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freemap thread followup - you may want to check out NASA World Wind

Started by Paul J. Keenan · · Last activity · 22 posts · 609 views

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General fitness, health and nutrition
Published
17 December 2004
Last activity
4 January 2005
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Paul J. Keenan
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  1. Back in March acc to Google Groups, Boo said :

    Quoted message said:

    I think that at some point not too far in the future it will be
    sufficiently simple to digitise aerial photographs using a computer and
    maybe at this point mapping will become available that is free in both
    senses of the word.

    I'm surprised not to find any mention in this forum to date, but
    the future arrived a month or two ago - check out NASA's GPL offering
    "World Wind" at

    http://learn.arc.nasa.gov/worldwind

    There's an abundance of rough edges

    - can be tricky to install
    - plenty of bugs
    - doesn't work with some cards
    - needs a reasonably fast PC
    - data problems (clouds, missing data, dodgy elevation data in places)
    - no GPS linkage
    - feature list way incomplete
    - currently Windows only

    but all of these are being worked on, albeit slowly in places. What you
    do get already is rather impressive.

    Essentially it is a tool for showing 3D visualisation for pretty
    much any part of the globe from any angle. The program is free, and the
    data sources available are public domain satellite imagery.

    It can use multiple independent data sources if the data (or a server
    configured to serve up the data) exists. Topographic maps, hires (1m per
    pixel) imagery, .... You can even get Mars if you're keen, although I
    hear the walk-in is even longer than Ladhar Bheinn.

    It is a client-server app, but maintains a local cache of data.
    If you load your hard disk cache with the data in advance, you can
    use it offline and save a lot of download time.

    If someone has a fat internet pipe and is willing and able to host a
    couple of gig of UK Landsat7 False-Color data (only Scotland hi-res
    complete so far), I could send them a DVD through the mail. It's all
    legit, since NASAs UK Landsat7 data data is public domain.

    The program is open source, so if you want a feature bad enough, you
    can write the extension yourself or talk nicely to someone else who
    will. There is already rudimentary support for trails, check out this
    forum post :

    http://learn.arc.nasa.gov/worldwind/forums/index.php?showtopic=701

    If you redirect the freemap route-building effort around refining
    this function and building the routes, the potential is enormous. There
    is already work going on to link it into your browser, so you can bookmark
    locations and access the program through customised links on a web page.

    I've never used Anquet or MemoryMap other than brief goes with the demo
    versions. World Wind is way behind these two in a lot of ways, but will
    surely give them a run for their money as it evolves in the next couple of
    years. It already floats my boat.

    I've put together a file in the native format containing the Munro names
    and heights. This allows you to see each hill name attached to the
    summit, regardless of which angle you're viewing from.

    Here's some screenshots :

    http://pkeenan.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/ww/ben-nevis.jpg
    http://pkeenan.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/ww/mamores-and-nevis.jpg
    http://pkeenan.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/ww/cairngorm-plateau.jpg
    http://pkeenan.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/ww/glencoe.jpg

    Since good 3D cards are bcoming ubiquitous, it gives adequate
    performance on most recent PCs. One downside is that it may well be tempt
    you into spending money upgrading your PC to get more oomph !

    --
    pjk

  2. meaty system spec required though!
    Windows 2000, XP Home, or XP Professional
    Intel Pentium 3 1 ghz or AMD Athlon or higher
    256 MB of RAM
    3D Graphics Card
    nVidia GeForce 2 Ultra
    ATI Radeon 7500
    Intel Extreme Graphics 2
    DSL / Cable connection or faster
    2 GB of disk space

    "Paul J. Keenan" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    Back in March acc to Google Groups, Boo said :

    Quoted message said:

    I think that at some point not too far in the future it will be
    sufficiently simple to digitise aerial photographs using a computer and
    maybe at this point mapping will become available that is free in both
    senses of the word.

