gm per day!
    ||

    Why?


    Because with very low carbs the only foods left are higher fat, thus higher
    calorie, foods.

    doug

  10. On 9/14/04 9:30 PM, in article [email hidden],

    jas said:

    if your suffering from joint pain (would it be gout?) then a low carb
    way of dieting i find tends to aggravate that condition. it may just be
    that my protein intake was way very high but it was definately the low
    carb diet i went on that triggered severe gout in me a few years back.

    The joint pain in my big toe joint is almost certainly gout. The new pain at
    my hip I'm not sure about. But both are relatively abated this week.

    The toe pain I've been feeling off and on for like 15 years though!

    doug

  11. Ignoramus13229 said:
    In article said:

    On 9/14/04 8:42 PM, in article [email hidden], "Roger

    Zoul said:

    Doug Lerner wrote:

    || I
    || think it would be very hard to eat low cal and keep carbs at, say,
    || under 30 gm per day!
    ||

    Why?


    Because with very low carbs the only foods left are higher fat, thus higher
    calorie, foods.

    There are also vegetables, of which you could eat a lot! For example,
    cabbage, 5 g of carbs per cup. Or spinach, which is nearly calorie
    free, etc.

    It's hard to imagine munching on spinach and cabbage as main snacks for
    years at a time though. But your point is well taken. 🙂

    doug

  12. Doug Lerner wrote:
    || On 9/14/04 8:42 PM, in article [email hidden],
    || "Roger Zoul" <[email hidden]> wrote:
    ||
    ||| Doug Lerner wrote:
    |||
    ||||| I
    ||||| think it would be very hard to eat low cal and keep carbs at, say,
    ||||| under 30 gm per day!
    |||||
    |||
    ||| Why?
    |||
    |||
    || Because with very low carbs the only foods left are higher fat, thus
    || higher calorie, foods.
    ||

    Not true at all. Veggie? And even if you eat high fat foods, just don't eat
    so much. I've done low cal, low carb many, many times.

  13. Doug Lerner wrote:
    || On 9/14/04 10:32 PM, in article [email hidden],
    || "Ignoramus13229" <[email hidden]> wrote:
    ||
    ||| In article <[email hidden]>, Doug Lerner wrote:
    |||| On 9/14/04 8:42 PM, in article [email hidden],
    |||| "Roger Zoul" <[email hidden]> wrote:
    ||||
    ||||| Doug Lerner wrote:
    |||||
    ||||||| I
    ||||||| think it would be very hard to eat low cal and keep carbs at,
    ||||||| say, under 30 gm per day!
    |||||||
    |||||
    ||||| Why?
    |||||
    |||||
    |||| Because with very low carbs the only foods left are higher fat,
    |||| thus higher calorie, foods.
    ||||
    |||
    ||| There are also vegetables, of which you could eat a lot! For
    ||| example, cabbage, 5 g of carbs per cup. Or spinach, which is nearly
    ||| calorie
    ||| free, etc.
    |||
    ||
    || It's hard to imagine munching on spinach and cabbage as main snacks
    || for
    || years at a time though. But your point is well taken. 🙂

    Years at a time? If the objective is to low weight (the main reason for a
    low cal diet) then there is no need to do it for years at a time. Perhaps
    you need to lose the notion that low carb means high calorie. It's not true.

  14. Ignoramus13229 wrote:
    || In article <[email hidden]>, Doug Lerner wrote:
    ||| Thanks for your reply!
    |||
    ||| Yes - I know that low carb and low cal are not necessarily
    ||| incompatible. Well, at least low cal and *lower* carb are not. I
    ||| think it would be very hard to eat low cal and keep carbs at, say,
    ||| under 30 gm per day!
    ||
    || I guess that what is and what is not hard depends on the person, but,
    || when I think of "low cal", I think about relatively small calorie
    || deficit, say 1000 calories per day.

    You consider a 1000-calorie per day deficit small? Perhaps I'm
    misunderstanding you.

  15. In article <[email hidden]>, Doug Lerner <[email hidden]>

    Quoted message said:

    On 9/14/04 8:42 PM, in article [email hidden], "Roger

    Zoul said:

    Doug Lerner wrote:

    || I
    || think it would be very hard to eat low cal and keep carbs at, say,
    || under 30 gm per day!
    ||

    Why?


    Because with very low carbs the only foods left are higher fat, thus higher
    calorie, foods.

    doug

    Not true. An egg, for example, generally has less than 100 calories.
    Three eggs is a filling meal. A grilled chicken breast is low-fat, as are
    many low-carb vegetables. I was easily able to stay under 1500 calories
    and 20-30g carbs.

    --
    Michelle Levin
    http://www.mindspring.com/~lunachick

    I have only 3 flaws. My first flaw is thinking that I only have 3 flaws.

  16. Luna wrote:
    || In article <[email hidden]>, Doug Lerner
    || <[email hidden]> wrote:
    ||
    ||| On 9/14/04 8:42 PM, in article [email hidden],
    ||| "Roger Zoul" <[email hidden]> wrote:
    |||
    |||| Doug Lerner wrote:
    ||||
    |||||| I
    |||||| think it would be very hard to eat low cal and keep carbs at,
    |||||| say, under 30 gm per day!
    ||||||
    ||||
    |||| Why?
    ||||
    ||||
    ||| Because with very low carbs the only foods left are higher fat,
    ||| thus higher calorie, foods.
    |||
    ||| doug
    |||
    ||
    || Not true. An egg, for example, generally has less than 100 calories.
    || Three eggs is a filling meal. A grilled chicken breast is low-fat,
    || as are many low-carb vegetables. I was easily able to stay under
    || 1500 calories
    || and 20-30g carbs.

