Are front panniers really necessary?

Dave Knott said:

Still planning my big west coast adventure, and I've run into a major snag...

...

Quoted message said:

So now I'm faced with three choices:
(1) Do the trip without front panniers and make do with rear panniers and a handlebar bag.
(2) Buy a new rigid fork and a front pannier rack.
(3) Use my old fork, along with the headset and stem from my old bike as well.
(4) Buy a trailer.

...

Quoted message said:

Has anyone else done long-distance (multi-week) touring without front panniers? If so, how did it
work out? Recommend or not?

I haven't done any multi-week tours, but have done quite a few that were up to a week long with the
rear pannier/handlebar bag arrangement. Just got back last week from a self-supported camping tour
down the coast from SF to Santa Barbara with three other cyclists and all of us used only rear
panniers. None of us had any problems with the weight distribution or handling characteristics of
our bikes. I think we may have packed a bit lighter than we would have if we had used more bags but
we weren't lacking any essentials. I didn't even carry anything on top of the rear rack (sleeping
bag, pad, and tent all went inside the panniers), so I certainly could have carried more gear if
required for a longer trip.

I'd suggest you load up your bike as required with your rear panniers and handlebar bag and go for a
trial ride near home including climbing and descending a hill. If it feels ok on this ride then go
ahead and plan to do the tour that way.

In article said:

Still planning my big west coast adventure, and I've run into a major snag...

Front pannier racks do not work with suspension forks! Well, okay, that's not strictly true. There
do exist racks that work with front suspension, but they're hard to find, and very expensive.

snip

If you have the heel clearance (which I count as unlikely) you could try Jaand "Large
Mountain" panniers.

If you aren't camping you could get by with normal sized rear panniers.

Personally I think you are taking the wrong bike for the trip.

Tom Gibb <[email hidden]

Why the wrong bike? Just curious.

"TBGibb" <[email hidden]> wrote in message "]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

In article said:

Still planning my big west coast adventure, and I've run into a major

snag...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

Front pannier racks do not work with suspension forks! Well, okay, that's not strictly true.
There do exist racks that work

with

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

front suspension, but they're hard to find, and very expensive.

snip

If you have the heel clearance (which I count as unlikely) you could try

Jaand

Quoted message said:

"Large Mountain" panniers.

If you aren't camping you could get by with normal sized rear panniers.

Personally I think you are taking the wrong bike for the trip.

Tom Gibb <[email hidden]>

---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (grisoft.comgrisoft.comOpen ↗).
Version: 6.0.483 / Virus Database: 279 - Release Date: 19/05/2003

"Dave Knott" <[email hidden]> wrote in message "]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Still planning my big west coast adventure, and I've run into a major

snag...

Quoted message said:

Front pannier racks do not work with suspension forks! Well, okay, that's not strictly true. There
do exist racks that work with front suspension, but they're hard to find, and very expensive.

Of course, I was aware of this from the start. I had originally planned

to

Quoted message said:

swap on the rigid fork from my old bike. But I have now belatedly

realized

Quoted message said:

that it was designed for a different headset than my current bike. 🙁

This is a shame, since I already have some smaller panniers that I used to have on the rear, but
was planning to use on the front for this trip.

So now I'm faced with three choices:
(1) Do the trip without front panniers and make do with rear panniers and

a

Quoted message said:

handlebar bag.
(2) Buy a new rigid fork and a front pannier rack.
(3) Use my old fork, along with the headset and stem from my old bike as

well.

Quoted message said:

(4) Buy a trailer.

I've pretty much dismissed Option #3 as just too much of a pain in the

ass.

Quoted message said:

Option #4 is far too expensive.

So I'm tempted to go with just rear panniers, if only to save the expense

and

Quoted message said:

trouble of buying and installing a new rigid fork. But since I'm planning

a

Quoted message said:

self-supported trip, I expect that the rear panniers and handlebar bag

will

Quoted message said:

fill up quickly. Plus, this method puts a lot more weight on the rear of

the

Quoted message said:

bike. So I'm not sure if rear-only is the right way to go.

A BOB trailer weights 12 lbs. Used $180 Rear Rack about 570 grams $43 Front Rack 480 grams $38 Rear
Panniers 4 lbs 10 oz $195 Front Roller Panniers 2 lbs 15 oz $12

Weight penalty compared is a lot less than 12 lbs. The Bob will probably carry more, which may or
may not be an advantage. Another consideration is that while the Bob tracks well when riding, it
is unwieldy in tight quarters.
. I like panniers less than I like a BOB.