    I'm surprised not to find any mention in this forum to date, but
    the future arrived a month or two ago - check out NASA's GPL offering
    "World Wind" at

    http://learn.arc.nasa.gov/worldwind

    There's an abundance of rough edges

    - can be tricky to install
    - plenty of bugs
    - doesn't work with some cards
    - needs a reasonably fast PC
    - data problems (clouds, missing data, dodgy elevation data in places)
    - no GPS linkage
    - feature list way incomplete
    - currently Windows only

    but all of these are being worked on, albeit slowly in places. What you
    do get already is rather impressive.

    Essentially it is a tool for showing 3D visualisation for pretty
    much any part of the globe from any angle. The program is free, and the
    data sources available are public domain satellite imagery.

    It can use multiple independent data sources if the data (or a server
    configured to serve up the data) exists. Topographic maps, hires (1m per
    pixel) imagery, .... You can even get Mars if you're keen, although I
    hear the walk-in is even longer than Ladhar Bheinn.

    It is a client-server app, but maintains a local cache of data.
    If you load your hard disk cache with the data in advance, you can
    use it offline and save a lot of download time.

    If someone has a fat internet pipe and is willing and able to host a
    couple of gig of UK Landsat7 False-Color data (only Scotland hi-res
    complete so far), I could send them a DVD through the mail. It's all
    legit, since NASAs UK Landsat7 data data is public domain.

    The program is open source, so if you want a feature bad enough, you
    can write the extension yourself or talk nicely to someone else who
    will. There is already rudimentary support for trails, check out this
    forum post :

    http://learn.arc.nasa.gov/worldwind/forums/index.php?showtopic=701

    If you redirect the freemap route-building effort around refining
    this function and building the routes, the potential is enormous. There
    is already work going on to link it into your browser, so you can bookmark
    locations and access the program through customised links on a web page.

    I've never used Anquet or MemoryMap other than brief goes with the demo
    versions. World Wind is way behind these two in a lot of ways, but will
    surely give them a run for their money as it evolves in the next couple of
    years. It already floats my boat.

    I've put together a file in the native format containing the Munro names
    and heights. This allows you to see each hill name attached to the
    summit, regardless of which angle you're viewing from.

    Here's some screenshots :

    http://pkeenan.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/ww/ben-nevis.jpg
    http://pkeenan.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/ww/mamores-and-nevis.jpg
    http://pkeenan.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/ww/cairngorm-plateau.jpg
    http://pkeenan.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/ww/glencoe.jpg

    Since good 3D cards are bcoming ubiquitous, it gives adequate
    performance on most recent PCs. One downside is that it may well be tempt
    you into spending money upgrading your PC to get more oomph !

    --
    pjk

  3. "Bryan Hall" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    meaty system spec required though!
    Windows 2000, XP Home, or XP Professional
    Intel Pentium 3 1 ghz or AMD Athlon or higher
    256 MB of RAM
    3D Graphics Card
    nVidia GeForce 2 Ultra
    ATI Radeon 7500
    Intel Extreme Graphics 2
    DSL / Cable connection or faster
    2 GB of disk space

    meaty ???? thats slower than the norm for nowadays

  4. Depends if by the norm you mean already in use, rather than recently
    bought,I would have thought 3.1Ghz is a bit new ?

    1.8Ghz Win 98SE and cheap !!

    "Chris 159" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:


    "Bryan Hall" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    meaty system spec required though!
    Windows 2000, XP Home, or XP Professional
    Intel Pentium 3 1 ghz or AMD Athlon or higher
    256 MB of RAM
    3D Graphics Card
    nVidia GeForce 2 Ultra
    ATI Radeon 7500
    Intel Extreme Graphics 2
    DSL / Cable connection or faster
    2 GB of disk space

    meaty ???? thats slower than the norm for nowadays

  5. Bryan Hall said:

    Depends if by the norm you mean already in use, rather than recently
    bought,I would have thought 3.1Ghz is a bit new ?

    ....that's "Pentium III, 1Ghz"....

