Happy Bachetta and P38 owners ?

The riding positions on these two bikes are _completely_ different. You have ridden them and don't prefer one over the other?

Quoted message said:

You have ridden them and don't prefer one over the other?

Thanks John.

I'm in Australia and have no opportunity to ride any 2 wheel recumbents.

This means I have to rely on reviews, opinions and any other info I can
dredge up. It's less than ideal, but it worked for my trike, which has been
very succesful (MR Components Swift and Swiftlet.)

Now I've "discovered" the RANS Force 5 XP - but there's a couple for sale
and that's a bad sign...!

I favour the P38, but I'm a little concerned about the 20 inch front wheel.
It should roll fine with a Tioga Comp Pool (we have rough chipseal
surfaces.) I'm an older rider, so a more upright position would be more
suitable. Also the P38 is a "mature" design with good accessories. It's
pricey though.

Paul W

"Paul W" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
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Quoted message said:

The Strada is about $1000 cheaper than the P38 and 1.7 kilos (about a
pound)
heavier.

1.7 kilos is about 3.75 pounds!

correction here....1.7 Kilos is NOT (about a pound) try 1 Kilo = 3.75 pounds

"Paul W" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
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Quoted message said:

The Strada is about $1000 cheaper than the P38 and 1.7 kilos (about a
pound)
heavier.

I would expect the twin 650 Strada to roll a bit freer and wonder if
fitting
a $1000 wheelset to a Strada would make it a better ride than the P38.
(Better = faster, smoother.)

One review of the Strada mentioned quality control problems.
The P38 is a "system" bike - mature and with excellent choice of
accessories.

Are there any other

Can I get owners of either to engage in an educational battle on the
merits
or otherwise of either.

Paul W
The search goes on......

Quoted message said:

correction here....1.7 Kilos is NOT (about a pound) try 1 Kilo = 3.75

pounds

Thanks Harv and Joshua....
repeat with me, I must not confuse the * with the / !

According to Bicycle Science, 1 kilo added weight reduces average speed by
1/3 rd kph.
That will be an approximation depending on terrain and in any case I'm too
old for racing!

The larger front wheel of the Bachetta will have considerably less rollover
resistance than the 20 inch on the P38 and Australia roads are often lightly
travelled chipseal - which is very rough.

Then there's the RANS Force 5 XP which I've just stumbled onto.... Aaarhghhh

"Paul W" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

The larger front wheel of the Bachetta will have considerably less rollover
resistance than the 20 inch on the P38 and Australia roads are often lightly
travelled chipseal - which is very rough.

Sorry, I didn't figure out from your address that you were in Aus.

Just to muddy the waters some more, if you are concerned about rough
chipseal, maybe you should consider the Giro 26. Wide tires could be
fitted, if necessary.

This bike is fairly tall, so you should be too ;-)

The P-38 has a fairly tight riding angle, and you can get r-butt.

If you are tall enough, I think the Giro 26 would offer a lot of
flexibility and options.

John Riley

"Paul W" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
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Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

correction here....1.7 Kilos is NOT (about a pound) try 1 Kilo = 3.75

pounds

Wrong - 1 kilo is 2.2 pounds

Doug Thomas
Welland, Ontario

Quoted message said:

"Paul W" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

Quoted message said:

correction here....1.7 Kilos is NOT (about a pound) try 1 Kilo = 3.75

pounds

Thanks Harv and Joshua....
repeat with me, I must not confuse the * with the / !

According to Bicycle Science, 1 kilo added weight reduces average speed by
1/3 rd kph.
That will be an approximation depending on terrain and in any case I'm
too
old for racing!

The larger front wheel of the Bachetta will have considerably less
rollover
resistance than the 20 inch on the P38 and Australia roads are often
lightly
travelled chipseal - which is very rough.

Then there's the RANS Force 5 XP which I've just stumbled onto....
Aaarhghhh

I haven't ridden the bikes your are interested in, but as Mr. Riley pointed
out they offer very different in riding positions. They are at different
extremes. As an "older rider" are you sure you want that?

Have you considered a lwb...Tour Easy, Stratus or maybe a V2? Nothing
extreme there. They are comfortable and easy to ride. Seems to me one of
them would be a safer bet if you aren't able to test ride and haven't ever
ridden a two wheel recumbent.

On the other hand you can always sell the bike if you don't like it and get
something else - but that can get a bit expensive and time consuming after a
while.

