Sharon : The Temple Mount

davidmc said:

Something must be seriously wrong if the american public elect's the guy who lost all three debates. It baffles the mind. Especially after all of the scandals-Cheney war profiteering, abu-ghraib, 400 ton's of explosives turn up missing , Bremer's announcement that the US military was woefully inadequete in #'s, Gen. Clark's statement that bush had him looking for evidence on iraq that was'nt there in the 1st place, babylonian museum looted due to inadequete planning , bush's utter inability to speak the english language-by any standard, cozying up to the religious right w/ the marriage amendment; which was just a sacrificial lamb that they knew would'nt pass anyway, bush's gutting of the clean air act, cheney allowing energy buisiness leader's & lobbyist's to write energy legislation, cheney using scare tactic's to get people to vote for their party, the bush family's long history of dealing w/ the bin-laden's, ect...

Yes, It all stinks. President Putin and the Russian Government have signed up to the Kyoto global problem of reducing pollution on the land and in the air. What did the aMerkins do? Walk out of it all. I've said before, and I'll say it again, the most precious commodity on earth is clean water. The first areas to blow it will be Californian agriculture, the populations of San Francisco, and the second biggest city San Diego. No use doing rain dances, the indigenous population were systematically murdered a long time ago. Have you checked out Halliburton, possibly Haliburton. The reconstruction of Iraq? Hey listen, you can come and live in Europe anytime. Any chance that the Trekkie might foff to the planet Kraptonite and sell some snake oil and bibles to his non existent clients. Steer 8479473412 Mister Spock to the star God. Sorry Captain, it's not on my coordinates. You're information is corrupted Mister Spock, president Bush says that's his guiding light, and he's never wrong. Sorry Captain I can assure you that there is no God. A universe. Yes. That's enough of that for the moment Mister Spock, I must check out brainwashing.

FredC said:

Yes, It all stinks. President Putin and the Russian Government have signed up to the Kyoto global problem of reducing pollution on the land and in the air. What did the aMerkins do? Walk out of it all. I've said before, and I'll say it again, the most precious commodity on earth is clean water. The first areas to blow it will be Californian agriculture, the populations of San Francisco, and the second biggest city San Diego. No use doing rain dances, the indigenous population were systematically murdered a long time ago. Have you checked out Halliburton, possibly Haliburton. The reconstruction of Iraq? Hey listen, you can come and live in Europe anytime. Any chance that the Trekkie might foff to the planet Kraptonite and sell some snake oil and bibles to his non existent clients. Steer 8479473412 Mister Spock to the star God. Sorry Captain, it's not on my coordinates. You're information is corrupted Mister Spock, president Bush says that's his guiding light, and he's never wrong. Sorry Captain I can assure you that there is no God. A universe. Yes. That's enough of that for the moment Mister Spock, I must check out brainwashing.

Brilliant, I'd ride bikes, w/ you & Lim, anytime. I suspect Marion, bertie, & luftie ride, either-gasoline engine powered bikes, electric bikes or trikes :p

Trekker2017 said:

I do not think that Israel should exists - in it's present location.
And it's not pointless to raise this issue because it is evident that the vast majority of posters, either through a lack of knowledge of history or willfull intent to distort history, are not aware of the Balfour Declaration, 1948 Jewish/Israeli atrocities and ongoing atrocities against the Palestinian people.

You don't think Israel should exist; I happen to feel that its existance is the fulfullment of Biblical prophecy. Just the way I happen to believe that the EU is the Ten-Toed kingdom from the Book of Daniel. Now, according to the Bible, the only way to prove that a prophet is a prophet is to see if his prophecies come true. According to my count, the fact that Israel does exist adds credence to Jeremiah and Daniel. And as far as the Balfour Declaration goes, it has as much relevancy as anything the US might have written and signed about Iraq. Whatever we set up, the Iraqis will redo when and if we leave no matter what kinds of documents or media gripping names we give them. So there is and was no reason to expect the "native" population to hold to an agreement named for an Englishman. Who would expect the Iraqis to hold to an agreement called "The Bush Declaration"?

There is a reason for everything that is happening now. Where you see a world of random acts, I see a world spinning on a collision course with an ending that was written for it when time began.[/QUOTE]

First of all, before you make a rebuttal argument - you should read the statement of the person holding the opposing view.

I said and I quote " I do not think that Israel should exists - in it's present location.
You contended that I said that Israel shouldn';t exist at all and then you go on to quote how the creation of Israel conforms to your interpretation of the Bible !

Your interpretation of the Bible, is your view.
And with all due respect, not knowing what theological/religious viewpoint you hold, precludes me from affording your view any merit, at this point.
(This is not my attempt at insulting you, by the way).

I am sure that we could all take modern events and retrospectively state that
the Bible foretold these events happening.