  6. ah!
    shows how long since i last bothered to read the pc mags then ;-)

    "Nigel Crompton" <nigel&crompton.org.uk@> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:
    Bryan Hall said:

    Depends if by the norm you mean already in use, rather than recently
    bought,I would have thought 3.1Ghz is a bit new ?

    ...that's "Pentium III, 1Ghz"....

  7. In article <[email hidden]>, Nigel Crompton
    <nigel&crompton.org.uk@> says...

    Quoted message said:
    Bryan Hall said:

    Depends if by the norm you mean already in use, rather than recently
    bought,I would have thought 3.1Ghz is a bit new ?

    ...that's "Pentium III, 1Ghz"....

    And if you do decide to d/l it, be aware that the main prog is a 1/4 GB
    - pretty sizeable even for broadband!

    --
    Darren

  8. "Bryan Hall" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:

    ah!
    shows how long since i last bothered to read the pc mags then ;-)

    ;-)

  9. "Paul J. Keenan" <[email hidden]> wrote in message

    Quoted message said:

    Here's some screenshots :

    http://pkeenan.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/ww/ben-nevis.jpg
    http://pkeenan.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/ww/mamores-and-nevis.jpg
    http://pkeenan.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/ww/cairngorm-plateau.jpg
    http://pkeenan.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/ww/glencoe.jpg

    Since good 3D cards are bcoming ubiquitous, it gives adequate
    performance on most recent PCs. One downside is that it may well be tempt
    you into spending money upgrading your PC to get more oomph !

    --
    pjk

    This is just fantastic, did you choose the viewing posistion, angle
    elevation etc. Can an image like this be created for anywhere in the world?

    Can you move about as if you are flying. ?

  10. Mmmm...Aonach Eagach doesn't look so bad from up there, might try soon!

    Jhimmy

  11. Stuart said:

    This is just fantastic, did you choose the viewing posistion, angle
    elevation etc. Can an image like this be created for anywhere in the world?

    Can you move about as if you are flying. ?

    Yes to all of the above. The user interface, along with most things
    in the program, are up for debate. The flying mode has been suggested in
    the forums and it will likely make its way into a future release.

    For now you can turn on motion momentum and 'grab'
    the screen and 'throw' it with the mouse in the desired direction and it
    will continue to scroll over the landscape at a constant speed after you
    let go. You can rotate while it is scrolling to effect a change in
    direction, but you can't change altitude.

  12. Darren G said:

    In article <[email hidden]>, Nigel Crompton
    <nigel&crompton.org.uk@> says...

    And if you do decide to d/l it, be aware that the main prog is a 1/4 GB
    - pretty sizeable even for broadband!

    The 1.2d full installer is 174MB and can be gotten from :

    http://learn.arc.nasa.gov/worldwind/forums/index.php?showtopic=715

    It fixes a number of problems, and doesn't include Managed DirectX or the
    Microsoft .net framework to cut down the size since you may already have
    them. It does provide a link to download those separately if needed.

    Map-a-holics with a broadband connection already could find it the best
    174MB they've downloaded in a while. At 2Mbits, that's only about 10 mins.

    As a random data point, my PC has an AMD Athlon 2600XP, I've got 768MB RAM
    and a Radeon 9200SE (£40 a few months ago, £25 now) and the performance
    is pretty darned good.

    I'm sure there is higher res data available for the UK, but not available
    for World Wind. The quality of images you do get I find fairly
    remarkable. Although if your favourite spot was in cloud when the
    satellite photo was taken, there isn't much you can do for now.

    For some cities in the US, the pictures are so detailed that you can make
    out a red car next to a green truck. I hope that World Wind will
    stir up demand in the UK for such data here, driving the prices from the
    commercial boys down. Finally some competition for the OS boys !

    You might also want to look at Keyhole (http://www.keyhole.com/), recently
    purchased by the folks at Google. This is not free, but has similar aims
    and a company with deep pockets behind it. A yearly license is $29.95
    (about 10.7p 🙂 ) but there's a 7-day free trial. There was no decent
    Scotland data, but some very hi-res Greater London for all you sassenachs
    out there. With a bit of practice and deft controls, you could probably
    roll your own Eastenders title sequence. 🙂

    --
    pjk

  13. Darren G said:

    In article <[email hidden]>, Nigel Crompton
    <nigel&crompton.org.uk@> says...