Disclaimer - I prefer lwb to swb because of the annoying numb toes issue a
few of us unfortunates have with swb high bottom bracket bikes.

Joshua Goldberg said:

correction here....1.7 Kilos is NOT (about a pound) try 1 Kilo = 3.75 pounds

correction here... 1 kg ~= 2.2046226 lb avoirdupois

If you know how many pounds are in a ton (long ton in the USA) it's easy

1 tonne ~= 1 (long) ton

or
1000kg ~= 2240 lb

Which is close enough for most purposes (actually I can usually remember
to switch the 4 and the 0 :-)

Mike

Skip said:

Disclaimer - I prefer lwb to swb because of the annoying numb toes issue a
few of us unfortunates have with swb high bottom bracket bikes.

I didn't have problems with the high BB on my trike unless I had the laces
or straps too tight.
Unless it's very cold, I wear Shimano SPD sandals and for me they're very
comfortable.

I seem to get more power from a high BB and there are some studies that back
this up - and the reduction in front profile is useful too.

My latest trike has a low BB and it's taking a while to get used to - it may
be just muscle accomodation, but I don't feel as relaxed at the moment (1200
kms.)

One comment I'd make about the dual 700c high racers is that they're farther
above the ground which means higher wind speeds and falling off would be
unpleasant compared to (say) the P 38 or any bent that puts the rider close
to the ground.

My first 'bent was a home built LWB Tour Easy kinda clone. It was
comfortable.

Paul W

"Paul W" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
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Quoted message said:

Skip said:

Disclaimer - I prefer lwb to swb because of the annoying numb toes issue a
few of us unfortunates have with swb high bottom bracket bikes.

I didn't have problems with the high BB on my trike unless I had the laces
or straps too tight.
Unless it's very cold, I wear Shimano SPD sandals and for me they're very
comfortable.

I seem to get more power from a high BB and there are some studies that
back
this up - and the reduction in front profile is useful too.

My latest trike has a low BB and it's taking a while to get used to - it
may
be just muscle accomodation, but I don't feel as relaxed at the moment
(1200
kms.)

One comment I'd make about the dual 700c high racers is that they're
farther
above the ground which means higher wind speeds and falling off would be
unpleasant compared to (say) the P 38 or any bent that puts the rider
close
to the ground.

My first 'bent was a home built LWB Tour Easy kinda clone. It was
comfortable.

Paul W

Sorry, but I interpreted your second post as saying you had never ridden a
two wheel recumbent and my post was based on that assumption.

I agree you can get more power out of a high BB bike. I seem to feel the
extra power when my feet are higher than my hip. However, my main interest
is touring and for me the neither the extra power or the comfort offered by
the high BB bike is sustainable over the course of a long ride. LWB low BB
works best for me.

I've owned a couple of RANS bikes and had no problems whatsoever with them
or the company. Bachetta makes also makes an excellent product and offers
excellent service from what I've read. Company service on the P38 seems to
run hot and cold - if that's a consideration for you I would advise some
research on the matter. I think P38 frames have been beefed up sufficiently
that frame failure isn't a problem these days.

Good luck. Let us know how it goes with whatever you end up getting.

"Paul W" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

Skip said:

Disclaimer - I prefer lwb to swb because of the annoying numb toes issue a
few of us unfortunates have with swb high bottom bracket bikes.

I didn't have problems with the high BB on my trike unless I had the laces
or straps too tight.
Unless it's very cold, I wear Shimano SPD sandals and for me they're very
comfortable.

I'll ditto that. I switched from a SWB Lightning to a LWB Tour Easy a
couple years back. I started having numb toes *after* the switch. I
had also switched shoes and was tieing the laces extra-tight. After
breaking in the shoes and loosening the laces a bit, numb toes went
away.

Jeff

Paul:

I've ridden both, and like both. I know the makers of the Strada, so I'd
probably go with that over the Lightning, but would love to have a
Lightning. When I was making my decision back in '98 the Strada wasn't
available, and I got a V-Rex over the Lightning. Although I loved the feel
of the Lightning the V-Rex just felt like it was more "fun." The deciding
factors were, however, the fact that I felt the V-Rex was much better for
stop and go riding because the seat allowed me to get my feet down better.
The "square pan" on the Lightning was comfortable to ride, but it impeded my
thighs when I tried to plant my feet at a stop. The other issue (besides
price) was the fact that I have an old ligament injury which I felt might
become a problem with the relatively 'closed' riding position of P38.