Bit like the Rapture crowd that believe that Armageddon will be the location
for the arrival of the Messiah.
The Bible can be manipulated to exonerate and/or endorse everything and anything.

Trekker2017 said:

I do not think that Israel should exists - in it's present location.
And it's not pointless to raise this issue because it is evident that the vast majority of posters, either through a lack of knowledge of history or willfull intent to distort history, are not aware of the Balfour Declaration, 1948 Jewish/Israeli atrocities and ongoing atrocities against the Palestinian people.

You don't think Israel should exist; I happen to feel that its existance is the fulfullment of Biblical prophecy. Just the way I happen to believe that the EU is the Ten-Toed kingdom from the Book of Daniel. Now, according to the Bible, the only way to prove that a prophet is a prophet is to see if his prophecies come true. According to my count, the fact that Israel does exist adds credence to Jeremiah and Daniel. And as far as the Balfour Declaration goes, it has as much relevancy as anything the US might have written and signed about Iraq. Whatever we set up, the Iraqis will redo when and if we leave no matter what kinds of documents or media gripping names we give them. So there is and was no reason to expect the "native" population to hold to an agreement named for an Englishman. Who would expect the Iraqis to hold to an agreement called "The Bush Declaration"?

There is a reason for everything that is happening now. Where you see a world of random acts, I see a world spinning on a collision course with an ending that was written for it when time began.[/QUOTE]
That waccy baccy you smoke, can you send me some before you transubstantiate back to your planet of Kraptonite? The book of Denial, lions dens and liars lairs. La di da di da can you come back for our production of the musical. Fiddler on the Roof, my cousin Stella is producing it (honestly) it's always a sell-out. I think she's done it 6-7 times. The only problem is that when it rains all the houses get full of water.

First of all, before you make a rebuttal argument - you should read the statement of the person holding the opposing view.

I said and I quote " I do not think that Israel should exists - in it's present location.
You contended that I said that Israel shouldn';t exist at all and then you go on to quote how the creation of Israel conforms to your interpretation of the Bible !

Your interpretation of the Bible, is your view.
And with all due respect, not knowing what theological/religious viewpoint you hold, precludes me from affording your view any merit, at this point.
(This is not my attempt at insulting you, by the way).

I am sure that we could all take modern events and retrospectively state that
the Bible foretold these events happening.

Bit like the Rapture crowd that believe that Armageddon will be the location
for the arrival of the Messiah.
The Bible can be manipulated to exonerate and/or endorse everything and anything.[/QUOTE]

No. I read your full statement but the parenthetical "in its present location" to me was kind of extraneous since historically, there is no other location where it could exist. It's like the native Americans in the mid-west. They are claiming (and rightly so) that the United States Government has never upheld the terms of the 1869 treaty which was the only treaty that the senate actually signed. Therefore they are petitioning for the return of what would amount to the territory of three states. Now are they legally correct? Yes. Does anyone expect the United States Government to order several million people to vacate their homes and cities to allow the native Americans to move back? No.

By the way... doesn't it just tweek your interest at all that the major armies of the world have already found some reason to converge in an area that is not all that far from the valley of Meggedo (sp) where the battle of Armageddon is to take place?

davidmc said:

Brilliant, I'd ride bikes, w/ you & Lim, anytime. I suspect Marion, bertie, & luftie ride, either-gasoline engine powered bikes, electric bikes or trikes :p

I might be wrong but I think that they are wind powered from the rear end.

Quoted post said:

By the way... doesn't it just tweek your interest at all that the major armies of the world have already found some reason to converge in an area that is not all that far from the valley of Meggedo (sp) where the battle of Armageddon is to take place?

So, logically it would follow, dubya would be the Antichrist; ascending to power. Come on, enough w/ the end-times prophecies. You believe in the rapture like Reagan did 😕 . Assertions like that remove all rational thought from a discussion. You are, probably, in the wrong forum. You want-end times.com :p You might be pushing the envelop , irt: the appropriateness of religious post's. Your literal interpretations are disquieting

Trekker2017 said:

First of all, before you make a rebuttal argument - you should read the statement of the person holding the opposing view.

I said and I quote " I do not think that Israel should exists - in it's present location.
You contended that I said that Israel shouldn';t exist at all and then you go on to quote how the creation of Israel conforms to your interpretation of the Bible !

Your interpretation of the Bible, is your view.
And with all due respect, not knowing what theological/religious viewpoint you hold, precludes me from affording your view any merit, at this point.
(This is not my attempt at insulting you, by the way).

I am sure that we could all take modern events and retrospectively state that
the Bible foretold these events happening.

Bit like the Rapture crowd that believe that Armageddon will be the location
for the arrival of the Messiah.
The Bible can be manipulated to exonerate and/or endorse everything and anything.