Dave Knott said:

Still planning my big west coast adventure, and I've run into a major snag...

Front pannier racks do not work with suspension forks! .... So I'm tempted to go with just rear
panniers, if only to save the expense and trouble of buying and installing a new rigid fork. But
since I'm planning a self-supported trip, I expect that the rear panniers and handlebar bag will
fill up quickly. Plus, this method puts a lot more weight on the rear of the bike. So I'm not sure
if rear-only is the right way to go.

Has anyone else done long-distance (multi-week) touring without front panniers? If so, how did it
work out? Recommend or not?

I used to do long-distance tours (I think the longest was 2 weeks) with only rear panniers and
handlebar bag. It is possible if you can keep the weight down. Do a test run with the same weight
that you plan for the long tour.

Later (1989 or so) I added small front panniers and it became easier to carry more weight (maybe
too easy to carry too much weight!). The ride seems more stable.

Then, a few years ago, I lost the small panniers (they were actually stolen, along with the bike
they were on!) I went on a 3 or 4 day trip with just large rear panniers. It felt awkward and I
had a hard time fitting everything in. I immediately bought another pair of small panniers for
the front.

My normal touring set-up is a "classic" touring bike, 700x32 tires, Blackburn lowriders on the
front forks.

--

David Dermott , Wolfville Ridge, Nova Scotia, Canada email: [email hidden] WWW pages:
www3.ns.sympatico.cadermottOpen ↗

I'd recommend replacing the fork and getting a front rack. Second get a front rack for the
suspension fork and lock the fork out if possible.

While front bags aren't ABSOLUTELY necessary, they really do make the bike handle better.

"Dave Knott" <[email hidden]> wrote in message "]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Still planning my big west coast adventure, and I've run into a

major snag...

Quoted message said:

Front pannier racks do not work with suspension forks! Well, okay, that's not strictly true. There
do exist racks that

work with

Quoted message said:

front suspension, but they're hard to find, and very expensive.

Of course, I was aware of this from the start. I had originally

planned to

Quoted message said:

swap on the rigid fork from my old bike. But I have now belatedly

realized

Quoted message said:

that it was designed for a different headset than my current bike.

🙁

Quoted message said:

This is a shame, since I already have some smaller panniers that I

used to

Quoted message said:

have on the rear, but was planning to use on the front for this

trip.

Quoted message said:

So now I'm faced with three choices:
(1) Do the trip without front panniers and make do with rear

panniers and a

Quoted message said:

handlebar bag.
(2) Buy a new rigid fork and a front pannier rack.
(3) Use my old fork, along with the headset and stem from my old

bike as well.

Quoted message said:

(4) Buy a trailer.

I've pretty much dismissed Option #3 as just too much of a pain in

the ass.

Quoted message said:

Option #4 is far too expensive.

So I'm tempted to go with just rear panniers, if only to save the

expense and

Quoted message said:

trouble of buying and installing a new rigid fork. But since I'm

planning a

Quoted message said:

self-supported trip, I expect that the rear panniers and handlebar

bag will

Quoted message said:

fill up quickly. Plus, this method puts a lot more weight on the

rear of the

Quoted message said:

bike. So I'm not sure if rear-only is the right way to go.

Has anyone else done long-distance (multi-week) touring without

front

Quoted message said:

panniers? If so, how did it work out? Recommend or not?

Thanks for any advice.

later, dave
--
Dave Knott Graduate Student University of British Columbia [email hidden]

Trailgalore said:

I like panniers less than I like a BOB.<

I'll second the BOB option. I'm spoiled by my BOB - I'll probably never go back to panniers.

Dave

Another option that no one has mentioned is a backpack. I just returned from a week long trip using
only a backpack and a top bag for my rear rack. I don't recommend carrying too much stuff in the
pack, especially for long distances, but it can be a good solution for carrying light weight space
eaters like jackets and clothing.

"TBGibb" <[email hidden]> wrote in message "]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Because you are intending to ride across the USA which has a very good

network

Quoted message said:

of roads. Front suspension will be extra weight (OK that is a marginal

issue

Quoted message said:

when touring) and extra complexity (which is NOT a marginal issue) in

riding

Quoted message said:

situations that don't require suspension. And front suspension

complicates the

Quoted message said:

issue of front panniers, which make weight distribution much simpler and

add

Quoted message said:

carrying capacity for those longer reaches between food and, most

importantly,

Quoted message said:

water.

That's the bike the OP has, and he has mentioned several times that expense is an issue. People have
crossed the country with penny farthings on dirt roads. You can do it on a modern mtb with front
suspension.