The Strada is very similar to the Rex, except that it feels more more
balanced and smooth in turns, a credit to Mark Colliton's superior designing
capabilities. He was not involved in the re-design of the V-Rex, although
he designed the original.

Hope this helps.

--Scott

--
--Scott
"Paul W" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

The Strada is about $1000 cheaper than the P38 and 1.7 kilos (about a
pound)
heavier.

I would expect the twin 650 Strada to roll a bit freer and wonder if
fitting
a $1000 wheelset to a Strada would make it a better ride than the P38.
(Better = faster, smoother.)

One review of the Strada mentioned quality control problems.
The P38 is a "system" bike - mature and with excellent choice of
accessories.

Are there any other

Can I get owners of either to engage in an educational battle on the
merits
or otherwise of either.

Paul W
The search goes on......

"Paul W" <[email hidden]> wrote in message news:<[email hidden]>...

Quoted message said:

The Strada is about $1000 cheaper than the P38 and 1.7 kilos (about a pound)
heavier. I would expect the twin 650 Strada to roll a bit freer and

wonder if fitting a $1000 wheelset to a Strada would make it a better
ride than the P38.(Better = faster, smoother.)One review of the Strada
mentioned quality control problems. The P38 is a "system" bike -
mature and with excellent choice of accessories.Are there any other
Can I get owners of either to engage in an educational battle on the
merits or otherwise of either.Paul W The search goes on......

Yo Paul,

I've owned a V-REX (similar to Giro) test ridden a P-38 and now own a
Strada. For customer service, I'd rank Bacchetta and RANS far ahead
of Lightning (based on comments from Lightning owners).

One of the key deciding factors me thinks is where you will do most or
all of your riding. If you're talking a commuter bike, personally I'd
rule out the Strada because I think it's designed for speed, long
distance rides and that works best with a laid back position.

Riding Position: The Giro, V-REX, Strada and similar bikes allow you
to drastically change the seat position. When I ride my Strada on
recreational rides in Portland Or, I change the seat position to
almost upright. If I'm not mistaken the P-38 has a pretty much
closed/upright position period. Great for climbing according to those
who own them.

Better Ride? I think the Strada (dual 26" wheels) will give you a
far smoother ride than either the P-38, V-Rex, or Giro. Simply change
the tires from rock hard speedos to a less inflated tire.

If you're gonna spend another $1,000 for a wheelset put that towards
an AERO or top of the line RANS or Volae.

My two centavos

Slow Joe Recumbo

Paul I presently own / ride a Bacchetta Aero and have previously owned a
P-38. From my many previous bikes I've owned I personally feel the duel
large wheel bike works much BETTER for me, as opposed to a 20in front /
700cc rear. (Tour Easy, GRR / Alum, GRR Ti, R-40, R-45 M5 bikes that I've
also owned / ridden) Much more stable than different size tires and I don't
have to pack different tires / tubes.
As for the P-38, a really nice / fast bike, but no real seat adjusting
capability. Plus the P-38 seat setup had me actually being in a sitting but
hunched / crunched forward type of position and I felt much like I would on
a DF bike. Having a blowout on a front 20in tire can be very SCARY.
On my Aero, I have plenty of adjustment, am laid back and I can also plant
my feet solidly on the ground, as opposed to my "Custom" P-38 frame that
still had me doing the barely toe touch to the ground.
My personal feeling is, go with a duel large wheel bike and if a Strada, you
can also modify it for 700cc wheels, with the Aero you can't.
EZ Biker :-) Pompano Beach, Fl. Aero Pilot / Team Wanna B

"Paul W" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
news:[email hidden]...

Quoted message said:

The Strada is about $1000 cheaper than the P38 and 1.7 kilos (about a

pound)

Quoted message said:

heavier.

I would expect the twin 650 Strada to roll a bit freer and wonder if

fitting

Quoted message said:

a $1000 wheelset to a Strada would make it a better ride than the P38.
(Better = faster, smoother.)

One review of the Strada mentioned quality control problems.
The P38 is a "system" bike - mature and with excellent choice of
accessories.

Are there any other

Can I get owners of either to engage in an educational battle on the

merits

Quoted message said:

or otherwise of either.

Paul W
The search goes on......