    And if you do decide to d/l it, be aware that the main prog is a 1/4 GB
    - pretty sizeable even for broadband!

    The 1.2d full installer is 174MB and can be gotten from :

    http://learn.arc.nasa.gov/worldwind/forums/index.php?showtopic=715

    It fixes a number of problems, and doesn't include Managed DirectX or the
    Microsoft .net framework to cut down the size since you may already have
    them. It does provide a link to download those separately if needed.

    Map-a-holics with a broadband connection already could find it the best
    174MB they've downloaded in a while. At 2Mbits, that's only about 10 mins.

    As a random data point, my PC has an AMD Athlon 2600XP, I've got 768MB RAM
    and a Radeon 9200SE (£40 a few months ago, £25 now) and the performance
    is pretty darned good.

    I'm sure there is higher res data available for the UK, but not available
    for World Wind. The quality of images you do get I find fairly
    remarkable. Although if your favourite spot was in cloud when the
    satellite photo was taken, there isn't much you can do for now.

    For some cities in the US, the pictures are so detailed that you can make
    out a red car next to a green truck. I hope that World Wind will
    stir up demand in the UK for such data here, driving the prices from the
    commercial boys down. Finally some competition for the OS boys !

    You might also want to look at Keyhole (http://www.keyhole.com/), recently
    purchased by the folks at Google. This is not free, but has similar aims
    and a company with deep pockets behind it. A yearly license is $29.95
    (about 10.7p 🙂 ) but there's a 7-day free trial. There was no decent
    Scotland data, but some very hi-res Greater London for all you sassenachs
    out there. With a bit of practice and deft controls, you could probably
    roll your own Eastenders title sequence. 🙂

    --
    pjk

  14. In a recent message <[email hidden]>,
    Paul J. Keenan <[email hidden]> wrote.

    [...]

    Quoted message said:

    I'm surprised not to find any mention in this forum to date, but
    the future arrived a month or two ago - check out NASA's GPL offering
    "World Wind" at

    http://learn.arc.nasa.gov/worldwind


    [...]

    An example of what you can do with Word Wind, after just a few minutes
    of playing about with it:

    http://www.hopton.dsl.pipex.com/snowdon.jpg

    A part of Snowdonia, looking NW-ish. I've probably grossly overdone the
    vertical exaggeration.

    Regards,
    Nick.
    --
    Nick Hopton and Anne Hopton
    Caversham, Reading, England
    <[email hidden]>

  15. "Paul J. Keenan" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:


    http://pkeenan.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/ww/ben-nevis.jpg
    http://pkeenan.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/ww/mamores-and-nevis.jpg
    http://pkeenan.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/ww/cairngorm-plateau.jpg
    http://pkeenan.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/ww/glencoe.jpg

    how did you manage to get such good quality pics ? i thought my graphics
    card was ok being only a few months old (geforce fx5200) but all the images
    i get are near as damnit grey-scale :-(
    also your screenshots show side view across the land and i can only get a
    downwards view.
    does your place-finder work ? mine doesnt but a mates does

    Happy New Year

  16. Chris 159 said:


    "Paul J. Keenan" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:


    http://pkeenan.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/ww/ben-nevis.jpg
    http://pkeenan.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/ww/mamores-and-nevis.jpg
    http://pkeenan.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/ww/cairngorm-plateau.jpg
    http://pkeenan.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/ww/glencoe.jpg

    how did you manage to get such good quality pics ? i thought my graphics
    card was ok being only a few months old (geforce fx5200) but all the
    images
    i get are near as damnit grey-scale :-(
    also your screenshots show side view across the land and i can only get a
    downwards view.
    does your place-finder work ? mine doesnt but a mates does

    Happy New Year

    Chris,

    If your images are almost grayscale are you looking at the "Visble
    Landsat" or the "Psudeo Landsat" the images mentioned above are psudeo,
    with false colours used to show different land surfaces. Youcan change the
    data sourced viewed using the buttons at the top.