No. I read your full statement but the parenthetical "in its present location" to me was kind of extraneous since historically, there is no other location where it could exist. It's like the native Americans in the mid-west. They are claiming (and rightly so) that the United States Government has never upheld the terms of the 1869 treaty which was the only treaty that the senate actually signed. Therefore they are petitioning for the return of what would amount to the territory of three states. Now are they legally correct? Yes. Does anyone expect the United States Government to order several million people to vacate their homes and cities to allow the native Americans to move back? No.

By the way... doesn't it just tweek your interest at all that the major armies of the world have already found some reason to converge in an area that is not all that far from the valley of Meggedo (sp) where the battle of Armageddon is to take place?[/QUOTE]
Right so, Have you decided who is going to be in charge of Armageddon, will it be you or George. Tweek is spelled Tweak [censored]. You are not providing anything useful to this thread, so why don't you go and reload your hubble bubble.

davidmc said:

So, logically it would follow, dubya would be the Antichrist; ascending to power. Come on, enough w/ the end-times prophecies. You believe in the rapture like Reagan did 😕 . Assertions like that remove all rational thought from a discussion. You are, probably, in the wrong forum. You want-end times.com :p You might be pushing the envelop , irt: the appropriateness of religious post's. Your literal interpretations are disquieting

Well he might be the antichrist, but god is on his side. I've got a bit lost here. Must have a couple pulls on the pipe.

davidmc said:

Brilliant, I'd ride bikes, w/ you & Lim, anytime. I suspect Marion, bertie, & luftie ride, either-gasoline engine powered bikes, electric bikes or trikes :p

You must be blind from the drugs you take to excess. See that avatar?? Yes, that me on one of my recent races. Real racing for points, money and bragging rights.

If your synapses are not fried from the toxins you find pleasurable, you would remember me talking about Mt. Evans. I can rest assured there is nothing like that in the present day United Kingdom, Ireland included. Call me when you can exert over 250 Watts above the treeline for at least one hour.

Its been over 4 years since I have ridden a motorcycle.

Trekker2017 said:

By the way... doesn't it just tweek your interest at all that the major armies of the world have already found some reason to converge in an area that is not all that far from the valley of Meggedo (sp) where the battle of Armageddon is to take place?

The only army converging in that region is the USA and it appears that they're being dispatched almost as quickly.

Invoking the Bible to underpin a claim to create a country is a novel approach.

As regards the end of the world - every sort of lunatic has been "predicting" the end of time 1000 AD, 1500 AD, 2000 AD.
All wrong needless to say.
Interesting though that the basis for these erroneous predictions were also
derived from the Good Book.

I won't be going to you for betting advice - needless to say.

davidmc said:

So, logically it would follow, dubya would be the Antichrist; ascending to power. Come on, enough w/ the end-times prophecies. You believe in the rapture like Reagan did 😕 . Assertions like that remove all rational thought from a discussion. You are, probably, in the wrong forum. You want-end times.com :p You might be pushing the envelop , irt: the appropriateness of religious post's. Your literal interpretations are disquieting

He could be. I never said that I supported him. I am saying that he is being manipulated by a higher power. As to being in the wrong forum, blame Limerickman, he started this thread. I'm just a Bible reading cyclist.

Trekker2017 said:

He could be. I never said that I supported him. I am saying that he is being manipulated by a higher power. As to being in the wrong forum, blame Limerickman, he started this thread. I'm just a Bible reading cyclist.

I beleive he started it to address whether or not Arafat could be buried in jeruselum (?) because Sharon said he would'nt allow it. As far as bush goes, he can do whatever he want's, in regard to religion, it just appears seemly to bandi it about in public. Does'nt the N.T. advocate praying in private ? His actions just solidify the islamist leaning terrorist's beliefs that this is a holy war & increase their recruiting #'s. As long as bush can convince people to enlist & then go to iraq, i guess he won't be worried about the inappropriateness of his statement's, especially when they don't represent all american's.

When he finally dies, strap him to a wheelchair and toss him over the rails of a cruise ship in the Med.

Trekker2017 said:

He could be. I never said that I supported him. I am saying that he is being manipulated by a higher power. As to being in the wrong forum, blame Limerickman, he started this thread. I'm just a Bible reading cyclist.

Why don't you just pedal off back to planet Kraptonite, and do your bible thumping away from us, and just before you go, tell us what it says about Yasser being buried on Temple Mount.

FredC said:

Why don't you just pedal off back to planet Kraptonite, and do your bible thumping away from us, and just before you go, tell us what it says about Yasser being buried on Temple Mount.

Boy, I touched a nerve with you, didn't I. Can't say that it matters to me one way or the other. If my beliefs make you squirm, that's your problem, not mine.