TBGibb said:

Because you are intending to ride across the USA which has a very good network of roads. Front
suspension will be extra weight (OK that is a marginal issue when touring) and extra complexity
(which is NOT a marginal issue) in riding situations that don't require suspension. And front
suspension complicates the issue of front panniers, which make weight distribution much simpler
and add carrying capacity for those longer reaches between food and, most importantly, water.

Everyone I've ever talked to that had front suspension on a tour said it was a great idea. It
really helps take all the extra jolts out of those cracks and potholes in the road. I'm tempted to
give it a try.

Quoted message said:

In article said:

Why the wrong bike? Just curious.

"TBGibb" <[email hidden]> wrote in message "]news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

In article <[email hidden]>, Dave Knott <[email hidden]> writes:

>Still planning my big west coast adventure, and I've run into a major

snag...

Quoted message said:

>
>Front pannier racks do not work with suspension forks! Well, okay, that's not strictly true.
>There do exist racks that work

with

Quoted message said:

>front suspension, but they're hard to find, and very expensive.

snip

If you have the heel clearance (which I count as unlikely) you could try

Jaand

Quoted message said:

"Large Mountain" panniers.

If you aren't camping you could get by with normal sized rear panniers.

Personally I think you are taking the wrong bike for the trip.

Tom Gibb <[email hidden]>

--
**********************************************
Chuck Anderson • Boulder, CO cycletourist.comcycletourist.comOpen ↗ Tolerance is recognizing that other people
have different ideals and needs than you. Compromise is acting on that knowledge.
***********************************************************

Dave Knott said:

Still planning my big west coast adventure, and I've run into a major snag...

Front pannier racks do not work with suspension forks! Well, okay, that's not strictly true. There
do exist racks that work with front suspension, but they're hard to find, and very expensive.

Of course, I was aware of this from the start. I had originally planned to swap on the rigid fork
from my old bike. But I have now belatedly realized that it was designed for a different headset
than my current bike. 🙁

This is a shame, since I already have some smaller panniers that I used to have on the rear, but
was planning to use on the front for this trip.

I did my first three tours (Seattle to San Francisco - Boulder to Minneapolis and Seattle to
Boulder) with the rear pannier - handlebar bag setup. That was solo and completely self supported
(tent and sleeping bag).

I toured with my daughter later, and bought front panniers to carry some of her weight (a repeat
Seattle to San Francisco). I then used the front and rear panniers in Europe for 3 months.

I find the rear only setup easier to handle when riding. The front panniers make the front wheel
have more inertia (term.?) to overcome when turning, and more momentum once it starts.

It is much easier for me to ride no handed with only rear panniers than in full dress.

Don't worry about it. Go with rear panniers, only.

The front ones just make you carry too much stuff.

I use Madden Buzzard Panniers on the rear - 3,000 cubic inches - and then bungee the tent, pad, and
sleeping bag on top of the rear rack and panniers.

--
**********************************************
Chuck Anderson • Boulder, CO cycletourist.comcycletourist.comOpen ↗ Tolerance is recognizing that other people
have different ideals and needs than you. Compromise is acting on that knowledge.
***********************************************************

Tom Kunich said:

I'd recommend replacing the fork and getting a front rack. Second get a front rack for the
suspension fork and lock the fork out if possible.

While front bags aren't ABSOLUTELY necessary, they really do make the bike handle better.

I have found this to be subjective. There are many people that believe one way or the other (based
on experience).

And it is the opposite for me. I find the rear-only setup more stable in all conditions (downhill -
curves - slow - fast) ...... until I get off the bike, that is. Then the rear weight makes the front
wheel want to almost float off the ground. You have to lean your bike carefully or the front wheel
turns and the whole bike comes crashing down - - - or you can get a kickstand and a brake-chuck, as
I did years ago.)

--
**********************************************
Chuck Anderson • Boulder, CO cycletourist.comcycletourist.comOpen ↗ Tolerance is recognizing that other people
have different ideals and needs than you. Compromise is acting on that knowledge.
***********************************************************

Dave Knott (that's me!) said:

So I'm tempted to go with just rear panniers, if only to save the expense and trouble of buying
and installing a new rigid fork. But since I'm planning a self-supported trip, I expect that the
rear panniers and handlebar bag will fill up quickly. Plus, this method puts a lot more weight on
the rear of the bike. So I'm not sure if rear-only is the right way to go.

Thanks to everyone for their advice!