    Not only that, but low cal eating on low carb is the best way to do it for
    most, because of appetite suppression. Doing low cal on low fat would be a
    nightmare for most.

  17. "Ignoramus13229" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    Do they sell "finger [censored]" blood sugar monitors in Italy? They are
    very convenient and more accurate, although, possibly, cost a bit
    more.

    The problem is that urine sticks only work if you're past the threshold
    where glucose spills into the urine. IIRC, it's around 180. That's a value
    some diabetics do not even reach at the time of diagnosis. The urine sticks
    only work as an alarm signal. Their main use is for T1 (or way out of
    control T2) to check for ketoacidosis (ketones + glucose in urine = bad
    news, emergency situation).

  18. "Doug Lerner" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    On 9/14/04 9:30 PM, in article


    [email hidden],

    Quoted message said:
    jas said:

    if your suffering from joint pain (would it be gout?) then a low carb
    way of dieting i find tends to aggravate that condition. it may just be
    that my protein intake was way very high but it was definately the low
    carb diet i went on that triggered severe gout in me a few years back.

    The joint pain in my big toe joint is almost certainly gout. The new pain


    at

    Quoted message said:

    my hip I'm not sure about. But both are relatively abated this week.

    The toe pain I've been feeling off and on for like 15 years though!

    Weight loss seems to lower the uric acid amount in the bloodstream (I wonder
    what is not positively affected by weight loss). I had some joint pain, and
    the kind of rough looking deposit on the big toe that is a sign of uric
    acid, but this has completely disappeared with the lost pounds (both the
    deposit and pain). My initial blood record showed a slightly elevated uric
    acid concentration, and this was well into weight loss, so it must have been
    *much* higher in the past. I'm still a meat and protein eater, so the drop
    is mostly from portion control and weight loss. It seems having slightly
    elevated values is also a consequence of the weight loss process...
    Best way is to get tested for uric acid and try to see how the values are
    moving for you with your diet. Drinking more (and using carbonnated water)
    seems to help too...

  19. My fave is raw cauliflower.

    In news:[email hidden],
    Ignoramus13229 <[email hidden]> stated
    |
    | maybe one could switch between vegetables, cabbage for some time,
    | spinach for some time etc. Find something that works... I like cabbage
    | and tomatoes, personally, someone else might like something else...
    |
    | i

  20. Doug,

    NO! You cannot get the blood sugar benefits from low glycemic carbs because
    anyone with a meter finds very quickly that many of the "low glycemic" carbs
    push up blood sugar very high. Plus, one serving of some of the supposedly
    "low glycemic" foods can easily contain 20 -60 grams or more of carbs and
    send your blood sugar up for many hours. In fact, all the "slowness" of the
    carb means is that it takes longer to hit the bloodstream and LONGER TO
    EXIT. It will still provoke an insulin response and since you have had
    diabetic blood sugars in the past, it is likely you are spiking to dangerous
    levels when eating some of these foods.

    Get someone in the US to mail you an $8 Relion meter from Wal-Mart and a $40
    box of 100 strips and start testing your blood sugar 1 hour after you eat a
    food. You'll quickly find out which foods push up your blood sugar. I've
    seen some of the highest readings ever with foods that are supposedly "low
    glycemic" most notably chickpeas.

    --Jenny - Low Carbing for 5 years. Below goal for weight. Type 2 diabetes,
    hba1c 5.7 .
    Cut the carbs to respond to my email address!

    Jenny's new site: What they Don't Tell You About Diabetes
    http://www.geocities.com/lottadata4u/

    Jenny's Low Carb Diet Facts & Figures
    http://www.geocities.com/jenny_the_bean/

    Looking for help controlling your blood sugar?
    Visit http://www.alt-support-diabetes.org/Newly%20Diagnosed.htm

    "Doug Lerner" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    Thanks for your reply!

    Yes - I know that low carb and low cal are not necessarily incompatible.
    Well, at least low cal and *lower* carb are not. I think it would be very
    hard to eat low cal and keep carbs at, say, under 30 gm per day!

    I didn't realize that about bacon fat. Interesting.

    About blood sugar - I am a bit worried about that. A year ago March I
    started Atkins after a diabetes scare - symptoms, blood sugar over 200,


    A1C

    Quoted message said:

    of 10.6. After a time on low carb it came under control - blood sugar


    about

    Quoted message said:

    100, AIC of just 4.6, etc.

    I wish I had something to measure my blood sugar without running over to


    the

    Quoted message said:

    hospital all the time. That is the only thing I am worried about.

    Surely, though, I can get the blood sugar control benefits of low carb by
    just sticking to low glycemic index foods, rather than low carb foods,


    can't

    Quoted message said:

    I?

    Thanks,

    doug

    Ignoramus13229 said:

    Doug, it is always interesting to see these human stories of struggle
    with weight. Just two things that I want to say, one, low carb and low
    cal are not incompatible -- one could eat low calorie while at the
    same time eating low carb, and two, bacon contains only 1/3 of its fat
    as saturated, 2/3 of bacon fat is not saturated.

    Also, you mentioned stable blood sugars in passing. If you are really
    a diabetic or a pre-diabetic, keeping blood sugar stable is very
    important, because unstable blood sugar causes terrible
    complications. So, I would give this issue more than a passing


    reference.

    Quoted message said:
    Quoted message said:


    i


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