    To view images from the side hold down the right mouse button and pull the
    mouse backwards, you can change the vertical exageration using the keys 1-9

    Cheers Si.

    ----
    www.srhymes.co.uk

  17. Chris 159 said:


    "Paul J. Keenan" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:


    http://pkeenan.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/ww/ben-nevis.jpg
    http://pkeenan.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/ww/mamores-and-nevis.jpg
    http://pkeenan.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/ww/cairngorm-plateau.jpg
    http://pkeenan.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/ww/glencoe.jpg

    how did you manage to get such good quality pics ? i thought my graphics
    card was ok being only a few months old (geforce fx5200) but all the
    images
    i get are near as damnit grey-scale :-(
    also your screenshots show side view across the land and i can only get a
    downwards view.
    does your place-finder work ? mine doesnt but a mates does

    Happy New Year

    Chris,

    If your images are almost grayscale are you looking at the "Visble
    Landsat" or the "Psudeo Landsat" the images mentioned above are psudeo,
    with false colours used to show different land surfaces. Youcan change the
    data sourced viewed using the buttons at the top.

    To view images from the side hold down the right mouse button and pull the
    mouse backwards, you can change the vertical exageration using the keys 1-9

    Cheers Si.

    ----
    www.srhymes.co.uk

  18. "Si" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:
    Chris 159 said:


    "Paul J. Keenan" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:


    http://pkeenan.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/ww/ben-nevis.jpg
    http://pkeenan.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/ww/mamores-and-nevis.jpg
    http://pkeenan.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/ww/cairngorm-plateau.jpg
    http://pkeenan.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/ww/glencoe.jpg

    how did you manage to get such good quality pics ? i thought my graphics
    card was ok being only a few months old (geforce fx5200) but all the
    images
    i get are near as damnit grey-scale :-(
    also your screenshots show side view across the land and i can only get a
    downwards view.
    does your place-finder work ? mine doesnt but a mates does

    Happy New Year

    Chris,

    If your images are almost grayscale are you looking at the "Visble
    Landsat" or the "Psudeo Landsat" the images mentioned above are psudeo,
    with false colours used to show different land surfaces. Youcan change the
    data sourced viewed using the buttons at the top.

    To view images from the side hold down the right mouse button and pull the
    mouse backwards, you can change the vertical exageration using the keys
    1-9

    Cheers Si.

    thats better :-D thanks for that

  19. Chris 159 said:


    thats better :-D thanks for that

    Agreed - although the data is called 'false-color', it looks far more
    realistic to me, so I've stuck with it. The biggest problem with it is
    that high level snow tends to look a bit purplish, but it's pretty good
    everywhere else.

    The NASA guys are currently involved in 'reprojecting' their
    Landsat7 data to closer align the height data with the image data. They
    also hinted that although they are working from the same base data, the
    images may be slightly sharper due to better software. Next release of
    data and program updates is due end of January.

    --
    pjk

  20. "Paul J. Keenan" <[email hidden]> wrote in message
    news:[email hidden]...

    Quoted message said:
    Chris 159 said:


    thats better :-D thanks for that

    Agreed - although the data is called 'false-color', it looks far more
    realistic to me, so I've stuck with it. The biggest problem with it is
    that high level snow tends to look a bit purplish, but it's pretty good
    everywhere else.

    The NASA guys are currently involved in 'reprojecting' their
    Landsat7 data to closer align the height data with the image data. They
    also hinted that although they are working from the same base data, the
    images may be slightly sharper due to better software. Next release of
    data and program updates is due end of January.

    since looking at it 'pseudo' style and across the terrain rather down onto
    it i've noticed something rather alarming - wastwater goes up the side of
    yewbarrow :-O Nooooooooo

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