Having given it some thought, I've now decided to swap a rigid fork onto my bike.

The main reason is that I already have some smaller panniers that should fit on the front. It would
be a shame to waste all that carrying volume. This will hopefully allow me to purchase smaller rear
panniers. Getting better front-back weight distribution should be nice too.

My one concern is that the smaller panniers were originally designed for the rear, so they're shaped
differently, and have a large rear pouch. But I don't think that will prevent them from working on
the front.

I can get a used rigid fork for $20Cdn and a low-rider front rack for $18Cdn, so it should be fairly
inexpensive. In fact, I'll be able to save money, since I can get 43L rear panniers for at least
$50Cdn cheaper than 56L ones. I might even be able to avoid buying a handlebar bag now (although I
might still get one for convenience)

later, dave
--
Dave Knott Graduate Student University of British Columbia [email hidden]

Dave Knott <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Dave Knott (that's me!) said:

So I'm tempted to go with just rear panniers, if only to save the expense and trouble of buying
and installing a new rigid fork. But since I'm planning a self-supported trip, I expect that the
rear panniers and handlebar bag will fill up quickly. Plus, this method puts a lot more weight
on the rear of the bike. So I'm not sure if rear-only is the right way to go.

Thanks to everyone for their advice!

Having given it some thought, I've now decided to swap a rigid fork onto my bike.

The main reason is that I already have some smaller panniers that should fit on the front. It
would be a shame to waste all that carrying volume. This will hopefully allow me to purchase
smaller rear panniers. Getting better front-back weight distribution should be nice too.

My one concern is that the smaller panniers were originally designed for the rear, so they're
shaped differently, and have a large rear pouch. But I don't think that will prevent them from
working on the front.

I can get a used rigid fork for $20Cdn and a low-rider front rack for $18Cdn, so it should be
fairly inexpensive. In fact, I'll be able to save money, since I can get 43L rear panniers for at
least $50Cdn cheaper than 56L ones. I might even be able to avoid buying a handlebar bag now
(although I might still get one for convenience)

later, dave

Whatever works for you. Sounds like a plan!

Another approach that no one mentioned is front panniers without the need for a front rack. I've
never used the Carradice Limpets, but I'm told they work quite well. See
wallbike.comlimpet.htmlOpen ↗.

Peter Storey

I did a 3 week trip last year in France <http://homepage.eircom.net/~IrlBiker/index.htm> with rear
panniers and handlebar bag; I have a front suspension that won't take standard front panniers except
those from old man mountain which I intend to get. The ride last year was unstable and not worth the
weeks of "riding on the edge". You should do a trial run by packing the rear panniers and handlebar
bag and taking a mini-tour. However if you are going to do this be sure to pack all of the items
that you would them be taking on the longer trip. I did a "trial run" by packing the pannier bags
full of clothing items but this was not the same load as I eventually ended up bringing with me -
hence different wright distribution issues. It was only when I got off the ferry in france and got
on the bike that I realised that the bike was far from stable. Trying to keep a badly balanced bike
straight in a crosswind is a nightmare on a busy road..

[email hidden] (Peter Storey) wrote in message
news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Dave Knott <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Dave Knott (that's me!) said:

So I'm tempted to go with just rear panniers, if only to save the expense and trouble of
buying and installing a new rigid fork. But since I'm planning a self-supported trip, I expect
that the rear panniers and handlebar bag will fill up quickly. Plus, this method puts a lot
more weight on the rear of the bike. So I'm not sure if rear-only is the right way to go.

Thanks to everyone for their advice!

Having given it some thought, I've now decided to swap a rigid fork onto my bike.

The main reason is that I already have some smaller panniers that should fit on the front. It
would be a shame to waste all that carrying volume. This will hopefully allow me to purchase
smaller rear panniers. Getting better front-back weight distribution should be nice too.

My one concern is that the smaller panniers were originally designed for the rear, so they're
shaped differently, and have a large rear pouch. But I don't think that will prevent them from
working on the front.

I can get a used rigid fork for $20Cdn and a low-rider front rack for $18Cdn, so it should be
fairly inexpensive. In fact, I'll be able to save money, since I can get 43L rear panniers for
at least $50Cdn cheaper than 56L ones. I might even be able to avoid buying a handlebar bag now
(although I might still get one for convenience)

later, dave

Whatever works for you. Sounds like a plan!

Another approach that no one mentioned is front panniers without the need for a front rack. I've
never used the Carradice Limpets, but I'm told they work quite well. See
wallbike.comlimpet.htmlOpen ↗.

Peter Storey