As far as Arafat is concerned. The ecumenical thing to do would be to bury him on the Temple Mount. But since the Israelies are anything but ecumenical, I seriously doubt that will happen. One of the racial traits that reoccurs time and time again in the Old Testament is the call for Jews to be xenophobic. Their troubles and punishments have all stemmed from their failure to become so. That they are building a wall is hardly surprising based on this particular racial trait. I can foresee a day when they have completely walled themselves in and then tear down the Churches and Mosques on Temple Mount and reconstruct a new Temple. They are already looking for the red heifer to sacrifice on the new altar.

davidmc said:

I beleive he started it to address whether or not Arafat could be buried in jeruselum (?) because Sharon said he would'nt allow it. As far as bush goes, he can do whatever he want's, in regard to religion, it just appears seemly to bandi it about in public. Does'nt the N.T. advocate praying in private ? His actions just solidify the islamist leaning terrorist's beliefs that this is a holy war & increase their recruiting #'s. As long as bush can convince people to enlist & then go to iraq, i guess he won't be worried about the inappropriateness of his statement's, especially when they don't represent all american's.

You only pray in private if you want God to answer your prayers. If you want the people to answer your payers (and vote for you), you had better pray on prime-time TV. By doing so, Bush was able to solidify the populist right which has come to out weigh the liberal left at the voting booth. Take a look at Ohio for example. The Democrats were so sure that because of all the jobs lost in the state, the unemployed would vote for Kerry. Yet, President Bush has never ordered a company to take its business out of the country. Senator Kerry's wife (through her Heinz company holdings) has. I read a bottle of ketsup the other day and it said, Heinz - Canada. I can remember a day that used to say Heinz - USA. Kerry had the power to win the election. All he had to do was to say that he was ordering his wife to bring all of Heinz holdings back to the United States. It would have created hundreds of thousands of new jobs in an instant and given the anti-NAFTRA people a new hero. It would have been worth millions of votes especially in that block of red states in the mid-west and the south.

davidmc said:

Something must be seriously wrong if the american public elect's the guy who lost all three debates. It baffles the mind. Especially after all of the scandals-Cheney war profiteering, abu-ghraib, 400 ton's of explosives turn up missing , Bremer's announcement that the US military was woefully inadequete in #'s, Gen. Clark's statement that bush had him looking for evidence on iraq that was'nt there in the 1st place, babylonian museum looted due to inadequete planning , bush's utter inability to speak the english language-by any standard, cozying up to the religious right w/ the marriage amendment; which was just a sacrificial lamb that they knew would'nt pass anyway, bush's gutting of the clean air act, cheney allowing energy buisiness leader's & lobbyist's to write energy legislation, cheney using scare tactic's to get people to vote for their party, the bush family's long history of dealing w/ the bin-laden's, ect...

Bush did exactly what he needed to do to get re-elected -- he played up to the crumbling middle class. The problem with the liberal elitists is that you only maintain your elite status by keeping your numbers small. You can't win an election with small numbers. By collapsing the middle class and not absorbing it, the left has driven them into the arms of the populist right and they tend to be very conservative. Bush literally speaks their language. It's the good ol' boy style of speaking you hear down at the local diner where more people eat than at Chez Maurice.

limerickman said:

Todays Guardian Newspaper carries a report about General Ariel Sharon and his thoughts about the possible burial site of Yassar Arafat.

Specifically, Arafat's people want him to be buried in Jersusalem on the Temple Mount.
General Sharon objects, stating that, "The Temple Mount is reserved as a burial site for worthy people such as Jewish Kings -and not terrorists".

As always when that lot speak - one has to be careful to remember that one doesn't get the full truth, when they speak.

1991.

1991 - so what ?

1991 - a British businessman called Robert Maxwell died, apparently after falling off his yacht, on the Spanish Coast.

Robert Maxwell - who's real name was Jan Koch - was a business man who owned the biggest selling newspaper in Britain "The Daily Mirror" and other
substantial business interests.
Maxwell though raided his employees pension fund and stole £500 million (Sterling) from that fund - leaving pensioned employees with nothing for their retirement and many of whom are now impoverished.

Maxwell was given a State funeral in Israel (in 1991), as he was Jewish, and is buried on the Temple Mount with - and get this - "all of the other righteous Jews".
Seems General Sharon has forgotten this small issue.

Hypocrisy - don't you just love it ?

I just want to give Limerickman a pat on the back. I don't agree with him a lot of the time, but he always posts something that we can get our teeth into or into each other.

Quoted post said:

I can remember a day that used to say Heinz - USA. Kerry had the power to win the election. All he had to do was to say that he was ordering his wife to bring all of Heinz holdings back to the United States. It would have created hundreds of thousands of new jobs in an instant and given the anti-NAFTRA people a new hero. It would have been worth millions of votes especially in that block of red states in the mid-west and the south.

Crushing tomatoes, adding a pinch of salt & some sugar; putting the resulting amalgam in a glass jar pay's how much 😕